Lance Armstrong gets life ban,loses 7 TDF,confesses he doped

Richmond Racer

Danny Pate's not happy by the look of his twitter feed

Macaloon

Danny Pate would be Bill Hicks if he dropped a few f-bombs.

dennisn

Richmond Racer wrote:

Have to say, the thought of Landis making a packet out of this sticks in my throat.

Doping, lying, lying, Floyd Fairness Fund, more lying. Then confession only as retribution when Lance wouldnt fix him up a job. Oh, and he gets lauded as a hero in the ant-doping fight.

Who's calling Floyd a hero?????

deejay

Rundfahrt wrote:

The moral is not to have someone bigger, the moral is to be like Indurain and be a nice guy, keep your mouth shut and give many gifts on the road.

Bollox. Do you come from Planet Armstrong, the Land of Make Believe.
Put your money where your Gob is and show some proof.
Inhaler was cleared by all.
Being only a "Client" to a Respected Professor.
Next. ???

Rundfahrt

deejay wrote:

Rundfahrt wrote:

The moral is not to have someone bigger, the moral is to be like Indurain and be a nice guy, keep your mouth shut and give many gifts on the road.

Bollox. Do you come from Planet Armstrong, the Land of Make Believe.

No, I just understand that this all came down on Armstrong because he was an asshole towards people who said things he did not like. It's public knowledge...and common sense.

Put your money where your Gob is and show some proof.

Proof of what, I made no accusations.

Inhaler was cleared by all.
]Being only a "Client" to a Respected Professor.

Once again I made no accusations, but you sound like a real muppet touting the UCI clearing an inhaler and a rider being "only" a client to a famous doping doctor

Next. ???

Intelligence from you?????

Crankbrother

I know the Feds are going after Tailwind, of which Armstrong is/was a part owner ... But surely the riders' contracts had anti-doping clauses which in turn would mean Tailwind can go after them for breach of contract ... I sure hope so, let's see how GH, LL, DZ, TD et al's 6 month ban feels when it bankrupts them, they don't have LA's wealth to fall back on ... Bear in mind Tailwind don't have to make it stick, just get it to drag on long enough to hit them in the pocket ...

iainf72

Crankbrother wrote:

I know the Feds are going after Tailwind, of which Armstrong is/was a part owner ... But surely the riders' contracts had anti-doping clauses which in turn would mean Tailwind can go after them for breach of contract ... I sure hope so, let's see how GH, LL, DZ, TD et al's 6 month ban feels when it bankrupts them, they don't have LA's wealth to fall back on ... Bear in mind Tailwind don't have to make it stick, just get it to drag on long enough to hit them in the pocket ...

So would they go after Lance as well? Because if you followed your logic, they'd have to, no?

And why won't they? Because the Tailwind guys were perfectly aware of how the races were won.

Crankbrother

iainf72 wrote:

Crankbrother wrote:

I know the Feds are going after Tailwind, of which Armstrong is/was a part owner ... But surely the riders' contracts had anti-doping clauses which in turn would mean Tailwind can go after them for breach of contract ... I sure hope so, let's see how GH, LL, DZ, TD et al's 6 month ban feels when it bankrupts them, they don't have LA's wealth to fall back on ... Bear in mind Tailwind don't have to make it stick, just get it to drag on long enough to hit them in the pocket ...

So would they go after Lance as well? Because if you followed your logic, they'd have to, no?

And why won't they? Because the Tailwind guys were perfectly aware of how the races were won.

Agree 100% ... but LA would just be taking from one hand to give to the other ... and Tailwind will be looking to diminish their responsibility by highlighting the complicity of the riders ...

Plus, we all know how vindictive LA can be ... and nothing hurts more than in the pocket ...

It would be an interesting turn of events to see if it stuck ...

deejay

Rundfahrt wrote:

deejay wrote:

Rundfahrt wrote:

The moral is not to have someone bigger, the moral is to be like Indurain and be a nice guy, keep your mouth shut and give many gifts on the road.

Bollox. Do you come from Planet Armstrong, the Land of Make Believe.

No, I just understand that this all came down on Armstrong because he was an asshole towards people who said things he did not like. It's public knowledge...and common sense.

I knew this in 1994 as I stood next to the SOB. (world champion)
Is this more Gobbledegook from Planet Armstrong. ?

Rundfahrt wrote:

deejay wrote:

Put your money where your mouth is and show some proof.

Proof of what, I made no accusations.

