BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
Comments
-
Joelsim wrote:Oh, and then you have Scotland, Northern Ireland and now Wales.
Yes we have Scotland, Wales and N Ireland...and?0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:mamba80 wrote:yeah but when will Art 50 get triggered? has May got the nerve to do it? economically or politically, what ever she does, could be a disaster for the Tories.... behind every cloud......
Havent the EU commission hinted that even after triggering Art 50, there may still be away back for the UK....... Germany is also very keen to string everything out, giving the UK a chance to reverse Brexit before triggering art 50.
the Eu has a history of bending rules, so not beyond the realms of possibility, if unlikely.
Our relationship with the EU would be irreparably damaged. As Surey Commuter said.
I do not believe the EU can kick us out but having us hanging around on the verge of departure would be a disaster. I think they would encourage us to leave or make us sign up for 50 years with no get out clause.
Can't see how we can really stay part of the EU. WE voted to leave and the EU won't want us hanging around ready to flounce at any time.
How many European leaders have implored us to get on with it?
That doesn't alter the fact that no one knows what the legal position is pre or post A50 yet. And we won't know that until December at the very earliest.
Legal position after A50? Two years and we are out unless the other 27 agree to extend negotiations. Seems pretty straight forward to me. Parliament agreeing to the terms is irrelevant.
As I said, there are many factors at play in the process which are as yet undecided. It isn't even known if we can trigger A50 and still pull out of that trigger. That, in fact, is the whole basis of the court case that is happening at the moment.
You seriously suggesting that we could trigger A50, negotiate for a few months then turn round saying we have changed our minds, only for the EU to say "Thank fcuk for that! Lets go back to how it was shall we?"
Delusional.
Maybe, but our poor relationship with the EU is only as long as the present Gov is in power, any move to halt/reverse brexit would mean a GE and new Gov, new era of EU - UK co-op.... blah blah blah you know how it works Bally.
oh and Gibraltar...0 -
Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Oh, and then you have Scotland, Northern Ireland and now Wales.
Yes we have Scotland, Wales and N Ireland...and?
Well they've all had Barristers in court this week on a watching brief, and as you no doubt know there is a case to be heard relating to the validity of Brexit and the GFA.0 -
mamba80 wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:mamba80 wrote:yeah but when will Art 50 get triggered? has May got the nerve to do it? economically or politically, what ever she does, could be a disaster for the Tories.... behind every cloud......
Havent the EU commission hinted that even after triggering Art 50, there may still be away back for the UK....... Germany is also very keen to string everything out, giving the UK a chance to reverse Brexit before triggering art 50.
the Eu has a history of bending rules, so not beyond the realms of possibility, if unlikely.
Our relationship with the EU would be irreparably damaged. As Surey Commuter said.
I do not believe the EU can kick us out but having us hanging around on the verge of departure would be a disaster. I think they would encourage us to leave or make us sign up for 50 years with no get out clause.
Can't see how we can really stay part of the EU. WE voted to leave and the EU won't want us hanging around ready to flounce at any time.
How many European leaders have implored us to get on with it?
That doesn't alter the fact that no one knows what the legal position is pre or post A50 yet. And we won't know that until December at the very earliest.
Legal position after A50? Two years and we are out unless the other 27 agree to extend negotiations. Seems pretty straight forward to me. Parliament agreeing to the terms is irrelevant.
As I said, there are many factors at play in the process which are as yet undecided. It isn't even known if we can trigger A50 and still pull out of that trigger. That, in fact, is the whole basis of the court case that is happening at the moment.
You seriously suggesting that we could trigger A50, negotiate for a few months then turn round saying we have changed our minds, only for the EU to say "Thank fcuk for that! Lets go back to how it was shall we?"
Delusional.
Maybe, but our poor relationship with the EU is only as long as the present Gov is in power, any move to halt/reverse brexit would mean a GE and new Gov, new era of EU - UK co-op.... blah blah blah you know how it works Bally.
oh and Gibraltar...
