I'm Shunning discs.

meanredspider

essex-commuter wrote:

Kind of irrelevant to this conversation seeing as it was on a MTB but.....

7 years ago I had to have 6 stitches in my left knee due to falling off my mountain bike and my knee getting sliced open on the front rotor. I was doing something stupid at the time so all my fault. My neighbour 'Louise the Nurse' removed the stitches for me, she was well fit as well. That's irrelevant too but it's what I remember about the accident the most!!

Sorry I don't have pics. Knee or Louise.

Funny, I had 6 stitches in my knee because I hit the rim of the wheel of the sightscreen as I slid in to stop the ball in a cricket match. Cut through my whites, through my leg, and I could see my bone. Had a lovely nurse remove my stitches too. Lost the feeling in that part of my leg.

Sport can be dangerous.

Seriously - Doull's butt is a right mess and he's worried about his shoe.

essex-commuter

meanredspider wrote:

essex-commuter wrote:

My neighbour 'Louise the Nurse' removed the stitches for me, she was well fit

Had a lovely nurse remove my stitches too.

So basically (according to the Daily Mail), we can conclude this thread with the statement 'Cyclists that use disc brakes meet fit birds'.

Sorted.

hopkinb

meanredspider wrote:

Yup - never mind that he left most of his @rse on the road.

I now have one thing in common with Owain Doull! I left most of my arse on CS7 this morning, not quite as bad, but my god is the road rash stinging at the moment. Still riding home though.

chris_bass

essex-commuter wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

essex-commuter wrote:

My neighbour 'Louise the Nurse' removed the stitches for me, she was well fit

Had a lovely nurse remove my stitches too.

So basically (according to the Daily Mail), we can conclude this thread with the statement 'Cyclists that use disc brakes meet fit birds'.

Sorted.

Or The Sun would just go with

"Heart Braker"

meanredspider

Chris Bass wrote:

essex-commuter wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

essex-commuter wrote:

My neighbour 'Louise the Nurse' removed the stitches for me, she was well fit

Had a lovely nurse remove my stitches too.

So basically (according to the Daily Mail), we can conclude this thread with the statement 'Cyclists that use disc brakes meet fit birds'.

Sorted.

Or The Sun would just go with

"Heart Braker"

Chapeau!

ugo.santalucia

The coach Keanu Reeves was riding in Speed had disc brakes...

It's a no from me

voodooman

MRS - that incident with a sightscreen wasn't about 14 years ago at BAT sports in Totton? Cos I was there when a player slid into the sightscreen and put a 10 mm dint into the lower part of his knee. I can remember the sound and ran over and was nearly sick at the sight.

Oh yeah, discs all the way. Would never go back to the cantilever brakes (got an X-bow and have never used caliper brakes) except for cross where it's part of the "fun". My CAADX has the crappy promax sort... but they work and have only needed the odd fettle. The haul me back and I'm around 100Kg, more with all the commuting gear and laptop etc. Have thought of putting Juin Tech jobbies on but am waiting til the promax are wasted - so far just over 2000km and still on the original pads.

meanredspider

voodooman wrote:

MRS - that incident with a sightscreen wasn't about 14 years ago at BAT sports in Totton? Cos I was there when a player slid into the sightscreen and put a 10 mm dint into the lower part of his knee. I can remember the sound and ran over and was nearly sick at the sight.

Unfortunately, no. Sorry to hear about someone else getting that injury. I've dabbled in lots of sports including rugby and motorsport and that cricket injury is by far the worst. The screen shouldn't have been on the pitch but the boundary was right up against a line of trees.

The funny thing is that I walked back to my position and only looked down after the next ball. My whites beneath my knee were soaked in blood and I inspected my bone. I then asked permission of the umpire to leave the field (such is shock).

rubertoe

Anyone seen any Tiagra Hydraulic groupsets for sale (I actually only need shifters and calipers)?

