F1 and Cycling cross paths
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Surprised no-one seems to have mentioned Alex Zanardi in all this. A real cross-over competitor rather than this dilettante stuff - seen him whilst doing the maratona dles dolomites0
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greasedscotsman wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:greasedscotsman wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:I recon from a purely sporting perspective they're quite close - enough that I wouldn't be surprised if quite a few pro-cycling fans were also fans of F1.
Both racing, both are about maximising your relative weakness / strength positions.
Think your probably right. As far as sports go, I like to watch races, such as cycling, F1 and even stuff like athletics, whereas I'm not so bothered about games, like football, rugby, etc.
Yeah. It's a tactical and strategic race that starts from the premise that not everyone is fighting with equal speed.
Have you beed to see a F1 race at all? I've only managed some F1 testing at Silverstone when I used to live nearby (well, sort of...) I wasn't that impressed with the speed, but the noise, fantastic!
Would love to go and see a race at Monza, Spa or Monaco.
Been to Silverstone 3 times - each time for the race.
It's better than watching cycling, not by that much though.0 -
BikingBernie wrote:
Yes, you are wrong. ABS was first developed for use on aeroplanes when landing in the 1920's. In any case F1 cars are barred from using ABS and all the other electronic safety and traction control systems that are found in - and were specifically developed for - modern passenger cars.Rick Chasey wrote:
Years ago I think ABS braking was originally conceived in Formula one... Could be wrong.frenchfighter wrote:
Can you give examples of this? Curiosity.RichN95 wrote:There are many very brilliant people in F1 doing incredible things which filter down into everyday life.
But there was a time when traction control, ABS were legal in F1. They then became more common on your everyday car, so much so that almost all cars are now sold with these safety features.
The previous model of M5 also had a V10 engine losely based on the BMW F1 V10 developed at the time.0 -
That doesn't stop the 'boy racers' from trying to emulate their heroes on the public road though, and the supposed 'glamour' of F1 does help to underpin the 'culture of speed' that so strongly influences attitudes to car use. I have even seen it argued that the fact that F1 drivers can survive high speed crashes 'proves' that 'speed is not dangerous', as though this somehow justifies doing 50 Mph plus down residential streets!frenchfighter wrote:Oh another MAJOR difference is that the fan has ZERO hope of doing what they do in F10 -
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BikingBernie wrote:
British Leyland also provided work for over a quarter of a million employees, plus tens of thousands more in automotive component manufacturing companies. McClaren Automotive employ 1500, so they are pretty much an irrelevance in the great scheme of things.frenchfighter wrote:
Precisely.BikingBernie wrote:Anyhow, what's so good about McClaren, they are hardly building "the peoples' car", are they?
And I wonder if they contribute to the UK economy via taxes or do they avoid them.
A quarter of a million employees who would go out on strike at the drop of a hat and produced really bad cars.
The worst thing was they didn't care they were making an awful product.
The Unions finished the British car industry, fact.0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:It's better than watching cycling, not by that much though.
Do you mean from the roadside/stands rather than the TV? I love watching bike racing from the roadside. It's usually as part of a holiday as the races I go to see are in mainland europe, so that helps. I also like the whole carnival atmosphere you get there and how close you can get to the action!
But then as I said, I've not been to an F1 race, so maybe I'd enjoy that just as much.0 -
But the introduction of ABS and so forth in today's cars was driven by the desire to make cars safer and had nothing to do with its use in F1.pat1cp wrote:there was a time when traction control, ABS were legal in F1. They then became more common on your everyday car, so much so that almost all cars are now sold with these safety features. The previous model of M5 also had a V10 engine losely based on the BMW F1 V10 developed at the time
As to the engine you mention. All Fiat OHC engines, including the one in my old 128 were 'loosely based' on the design of the Ferrari Dino. But so what? The gap is even bigger between a F1 engine and any engine designed for the real world, where almost nothing other than basic principles can be carried over, and these principles have been known for decades. Also, the effectively hand-made nature of F1 cars means that there can be little carry over to the real world of mass production.
There have been some great advances in road car design and manufacture in recent years, and for my money two of the best are the Common rail diesel and the FAP system on my C5 Estate, neither of which owe anything to F1.0 -
Where did you read that, in the Daily Mail? :roll:pat1cp wrote:The Unions finished the British car industry, fact.
Just look at Germany, which has perhaps the strongest union movement in world. 'Despite' this Germany is a world leader in car manufacturing. In fact, many would argue that the two are directly linked.0 -
Are you seriously trying to argue that 'boy racers' don't follow F1 and other motor sports? Really? Seriously? :shock:Rick Chasey wrote:If you like F1 you go Go-Karting, not razzing it in an escort.