GE held this Thursday, what colour government on Friday?0 -
Let's put that one into perspective as I run a treasury department so we have a pretty close relationship with some major banks.Joelsim wrote:Many banks set to relocate thousands of workers after not being happy with this week's meetings with the govt.
Most of the big players already have EU resident subsidiary companies somare already set up in terms of 'passporting'. They may have to move some bodies to the EU subs but not many. My contact at one of the largest High St banks said it would be in the hundred for them, but compare thst to the 8,000 UK jobs they are shedding due to cost cutting and increased automation.
It is not a major issue in the scheme of things."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.0 -
Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Oh, and then you have Scotland, Northern Ireland and now Wales.
Yes we have Scotland, Wales and N Ireland...and?
Well they've all had Barristers in court this week on a watching brief, and as you no doubt know there is a case to be heard relating to the validity of Brexit and the GFA.
https://constitution-unit.com/2016/08/0 ... uite-well/0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:
Let's put that one into perspective as I run a treasury department so we have a pretty close relationship with some major banks.Joelsim wrote:Many banks set to relocate thousands of workers after not being happy with this week's meetings with the govt.
Most of the big players already have EU resident subsidiary companies somare already set up in terms of 'passporting'. They may have to move some bodies to the EU subs but not many. My contact at one of the largest High St banks said it would be in the hundred for them, but compare thst to the 8,000 UK jobs they are shedding due to cost cutting and increased automation.
It is not a major issue in the scheme of things.
Well, you can't have your cake and eat it. The article is talking thousands of jobs, report prior suggested up to 70,000 of some of the highest tax payers blah blah blah. I can link it to a post you wrote earlier on another thread if you like Steve.0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Oh, and then you have Scotland, Northern Ireland and now Wales.
Yes we have Scotland, Wales and N Ireland...and?
Well they've all had Barristers in court this week on a watching brief, and as you no doubt know there is a case to be heard relating to the validity of Brexit and the GFA.
https://constitution-unit.com/2016/08/0 ... uite-well/
Like all opinions, I've seen plenty the other way too.0 -
Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.
But if A50 IS reversible, it's a whole new ball game.0 -
See my post above Bally. Even if this is not true, the Euro and therefore the EU is probably living on borrowed time. Certainly that is the view of one of the founders of the Euro, or,at Issing as you mentioned not long ago:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/16/euro-house-of-cards-to-collapse-warns-ecb-prophet/
These petulant Eurotw@t politicians who are trying to harm the UK may soon get what they so clearly deserve..."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.
But if A50 IS reversible, it's a whole new ball game.
Potentially, yes. But we don't know that yet. Tusk suggested it could be last week. But he doesn't know how that stands legally.0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.
But if A50 IS reversible, it's a whole new ball game.
The Dutch use the Eoro don't they?
One of your biggest bug bears has been the fall in Sterling. If a Euro country triggered A50 with the intention of getting a better deal, what then?0 -
I am happy to set more store by my conversations with the relevant people in major banks and my industry knowledge over some journo trying to sell as many copies of their rag as possible, They're hardly likely to under egg it are they.Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
Let's put that one into perspective as I run a treasury department so we have a pretty close relationship with some major banks.Joelsim wrote:Many banks set to relocate thousands of workers after not being happy with this week's meetings with the govt.
Most of the big players already have EU resident subsidiary companies somare already set up in terms of 'passporting'. They may have to move some bodies to the EU subs but not many. My contact at one of the largest High St banks said it would be in the hundred for them, but compare thst to the 8,000 UK jobs they are shedding due to cost cutting and increased automation.
It is not a major issue in the scheme of things.
Well, you can't have your cake and eat it. The article is talking thousands of jobs, report prior suggested up to 70,000 of some of the highest tax payers blah blah blah. I can link it to a post you wrote earlier on another thread if you like Steve."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.
But if A50 IS reversible, it's a whole new ball game.
