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  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    imposter2.0 said:

    TheBigBean said:

    Ukrainians have released videos of PoWs speaking which I don't think is allowed.

    The Geneva Convention is your friend here. Filming them and allowing them to speak on camera is allowed. What is not allowed is forcing them to denounce or denigrate their own side - such as the Iraqis did with Adrian Nichol/John Peters and others in Gulf War 1...
    Best not to do it as you don't know what level of coercion has been used
  • imposter2.0
    imposter2.0 Posts: 12,028
    surrey_commuter said:

    rick_chasey said:

    It’s a fake video anyway!

    in the context of a debate about what is the acceptable level of violence to inflict upon a prisoner of war that is irrelevant
    Just to be clear - there is no level of violence which is acceptable, so moot point.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 21,873
    imposter2.0 said:

    TheBigBean said:

    Ukrainians have released videos of PoWs speaking which I don't think is allowed.

    The Geneva Convention is your friend here. Filming them and allowing them to speak on camera is allowed. What is not allowed is forcing them to denounce or denigrate their own side - such as the Iraqis did with Adrian Nichol/John Peters and others in Gulf War 1...
    It's not that clear cut. Prisoners are supposed to be protected against "public curiosity".

    https://fullfact.org/law/prisoners-war-geneva-convention-photographs/
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    imposter2.0 said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    rick_chasey said:

    It’s a fake video anyway!

    in the context of a debate about what is the acceptable level of violence to inflict upon a prisoner of war that is irrelevant
    Just to be clear - there is no level of violence which is acceptable, so moot point.
    that is in your opinion.

    Most accept that this forum is not representative of society but even here we have people who believe that killing them is fine and others who would accept maiming them
  • MattFalle
    MattFalle Posts: 11,644
    imposter2.0 said:

    TheBigBean said:

    Ukrainians have released videos of PoWs speaking which I don't think is allowed.

    The Geneva Convention is your friend here. Filming them and allowing them to speak on camera is allowed. What is not allowed is forcing them to denounce or denigrate their own side - such as the Iraqis did with Adrian Nichol/John Peters and others in Gulf War 1...
    this, exactly.

    no coercion, torture, etc but if Ivan wants to stand up infront of a camera and denounce the war he's allowed to.

    you jyst can't force someone to.
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • john80
    john80 Posts: 2,965
    surrey_commuter said:

    imposter2.0 said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    rick_chasey said:

    It’s a fake video anyway!

    in the context of a debate about what is the acceptable level of violence to inflict upon a prisoner of war that is irrelevant
    Just to be clear - there is no level of violence which is acceptable, so moot point.
    that is in your opinion.

    Most accept that this forum is not representative of society but even here we have people who believe that killing them is fine and others who would accept maiming them
    The pragmatists are likely taking the view that there are significant challenges to sheltering, feeding and securing POW's when you are in a town that is being indiscriminately bombed by an invading army. Given these challenges those POW should be grateful for what they receive and hope that it shows more compassion than they have shown to the population of Ukraine. I don't think anyone is saying that they would get themselves down their to hold the rifle. But as others have said the videos appear to be fake.

    There is a good sign on the wall of Alcatraz prison if you get the chance to visit. You are entitled to food shelter and medical attention. Everything else is a privilege.
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    This Ukrainian soldier is doing a video blog from the front line. His stuff is really good. Ukraine keeping up with its information war.

    Oh and WTF re the bit 1 min 47 in???

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFSG2WU_p4M&t=310s
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,307
    Interesting comments from Zelensky on the UK/Boris:
    https://bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60890199

    Quote:
    "In an interview with the Economist, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has given his view on which Western European countries are helping out or not, in his country's fight against Russia:

    He strongly criticises France's President Emmanuel Macron for failing to provide military support. Why? "Because they are afraid of Russia. And that’s it. And those who say it first are the first to be afraid."
    He says the UK's Boris Johnson has been much keener to send weapons: "Yes. To be honest, Johnson is a leader who is helping more. The leaders of countries react according to how their constituents act. In this case, Johnson is an example.
    Quote Message: Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation." from Volodymyr Zelensky
    Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation."

    Volodymyr Zelensky"

    But of course he must be just saying it so nobody guesses that Boris is really a Russian agent ;)
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195
    I did read a lot about this, and does appear to be pretty widely reported.

