BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
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https://www.bcpcouncil.gov.uk/Contact-us/Report-fraud/Report-council-employee-and-contractor-corruption-and-fraud.aspxmr_goo said:
You need to furnish the planning officer with a nice fat brown envelope. BCP planning department and it's associated councillors are notorious for being corrupt.Pross said:
I'm surprised anything gets built in BCP. I had some dialogue with a person there who seemed helpful at first but has now failed to answer a simple question for 5 weeks despite repeat chasing which is stopping anything being designed let alone built (education scheme not housing).mr_goo said:Lots of houses being built in the greater BCP area. Mostly to accommodate those pesky London commuters that no longer have to travel into the city for work. I blame MS Teams.
Keep away you skinny macchiato lovers.0 -
The junctions tend to be at primary routes, the problem is that the local routes have become so congested and slow that people use the motorways despite them not being the direct and intended route.kingstongraham said:
I'd agree with that. Motorways are full of local traffic around cities.rjsterry said:
So we now need a motorway with no connections to the surroundings? I grew up a couple of miles from the M4/M5 interchange. Bank Holiday jams on the M5 have been happening for at least the last 40-odd years; long before most of these housing developments were built.john80 said:
The guys that commute on the m5 might have a different take on this. We allowed an excessive number of junctions and housing developments next to them. Should we then deliver a rubbish experience when you use them as well.rjsterry said:
Building more motorways for the couple of weekends a year that everyone wants to drive to Cornwall is about as daft as it gets.john80 said:
M6 version two slap bang down the middle of the country. More roads into Cornwall or any other areas where there is congestion.surrey_commuter said:
I am not against building motorways but do think you get more bang for your buck upgrading existing routes, like the A14 you mentioned.john80 said:
Every freight train I have ever seen pulling loads is a couple of diesel locomotives. Not sure that is the green answer you are looking for. When we all have electric vehicles and most of our power comes from carbon free sources why are we bothered about trains when they don't take those outside cities from door to door. This is the elephant in the room the greens miss in that if technology makes something green then they lose their objection. Why not another motorway when everything on it is green for example.elbowloh said:
Your experience is completely wrong, which is why we're investing in rail.rick_chasey said:I get that we are in a sort of neo victorian world where we have to rely on a few ultra rich benefactors to make interesting technological developments and blame the poor for their own poverty, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised everyone gets a hard on over rail.
My experience of rail is that it is abhorrently expensive and British rail cannot cope with any increased demand, and any attempt to improve capacity is met with shrieking nimbyism that massively increases the cost of it.
Plus we need to if we want to meet climate change targets.
Where would you build new motorway (s)
The M25 is 5 or 6 lanes in each direction in places now and still comes to a halt regularly. There is no motorway that can be built that won't fill up with traffic as soon as it's open.