No accusations eh, then we just call what you posted as Snide remarks that I dislike without facts.

Rundfahrt wrote:

Inhaler was cleared by all.
Being only a "Client" to a Respected Professor.

Once again I made no accusations, but you sound like a real muppet touting the UCI clearing an inhaler and a rider being "only" a client to a famous doping doctor

There was a partnership between the Olympic Committee and Professor Conconi's biomedical research centre at the University of Ferrara and the Olympic Committee financed his research.

OK with hindsight he isn't respected but at the time Indurain was tested he was respected.
I said Professor, dummy not doctor and this is what I tout.

In May 1994, Indurain used salbutamol in the Tour de L'Oise in France. Though the β2-adrenergic agonist, found in nasal inhalers, was on the banned substance list of both the IOC and UCI, both organizations permitted sportsmen with asthma to use it

So if you want to post about "On Topic" comments then don't put in Snide remarks that lead to your puzzlement.

Rundfahrt

deejay wrote:

Rundfahrt wrote:

deejay wrote:

Rundfahrt wrote:

The moral is not to have someone bigger, the moral is to be like Indurain and be a nice guy, keep your mouth shut and give many gifts on the road.

Bollox. Do you come from Planet Armstrong, the Land of Make Believe.

No, I just understand that this all came down on Armstrong because he was an asshole towards people who said things he did not like. It's public knowledge...and common sense.

I knew this in 1994 as I stood next to the SOB. (world champion)
Is this more Gobbledegook from Planet Armstrong. ?

Interesting response, an insult and an attempt to tout yourself, all done while avoiding admitting that my comments are pretty obvious to anyone who doesn't have a hate on for Armstrong.

Rundfahrt wrote:

deejay wrote:

Put your money where your mouth is and show some proof.

Proof of what, I made no accusations.

No accusations eh, then we just call what you posted as Snide remarks that I dislike without facts.

I asked for what I need to show proof of and this is how you respond? Obviously you made a bad assumption and can't man up to it.

Rundfahrt wrote:

Inhaler was cleared by all.
Being only a "Client" to a Respected Professor.

Once again I made no accusations, but you sound like a real muppet touting the UCI clearing an inhaler and a rider being "only" a client to a famous doping doctor

There was a partnership between the Olympic Committee and Professor Conconi's biomedical research centre at the University of Ferrara and the Olympic Committee financed his research.

OK with hindsight he isn't respected but at the time Indurain was tested he was respected.
That makes as much sense as someone saying that Armstrong is still the 7-Time Tour Champion because, at the time he was not an admitted doper.

I said Professor, dummy not doctor and this is what I tout.
Delightful job of avoiding admitting what Conconi truly was to the sport of cycling and going for an insult as well. How many insults is that in this one response by you alone?

In May 1994, Indurain used salbutamol in the Tour de L'Oise in France. Though the β2-adrenergic agonist, found in nasal inhalers, was on the banned substance list of both the IOC and UCI, both organizations permitted sportsmen with asthma to use it

So if you want to post about "On Topic" comments then don't put in Snide remarks that lead to your puzzlement.

There were no snide remarks and nothing lead to my puzzlement. Perhaps you should go back to school and work on your reading comprehension skills. While you are at it, work on your self-esteem.

dave_1

RichN95 wrote:

So kids, the moral of the story is: Cheat all you want, just make sure there's someone bigger to grass up. That way crime doesn't pay - it pays twice. And the government will support you all the way.

I hope it fails.

I'm with you Rich...I think it fair enough to sue LA and his mates..but is hard to defend Landis getting such reward..he has helped clean up cycling but it wasn't his motive..being unable to find a team and anger at that was his motive and his ONLY motive..so no reward should go to him. Even Tyler deserves it more

skavanagh.bikeradar

It is unedifying, but it is a mess of cycling (and Armstrong's') own making.

ddraver

Dave_1 wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

So kids, the moral of the story is: Cheat all you want, just make sure there's someone bigger to grass up. That way crime doesn't pay - it pays twice. And the government will support you all the way.

I hope it fails.

I'm with you Rich...I think it fair enough to sue LA and his mates..but is hard to defend Landis getting such reward..he has helped clean up cycling but it wasn't his motive..being unable to find a team and anger at that was his motive and his ONLY motive..so no reward should go to him. Even Tyler deserves it more

If he does win he should give it away sharpish! To whoever, WADA, USADA, US Cycling or just a selection of 100 youth cycling clubs but if he keeps it then he'll be pilloried (although if you ve been pilloried for 10 years then it must be pretty tempting just to take the gazillions and walk off into the sunset with your middle finger in the air...)

disgruntledgoat

ddraver wrote:

Dave_1 wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

So kids, the moral of the story is: Cheat all you want, just make sure there's someone bigger to grass up. That way crime doesn't pay - it pays twice. And the government will support you all the way.

