Dauphine - Stage 5 *Spoiler*
Comments
-
And by the way, gifting stages to bank credit in the favour bank is as cold and calculating as screaming past an escapee 20m from the line, especially when it comes time to collect.
This "Froome is not a team player" guff is utter bollocks, arising from a misplaced need to defend Wiggo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yLWjeaZ ... u.be&t=22m
[bonus winner]...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
Macaloon wrote:And by the way, gifting stages to bank credit in the favour bank is as cold and calculating as screaming past an escapee 20m from the line, especially when it comes time to collect.
But it's also what makes the sport beautiful (when done correctly) ...0 -
oneof1982 wrote:frenchfighter wrote:This Sky kit is appalling. Looks like he is wearing a bin liner.
You'll really hate this, (and I think I do to) but the reason the kit is the way it is, and the reason that so many footall teams where black "away" kits, is that it shows up the sponsors logo more clearly on tv and in the papers.
(Wife used to work in sports sponsorship)
Lol. Didnt know that. Makes sense even if it is awful for the fans. I think this kit (shiny) is not commercially available.Contador is the Greatest0 -
RichN95 wrote:In these days of betting on many sports including cycling and fixing in some of them, gifting stages really shouldn't too acceptable anymore.
And with such variables, the bookies offer short odds but continue to take the bets ...
but also the contrary morals of the UCI allowing a betting chain to sponsor a competition within the TDF but not allow a team (Mr Bookmaker) access to races ...0 -
Classement de la 5e étape courue jeudi de Grésy-sur-Aix à Valmorel:
1. Chris Froome (GBR/Sky), les 139 km en 3 h 28:39.
2. Alberto Contador (ESP/SAX) à 04.
3. Matthew Busche (USA/RSH) 04.
4. Alejandro Valverde (ESP/MOV) 10.
5. Michael Rogers (AUS/SAX) 12.
6. Dani Moreno (ESP/KAT) 12.
7. Rein Taaramae (EST/COF) 12.
8. Dani Navarro (ESP/COF) 21.
9. Richie Porte (AUS/SKY) 24.
10. Jakob Fuglsang (DEN/AST) 29
Classement général:
1. Chris Froome (GBR/SKY) 16h08:44.
2. Richie Porte (AUS/SKY) à 0:52.
3. Rohan Dennis (AUS/GRM) 0:54.
4. Michael Rogers (AUS/SAX) 1:37.
5. Daniel Moreno (ESP/KAT) 1:47.
6. Daniel Navarro (ESP/COF) 1:49.
7. Rein Taaramae (EST/COF) 1:52.
8. Michal Kwiatkowski (POL/OPQ) 1:58.
9. Leopold König (CZE/APP) 2:16.
10. Jakob Fuglsang (DEN/AST) 2:20.Contador is the Greatest0 -
"In these days of betting on many sports including cycling and fixing in some of them, gifting stages really shouldn't too acceptable anymore."
As someone who likes the occasional flutter, I'm afraid I disagree with that. It's part of the sport that people will give away the battle to win the war, and should remain part of it as far as I'm concerned. If you're betting on cycling it should be something you're aware of so can't really complain. Personally I'd never bet on individual stages for that very reason...0 -
pat1cp wrote:
You really are a tool at times.frenchfighter wrote:Froome waits for 1km banner and attacks. Lightweight. Zero to hero, ugly mofo.
I hope Contador rips him to pieces in the Tour. 50km attacks again and again.
Over 1min anaerobic effort just like in the Vuelta :roll:
At times?0 -
thamacdaddy wrote:I didn't like it last year when he tried to make a mockery of wiggins signalling to him to speed up etc .
he so should have done this today0 -
I can't think of any other occurrence in sport of an individual or team deliberately losing for any reason other corrupt ones.JackPozzi wrote:"In these days of betting on many sports including cycling and fixing in some of them, gifting stages really shouldn't too acceptable anymore."
As someone who likes the occasional flutter, I'm afraid I disagree with that. It's part of the sport that people will give away the battle to win the war, and should remain part of it as far as I'm concerned. If you're betting on cycling it should be something you're aware of so can't really complain. Personally I'd never bet on individual stages for that very reason...
Busche hadn't helped Froome gain time on the field and Radioshack are unlikely to be needed in future so why give them anything.Twitter: @RichN950 -
frenchfighter wrote:That must have been really cool to be on the Tourmalet that day. The Contador Schleck duel was the stuff of true cycling stories.
