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...or. to be slightly more clear, there are an awful lot of political theories that seem to hit the rocks rather badly when they intersect with reality - hence the number of academic economists, even nobel prize winning ones, who still do things like write letters to the Guardian rather quaintly insisting that the world is flat because their theories state that it must be.
Can you tell me which one of Paul Krugman's theories have hit the rocks rather badly?0 -
John McDonennell appointed shadow chancellor - the lunatics have take over the asylum. Here's a few of his previous statement and views on policy: :shock:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/john-mcdonnell-profile-jeremy-corbyns-new-shadow-chancellor-who-once-said-he-wanted-to-assassinate-margaret-thatcher-10499474.html
@ mamba, I will answer your point later although you need to understand supply and demand
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Nope, you're reading too much into that finchy. Some people may well have good personal reasons to vote for him - trade union members, long term unemployed etc?^^^ Stevo, you're implying people are stupid for supporting Corbyn. Seeing as a couple of forum members have already said that they will vote for him, are you really denying that you have resorted to insults on this thread?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
A Jeremy Corbyn lead labour party is so totally unelectable, the right wing press/media feel the need to start what will no doubt be a four year plus hatchet job on him?
It's a bit like myself kicking the sh1t out out of a blind man in a wheel chair, why would I do that?Tail end Charlie
The above post may contain traces of sarcasm or/and bullsh*t.0 -
John McDonennell appointed shadow chancellor - the lunatics have take over the asylum. Here's a few of his previous statement and views on policy: :shock:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/john-mcdonnell-profile-jeremy-corbyns-new-shadow-chancellor-who-once-said-he-wanted-to-assassinate-margaret-thatcher-10499474.html
@ mamba, I will answer your point later although you need to understand supply and demand
theres alot more than one point you failed to address and i know plenty about supply and demand, which is why everyone and his dog is trying to get on the buy to let gravy train (funded by housing benefit, in turn funded by the likes of me and you on 40%)
i m just thinking "which beer or more, shall i have when stevo's buying"
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"The lady doth protest too much, methinks" The lady in this case being the press and Tories.A Jeremy Corbyn lead labour party is so totally unelectable, the right wing press/media feel the need to start what will no doubt be a four year plus hatchet job on him?
It's a bit like myself kicking the sh1t out out of a blind man in a wheel chair.
If he is that bad why bother? Give him enough rope.....
Or, they are worried and are getting their retaliation in early.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Corbyns agenda hasn't evolved since he entered Parliament nor has basic economics.
The only difference is, Maggie was correct.“Give a man a fish and feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and feed him for a lifetime. Teach a man to cycle and he will realize fishing is stupid and boring”
Desmond Tutu0 -
Not really, it's just business as usual in politics. If the press are as right wing as you say (excluding maybe the Guardian, Independent, Mirror and the whole of the BBC) then what do you expect them to do, be nice to him? Ditto the Conservatives, it's just business as usual in Westminster.
"The lady doth protest too much, methinks" The lady in this case being the press and Tories.A Jeremy Corbyn lead labour party is so totally unelectable, the right wing press/media feel the need to start what will no doubt be a four year plus hatchet job on him?
It's a bit like myself kicking the sh1t out out of a blind man in a wheel chair.
If he is that bad why bother? Give him enough rope.....
Or, they are worried and are getting their retaliation in early.
I am totally relaxed about Corbyn leading Labour, in fact I love it. But giving him a kicking is just good sport, in a 'shooting fish in a barrel' sort of way."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
They could at least wait until he comes up with a manifesto.Not really, it's just business as usual in politics. If the press are as right wing as you say (excluding maybe the Guardian, Independent, Mirror and the whole of the BBC) then what do you expect them to do, be nice to him? Ditto the Conservatives, it's just business as usual in Westminster.
I am totally relaxed about Corbyn leading Labour, in fact I love it. But giving him a kicking is just good sport, in a 'shooting fish in a barrel' sort of way.
Fair game after that, but until then it is all just stuff and nonsense.
The BBC are an interesting example. Everybody thinks they are for the other side. I suppose that means they are getting it right. :? :?:
Bored of the subject now.....The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Asking so many questions I dont have time to answer them all, does not make you rightJohn McDonennell appointed shadow chancellor - the lunatics have take over the asylum. Here's a few of his previous statement and views on policy: :shock:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/john-mcdonnell-profile-jeremy-corbyns-new-shadow-chancellor-who-once-said-he-wanted-to-assassinate-margaret-thatcher-10499474.html
@ mamba, I will answer your point later although you need to understand supply and demand
theres alot more than one point you failed to address and i know plenty about supply and demand, which is why everyone and his dog is trying to get on the buy to let gravy train (funded by housing benefit, in turn funded by the likes of me and you on 40%)
i m just thinking "which beer or more, shall i have when stevo's buying" I'm a busy boy and tax doesnt just save itself.