    Anyway, there's a lot of nuance to the discussion (I know you don't understand that sort of thing) so not all news has to be negative (or positive, in your case).
  • morstar
    morstar Posts: 6,190
    Useful patsy and Russian agent not necessarily the same thing.
  • MattFalle
    MattFalle Posts: 11,644
    Also good for reelection as that crow Thatcher found out in '82...
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,263
    This is quite an interesting article, and references the '40-mile convoy'.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/the-drone-operators-who-halted-the-russian-armoured-vehicles-heading-for-kyiv
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,307
    shirley_basso said:

    I did read a lot about this, and does appear to be pretty widely reported.

    Anyway, there's a lot of nuance to the discussion (I know you don't understand that sort of thing) so not all news has to be negative (or positive, in your case).

    Are you going to pat on the head as well? :) Beats making a sensible counterpoint, which you could do when you've finished sulking.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    briantrumpet said:

    This is quite an interesting article, and references the '40-mile convoy'.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/the-drone-operators-who-halted-the-russian-armoured-vehicles-heading-for-kyiv

    I was going to post that too. It's fascinating stuff.
  • imposter2.0
    imposter2.0 Posts: 12,028
    edited March 2022
    surrey_commuter said:

    imposter2.0 said:

    surrey_commuter said:

    rick_chasey said:

    It’s a fake video anyway!

    in the context of a debate about what is the acceptable level of violence to inflict upon a prisoner of war that is irrelevant
    Just to be clear - there is no level of violence which is acceptable, so moot point.
    that is in your opinion.

    Most accept that this forum is not representative of society but even here we have people who believe that killing them is fine and others who would accept maiming them
    Maybe so, but worth clarifying that it's also the 'opinion' of the Geneva Convention...which is the point I was making...
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,263
    thegreatdivide said:

    briantrumpet said:

    This is quite an interesting article, and references the '40-mile convoy'.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/the-drone-operators-who-halted-the-russian-armoured-vehicles-heading-for-kyiv

    I was going to post that too. It's fascinating stuff.

    Given the amount of support flooding into Ukraine, a bit surprising that that vector is still rather on its own, given its apparent successes.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,495
    Stevo_666 said:

    Interesting comments from Zelensky on the UK/Boris:
    https://bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60890199

    Quote:
    "In an interview with the Economist, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has given his view on which Western European countries are helping out or not, in his country's fight against Russia:

    He strongly criticises France's President Emmanuel Macron for failing to provide military support. Why? "Because they are afraid of Russia. And that’s it. And those who say it first are the first to be afraid."
    He says the UK's Boris Johnson has been much keener to send weapons: "Yes. To be honest, Johnson is a leader who is helping more. The leaders of countries react according to how their constituents act. In this case, Johnson is an example.
    Quote Message: Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation." from Volodymyr Zelensky
    Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation."

    Volodymyr Zelensky"

    But of course he must be just saying it so nobody guesses that Boris is really a Russian agent ;)

    I think we all knew we were doing well on the arms supply side. Which is great. We're not so hot on the sanctioning as that is where it will hurt us, just as Germany is not so hot on stopping buying Russian gas.

    The only person who has mentioned Johnson being a Russian agent is you.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • thegreatdivide
    thegreatdivide Posts: 5,807
    briantrumpet said:

    thegreatdivide said:

    briantrumpet said:

    This is quite an interesting article, and references the '40-mile convoy'.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/the-drone-operators-who-halted-the-russian-armoured-vehicles-heading-for-kyiv

    I was going to post that too. It's fascinating stuff.

    Given the amount of support flooding into Ukraine, a bit surprising that that vector is still rather on its own, given its apparent successes.
    There have been a few Twitter photos of Mavic DJI deliveries which I think were donated - could have been to these guys.

    That Delta sensor set up sounds very effective too.
  • MattFalle
    MattFalle Posts: 11,644
    I want to say fake vid.

    getting shot hurts wuite a ot - that lot just took it and lay there - no screaming no rolling around, not even holding their legs.
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 21,873
    MattFalle said:

    I want to say fake vid.

    getting shot hurts wuite a ot - that lot just took it and lay there - no screaming no rolling around, not even holding their legs.

    They're not in the premier league.
  • MattFalle
    MattFalle Posts: 11,644
    TheBigBean said:

    MattFalle said:

    I want to say fake vid.

    getting shot hurts wuite a ot - that lot just took it and lay there - no screaming no rolling around, not even holding their legs.

    They're not in the premier league.
    they'd deffo never, ever play for Italy or Portugal....
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • MattFalle
    MattFalle Posts: 11,644
    DeVlaeminck said:

    rjsterry said:

    DeVlaeminck said:

    Video doing the rounds of captured prisoners being shot in the legs to disable them - purportedly Ukrainians on Russian POWs.

