Lance Armstrong gets life ban,loses 7 TDF,confesses he doped

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Comments

  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    jerry3571 wrote:
    How did George Hincapie get away things as he was LA's sidekick for years? I watched the stage where he beat a load of climbers in the Alps one year. I remembered thinking that this result was impossible. Stage 15 2005??
    discovery-channel-team-rider-hincapie-of-us-crosses-finish-line-to-H1XKJX.jpg
    Well, you watched it happen. I saw it too. So did lots of other people. Why would you think it was impossible?
  • Garry H
    Garry H Posts: 6,639
    His eyes are too close together for a start.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    jerry3571 wrote:
    How did George Hincapie get away things as he was LA's sidekick for years? I watched the stage where he beat a load of climbers in the Alps one year. I remembered thinking that this result was impossible. Stage 15 2005??

    'Cos the story of Lance isn't really about doping.

    Most of the big names were doping.

    It's about what happens when you don't make friends/make too many enemies while you're doing it.
    _
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,308
    ...and rubbing people's noses in it and going on and on about how the French press were out to get him and how he was clean.
    ...and coercing team mates into ' the program'.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,308
    Oh and did I mention: I got a Polar Heart rate monitor for Aug '99 letter of the month in Cycle Sport with a letter defending Lance Armstrong having suffered cancer myself.
    When the proverbial hit the fan, I felt totally duped and uninspired.
    On the plus side, the Heart Rate monitor fetched a bit of money.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    Pinno wrote:
    ...and rubbing people's noses in it and going on and on about how the French press were out to get him and how he was clean.
    ...and coercing team mates into ' the program'.


    Rubbing who and their noses in what?
    The "French Press" knows everyone was cheating. Everyone was claiming they were clean. It's part of the game. Never confess to anything. How can you not know that?
    "...coercing..."? Please, all his teammates wanted to win. I doubt he had to twist too many arms.
    You sound like you've raised him to some sort of criminal mastermind bent on taking over the world. You make way too much of him. He was an athlete who was cheating. Not some comic book super villain or Darth Vader type.
    As for "the program"? Is that the best you can do with a conspiracy theory?
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,308
    It was oft referred to as 'the program' even by LA IIRC, hence the title of this:

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/lance-a ... am-review/
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,434
    It can't be 5 years ago already?
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,133
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Most of the big names were doping.

    There were no other big names.
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,308
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Most of the big names were doping.

    There were no other big names.

    That's either sarcasm or...

    Pantani. Valverde. Ulrich has been exceedingly quiet over the scandal.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,133
    Pinno wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Most of the big names were doping.

    There were no other big names.

    That's either sarcasm or...

    Pantani. Valverde. Ulrich has been exceedingly quiet over the scandal.

    No, I mean that there were no other cyclists who were big names at all. Not even close to how big Armstrong was.
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,308
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Pinno wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Most of the big names were doping.

    There were no other big names.

    That's either sarcasm or...

    Pantani. Valverde. Ulrich has been exceedingly quiet over the scandal.

    No, I mean that there were no other cyclists who were big names at all. Not even close to how big Armstrong was.

    I see but maybe that was proportionate to the amount of drugs he was taking. In the absence of Lance, it could have been quite different. At the end of the Induarin era, the TdF was Riis, Ulrich, Pantani. 3 different names in 3 years. Who knows?
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Most of the big names were doping.

    There were no other big names.

    I'm not sure what you're trying to illustrate by saying that?

    I'm sure you can make the mental leap that the comment is said in the context of cycling, as opposed to the wider world.

    And that, even if one name is significantly bigger than the others, it doesn't mean there aren't other names that are big in their own right.

    So what point are you making, in the context of what I have said?
    _
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,133
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    jerry3571 wrote:
    How did George Hincapie get away things as he was LA's sidekick for years? I watched the stage where he beat a load of climbers in the Alps one year. I remembered thinking that this result was impossible. Stage 15 2005??

    'Cos the story of Lance isn't really about doping.

    Most of the big names were doping.

    It's about what happens when you don't make friends/make too many enemies while you're doing it.

    There were no other big names.