I'd like to see more large park and ride facilities at key motorway junctions so that people can get to the edges of the city and then make use of public transport within the city itself. They could be built with charging stations to future proof them. Cheap all day parking and a good network of bus / tram routes into the key city centre destinations plus a chance to keep your electric car charged up. As it stands I think the large scale electric car charging stations are going to end up being commercial ventures (I've worked on one in a fairly random location where the amount of charging stations was reduced and other "facilities" increased as soon as the initial planning consent was obatined!) but should really be the sort of thing Government are looking to do to get down to net zero.0 -
Do you have stats for whether park and ride schemes work? Kingston run one at Xmas using the car park at Chessington World of Adventures and it never looks busy. My thought is that the journey into town would have to be quicke than by car to outweigh the inconvenience.Pross said:
The junctions tend to be at primary routes, the problem is that the local routes have become so congested and slow that people use the motorways despite them not being the direct and intended route.kingstongraham said:
I'd agree with that. Motorways are full of local traffic around cities.rjsterry said:
So we now need a motorway with no connections to the surroundings? I grew up a couple of miles from the M4/M5 interchange. Bank Holiday jams on the M5 have been happening for at least the last 40-odd years; long before most of these housing developments were built.john80 said:
The guys that commute on the m5 might have a different take on this. We allowed an excessive number of junctions and housing developments next to them. Should we then deliver a rubbish experience when you use them as well.rjsterry said:
Building more motorways for the couple of weekends a year that everyone wants to drive to Cornwall is about as daft as it gets.john80 said:
M6 version two slap bang down the middle of the country. More roads into Cornwall or any other areas where there is congestion.surrey_commuter said:
I am not against building motorways but do think you get more bang for your buck upgrading existing routes, like the A14 you mentioned.john80 said:
Every freight train I have ever seen pulling loads is a couple of diesel locomotives. Not sure that is the green answer you are looking for. When we all have electric vehicles and most of our power comes from carbon free sources why are we bothered about trains when they don't take those outside cities from door to door. This is the elephant in the room the greens miss in that if technology makes something green then they lose their objection. Why not another motorway when everything on it is green for example.elbowloh said:
Your experience is completely wrong, which is why we're investing in rail.rick_chasey said:I get that we are in a sort of neo victorian world where we have to rely on a few ultra rich benefactors to make interesting technological developments and blame the poor for their own poverty, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised everyone gets a hard on over rail.
My experience of rail is that it is abhorrently expensive and British rail cannot cope with any increased demand, and any attempt to improve capacity is met with shrieking nimbyism that massively increases the cost of it.
Plus we need to if we want to meet climate change targets.
Where would you build new motorway (s)
The M25 is 5 or 6 lanes in each direction in places now and still comes to a halt regularly. There is no motorway that can be built that won't fill up with traffic as soon as it's open.
I'd like to see more large park and ride facilities at key motorway junctions so that people can get to the edges of the city and then make use of public transport within the city itself. They could be built with charging stations to future proof them. Cheap all day parking and a good network of bus / tram routes into the key city centre destinations plus a chance to keep your electric car charged up. As it stands I think the large scale electric car charging stations are going to end up being commercial ventures (I've worked on one in a fairly random location where the amount of charging stations was reduced and other "facilities" increased as soon as the initial planning consent was obatined!) but should really be the sort of thing Government are looking to do to get down to net zero.0 -
They work in Cambridge. Used all over the place.surrey_commuter said:
Do you have stats for whether park and ride schemes work? Kingston run one at Xmas using the car park at Chessington World of Adventures and it never looks busy. My thought is that the journey into town would have to be quicke than by car to outweigh the inconvenience.Pross said:
The junctions tend to be at primary routes, the problem is that the local routes have become so congested and slow that people use the motorways despite them not being the direct and intended route.kingstongraham said:
I'd agree with that. Motorways are full of local traffic around cities.rjsterry said:
So we now need a motorway with no connections to the surroundings? I grew up a couple of miles from the M4/M5 interchange. Bank Holiday jams on the M5 have been happening for at least the last 40-odd years; long before most of these housing developments were built.john80 said:
The guys that commute on the m5 might have a different take on this. We allowed an excessive number of junctions and housing developments next to them. Should we then deliver a rubbish experience when you use them as well.rjsterry said:
Building more motorways for the couple of weekends a year that everyone wants to drive to Cornwall is about as daft as it gets.john80 said:
M6 version two slap bang down the middle of the country. More roads into Cornwall or any other areas where there is congestion.surrey_commuter said:
I am not against building motorways but do think you get more bang for your buck upgrading existing routes, like the A14 you mentioned.john80 said:
Every freight train I have ever seen pulling loads is a couple of diesel locomotives. Not sure that is the green answer you are looking for. When we all have electric vehicles and most of our power comes from carbon free sources why are we bothered about trains when they don't take those outside cities from door to door. This is the elephant in the room the greens miss in that if technology makes something green then they lose their objection. Why not another motorway when everything on it is green for example.elbowloh said:
Your experience is completely wrong, which is why we're investing in rail.rick_chasey said:I get that we are in a sort of neo victorian world where we have to rely on a few ultra rich benefactors to make interesting technological developments and blame the poor for their own poverty, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised everyone gets a hard on over rail.