I hope it fails.

I'm with you Rich...I think it fair enough to sue LA and his mates..but is hard to defend Landis getting such reward..he has helped clean up cycling but it wasn't his motive..being unable to find a team and anger at that was his motive and his ONLY motive..so no reward should go to him. Even Tyler deserves it more

If he does win he should give it away sharpish! To whoever, WADA, USADA, US Cycling or just a selection of 100 youth cycling clubs but if he keeps it then he'll be pilloried (although if you ve been pilloried for 10 years then it must be pretty tempting just to take the gazillions and walk off into the sunset with your middle finger in the air...)

This is pretty much exactly what I'd do.

lloyd_bower

Macaloon wrote:

"...and upon retiring for the night 'Lance' and his young lady decided a champagne night-cap was in order. Room service was contacted and shortly after a waiter arrived with said champagne.

Upon entering the room the waiter, a 'cycling' fan, was met with the scene of thousands of pounds strewn across a bed that also framed the half naked former Miss World.

As the bell-boy received a healthy tip he could not help but ask, “'Lance', where did it all go wrong?”

Mmmm, ain't that the famous George Best quote? from US Hotel, the girl being Mary Stavin, ex Miss World.

Other famous one, 'I spent 90% of my money on women, drink and fast cars. The rest I wasted' Sadly drink did him in the end.

iainf72

I think everyone is forgetting what Floyd did, and when he did it. He didn't say it when everyone knew Lance was evil. He's a powerful guy with lots of resources, and Floyd was fed up enough to say it then, regardless of his motivation. That took balls of steel. And then he got grief from every angle

None of this would've happened without Floyd

Richmond Racer

Landis still doesnt deserve to make a fortune out of it

ddraver

I know what you re saying iain, but he still happily took part in the scam until it went wrong. He should have done it earlier and he should nt have bullsh1tted us for so long about his own history but he deserves credit for doing what he did, but not however many millions of dollars of credit!

No_Ta_Doctor

ddraver wrote:

I know what you re saying iain, but he still happily took part in the scam until it went wrong. He should have done it earlier and he should nt have bullsh1tted us for so long about his own history but he deserves credit for doing what he did, but not however many millions of dollars of credit!

Is everyone forgetting that he actually owes a few million dollars of credit to the Floyd Fairness Fund? He had a court case a while back about it, didn't he? I think he'll be obliged to pay that back to start with.

Personally, I think Floyd is an occasionally amusing arsehole. I don't really want to speculate on his motives, but he threw a huge f******** spanner in the works, and for that I'm glad. I like his absolutely nutjob style, spreading chaos everywhere. I liked the way he took the piss on twitter. And I like the fact that he hasn't, yet, written a self serving book about it all. He comes across as the most honest and genuine of all of them. No "big boy made me do it" stuff, no excuses, no "I can cure cycling of its ills" just a big F U to LA and genuine acceptance of his responsibility for his actions.

I don't know how much that's worth in cash terms, but for the entertainment value at least it's got to be worth a few bob.

iainf72

No tA Doctor wrote:

Is everyone forgetting that he actually owes a few million dollars of credit to the Floyd Fairness Fund? He had a court case a while back about it, didn't he? I think he'll be obliged to pay that back to start with.

Let's not get over the top. It's probably $400K at most - Remember, most of the money paid was from Lance's crew in terms of hush money. So if you take those away it was probably about 25% of that.

deejay

Rundfahrt wrote:

There were no snide remarks and nothing lead to my puzzlement. Perhaps you should go back to school and work on your reading comprehension skills. While you are at it, work on your self-esteem.

So WTF do you have a name for this sentence. ?

Rundfahrt wrote:

The moral is not to have someone bigger, the moral is to be like Indurain and be a nice guy, keep your mouth shut and give many gifts on the road.

Accusation NO you say or Snide Remark also NO.
Well It's something that comes out of your backside that your superior education has a name for.

No_Ta_Doctor

iainf72 wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

Is everyone forgetting that he actually owes a few million dollars of credit to the Floyd Fairness Fund? He had a court case a while back about it, didn't he? I think he'll be obliged to pay that back to start with.