I can only find 105 hydraulic and for an extra 10 quid I can get Full Ultegra mechanical.

ugo.santalucia

rubertoe wrote:

Anyone seen any Tiagra Hydraulic groupsets for sale (I actually only need shifters and calipers)?

I can only find 105 hydraulic and for an extra 10 quid I can get Full Ultegra mechanical.

As you say, it's priced the same as 105, so my guess is that you won't see many around

veronese68

rubertoe wrote:

Anyone seen any Tiagra Hydraulic groupsets for sale (I actually only need shifters and calipers)?

I can only find 105 hydraulic and for an extra 10 quid I can get Full Ultegra mechanical.

What about selling your complete groupset and going 11 speed. That would offset a fair chunk of the costs. Then for an extra £10 you might as well go Ultegra. After buying the new set and before selling the old you will look at what you have and realise that you only need a frame and a couple of bits to build up a new bike, next thing you know you have achieved n+1.

rubertoe

Hmmmm N+1.... now there is an idea.

milemuncher1

My problem with disc brakes on a road bike are 2 fold. I don't like the thought of riding in a close pack, at speed, with a spinning metal saw blade anywhere near me. They are fine on a mountain bike, or Hybrid, designed to be ridden without a large group around you, and at speeds that are unlikely to result in messy pile ups. My second problem is that manufacturers strive to make the bikes as light as possible, then stick ( relatively heavy ) disc brakes on them. I've turned people away from a fast group, road bike ride I've organised in the past, for turning up on a road bike with disc brakes. It's my circus, my monkeys, I can't be arsed with the paperwork involved if any injuries are caused by the disc brakes.

timothyw

rubertoe wrote:

Anyone seen any Tiagra Hydraulic groupsets for sale (I actually only need shifters and calipers)?

I can only find 105 hydraulic and for an extra 10 quid I can get Full Ultegra mechanical.

This is a good opportunity to call Shimano out actually - the Tiagra 10 speed hydraulics are the least compatible upgrade ever.

For a start, new tiagra has different pull ratio so you need to buy new front and rear derailleurs.

Worse though, it only comes with the 505 flat mount calipers.

You can't adapt flat mount calipers to fit on post mount or IS, so you now need a new frameset.



The good news is that if you are stuck with a ten speed rear wheel, you can use Shimano 11 speed shifters with a 4700 tiagra rear derailleur and it should work - the brifters and 685 calipers will cost you somewhere around the £260-£300 mark, which once you add on new derailleurs is quite a bit of cash to spend on a kaffenback.

veronese68

rubertoe wrote:

Hmmmm N+1.... now there is an idea.

No need to thank me.

Of all the possible risks of riding on the road in a group I really don't think discs are anywhere near the top. But ignorance is king.

meanredspider

Milemuncher1 wrote:

My problem with disc brakes on a road bike are 2 fold. I don't like the thought of riding in a close pack, at speed, with a spinning metal saw blade anywhere near me. They are fine on a mountain bike, or Hybrid, designed to be ridden without a large group around you, and at speeds that are unlikely to result in messy pile ups. My second problem is that manufacturers strive to make the bikes as light as possible, then stick ( relatively heavy ) disc brakes on them. I've turned people away from a fast group, road bike ride I've organised in the past, for turning up on a road bike with disc brakes. It's my circus, my monkeys, I can't be arsed with the paperwork involved if any injuries are caused by the disc brakes.

Utter utter BS. It's too funny.

Did you see the video done where they put the sausage against the spinnning disc? Then put it in the spinning spokes? I hope you don't allow people to ride with spokes on their bike!

ETA - you have absolutely illustrated perfectly for me why I don't do cycling clubs - somebody making the rules up according to their own prejudices as they go along.