    I'm not sure what you're trying to illustrate by saying that?

    I'm sure you can make the mental leap that the comment is said in the context of cycling, as opposed to the wider world.

    And that, even if one name is significantly bigger than the others, it doesn't mean there aren't other names that are big in their own right.

    So what point are you making, in the context of what I have said?

    That the Lance story is not just about cycling, that he can't expect to be ignored like the rest of the "big names". He was in a different jungle from them, and he's been pursued by a different animal. USADA and the US authorities aren't going to spend as much effort going after anyone else. Not just about who he's pissed off along the way.
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,651
    I'm with KG on this - in the context of the US legal system: Pantawho? Ullrich? He's a drummer isn't he? ....
    Warning No formatter is installed for the format
  • Garry H
    Garry H Posts: 6,639
    USADA don't have the jurisdiction to go after anyone other than US riders.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,133
    Garry H wrote:
    USADA don't have the jurisdiction to go after anyone other than US riders.

    And hincapie isn't worth it.
  • Garry H
    Garry H Posts: 6,639
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    Garry H wrote:
    USADA don't have the jurisdiction to go after anyone other than US riders.

    And hincapie isn't worth it.

    True
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    I'm with KG on this - in the context of the US legal system: Pantawho? Ullrich? He's a drummer isn't he? ....

    Defrauding the US Govt is a federal offence carrying massive penalties. Turns out the US postal service is part of the US Govt.

    Same as FIFA, the US authorities only got involved when it went through US banks.
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,308
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    I'm with KG on this - in the context of the US legal system: Pantawho? Ullrich? He's a drummer isn't he? ....

    Defrauding the US Govt is a federal offence carrying massive penalties. Turns out the US postal service is part of the US Govt.

    So they can take themselves to court.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    The investigation wouldn't have gotten anywhere had he not had lots of people ready to rat on him.
    _
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    The investigation wouldn't have gotten anywhere had he not had lots of people ready to rat on him.
    While they may have "ratted him out" I tend to look on it as "covering your own ass", or "making a deal".
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Sure, but look, most of us here are convinced that Indurain was also taking industrial quantities of EPO, but we don't see him being investigated?

    That's because if you ask anyone about it, they'll clam up :P
    _
  • Garry H
    Garry H Posts: 6,639
    If only Armstrong hadn't been such a c***, as well as a cheat.
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    Pinno wrote:
    Surrey Commuter wrote:
    No tA Doctor wrote:
    I'm with KG on this - in the context of the US legal system: Pantawho? Ullrich? He's a drummer isn't he? ....

    Defrauding the US Govt is a federal offence carrying massive penalties. Turns out the US postal service is part of the US Govt.

    So they can take themselves to court.

    Depends who "they" are
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Garry H wrote:
    If only Armstrong hadn't been such a c***, as well as a cheat.
    Basically.
    _
  • Mad_Malx
    Mad_Malx Posts: 5,182
    Rick Chasey wrote:
    Sure, but look, most of us here are convinced that Indurain was also taking industrial quantities of EPO, but we don't see him being investigated?

    That's because if you ask anyone about it, they'll clam up :P

    Genuine questions here - Were there ever specfic allegations about Mig? Wiki says conconi client, what else?
    Sure the superhuman stuff is part mythology, but it's surprising that no-one wants to p155 in the paella, however nice the guy is.

    Were industrial quantities of EPo even available in the early 90s? I was working on recombinant proteins at the time and the cost for clinical grade material would have been astounding (even for rich teams).

    Edit: cn archive says that epo started in sports around 1990, so looks like the answer to the last q is yes.
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    Garry H wrote:
    If only Armstrong hadn't been such a c***, as well as a cheat.
    I have my doubts that him being a c*** has much to do with it. This is about money and who gets some and for what.
  • Vino'sGhost
    Vino'sGhost Posts: 4,129
    So basically, its good he got busted because he's a c nt not the massive institutionalised drug program.???

    Now I understand why wiggins is ok.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Vino'sGhost wrote:
    So basically, its good he got busted because he's a c nt not the massive institutionalised drug program.???

    No. No one has said that.
    _

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