Your evidence thay buy to let is a gravy train is what? Many are simply trying to grt a decent return on their money or create a pension pot. Why penalise that? Sounds like politics of envy.
Anyway, on supply and demand re the private tenant right to buy and also the expected rent controls. As youre a supply and demand literate type this will be pretty easy to understand.
- Rent controls will reduce the return from rentals and in some cases make it uneconomic to rent a property.
- Private tenants right to buy means that a private landlords wil, have no control over when they have to give up their assets, and by implication no control over the price (otherwise they would just overprice the property to prevent a sale).
If I were a private landlord I would sell up and get out while I have control on price and timing. The result is a large decrease in rented housing availability with no change in demand. And as many wanting to rent will either not want to buy or not be able to afford to buy, result will be both an increase in homelessness and reduced labour mobility. It wil, also add to upward pressure on rental prices. The opposite effects from what is intended.
And do tell us, where will the state get all the cash to take these properties into public ownership? Or build enough tk replace the loss of private stock in the timescale that the landlord exit the market?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
If a lot of rental properties hit the market due to the landlords having the same idea Stevo has would property prices rise, lower or just stagnate? If prices drop would it make them more affordable? I doubt it but reckon a certain reduction in property prices which probably has a negative effect on the economy nonetheless.
I nearly bought to let as a student with my parent's help. It was a reasonable way to reduce the cost of university. We didn't because I couldn't find a property that was right. My parents nearly bought a property closer to home where a newer uni was rapidly expanding. I'm sure there's a.lot who get into rental to create income or for savings. Rent to cover mortgage while house prices go up making.you real money I guess is one theory for some. People taking risk to strive for better financial security.0 -
Diane Abbott on the front bench. :shock: :shock: :shock: 0
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Not the same Socialist Diane Abbott who sent her own kids to private education to give them the best chance in life. Who criticised Harriet Harman and Tony Blair for sending their kids to selective schools then you went and sent her own to a fee-paying one?? You couldn't make it upDiane Abbott on the front bench. :shock: :shock: :shock:
All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....0 -
Yeah that's the one who claimed that at her local hospital "blonde, blue-eyed Finnish girls" were unsuitable as nurses because they had "never met a black person before"
That British invented racism.
White people play divide and rule.
That's the one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbott0 -
Yeah that's the one who claimed that at her local hospital "blonde, blue-eyed Finnish girls" were unsuitable as nurses because they had "never met a black person before"
That British invented racism.
White people play divide and rule.
That's the one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbott
jeez talk about hyprocrisy, in another thread you berate people for expecting a better moral std from our mp' s involved in what is basically theft but quite happy to criticise someone over their choice of school??? :roll:
Abbott is not in power and all your doing is mug slinging, unlike say Hunt or Gove who have single handed managed to pee off whole professions.
Kids have one shot at life and if i my local school was awful or my child was being bullied, then (if i could afford it) i d send then to a fee paying school, whats important is to raise the std for all kids.
fwiw worth, i cant stand her either!0 -
Yeah that's the one who claimed that at her local hospital "blonde, blue-eyed Finnish girls" were unsuitable as nurses because they had "never met a black person before"
That British invented racism.
White people play divide and rule.
That's the one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbott
jeez talk about hyprocrisy, in another thread you berate people for expecting a better moral std from our mp' s involved in what is basically theft but quite happy to criticise someone over their choice of school??? :roll:
Abbott is not in power and all your doing is mug slinging, unlike say Hunt or Gove who have single handed managed to pee off whole professions.
Kids have one shot at life and if i my local school was awful or my child was being bullied, then (if i could afford it) i d send then to a fee paying school, whats important is to raise the std for all kids.
fwiw worth, i cant stand her either!
Did you read the article?
She criticised other members of her party for sending their kids to private education, then she did the same thing herself. Even Corbyn, fell out with his first wife because she wanted their child to go private and he insisted they went comprehensive Whether you agree with him or not he stood by his principles and political views. Abbott is a political chancer who'll talk socialism and happily eat off a capitalist table, who'll take payment and fail to declare it, an inverted racist. No time for her whatsoeverAll lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....0 -
Sorry mamba, we forgot that we are not allowed to be nasty to JC or any of his leftie apostles as that's just right wing bias isn't it. Nothing to do with their stated views, policies, previous track record or clear hypocrisy on certain issues :roll:Yeah that's the one who claimed that at her local hospital "blonde, blue-eyed Finnish girls" were unsuitable as nurses because they had "never met a black person before"
That British invented racism.