Potentially, yes. But we don't know that yet. Tusk suggested it could be last week. But he doesn't know how that stands legally.
So for Brexiters it's win/win.
Irreversible and we are out.
Reversible and the EU is fcuked and we are out.0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:
See my post above Bally. Even if this is not true, the Euro and therefore the EU is probably living on borrowed time. Certainly that is the view of one of the founders of the Euro, or,at Issing as you mentioned not long ago:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/16/euro-house-of-cards-to-collapse-warns-ecb-prophet/
These petulant Eurotw@t politicians who are trying to harm the UK may soon get what they so clearly deserve...
I'm aware of this Steve. Regarding the 'petulant' politicians, I agree with them. They haven't changed their stance, the EU is built on a collection of pillars and to be a member who benefits you have to abide by those rules. Theresa Mayhem got 5 minutes at 1am last night and no feedback. The power lies with the 27 and they are highly unlikely to budge. And rightly so.0 -
Stevo 666 wrote:
I am happy to set more store by my conversations with the relevant people in major banks and my industry knowledge over some journo trying to sell as many copies of their rag as possible, They're hardly likely to under egg it are they.Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
Let's put that one into perspective as I run a treasury department so we have a pretty close relationship with some major banks.Joelsim wrote:Many banks set to relocate thousands of workers after not being happy with this week's meetings with the govt.
Most of the big players already have EU resident subsidiary companies somare already set up in terms of 'passporting'. They may have to move some bodies to the EU subs but not many. My contact at one of the largest High St banks said it would be in the hundred for them, but compare thst to the 8,000 UK jobs they are shedding due to cost cutting and increased automation.
It is not a major issue in the scheme of things.
Well, you can't have your cake and eat it. The article is talking thousands of jobs, report prior suggested up to 70,000 of some of the highest tax payers blah blah blah. I can link it to a post you wrote earlier on another thread if you like Steve.
Anthony Browne, head of the British Bankers’ Association, warns that major lenders are poised to hit relocate button.0 -
There is already significant capital flight from Italian banks because of the risk that the anti Euro Five Star party will take power in the near future. Investors don't like the idea of their Italian Euros being changed into Italian Lira.Ballysmate wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.
But if A50 IS reversible, it's a whole new ball game.
The Dutch use the Eoro don't they?
One of your biggest bug bears has been the fall in Sterling. If a Euro country triggered A50 with the intention of getting a better deal, what then?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
All I said was that nothing is decided pre or post trigger yet.
In theory, yes they could. Although the Dutch having seen what's happened to The UK in the last few months saw quite a shift in voting intention - 17% shift from Leave to Remain.
The UK's troubles are the best PR for the EU within the EU.
But if A50 IS reversible, it's a whole new ball game.
The Dutch use the Eoro don't they?
One of your biggest bug bears has been the fall in Sterling. If a Euro country triggered A50 with the intention of getting a better deal, what then?
Yes it was the first indication, now others are coming through, many of which are social. Outsiders looking in to what was once a bastion of welcoming behaviour has turned into a cesspit of racism and division. No country in their right mind would want that.0 -
0
-
Joelsim wrote:
Depends on your intellectual capacity I suppose.0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:
Depends on your intellectual capacity I suppose.
''Tis why I used the word surprisingly. And of course it has to be written in basic English, that goes without saying, but the points made are very valid.0 -
...and rather wittily written. Yes, I do think one would need a certain intellectual capacity to get the wit and point being made.Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:
Depends on your intellectual capacity I suppose.
''Tis why I used the word surprisingly. And of course it has to be written in basic English, that goes without saying, but the points made are very valid.0 -
Possibly the attitude shown in the last 3 or 4 posts is why so many people voted for Brexit.0
-
Of course they are going to say things like that around the time that they are seeking assurances from the govt. It's part of their positioning to try to get the best deal for the industry. Same with Ghosn and Nissan.Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
I am happy to set more store by my conversations with the relevant people in major banks and my industry knowledge over some journo trying to sell as many copies of their rag as possible, They're hardly likely to under egg it are they.Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
Let's put that one into perspective as I run a treasury department so we have a pretty close relationship with some major banks.Joelsim wrote:Many banks set to relocate thousands of workers after not being happy with this week's meetings with the govt.