My experience of rail is that it is abhorrently expensive and British rail cannot cope with any increased demand, and any attempt to improve capacity is met with shrieking nimbyism that massively increases the cost of it.
Plus we need to if we want to meet climate change targets.
Where would you build new motorway (s)
The M25 is 5 or 6 lanes in each direction in places now and still comes to a halt regularly. There is no motorway that can be built that won't fill up with traffic as soon as it's open.
I'd like to see more large park and ride facilities at key motorway junctions so that people can get to the edges of the city and then make use of public transport within the city itself. They could be built with charging stations to future proof them. Cheap all day parking and a good network of bus / tram routes into the key city centre destinations plus a chance to keep your electric car charged up. As it stands I think the large scale electric car charging stations are going to end up being commercial ventures (I've worked on one in a fairly random location where the amount of charging stations was reduced and other "facilities" increased as soon as the initial planning consent was obatined!) but should really be the sort of thing Government are looking to do to get down to net zero.
Though the incentives are aligned. Cambridge city centre is basically shut to cars and you have to drive around the centre to get anywhere, and the parking is at a real premium. You'd spend an absolute fortune if you parked in the centre every day.0 -
What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.0 -
Bath seems to make a good go of it.surrey_commuter said:
Do you have stats for whether park and ride schemes work? Kingston run one at Xmas using the car park at Chessington World of Adventures and it never looks busy. My thought is that the journey into town would have to be quicke than by car to outweigh the inconvenience.Pross said:
The junctions tend to be at primary routes, the problem is that the local routes have become so congested and slow that people use the motorways despite them not being the direct and intended route.kingstongraham said:
I'd agree with that. Motorways are full of local traffic around cities.rjsterry said:
So we now need a motorway with no connections to the surroundings? I grew up a couple of miles from the M4/M5 interchange. Bank Holiday jams on the M5 have been happening for at least the last 40-odd years; long before most of these housing developments were built.john80 said:
The guys that commute on the m5 might have a different take on this. We allowed an excessive number of junctions and housing developments next to them. Should we then deliver a rubbish experience when you use them as well.rjsterry said:
Building more motorways for the couple of weekends a year that everyone wants to drive to Cornwall is about as daft as it gets.john80 said:
M6 version two slap bang down the middle of the country. More roads into Cornwall or any other areas where there is congestion.surrey_commuter said:
I am not against building motorways but do think you get more bang for your buck upgrading existing routes, like the A14 you mentioned.john80 said:
Every freight train I have ever seen pulling loads is a couple of diesel locomotives. Not sure that is the green answer you are looking for. When we all have electric vehicles and most of our power comes from carbon free sources why are we bothered about trains when they don't take those outside cities from door to door. This is the elephant in the room the greens miss in that if technology makes something green then they lose their objection. Why not another motorway when everything on it is green for example.elbowloh said:
Your experience is completely wrong, which is why we're investing in rail.rick_chasey said:I get that we are in a sort of neo victorian world where we have to rely on a few ultra rich benefactors to make interesting technological developments and blame the poor for their own poverty, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised everyone gets a hard on over rail.
My experience of rail is that it is abhorrently expensive and British rail cannot cope with any increased demand, and any attempt to improve capacity is met with shrieking nimbyism that massively increases the cost of it.
Plus we need to if we want to meet climate change targets.
Where would you build new motorway (s)
The M25 is 5 or 6 lanes in each direction in places now and still comes to a halt regularly. There is no motorway that can be built that won't fill up with traffic as soon as it's open.