White people play divide and rule.
That's the one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbott
jeez talk about hyprocrisy, in another thread you berate people for expecting a better moral std from our mp' s involved in what is basically theft but quite happy to criticise someone over their choice of school??? :roll:
Abbott is not in power and all your doing is mug slinging, unlike say Hunt or Gove who have single handed managed to pee off whole professions.
Kids have one shot at life and if i my local school was awful or my child was being bullied, then (if i could afford it) i d send then to a fee paying school, whats important is to raise the std for all kids.
fwiw worth, i cant stand her either!
What are your views on John McDonnell? (see my link above). Here's another one link in case you 'forgot' the last one.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/11863279/John-McDonnells-top-six-political-blunders.html
Not exactly ideal material for a senior appointment in a supposedly mainstream political party and according to you, someone who has a good chance of being chancellor of the exchequer in 2020. Would you not agree?
PS: when will you reply to my questions above? "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Many are simply trying to grt a decent return on their money or create a pension pot. Why penalise that? Sounds like politics of envy.
Penalise is an emotive word. Legislation is what governments are required to provide. The prevailing mindset of governments in recent years is that rising property values above normal inflation is necessary to keep well heeled voters on side.
Whilst it is hugely beneficial to many, it is completely artificial as it is fuelled by housing benefit. In the long term, it is causing huge social disparity. Legislation should be put in place to redress the imbalance.
As a society, we'd be much better off if property prices dropped and the market re-aligned itself. Houses won't be cheap as a result of any short term fix as there are supply issues. But simply owning a home is not a right to free savings growth. Unfortunately, that is how it is treated.0 -
It's also a free country and you can (at least for now) invest your money how you want.Many are simply trying to grt a decent return on their money or create a pension pot. Why penalise that? Sounds like politics of envy.
Penalise is an emotive word. Legislation is what governments are required to provide. The prevailing mindset of governments in recent years is that rising property values above normal inflation is necessary to keep well heeled voters on side.
Whilst it is hugely beneficial to many, it is completely artificial as it is fuelled by housing benefit. In the long term, it is causing huge social disparity. Legislation should be put in place to redress the imbalance.
As a society, we'd be much better off if property prices dropped and the market re-aligned itself. Houses won't be cheap as a result of any short term fix as there are supply issues. But simply owning a home is not a right to free savings growth. Unfortunately, that is how it is treated.
What legislation would you propose that would successfully override the law of supply and demand in the housing market?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Disposess all the kulaks, of courseWhat legislation would you propose that would successfully override the law of supply and demand in the housing market?0 -
All in the name of fairness of course...
Disposess all the kulaks, of courseWhat legislation would you propose that would successfully override the law of supply and demand in the housing market?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
your politics has led to 2 pointless wars (3 if you inc libya) ,billions of dollars wasted and large numbers of lives lost, the migration crisis we see now has its roots in the failed wars of bush, balir and cameron and what do you say to that? water on under the bridge, move on, to the families of british soldiers killed/ maimed or ex service men living in hostels or having topped themselves... not quite so easy.
housing? you dont listen or address the fact that speculators are profiting from the state, hardly capitalism at its best.
private rents up 20% in the s/w this year alone, how high should they rise? would a 100% increase be enough or 200% ? after all the state will pick up the bill wont it?
Your assumption that a move to building more social housing will lead to mass homelessness is rubbish, makes no sense at all.
As for mcdonald, never heard of him til yesterday, his take on mrs T is hardly unique and like abbotts views, they are meaningless, these people are not in power so cannot change anything can they? why so hot under the collar?0 -
housing? you dont listen or address the fact that speculators are profiting from the state, hardly capitalism at its best.
private rents up 20% in the s/w this year alone, how high should they rise? would a 100% increase be enough or 200% ? after all the state will pick up the bill wont it?
Your assumption that a move to building more social housing will lead to mass homelessness is rubbish, makes no sense at all.
It's OK for BTL landlords to accept state welfare, it's only when the working classes and unemployed do it that it's a problem. Saying otherwise is the politics of envy and class hate and delusional leftybollox or something innit.0 -
I fail to understand how anyone can be passionate about their support of the Tories when
traditionally the Tories serve a wealthy elite to which most of their supporters do not belong.
The political wing of the hedge fund industry, some call them.
Look at other nations, especially in northern Europe. Many are wealthier, more equal, with better industries, salaries, pensions, infrastructure, welfare, parental leave, etc. Britain is doing ok at reining in its deficit but it is still characterised by e.g. life chances dependent on where you were born, under-investment in education, apathy towards educational advancement and skills training. developing new job opportunities, etc.
I don't care in the long run if Jeremy Corbyn crashes and burns, so long as he tears down some of
Britain's sacred cows of inequality before he does, because there are still way too many of them.