    I suppose these are the realities of war.

    Would also be exactly the sort of thing Russia would want people to believe about Ukrainian troops.
    Well yes it is - whether it's genuine and who is doing what to whom and in what context it's hard to be sure.

    This is the longer video - last 20 seconds if you don't mind seeing it - I've never seen anyone shot so can't judge how real this is.

    https://files.catbox.moe/juxmpi.mp4
    2:52.

    bloke "shoots" fella in leg.

    matey boy stands on other side of leg. just standing there, chilled out. total bollox.

    if you're shooting someone i'm going to be nowhere near you. stuff that.

    rounds into a concrete floor - that's ricochet city.

    very, very dubious
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • imposter2.0
    imposter2.0 Posts: 12,028
    Does anyone even say "ow!"..?

  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,461
    imposter2.0 said:

    Does anyone even say "ow!"..?

    Or "I'm hit" in a heroic voice.
  • kingstonian
    kingstonian Posts: 2,847
    briantrumpet said:

    This is quite an interesting article, and references the '40-mile convoy'.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/the-drone-operators-who-halted-the-russian-armoured-vehicles-heading-for-kyiv

    Thanks for sharing the article
  • davidof
    davidof Posts: 3,114
    john80 said:

    Have a read of Allied war crimes in WWII on Wikipedia for starters.


    yes, it rather confirms my point:

    Held and killed by the Allied powers
    German POWs in East European (not including the Soviet Union) hands 32.9%
    German soldiers held by Soviet Union: 15–33%
    Italian soldiers held by the Soviet Union: 79%
    Japanese POWs held by Soviet Union: 10%
    German POWs in British hands 0.03%
    German POWs in American hands 0.15%
    German POWs in French hands 2.58%
    Japanese POWs in Chinese hands: 24%
    BASI Nordic Ski Instructor
    Instagramme
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 61,307
    rjsterry said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    Interesting comments from Zelensky on the UK/Boris:
    https://bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60890199

    Quote:
    "In an interview with the Economist, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has given his view on which Western European countries are helping out or not, in his country's fight against Russia:

    He strongly criticises France's President Emmanuel Macron for failing to provide military support. Why? "Because they are afraid of Russia. And that’s it. And those who say it first are the first to be afraid."
    He says the UK's Boris Johnson has been much keener to send weapons: "Yes. To be honest, Johnson is a leader who is helping more. The leaders of countries react according to how their constituents act. In this case, Johnson is an example.
    Quote Message: Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation." from Volodymyr Zelensky
    Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation."

    Volodymyr Zelensky"

    But of course he must be just saying it so nobody guesses that Boris is really a Russian agent ;)

    I think we all knew we were doing well on the arms supply side. Which is great. We're not so hot on the sanctioning as that is where it will hurt us, just as Germany is not so hot on stopping buying Russian gas.

    The only person who has mentioned Johnson being a Russian agent is you.
    A slight exaggeration to make the point as I'm sure you are aware. Still no evidence from Ms. Basso though...
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,691
    edited March 2022
    Pic incoming...

    Anyway. back to the subject. Sounds like there may be more good news on the ground.



    plus

    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,495
    edited March 2022
    Stevo_666 said:

    rjsterry said:

    Stevo_666 said:

    Interesting comments from Zelensky on the UK/Boris:
    https://bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60890199

    Quote:
    "In an interview with the Economist, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has given his view on which Western European countries are helping out or not, in his country's fight against Russia:

    He strongly criticises France's President Emmanuel Macron for failing to provide military support. Why? "Because they are afraid of Russia. And that’s it. And those who say it first are the first to be afraid."
    He says the UK's Boris Johnson has been much keener to send weapons: "Yes. To be honest, Johnson is a leader who is helping more. The leaders of countries react according to how their constituents act. In this case, Johnson is an example.
    Quote Message: Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation." from Volodymyr Zelensky
    Britain is definitely on our side. It is not performing a balancing act. Britain sees no alternative for the way out of the situation."

    Volodymyr Zelensky"

    But of course he must be just saying it so nobody guesses that Boris is really a Russian agent ;)

    I think we all knew we were doing well on the arms supply side. Which is great. We're not so hot on the sanctioning as that is where it will hurt us, just as Germany is not so hot on stopping buying Russian gas.

    The only person who has mentioned Johnson being a Russian agent is you.
    A slight exaggeration to make the point as I'm sure you are aware. Still no evidence from Ms. Basso though...
    No evidence for the thing nobody has claimed apart from you, no.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,691
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver

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