Hinaultscrapcousin

Milemuncher1 wrote:

My problem with disc brakes on a road bike are 2 fold. I don't like the thought of riding in a close pack, at speed, with a spinning metal saw blade anywhere near me. They are fine on a mountain bike, or Hybrid, designed to be ridden without a large group around you, and at speeds that are unlikely to result in messy pile ups. My second problem is that manufacturers strive to make the bikes as light as possible, then stick ( relatively heavy ) disc brakes on them. I've turned people away from a fast group, road bike ride I've organised in the past, for turning up on a road bike with disc brakes. It's my circus, my monkeys, I can't be arsed with the paperwork involved if any injuries are caused by the disc brakes.

Circular saw blade:


Hope's new rotor edge:


Shimano bevelled edge rotor (guessing they are tidier now):


As for lightest:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMsgzD-JFQs&t=2s

milemuncher1

meanredspider wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

My problem with disc brakes on a road bike are 2 fold. I don't like the thought of riding in a close pack, at speed, with a spinning metal saw blade anywhere near me. They are fine on a mountain bike, or Hybrid, designed to be ridden without a large group around you, and at speeds that are unlikely to result in messy pile ups. My second problem is that manufacturers strive to make the bikes as light as possible, then stick ( relatively heavy ) disc brakes on them. I've turned people away from a fast group, road bike ride I've organised in the past, for turning up on a road bike with disc brakes. It's my circus, my monkeys, I can't be arsed with the paperwork involved if any injuries are caused by the disc brakes.

Utter utter BS. It's too funny.

.

Really?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/doull-c ... us-injury/

veronese68

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Really?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/doull-c ... us-injury/

Yes, really. How do you get a shoe that far into the wheel when there are spokes in the way. You haven't read the thread have you.

bigmat

Jury is still out on the benefits and the safety issues. A lot of pros are really concerned about the safety issues, but then maybe they are all ignorant and full of BS? If the benefits were really so great then I suspect there would have been far greater uptake in races than there has been, benefits appear marginal at best. Main push seems to be from the manufacturers, eager to encourage us we all desperately need discs and therefore need to replace all our wheels / frames / groupsets. Can't say I'm in any rush.

bigmat

Veronese68 wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Really?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/doull-c ... us-injury/

Yes, really. How do you get a shoe that far into the wheel when there are spokes in the way. You haven't read the thread have you.

Easily, from what I have seen, although it does look like Doull's foot wasn't anywhere near Kittel's bike.

meanredspider

BigMat wrote:

Easily, from what I have seen,

Care to elaborate?

meanredspider

Veronese68 wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Really?

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/doull-c ... us-injury/

Yes, really. How do you get a shoe that far into the wheel when there are spokes in the way. You haven't read the thread have you.

Exactly. As I said, just entirely prejudiced. By why let facts get in the way of a good prejudice?

meanredspider

BigMat wrote:

Main push seems to be from the manufacturers,

Again - I'd quite like to see the evidence of this. Most of what I've seen from manufacturers is pretty balanced. It has, after all, taken them years to get to this point and they have a huge amount tied up in conventional rim brakes.

cookeeemonster

meanredspider wrote:

BigMat wrote:

Main push seems to be from the manufacturers,

Again - I'd quite like to see the evidence of this. Most of what I've seen from manufacturers is pretty balanced. It has, after all, taken them years to get to this point and they have a huge amount tied up in conventional rim brakes.

+1

There are far more rim brake bikes out there to buy new than there are discs. The disc bikes are heavier and pricier, meaning people are less likely to take to them. So why do people see a conspiracy? No one is forcing anyone to buy one, it's no different to the groupset or frame upgrades that happen every year. 99% of people don't buy a new bike just because of that and they wont do here.

Rim brakes and wheels will be available for a very long time yet, why are people losing their s**t so easily

bigmat

meanredspider wrote:

BigMat wrote:

Easily, from what I have seen,

Care to elaborate?