I have certainly known many 'petrol heads' who tick both boxes...0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:If you like F1 you go Go-Karting, not razzing it in an escort.
That's like saying if you like pro-cycling, you ride races, rather than do silly commuter racing / Strava, but then that isn't always the case is it?0 -
...or ride 'sportives' or have a 'burn up' with you mates around the countryside, or simply try to get from A to B in the shortest time possible.BigMat wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:If you like F1 you go Go-Karting, not razzing it in an escort.
That's like saying if you like pro-cycling, you ride races, rather than do silly commuter racing / Strava, but then that isn't always the case is it?0 -
This isn't true. Toyota are a prime example. They came into F1 with the biggest budget and managed 13 podiums in 8 years, their best finish in the constructors championship was 4th.BikingBernie wrote:
Quite so, in bike racing any rider could ride the same machine as any of his competitors with near-zero effect on the outcome. What counts - or should do - is the individual's talent, guts and determination.frenchfighter wrote:Oh please Rick! They are totally different. One is about human endeavour and sufferance the other, hmm, money.
In F1 the car is everything and it is the amount of money available that determines who has the most competitive car. The F1 teams might as well all get together with the biggest pile of money they can accrue, then set fire to it with the winner being the team who has set fire to the biggest pile of cash!0 -
I would argue that the supposed link here is 'performance'. In fact the average Japanese Euro-box is probably better 'engineered' than a Ferrari!johnfinch wrote:BikingBernie wrote:greasedscotsman wrote:Oh no, I've ruined it for everyone. I am so sorry. How about a picture of Kimi with a Colnago to try and get things back on track? Everyone likes Kimi, right?
So, adding the brand name of a car maker 'adds value' to the price of a bike? What does that say about the perceived status of cars as opposed to bikes? Or do Ferrari perhaps also make a 'Colnago' badged version of one of their cars with £100,000 added onto the price?
It says that (rightly or wrongly), Ferrari are associated with top class engineering in a way that bicycle manufacturers aren't. Personally I really couldn't give a toss about cars (I hate driving), but even I can recognise that they've got some of the world's top minds producing their vehicles.
I still wouldn't waste my money on one, though.0 -
Anyone else remember the stage of the '89 Tour that finished at the Spa motor racing circuit? Here's Raul Alcala winning it!
Maybe the could add a few laps to Liege Bastogne Liege, just to make it a bit harder!
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'Came into'... It will inevitably be hard for a new team to be competitive against established teams who have spent perhaps hundreds of millions over decades.Graeme_S wrote:
This isn't true. Toyota are a prime example. They came into F1 with the biggest budget and managed 13 podiums in 8 years, their best finish in the constructors championship was 4th.BikingBernie wrote:
Quite so, in bike racing any rider could ride the same machine as any of his competitors with near-zero effect on the outcome. What counts - or should do - is the individual's talent, guts and determination.frenchfighter wrote:Oh please Rick! They are totally different. One is about human endeavour and sufferance the other, hmm, money.
In F1 the car is everything and it is the amount of money available that determines who has the most competitive car. The F1 teams might as well all get together with the biggest pile of money they can accrue, then set fire to it with the winner being the team who has set fire to the biggest pile of cash!0 -
In one, many of the winners have engines built, tweeked and fuelled by Ferrari. And the other is Formula 1.frenchfighter wrote:Oh please Rick! They are totally different. One is about human endeavour and sufferance the other, hmm, money.Twitter: @RichN950 -
RichN95 wrote:
In one, many of the winners have engines built, tweeked and fuelled by Ferrari. And the other is Formula 1.frenchfighter wrote:Oh please Rick! They are totally different. One is about human endeavour and sufferance the other, hmm, money.
Can't top that!0 -
greasedscotsman wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:It's better than watching cycling, not by that much though.
Do you mean from the roadside/stands rather than the TV? I love watching bike racing from the roadside. It's usually as part of a holiday as the races I go to see are in mainland europe, so that helps. I also like the whole carnival atmosphere you get there and how close you can get to the action!
But then as I said, I've not been to an F1 race, so maybe I'd enjoy that just as much.
I'm not the biggest advocate of watching a bike race in person. Watched a few and they were fun, but not always worth the effort. I'm going to test the Belgian "sit in pub on route, watch race in pub. cheers as race goes past - return to pub" style for the Olympics. Maybe that'll be better.
But yes, F1 trackside is only marginally better than cycling road-side.
The cars are ridiculously impressive, but after 20 or so laps you get blase about it a little. You see so little of the track and so far away (usually) that it's often difficult to see where the time is being made up / lost.
You learn a lot from listening to them, but you'll need earplugs to do that comfortably for the whole race.
Nowadays with sound insulated earphones and all the new track development I imagine it's much better/easier to follow the race. I imagine the experience generally is more comfortable.