British inequality is like race politics in America i.e. the citizens never discuss it but it is the thing foreigners notice the most.0 -
To be fair to the Tories, Osborne's new tax rules on BTL landlords might just go some way to solving the problem.0
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A lot of lefties here are falling into the old trap of thinking that left = "for the many" and right = "for the few".
The fact is that capitalism and free markets have created vastly more prosperity, for vastly more people, than socialism - which, in all its history, has created pretty much zero prosperity for zero people (apart from the party elites, of course ;-))
It is entirely rational to believe that free markets are the best solution to poverty - and as a consequence, the pathetic, caricatured, stereotyping cliche that people who advocate it are either selfish or serfs who inexplicably fawn before their masters is simply a ridiculous slur.
PS - Alain's wheeling out the old myth that northern Europe is a paradise of socialist prosperity and equality: have a look at Scandinavian Unexceptionalism0 -
A lot of lefties here are falling into the old trap of thinking that left = "for the many" and right = "for the few".
The fact is that capitalism and free markets have created vastly more prosperity, for vastly more people, than socialism - which, in all its history, has created pretty much zero prosperity for zero people (apart from the party elites, of course ;-))
It is entirely rational to believe that free markets are the best solution to poverty - and as a consequence, the pathetic, caricatured, stereotyping cliche that people who advocate it are either selfish or serfs who inexplicably fawn before their masters is simply a ridiculous slur.
PS - Alain's wheeling out the old myth that northern Europe is a paradise of socialist prosperity and equality: have a look at Scandinavian Unexceptionalism
1) The actions of radical political movements in the past has allowed for ordinary people to share in that wealth that we all create.
2) The basic unit of a socialist economy would be the cooperative. There are millions of these around the world, delivering food, manufactured goods, services...
3) The "socialist" governments weren't socialist. They were just power-mad dictators that didn't allow the workers any say in economic matters whatsoever, and even banned independent trade unions.
4) Conservative does not necessarily mean neoliberal. My grandparents are lifelong Tory voters, but they don't support Thatcherism, they are more of the old school 1 nation Tories. So you are right, that not all conservatives are evil, heartless and selfish, but you've got to ask yourself why a Tory politician managed to land her party with the label "The Nasty Party".0 -
"but you've got to ask yourself why a Tory politician managed to land her party with the label "The Nasty Party"
Obvious really. Treat coal miners like dirt and treat labour as dispensible, while testing your radical policies on them.0 -
A lot of lefties here are falling into the old trap of thinking that left = "for the many" and right = "for the few".
The fact is that capitalism and free markets have created vastly more prosperity, for vastly more people, than socialism - which, in all its history, has created pretty much zero prosperity for zero people (apart from the party elites, of course ;-))
It is entirely rational to believe that free markets are the best solution to poverty - and as a consequence, the pathetic, caricatured, stereotyping cliche that people who advocate it are either selfish or serfs who inexplicably fawn before their masters is simply a ridiculous slur.
PS - Alain's wheeling out the old myth that northern Europe is a paradise of socialist prosperity and equality: have a look at Scandinavian Unexceptionalism
Think it's fair to say the Conservative party do not have monopoly over capitalist ideas, and the experience of the last 20 years in the UK demonstrates such.
Labour are accused from all sides for being too comfortable with the very sharp end of capitalism, with one senior member being "intensely comfortable with people being filthy rich " so I think you can take your straw man down.
No one here is arguing for the end of capitalism, even that extreme guy Corbyn put in as his right hand man.
If he does he won't last long for obvious reasons, so don't start making out people on the UK left are suddenly Bolsheviks.0 -
Yeah that's the one who claimed that at her local hospital "blonde, blue-eyed Finnish girls" were unsuitable as nurses because they had "never met a black person before"
That British invented racism.
White people play divide and rule.
That's the one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diane_Abbott
jeez talk about hyprocrisy, in another thread you berate people for expecting a better moral std from our mp' s involved in what is basically theft but quite happy to criticise someone over their choice of school??? :roll:
Abbott is not in power and all your doing is mug slinging, unlike say Hunt or Gove who have single handed managed to pee off whole professions.
Kids have one shot at life and if i my local school was awful or my child was being bullied, then (if i could afford it) i d send then to a fee paying school, whats important is to raise the std for all kids.
fwiw worth, i cant stand her either!
Berate? I said that MPs should pay back any money at the first time of asking and I postedBe they are shagging around, whatever sexual persuasion, prone to the odd risque comment - so what? If they are doing the job properly then fine.
What she did was rank hypocrisy and her expressed views were overtly racist. I still don't care about her private life but I do not respect a racist hypocrite.0
