Tirreno-Adriatico 2013 *SPOILERS*

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  • greasedscotsman
    greasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    nic_77 wrote:
    Phinney rode 130km of the stage solo, he had about as much chance of winning the TT as me.
    Personally agree that rules are rules and that he shouldn't be reinstated, but good on him anyway.

    Oh yeah, good for him. But it's not fair on the other rides who finished the stage to then change the rules and allow riders back in who didn't.
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,434
    greasedscotsman wrote:
    But how would that be fair on Tony Martin if Taylor Phinney had beaten him?

    I take your point.

    Let's take a made up scenario to illustrate.

    1 Cavendish finishes a mountain stage outside the time limit in a group of 50 riders. Due to the size of the group they are all docked green jersey points and start again the next day. Cavendish wins the final stage.

    2 Cavendish is riding a mountain stage in a group of 50 riders. On the final climb 49 riders decide it's too tough and quit. Cavendish continues to the end, finishes outside the time limit and is disqualified.


    That anomaly makes no sporting sense.
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • lostboysaint
    lostboysaint Posts: 4,250
    TailWindHome wrote:
    greasedscotsman wrote:
    But how would that be fair on Tony Martin if Taylor Phinney had beaten him?

    I take your point.

    Let's take a made up scenario to illustrate.

    1 Cavendish finishes a mountain stage outside the time limit in a group of 50 riders. Due to the size of the group they are all docked green jersey points and start again the next day. Cavendish wins the final stage.

    2 Cavendish is riding a mountain stage in a group of 50 riders. On the final climb 49 riders decide it's too tough and quit. Cavendish continues to the end, finishes outside the time limit and is disqualified.


    That anomaly makes no sporting sense.

    That.
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  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,434
    greasedscotsman wrote:
    nic_77 wrote:
    Phinney rode 130km of the stage solo, he had about as much chance of winning the TT as me.
    Personally agree that rules are rules and that he shouldn't be reinstated, but good on him anyway.

    Oh yeah, good for him. But it's not fair on the other rides who finished the stage to then change the rules and allow riders back in who didn't.


    Does the race referee/ organiser not have discretion on how rules are applied?

    What if there's a crash - someone 'does a Hoogerland'?
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • greasedscotsman
    greasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    TailWindHome wrote:
    2 Cavendish is riding a mountain stage in a group of 50 riders. On the final climb 49 riders decide it's too tough and quit. Cavendish continues to the end, finishes outside the time limit and is disqualified.

    Oh come on, that's not going happen. Cavendish will just hang onto a few team cars and make the time limit no problem.
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,434
    greasedscotsman wrote:
    TailWindHome wrote:
    2 Cavendish is riding a mountain stage in a group of 50 riders. On the final climb 49 riders decide it's too tough and quit. Cavendish continues to the end, finishes outside the time limit and is disqualified.

    Oh come on, that's not going happen. Cavendish will just hang onto a few team cars and make the time limit no problem.


    Essentially that's what seems to have happened to Phinney. The group he was with quit.

    Maybe there's more to it than that.
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • greasedscotsman
    greasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    TailWindHome wrote:
    What if there's a crash - someone 'does a Hoogerland'?

    Crashes are a tricky one. Hoogerland's wasn't his fault, but what if it is. What if a rider is going too fast, takes too many risks, crashes and then because of injuries he may have finishes outside the time limit? Should he be allowed to continue? Or what if it's a crash in the middle of the bunch? Is it the riders fault because he should have been riding on the front?

    I really don't know what the answer is. To come up with a set of rules robust enough for all situations is very difficult. And I do believe you are right that the race officals could have let Phinney back in.

    Ideas anyone?
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,651
    greasedscotsman wrote:
    TailWindHome wrote:
    What if there's a crash - someone 'does a Hoogerland'?

    Crashes are a tricky one. Hoogerland's wasn't his fault, but what if it is. What if a rider is going too fast, takes too many risks, crashes and then because of injuries he may have finishes outside the time limit? Should he be allowed to continue? Or what if it's a crash in the middle of the bunch? Is it the riders fault because he should have been riding on the front?

    I really don't know what the answer is. To come up with a set of rules robust enough for all situations is very difficult. And I do believe you are right that the race officals could have let Phinney back in.

    Ideas anyone?

    there are already discretionary powers to deal with stuff like crashes.
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  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    TimB34 wrote:
    That list doesn't really take into account build. Just for fun here's a list of BMIs (using ht and wt from wikipedia)

    Cadel Evans - 67kg, 1.74m : BMI 22.1
    Chris Froome - 69kg, 1.86m : BMI 19.9
    Robert Gesink - 68Kg, 1.87m : BMI 19.4
    Jurgen Van Den Broeck - 69kg, 1.86m : BMI 19.9
    Ryder Hejesdal - 72kg, 1.88m : BMI 20.4
    Bradley Wiggins - 69kg, 1.90m : BMI 19.1
    Tejay van Garderen - 67kg, 1.85m : BMI 19.6
    Vincenzo Nibali - 63kg, 1.80m : BMI 19.4
    J-rod - 57kg, 1.69m : BMI 20.0
    Alberto Contador : 62kg, 1.76m : BMI 20.0