I'd like to see more large park and ride facilities at key motorway junctions so that people can get to the edges of the city and then make use of public transport within the city itself. They could be built with charging stations to future proof them. Cheap all day parking and a good network of bus / tram routes into the key city centre destinations plus a chance to keep your electric car charged up. As it stands I think the large scale electric car charging stations are going to end up being commercial ventures (I've worked on one in a fairly random location where the amount of charging stations was reduced and other "facilities" increased as soon as the initial planning consent was obatined!) but should really be the sort of thing Government are looking to do to get down to net zero.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I think your last sentence is the crux of it. The parking has to be in a good location and the services into the destination have to be very convenient. The Bristol services are quite well used I think but some of the sites are located where you've already done the main battle of the car journey and I went to use one once and the payment on the bus wasn't covenient (needed cash or their own app), I suspect this may have changed now as my local out-of-date bus service that used to require exact cash payment now takes contactless at last. It needs a bit of a carrot and stick approach as with a lot of public transport options so make it a cheaper option and at least equally convenient and then gradually start making it more punitive to try to keep driving into the centre.surrey_commuter said:
Do you have stats for whether park and ride schemes work? Kingston run one at Xmas using the car park at Chessington World of Adventures and it never looks busy. My thought is that the journey into town would have to be quicke than by car to outweigh the inconvenience.Pross said:
The junctions tend to be at primary routes, the problem is that the local routes have become so congested and slow that people use the motorways despite them not being the direct and intended route.kingstongraham said:
I'd agree with that. Motorways are full of local traffic around cities.rjsterry said:
So we now need a motorway with no connections to the surroundings? I grew up a couple of miles from the M4/M5 interchange. Bank Holiday jams on the M5 have been happening for at least the last 40-odd years; long before most of these housing developments were built.john80 said:
The guys that commute on the m5 might have a different take on this. We allowed an excessive number of junctions and housing developments next to them. Should we then deliver a rubbish experience when you use them as well.rjsterry said:
Building more motorways for the couple of weekends a year that everyone wants to drive to Cornwall is about as daft as it gets.john80 said:
M6 version two slap bang down the middle of the country. More roads into Cornwall or any other areas where there is congestion.surrey_commuter said:
I am not against building motorways but do think you get more bang for your buck upgrading existing routes, like the A14 you mentioned.john80 said:
Every freight train I have ever seen pulling loads is a couple of diesel locomotives. Not sure that is the green answer you are looking for. When we all have electric vehicles and most of our power comes from carbon free sources why are we bothered about trains when they don't take those outside cities from door to door. This is the elephant in the room the greens miss in that if technology makes something green then they lose their objection. Why not another motorway when everything on it is green for example.elbowloh said:
Your experience is completely wrong, which is why we're investing in rail.rick_chasey said:I get that we are in a sort of neo victorian world where we have to rely on a few ultra rich benefactors to make interesting technological developments and blame the poor for their own poverty, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised everyone gets a hard on over rail.
My experience of rail is that it is abhorrently expensive and British rail cannot cope with any increased demand, and any attempt to improve capacity is met with shrieking nimbyism that massively increases the cost of it.
Plus we need to if we want to meet climate change targets.
Where would you build new motorway (s)
The M25 is 5 or 6 lanes in each direction in places now and still comes to a halt regularly. There is no motorway that can be built that won't fill up with traffic as soon as it's open.
I'd like to see more large park and ride facilities at key motorway junctions so that people can get to the edges of the city and then make use of public transport within the city itself. They could be built with charging stations to future proof them. Cheap all day parking and a good network of bus / tram routes into the key city centre destinations plus a chance to keep your electric car charged up. As it stands I think the large scale electric car charging stations are going to end up being commercial ventures (I've worked on one in a fairly random location where the amount of charging stations was reduced and other "facilities" increased as soon as the initial planning consent was obatined!) but should really be the sort of thing Government are looking to do to get down to net zero.0 -
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.0 -
Easiest route would be to join the EEA (ie Norway option) I have no idea if they would want us or how long it would take.Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.1 -
Single market, not EU. Are there more and less favourable terms? Let's say the same terms as currently for EEA countries outside the EU?Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.