Every time I went we basically stood on a mound of earth for the whole race. Went in '98 when it p!ssed it down and where we were standing and especially the car park was akin to Glastonbury. Mud carnage. Took 2hrs to get out of the 'carpark' / mudbath.
But like I said, I last went in 2002 - 10 years ago.0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:[I'm not the biggest advocate of watching a bike race in person. Watched a few and they were fun, but not always worth the effort. I'm going to test the Belgian "sit in pub on route, watch race in pub. cheers as race goes past - return to pub" style for the Olympics. Maybe that'll be better.
Think that could be the best way to watch the Olympics. Your not going to see much at the finish and I would guess Box Hill will be difficult to get to and from. That was pretty much how I watch the Tour stage in '07 to Canterbury. It was OK, but not the best day at a bike race for me, but then I am a "roadside fanboi". 0 -
greasedscotsman wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:[I'm not the biggest advocate of watching a bike race in person. Watched a few and they were fun, but not always worth the effort. I'm going to test the Belgian "sit in pub on route, watch race in pub. cheers as race goes past - return to pub" style for the Olympics. Maybe that'll be better.
Think that could be the best way to watch the Olympics. Your not going to see much at the finish and I would guess Box Hill will be difficult to get to and from. That was pretty much how I watch the Tour stage in '07 to Canterbury. It was OK, but not the best day at a bike race for me, but then I am a "roadside fanboi".
I'll be doing that in Fulham/SW London somewhere. Come down!0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:I'll be doing that in Fulham/SW London somewhere. Come down!
Wedding in Manchester to go to that weekend.0 -
greasedscotsman wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:I'll be doing that in Fulham/SW London somewhere. Come down!
Wedding in Manchester to go to that weekend.
You sir, are a fail.
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Not F1 but a star from my favourite sport. Looks like he'd be more suited to track but IIRC he finished just 9 seconds down on the slowest rider in the prologue. Not too sure on the helmet/skinsuit combo mind.
"Mummy Mummy, when will I grow up?"
"Don't be silly son, you're a bloke, you'll never grow up"0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:You sir, are a fail.
Your failing me for not coming to London to watch a chipper? Harsh!0 -
RichN95 wrote:
In one, many of the winners have engines built, tweeked and fuelled by Ferrari. And the other is Formula 1.frenchfighter wrote:Oh please Rick! They are totally different. One is about human endeavour and sufferance the other, hmm, money.
Where's the bloody "exalt" button when you need it?! Chapeau!Trail fun - Transition Bandit
Road - Wilier Izoard Centaur/Cube Agree C62 Disc
Allround - Cotic Solaris0 -
I shall be in France, riding my bike and eating chips.
Will watch the last 30 minutes when I get home."I have a lovely photo of a Camargue horse but will not post it now" (Frenchfighter - July 2013)0 -
BikingBernie wrote:
Where did you read that, in the Daily Mail? :roll:pat1cp wrote:The Unions finished the British car industry, fact.
Just look at Germany, which has perhaps the strongest union movement in world. 'Despite' this Germany is a world leader in car manufacturing. In fact, many would argue that the two are directly linked.
Not The Mail, it was a Clarkson documentary. I'll need to check my back catalogue if you'd like to know which one. 0 -
Right wing, cyclist hating, 'shoot strikers in front of their family', bonkers petrol-head Clarkson? You are joking, right?pat1cp wrote:BikingBernie wrote:
Where did you read that, in the Daily Mail? :roll:pat1cp wrote:The Unions finished the British car industry, fact.
Just look at Germany, which has perhaps the strongest union movement in world. 'Despite' this Germany is a world leader in car manufacturing. In fact, many would argue that the two are directly linked.
Not The Mail, it was a Clarkson documentary. I'll need to check my back catalogue if you'd like to know which one.0 -
BikingBernie wrote:
Right wing, cyclist hating, 'shoot strikers in front of their family', bonkers petrol-head Clarkson? You are joking, right?pat1cp wrote:BikingBernie wrote:
Where did you read that, in the Daily Mail? :roll:pat1cp wrote:The Unions finished the British car industry, fact.
Just look at Germany, which has perhaps the strongest union movement in world. 'Despite' this Germany is a world leader in car manufacturing. In fact, many would argue that the two are directly linked.
Not The Mail, it was a Clarkson documentary. I'll need to check my back catalogue if you'd like to know which one.
No, I think it was him. To be honest I wrote it a little tounge in cheek, and I don't agree with everything he says. I do however believe that the unions played a significant part in the demise of the "British" car industry. I'm sure I read somewhere that we are now making more cars than ever, just under foreign ownership. Oh, and the unions aren't as hostile and a little less militant.0