Was I watching a different race? As I recall that stage AS and AC rode up like two mates on a sportive with a token fixed sprint at the top.0 -
Cycling is very odd sport and surely it's the bookmakers problem when putting up a market on cycling. 'Matchfixing' has/is/will be a part of this sport. It happens every hour during the stages. "You do this, we give you that" "If they do this, you do that and we will give you this".
That's how it is - and you know what? I like it.
Contador's gift in 2011 - which he had nothing to lose on - to Tirralongo partly resulted in a Vuelta victory in 2012.0 -
RichN95 wrote:I can't think of any other occurrence in sport of an individual or team deliberately losing for any reason other corrupt ones.
Busche hadn't helped Froome gain time on the field and Radioshack are unlikely to be needed in future so why give them anything.
Exactly. In a situation where there is a GC rider and a domestique working together you can see why the GC rider would gift the stage win, but today's stage was nothing like this.
Some people just need to find a reason - any reason - to criticize Sky which is equally laughable and tedious.0 -
A lot of you are right negative nancys, aren't ya...0
-
Macaloon wrote:This "Froome is not a team player" guff is utter ****, arising from a misplaced need to defend Wiggo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yLWjeaZ ... u.be&t=22m
[bonus winner]
And he hadn't needed a serious talking from management on two stages to keep him towing the teamline?
It's not utter whateverI don’t know what will happen, but [Sergio] Henao and I are different than Froome. We always work for the team and we’ve never had any problems with the team,” Urán said. “We are not like Froome. I came here with the idea of helping the squad, whatever the goals may be. We shall see. We have to take it day by day
I don't feel the need to defend wiggo. It's plain to see Froome is a stronger rider who can dominate better than he can, I am just not a fan of his personality really. Probably completely unjustified.0 -
Tiralongo is an old team mate though, and presumably a good friend. Froome and Busche have no relationship - there's nothing in gifting this for Froome. I'm assuming that the DSs of Sky, Saxo and Radioshack convened in the last kilo of the race and hashed out some sort of deal. And as for banking favours, if Sky try to cash it in Radioshack will probably say 'well no-one asked you to give it to us' and go on their way. No-one's going to help the number 1 team unless it's to their mutual benefit.ThomThom wrote:Cycling is very odd sport and surely it's the bookmakers problem when putting up a market on cycling. 'Matchfixing' has/is/will be a part of this sport. It happens every hour during the stages. "You do this, we give you that" "If they do this, you do that and we will give you this".
That's how it is - and you know what? I like it.
Contador's gift in 2011 - which he had nothing to lose on - to Tirralongo partly resulted in a Vuelta victory in 2012.
If you want 'everyone gets a prize' sports then go to your local primary school sports day. (Although may get you unwanted police attention, so on second thoughts don't.)Twitter: @RichN950 -
Crozza wrote:thamacdaddy wrote:I didn't like it last year when he tried to make a mockery of wiggins signalling to him to speed up etc .
he so should have done this today
That I would have liked. As much as I am not a massive fan of froome, contador nevermind his talents is dead to me.0 -
ThomThom wrote:Cycling is very odd sport and surely it's the bookmakers problem when putting up a market on cycling. 'Matchfixing' has/is/will be a part of this sport. It happens every hour during the stages. "You do this, we give you that" "If they do this, you do that and we will give you this".
That's how it is - and you know what? I like it.
Contador's gift in 2011 - which he had nothing to lose on - to Tirralongo partly resulted in a Vuelta victory in 2012.
This is something that I’ll probably never understand. The winner knows he’s not really won it, the runner-up does too and almost certainly the peleton and probably even spectators and viewers know this.
When I was a kid, I asked my dad to teach me how to play chess and I always asked him not to let me win ‘cos it would have been meaningless. I wanted to earn it properly. If I was racing, I wouldn’t feel any different. People might say that the record books will show that you won it but the most important thing is that I’ll know I didn’t.0 -
RichN95 wrote:
Tiralongo is an old team mate though, and presumably a good friend. Froome and Busche have no relationship - there's nothing in gifting this for Froome. I'm assuming that the DSs of Sky, Saxo and Radioshack convened in the last kilo of the race and hashed out some sort of deal. And as for banking favours, if Sky try to cash it in Radioshack will probably say 'well no-one asked you to give it to us' and go on their way. No-one's going to help the number 1 team unless it's to their mutual benefit.ThomThom wrote:Cycling is very odd sport and surely it's the bookmakers problem when putting up a market on cycling. 'Matchfixing' has/is/will be a part of this sport. It happens every hour during the stages. "You do this, we give you that" "If they do this, you do that and we will give you this".