    Underweight = <18.5
    Normal weight = 18.5–24.9

    All perfectly normal! (probably due to significantly heavier legs than non-cyclists)

    Even Michael Rasmussen, the most stick-thin cyclist I can think of comes in at 59kg, 1.74m : BMI 19.5

    Edit: Peter Sagan - 73kg, 1.84m: BMI 21.6 :lol:

    tumblr_m7moe3awUi1r0wyzto4_1280.png
    Contador is the Greatest
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,462
    Jeez I thought my licence photo was bad! I only recently realised how tall Froome is, always assumed he was well under 6'.
  • LeicesterLad
    LeicesterLad Posts: 3,908
    That picture of Froome is minging. Look's like it belongs on crimewatch.
    http://www.twitter.com/InTheGC http://www.InTheGC.com http://www.facebook.com/intheGC
  • alihisgreat
    alihisgreat Posts: 3,872
    Pross wrote:
    Jeez I thought my licence photo was bad! I only recently realised how tall Froome is, always assumed he was well under 6'.

    Well under 6ft?!?!

    Have you ever seen a picture of him on a bike?
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    ALIHISGREAT wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Jeez I thought my licence photo was bad! I only recently realised how tall Froome is, always assumed he was well under 6'.

    Well under 6ft?!?!

    Have you ever seen a picture of him on a bike?


    Pross, did you think Froomedog was riding a 52? :wink:
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,462
    I don't know why I thought he was short, probably because I think of him as a climber and climbers are shortarses :lol: Then again, 6' 1" is short :wink:
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    Pross wrote:
    I don't know why I thought he was short, probably because I think of him as a climber and climbers are shortarses :lol: Then again, 6' 1" is short :wink:


    Well, yes, guess so if you are actually Big Maggy....
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    Pross wrote:
    I don't know why I thought he was short, probably because I think of him as a climber and climbers are shortarses :lol: Then again, 6' 1" is short :wink:

    I'll put you out of your misery. Your not alone as for some reason I too assumed as a climber he would naturally be short & thin, plus I saw him interviewed at T-A by Dan Lloyd which just seemed to back this up. :oops:
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • inseine
    inseine Posts: 5,788
    Bonkers. I don't watch a lot of cycling but it's obvious Froome is not a short arse (as a short arse myself I maybe have a better sense of size............ :oops: ). He looks very similar in build to Wiggins TBH.
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  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    inseine wrote:
    Bonkers. I don't watch a lot of cycling but it's obvious Froome is not a short ars* (as a short ars* myself I maybe have a better sense of size............ :oops: ). He looks very similar in build to Wiggins TBH.

    Well clearly not obvious to me. :oops:

    I guess part of it is he has a similar build to wiggo but much thinner and I guess I put that down to him being smaller overall than wiggo & the fact that as an out and out climber he would have the frame size inc height of some of a typical climber.
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    ALIHISGREAT wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Jeez I thought my licence photo was bad! I only recently realised how tall Froome is, always assumed he was well under 6'.

    Well under 6ft?!?!

    Have you ever seen a picture of him on a bike?


    Pross, did you think Froomedog was riding a 52? :wink:

    A 52, that's a big person's bike! :shock:

    ATC:
    157 cm
    48 kg

    Froome's arms are probably longer than my legs.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    ATC, you are petite!

    I'm 164cm and not happy about it...
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    ATC, you are petite!

    I'm 164cm and not happy about it...

    164cm is tall! :D I never really noticed that I was tiny before when most of my cycling was done amongst lots of hills but now I live in the Netherlands, wow I realise how small I am because everyone else is ridiculously tall and being tiny in a country with zero hills and permanent wind is not fun. The joke "oh its so windy the crosswind nearly blew me into the canal, ha ha ha!" is not a joke for me, its a reality.

    This about sums it up:

    tt_pooley_600_zpsd157abcd.jpg
    Correlation is not causation.
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,548
    Cheer up, Matt.
  • danlikesbikes
    danlikesbikes Posts: 3,898
    andyp wrote:
    Cheer up, Matt.

    Maybe he was reflecting on the good olde days
    Pain hurts much less if its topped off with beating your mates to top of a climb.
  • ocdupalais
    ocdupalais Posts: 4,317
    Above The Cows wrote:
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    ATC, you are petite!

    I'm 164cm and not happy about it...

    164cm is tall! :D I never really noticed that I was tiny before...

    This about sums it up:

    tt_pooley_600_zpsd157abcd.jpg

    Yeah but look how tiny that soft-focus security bloke is - he's only up to Pooley's hips!
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    OCDuPalais wrote:
    Yeah but look how tiny that soft-focus security bloke is - he's only up to Pooley's hips!

    I hear they produced a load of luminous yellow security dwarves just for the Olympics. It was known as Operation Oompa Loompa and was personally overseen by Seb Coe who could be heard cackling away in the laboratory.
    Correlation is not causation.

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