Most of the big players already have EU resident subsidiary companies somare already set up in terms of 'passporting'. They may have to move some bodies to the EU subs but not many. My contact at one of the largest High St banks said it would be in the hundred for them, but compare thst to the 8,000 UK jobs they are shedding due to cost cutting and increased automation.
It is not a major issue in the scheme of things.
Well, you can't have your cake and eat it. The article is talking thousands of jobs, report prior suggested up to 70,000 of some of the highest tax payers blah blah blah. I can link it to a post you wrote earlier on another thread if you like Steve.
Anthony Browne, head of the British Bankers’ Association, warns that major lenders are poised to hit relocate button."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Joelsim wrote:As I said, there are many factors at play in the process which are as yet undecided. It isn't even known if we can trigger A50 and still pull out of that trigger. That, in fact, is the whole basis of the court case that is happening at the moment.
Isn't the ongoing court case to do with whether TM can trigger Article 50 without Parliamentary approval?
The reversibility of notification under Article 50 isn't something the UK courts can decide. The strongest argument I've seen to say it is reversible is that there is no wording in the Treaty to say that it isn't. But there's no wording to say it is reversible either. The ECJ would ultimately decide and the spirit of the Treaty is that once you've "resigned" the matter is out of the hands of the resigning country, so it seems unlikely - to me - that it would be reversible. I can't see the ECJ siding with the UK and giving carte-blanche to member states to resign, try for a better deal, un-resign etc.0 -
Not so sure about that. They realise that their club is falling apart at the seams and the stance on the UK smacks of desperation and/or scapegoating. After all, it was stated clearly that they wanted to give us a hard time to discourage other from leaving. That tells you they are very worried that others will leave.Joelsim wrote:Stevo 666 wrote:
See my post above Bally. Even if this is not true, the Euro and therefore the EU is probably living on borrowed time. Certainly that is the view of one of the founders of the Euro, or,at Issing as you mentioned not long ago:Ballysmate wrote:Joel.
If it is the case that we CAN trigger A50 and then change our minds if we don't get the deal we want, that would be the end of the EU.
Every other state could do that to try to get special deals dependant on their circumstances. Trigger A50, negotiate and then reverse A50
Beware what you wish for...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/16/euro-house-of-cards-to-collapse-warns-ecb-prophet/
These petulant Eurotw@t politicians who are trying to harm the UK may soon get what they so clearly deserve...
I'm aware of this Steve. Regarding the 'petulant' politicians, I agree with them. They haven't changed their stance, the EU is built on a collection of pillars and to be a member who benefits you have to abide by those rules. Theresa Mayhem got 5 minutes at 1am last night and no feedback. The power lies with the 27 and they are highly unlikely to budge. And rightly so.
Like I say, some will get what they deserve."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
So why was it published in the Daily Mirror? Hardly the sharpest reader base in the country.briantrumpet wrote:
...and rather wittily written. Yes, I do think one would need a certain intellectual capacity to get the wit and point being made.Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:
Depends on your intellectual capacity I suppose.
''Tis why I used the word surprisingly. And of course it has to be written in basic English, that goes without saying, but the points made are very valid."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
No idea, except that it's unlikely that it was going to be published in the Daily Telegraph or Daily Mail, given their readerships.Stevo 666 wrote:
So why was it published in the Daily Mirror? Hardly the sharpest reader base in the country.briantrumpet wrote:
...and rather wittily written. Yes, I do think one would need a certain intellectual capacity to get the wit and point being made.Joelsim wrote:Ballysmate wrote:Joelsim wrote:
Depends on your intellectual capacity I suppose.
''Tis why I used the word surprisingly. And of course it has to be written in basic English, that goes without saying, but the points made are very valid.0