That's how it is - and you know what? I like it.
Contador's gift in 2011 - which he had nothing to lose on - to Tirralongo partly resulted in a Vuelta victory in 2012.
If you want 'everyone gets a prize' sports then go to your local primary school sports day. (Although may get you unwanted police attention, so on second thoughts don't.)
I wasn't speaking of this Froome gifting-discussion from today as I lost interest and didn't follow it as it made little sense to me. I was solely answering this: "In these days of betting on many sports including cycling and fixing in some of them, gifting stages really shouldn't too acceptable anymore"0 -
If this thread offers nothing else it is a salutory reminder that Frenchie can spin absolutely ANYTHING into how wonderful AC is, how awful Sky are and how his credibility is waning as a result.Trail fun - Transition Bandit
Road - Wilier Izoard Centaur/Cube Agree C62 Disc
Allround - Cotic Solaris0 -
Fair enough. I think we probably have different ideas on exactly what is covered by the term 'gifting'. Two riders riding together to their mutual benefit in search of ultimately different goals - for example Froome and Spilak riding together in Romandie - I don't consider 'gifting'. I wouldn't really object to two good friends on opposite temas helping each other out.ThomThom wrote:I wasn't speaking of this Froome gifting-discussion from today as I lost interest and didn't follow it as it made little sense to me. I was solely answering this: "In these days of betting on many sports including cycling and fixing in some of them, gifting stages really shouldn't too acceptable anymore"
Today, however, would have been throwing the race to a random rider with the expectation of claiming an unspecified and unsolicited reward of some sort further down the line is 'gifting'. That was thescenario today. I think that shouldn't be done. However, some think it is not only OK but expected.Twitter: @RichN950 -
But it's all so damn funny. I'm at loss to understand why anyone blocks him - they're missing out on all the entertainmentlostboysaint wrote:If this thread offers nothing else it is a salutory reminder that Frenchie can spin absolutely ANYTHING into how wonderful AC is, how awful Sky are and how his credibility is waning as a result.Twitter: @RichN950 -
Re betting. Betting just putting money on risk. We know the deal. You factor in risk of wins being handed over for political gain. A bit like betting on mutually favourable results in football.
As long as results are in no way affected by betting , it's all fine.0 -
RichN95 wrote:
But it's all so damn funny. I'm at loss to understand why anyone blocks him - they're missing out on all the entertainmentlostboysaint wrote:If this thread offers nothing else it is a salutory reminder that Frenchie can spin absolutely ANYTHING into how wonderful AC is, how awful Sky are and how his credibility is waning as a result.
I block because I was finding it difficult not to respond to his tiresome trolling - and his responses which he makes personal in the absence of any higher level of reasoning abilities. My continued participation just contributed to the noise that other posters find so tiresome - so I cut myself out of that. And really, I'm hardly missing out, believe me :roll:0 -
-
RichN95 wrote:
Fair enough. I think we probably have different ideas on exactly what is covered by the term 'gifting'. Two riders riding together to their mutual benefit in search of ultimately different goals - for example Froome and Spilak riding together in Romandie - I don't consider 'gifting'. I wouldn't really object to two good friends on opposite temas helping each other out.ThomThom wrote:I wasn't speaking of this Froome gifting-discussion from today as I lost interest and didn't follow it as it made little sense to me. I was solely answering this: "In these days of betting on many sports including cycling and fixing in some of them, gifting stages really shouldn't too acceptable anymore"
Today, however, would have been throwing the race to a random rider with the expectation of claiming an unspecified and unsolicited reward of some sort further down the line is 'gifting'. That was thescenario today. I think that shouldn't be done. However, some think it is not only OK but expected.
Wait, it wasn't suggested that Froome should give Busche the victory today, right? That would be ridiculous.0 -
Gifting made a lot more sense when riders were riding to feed their families that week and a win on a big race/stage could result in a life changing amount of money. Today this is not really ever the case at Pro Tour Level so there's much less to be gained.
At lower levels where a win could mean a ProTour contract it's a lot more prevelantWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
ThomThom wrote:RichN95 wrote:Today, however, would have been throwing the race to a random rider with the expectation of claiming an unspecified and unsolicited reward of some sort further down the line is 'gifting'. That was thescenario today. I think that shouldn't be done. However, some think it is not only OK but expected.
Wait, it wasn't suggested that Froome should give Busche the victory today, right? That would be ridiculous.
Oh yes it was. The failure of Froome to gift Busche the win was used as yet another tool to beat Sky with.Correlation is not causation.0