Let's not get over the top. It's probably $400K at most - Remember, most of the money paid was from Lance's crew in terms of hush money. So if you take those away it was probably about 25% of that.

Fair enough.

Though it would be marvellous to see irony eat itself if they sued him to get back money they'd paid him to shut up, from the funds he won from them in the whistle blower case.

edhornby

lance didn't come good on his promise to make sure he got a contract one way or another if he kept his trap shut so floyd thinks 'right if you are going to stuff my bike career then your threats are empty and I'm outta here' so I have no sympathy for either of 'em - even tho I'm glad that landis got the ball rolling

timoid.

iainf72 wrote:

I think everyone is forgetting what Floyd did, and when he did it. He didn't say it when everyone knew Lance was evil. He's a powerful guy with lots of resources, and Floyd was fed up enough to say it then, regardless of his motivation. That took balls of steel. And then he got grief from every angle

None of this would've happened without Floyd

+1 Floyd is the spark that lit the tinderbox on this one. And now cycling will be beneficiary.

He's more hero than anti-hero though and if he makes a few bucks out of Tailwind then hey ho who can begrudge him?

RichN95.

Timoid. wrote:

He's more hero than anti-hero though and if he makes a few bucks out of Tailwind then hey ho who can begrudge him?

He isn't a hero at all. He gave honesty a go only when all of the dishonest options had dried up.

Before he wrote his e-mail he was a very enthusiastic participant in the US Postal doping program, kept going with the doping after leaving for Phonak, stood on the podium on the Champs Elysee in the yellow jersey having doped, lied about his doping for four years after being caught, wrote a book about how he was innocent, asked the public to contibute to his fairness fund and still claims he never took the testorone that he tested positive for.

Is that your idea of a hero?

If he makes one cent out of this, it will be two cents too much.

Le Commentateur

There's a debate being streamed live on 28th Feb: Landis, Vaughters, Tygart.
http://new.livestream.com/yalelaw/SpinningOurWheels
11pm UK time.

mididoctors

RichN95 wrote:

Timoid. wrote:

He's more hero than anti-hero though and if he makes a few bucks out of Tailwind then hey ho who can begrudge him?

He isn't a hero at all. He gave honesty a go only when all of the dishonest options had dried up.

Before he wrote his e-mail he was a very enthusiastic participant in the US Postal doping program, kept going with the doping after leaving for Phonak, stood on the podium on the Champs Elysee in the yellow jersey having doped, lied about his doping for four years after being caught, wrote a book about how he was innocent, asked the public to contibute to his fairness fund and still claims he never took the testorone that he tested positive for.

Is that your idea of a hero?

If he makes one cent out of this, it will be two cents too much.

I don't think either term applies but I tend towards your analysis

the about face was if anything very funny with a tragic twist.

It is a sobering thought to speculate what would have passed if he had not got drunk and pressed the send button on that E-mail though. Without that "I wrote a letter"?

In a way his villainous attitude forced his hand because it was the rejection of that side of his character, his sense of entitlement to a job/ride that triggered his actions.. I suppose that is sort of anti-hero in nature.

I bet they all regret not buying him off now.

mididoctors

Timoid. wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

I think everyone is forgetting what Floyd did, and when he did it. He didn't say it when everyone knew Lance was evil. He's a powerful guy with lots of resources, and Floyd was fed up enough to say it then, regardless of his motivation. That took balls of steel. And then he got grief from every angle

None of this would've happened without Floyd

+1 Floyd is the spark that lit the tinderbox on this one. And now cycling will be beneficiary.

He's more hero than anti-hero though and if he makes a few bucks out of Tailwind then hey ho who can begrudge him?

THe most heroic aspect of his behaviour was having the balls to send the letter. It must have been a bit of a moment.

It hard to gauge how much people surrounding him influenced his devision in a positive sense. It's clear the hog and LA et al pi55ed him off no end but how much was he persuaded by others to speak up? That was taking place too. Do they get a mention? maybe not.

Richmond Racer

Have to take Vaughters word for it but it seems that he had been talking with Landis throughout and encouraging him to talk in the run up to the famous email

mididoctors

Richmond Racer wrote:

Have to take Vaughters word for it but it seems that he had been talking with Landis throughout and encouraging him to talk in the run up to the famous email

does he get a medal?

why didn't vaughters just do it? because he had too much to lose at the time?


he needed a deal first before going on record and just pushed Landis?