Obviously we would have less control, because that's what we voted for.0 -
Exactly, we'd get the trading benefits but would be full on rule takers which I thought was the perceived issue even when we were one of the rule makers. Joining on that basis would make the entire thing even more of a ludicrous folly so expect Johnson to announce it within the next 12 months if enough people make a noise about it.kingstongraham said:
Single market, not EU. Are there more and less favourable terms? Let's say the same terms as currently for EEA countries outside the EU?Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.
Obviously we would have less control, because that's what we voted for.0 -
I think the hardest challenge would be to persuade the EU leadership that the UK was serious enough to not want to leave within a 30-50 year timeframe again.
Though by the same logic that supporters of the EU politically need Brexit to be viewed internationally as a British failure, that same logic also states that it would be a big vote of confidence if, after experiencing life outside of the single market, Britain would want to rejoin it.0 -
Surely on that basis the best scenario for the EU would be to see the UK wanting to rejoin and being refused as that would highlight that we saw the benefits with hindsight but once you're out you're out.rick_chasey said:I think the hardest challenge would be to persuade the EU leadership that the UK was serious enough to not want to leave within a 30-50 year timeframe again.
Though by the same logic that supporters of the EU politically need Brexit to be viewed internationally as a British failure, that same logic also states that it would be a big vote of confidence if, after experiencing life outside of the single market, Britain would want to rejoin it.0 -
Yes you could well be right.Pross said:
Surely on that basis the best scenario for the EU would be to see the UK wanting to rejoin and being refused as that would highlight that we saw the benefits with hindsight but once you're out you're out.rick_chasey said:I think the hardest challenge would be to persuade the EU leadership that the UK was serious enough to not want to leave within a 30-50 year timeframe again.
Though by the same logic that supporters of the EU politically need Brexit to be viewed internationally as a British failure, that same logic also states that it would be a big vote of confidence if, after experiencing life outside of the single market, Britain would want to rejoin it.0 -
Being part of the single market was not viewed as a problem by many prominent Brexit supporters before the vote. It is only since the vote that it has become so clear to them that it would be a betrayal of everything they hold dear to their hearts.Pross said:
Exactly, we'd get the trading benefits but would be full on rule takers which I thought was the perceived issue even when we were one of the rule makers. Joining on that basis would make the entire thing even more of a ludicrous folly so expect Johnson to announce it within the next 12 months if enough people make a noise about it.kingstongraham said:
Single market, not EU. Are there more and less favourable terms? Let's say the same terms as currently for EEA countries outside the EU?Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.
Obviously we would have less control, because that's what we voted for.
I've moved in the opposite direction from them.1 -
Hmmm, I don't know...Pross said:
Surely on that basis the best scenario for the EU would be to see the UK wanting to rejoin and being refused as that would highlight that we saw the benefits with hindsight but once you're out you're out.rick_chasey said:I think the hardest challenge would be to persuade the EU leadership that the UK was serious enough to not want to leave within a 30-50 year timeframe again.
Though by the same logic that supporters of the EU politically need Brexit to be viewed internationally as a British failure, that same logic also states that it would be a big vote of confidence if, after experiencing life outside of the single market, Britain would want to rejoin it.
I think there are enough people who would want an end to all the hassle and enough EU ideologues to overcome the doubters/punishers.We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
Why does everybody think we should rejoin the EU when joining EFTA/EEA would solve most of our problems and still leave us outside the EU?1
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What's the process for that? How long would it take?surrey_commuter said:Why does everybody think we should rejoin the EU when joining EFTA/EEA would solve most of our problems and still leave us outside the EU?
Be good to know this kind of thing.surrey_commuter said:
Easiest route would be to join the EEA (ie Norway option) I have no idea if they would want us or how long it would take.Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.0 -
Who knows? I'd settle for that now that we were out (never felt much point when we were full EU members though). I guess it is partly as when we were leaving no-one seemed to be prepared to accept that as a halfway house.surrey_commuter said:Why does everybody think we should rejoin the EU when joining EFTA/EEA would solve most of our problems and still leave us outside the EU?