Disc on side of wheel, fairly sure you could just kick it if you wanted to, so follows that it could potentially cut a shoe. I'll have a go in the bike sheds after work. I did see a picture on twitter of someone demonstrating this (a disc convert and Doull incident sceptic FWIW).

bigmat

CookeeeMonster wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

BigMat wrote:

Main push seems to be from the manufacturers,

Again - I'd quite like to see the evidence of this. Most of what I've seen from manufacturers is pretty balanced. It has, after all, taken them years to get to this point and they have a huge amount tied up in conventional rim brakes.

+1

There are far more rim brake bikes out there to buy new than there are discs. The disc bikes are heavier and pricier, meaning people are less likely to take to them. So why do people see a conspiracy? No one is forcing anyone to buy one, it's no different to the groupset or frame upgrades that happen every year. 99% of people don't buy a new bike just because of that and they wont do here.

Rim brakes and wheels will be available for a very long time yet, why are people losing their s**t so easily

Oh come on, its the holy grail for bike manufacturers. Convince people they need disc brakes and you have a huge market of people suddenly believing they need new wheels and new frames - basically new bikes. I couldn't upgrade any of my bikes to discs, I'd have to start from scratch, same as with all my spare wheels. As I've said, I can't really see the point at the moment. On those rare occasions I find myself doing a steep twisty descent in the wet, I'll happily just back off a bit. I don't recall ever having an issue with rim brakes on the commute.

meanredspider

BigMat wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

BigMat wrote:

Easily, from what I have seen,

Care to elaborate?

Disc on side of wheel, fairly sure you could just kick it if you wanted to, so follows that it could potentially cut a shoe. I'll have a go in the bike sheds after work. I did see a picture on twitter of someone demonstrating this (a disc convert and Doull incident sceptic FWIW).

Well I tried it last night. The only way I could replicate a even the possibility of a cut where Doull had his was if my foot wasn't in the shoe. The wheel, fork and spokes are in the way.

meanredspider

BigMat wrote:

Oh come on, its the holy grail for bike manufacturers.

In your opinion. There's no evidence at all that bike manufacturers are pushing discs and none that they are forcing pros to ride them. Didn't I read recently one of the old boys who runs one of the Italian bike companies say he didn't see the point in discs?

In my experience, most of the drive for discs has come from punters trying them and liking them. Like many others, my first non-MTB bike with discs was the Boardman CX Team. The fact that the thread I started back then is still going today suggests how popular the Boardman has been with commuters. Yet, for many manufacturers they're only just in the 2nd year of disc options. It means a big investment in tooling and stock whilst continuing to support rim brakes. For shops it means far more stock requirements - especially because of TA options. Many of us that have tried cable discs would have liked hydro but those have been a long time coming too.

If manufacturers have been pushing it, they've been doing it in very subtle ways.

imatfaal

meanredspider wrote:

BigMat wrote:

meanredspider wrote:

BigMat wrote:

Easily, from what I have seen,

Care to elaborate?

Disc on side of wheel, fairly sure you could just kick it if you wanted to, so follows that it could potentially cut a shoe. I'll have a go in the bike sheds after work. I did see a picture on twitter of someone demonstrating this (a disc convert and Doull incident sceptic FWIW).

Well I tried it last night. The only way I could replicate a even the possibility of a cut where Doull had his was if my foot wasn't in the shoe. The wheel, fork and spokes are in the way.

I too find it hard to see how the disc could have made that direction / position of cut (for one thing my spokes are 23mm from my disc and the cut looks closer than that and side of shoe is unabraded); although crashes are weird and chaotic - so I could countenance it.

I have also tried to cut stuff with a spinning brake disc - and whilst going in from the side is lethal (but so are the spokes when insert is axial), edge on is fairly benign. I span my 140mm (MK's was 160mm) equipped back wheel up to 40kph equivalent - then whilst maintaining rotation with one handed pedalling tried to cut stuff by pressing it into the edge with the other. They just do not go fast enough to cut properly - the tangential velocity will be of the order of 2-4 m/s and rpm maxing at about 10. Grinding away will go through a jiffy envelope - but not in the instant of a chance collision