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Not sure if your questions are rhetorical or expect me to know the answerkingstongraham said:
What's the process for that? How long would it take?surrey_commuter said:Why does everybody think we should rejoin the EU when joining EFTA/EEA would solve most of our problems and still leave us outside the EU?
Be good to know this kind of thing.surrey_commuter said:
Easiest route would be to join the EEA (ie Norway option) I have no idea if they would want us or how long it would take.Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.
The best I can do is that it would be at less than half the time to join the EU.0 -
My questions were mistakenly left in, because I then saw your other reply. So neither, apologies.surrey_commuter said:
Not sure if your questions are rhetorical or expect me to know the answerkingstongraham said:
What's the process for that? How long would it take?surrey_commuter said:Why does everybody think we should rejoin the EU when joining EFTA/EEA would solve most of our problems and still leave us outside the EU?
Be good to know this kind of thing.surrey_commuter said:
Easiest route would be to join the EEA (ie Norway option) I have no idea if they would want us or how long it would take.Pross said:
Presumably if we got back in we would be on less favourable terms than we were as a founding member and we would have less control than we did when we were being told that we had handed control of our country to the EU.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.
The best I can do is that it would be at less than half the time to join the EU.
I still find it weird how something that was a core belief among Brexiters before the vote has become a core belief in the total other direction since the vote.0 -
I think to join the EAA you need to have agreement not just from the EU, but the other members of the EAA. Norway were making noises that they did not want us to join the EAA back when the withdrawal agreement was being made.0
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1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
It would probably start with a referendum. Which I would have thought is the biggest challenge - as I recall the EU requires all new entrants to adopt the single currency and other things from which we had opt outs when we were in. Not sure that's going to get past the electorate any time soon.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
You need to post your chart with the single market and EU compared again, maybe?Stevo_666 said:
It would probably start with a referendum. Which I would have thought is the biggest challenge - as I recall the EU requires all new entrants to adopt the single currency and other things from which we had opt outs when we were in. Not sure that's going to get past the electorate any time soon.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.0 -
Current EEA members not keen on us joining + requires unanimity of members. Can't see it happening as - like all treaties - involves sacrificing some sovereignty. At a guess 10 years minimum to get both sides to a place where they can start negotiations.rjsterry said:
EU? We're not going back for decades if at all. It's taken 5 years to leave so far and we still haven't sorted NI.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
No problem. The EU policy on what new entrants would need to adopt would need checking separately though.kingstongraham said:
You need to post your chart with the single market and EU compared again, maybe?Stevo_666 said:
It would probably start with a referendum. Which I would have thought is the biggest challenge - as I recall the EU requires all new entrants to adopt the single currency and other things from which we had opt outs when we were in. Not sure that's going to get past the electorate any time soon.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I haven't mentioned anything about rejoining the EU.Stevo_666 said:
No problem. The EU policy on what new entrants would need to adopt would need checking separately though.kingstongraham said:
You need to post your chart with the single market and EU compared again, maybe?Stevo_666 said:
It would probably start with a referendum. Which I would have thought is the biggest challenge - as I recall the EU requires all new entrants to adopt the single currency and other things from which we had opt outs when we were in. Not sure that's going to get past the electorate any time soon.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.0 -
for the EAA?Stevo_666 said:
It would probably start with a referendum. Which I would have thought is the biggest challenge - as I recall the EU requires all new entrants to adopt the single currency and other things from which we had opt outs when we were in. Not sure that's going to get past the electorate any time soon.kingstongraham said:What would the process to rejoin the single market look like, and how long would it take?
Please ignore the fact that it will not happen while we have a bunch of ideological headbangers who don't care about the prosperity and wellbeing of this country in charge.0
