Di2

CiB

Just posted in the what stuff we've bought lately thread, that I've gone down the electric gear path. I hung back as it's unseemly to go barging in shouting about it but I see within moments a response showing I'm not the only one (good).

So who's got this Di2/Ui2 set up then, and who's thinking of getting it? And who's had either long enough to have an opinion of its value? Share your views...

I'll start. Superb kit. Another notch on the improvements to cycling that we enjoy.

MonkeyMonster

CiB wrote:

I'll start. Superb kit. Another notch on the improvements to cycling that we enjoy.

So what makes it stand out?

asprilla

I really want it, but I'm waiting to see if Sram are going to come out with something.

I want another wheelset this year so it will probably have to wait until next year now.

Monkeypump

Would love to have it, and would likely go for the Ultegra version.

However, it's quite a long way down the list of cash priorities...

CiB

MonkeyMonster wrote:

So what makes it stand out?

In the other thread CiB wrote:

Gear changes? Every one a winner, a slight press on the lever and bosh - straight in, first time, every time. It's quick, consistent, easy and takes away any need to divert attention to the gear-change so you just keep on pedalling and accept that the change has happened, without losing any momentum & direction. It all just happens, you know it's going to happen and that it'll be right, straight away. It's not quite telepathic but close enough for me ta. It's been on my road bike for a week or so now and the only minor regret is not doing it sooner.

I reckon this electric shifting is a bit of a game changer, and it's a shame that I can't really do it justice with a couple of sentences that try to convey just how much better it is.

It's hard to identify it exactly but it's the sense that gear changes aren't something you do, they become something that happens. There's more to it but that so far is my take on it.

willy b

I'd love to ride a bike with it on, just to see what it is like.

I'd only ever get it, if it already came spec'd on a bike I was buying, which is not going to happen as i'm a tight arse.

MonkeyMonster

CiB wrote:

Interesting things

Hmmm, so no cable stretch - oh ffs, need to re-tension that slightly, no strength needed to move the shifter... I can see why it would seem rather nice. Is it just front or rear cassette too?

petemadoc

Monkeypump wrote:

Would love to have it, and would likely go for the Ultegra version.

However, it's quite a long way down the list of cash priorities...

^ this

meanredspider

I've posted before that it's as close to subconscious gear-shifting as I can imagine. It's far from essential but it is a joy to use - you just twitch a finger and let it happen. In a month or so of use, I've not had anything but perfect gear shifts. I'm also wondering just how long the battery will last. I keep checking but it's still indicating that it's over 50% full. I must be getting close to 30 hours of cycling and, given the terrain, I shift quite a lot at both ends. It was a doddle to set up and I've not needed to touch it since that very first setting - you can adjust the rear mech on the hoof if you needed to.

The bizarre thing ( and my LBS guy confirmed this was his experience too) is that I had to relearn which lever did which. They are exactly the same as the 105 I've been using for 3 years but there must be something about the way your brain works that the lack of movement in the levers causes you to need to relearn something that has entered the subconscious.

meanredspider

MonkeyMonster wrote:

Is it just front or rear cassette too?

Both. The front trims according to where the rear is automatically so no chain rub

CiB

MonkeyMonster wrote:

Hmmm, so no cable stretch - oh ffs, need to re-tension that slightly, no strength needed to move the shifter... I can see why it would seem rather nice. Is it just front or rear cassette too?

Front and rear mechs are electric. No adjustments are needed and the front mech trims itself when the rear changes - there's a tell-tale whirr from the front mech pulling itself into line as the chain moves across the cassette. That's neat.

So is the lack of physical movement on the changers; it requires a modicum of pressure to invoke a shift but no movement as such. I'm not fully convinced by the lack of mechanical feedback yet but it's gone from 'oh that's odd' to being how it works.

DonDaddyD

As of yet, not interested. I'm still discovering what makes Ultegra so much better than say Tiagra in as much as I've only tried two road groupsets. When I've owned or experienced cable operated Campag, Shimano and SRAM. Then I'll consider the electronic stuff. Also by then I'll be likely to afford it.

veronese68

I've gone from initial thoughts of "why?" to pipe dream. Having read MRS and now CiB raving about it I must admit to thinking it'd be nice. Unfortunately as it costs more than my bike cost it's not going to happen.
One question though. If there is so little movement required to shift have either of you accidentally shifted when braking?

TheStone

It's really tempting. Made a nice wedge from cheltenham too.

rick_chasey

2011/12 must have been an alright year for you!!

rjsterry

CiB wrote:

MonkeyMonster wrote:

So what makes it stand out?

In the other thread CiB wrote:

Gear changes? Every one a winner, a slight press on the lever and bosh - straight in, first time, every time. It's quick, consistent, easy and takes away any need to divert attention to the gear-change so you just keep on pedalling and accept that the change has happened, without losing any momentum & direction. It all just happens, you know it's going to happen and that it'll be right, straight away. It's not quite telepathic but close enough for me ta. It's been on my road bike for a week or so now and the only minor regret is not doing it sooner.

I reckon this electric shifting is a bit of a game changer, and it's a shame that I can't really do it justice with a couple of sentences that try to convey just how much better it is.

It's hard to identify it exactly but it's the sense that gear changes aren't something you do, they become something that happens. There's more to it but that so far is my take on it.

Won't be investing any time soon. My 15 year old Shimano RSX shifters manage "first time, every time" and cope with even my cack-handed mis-timed changing. Seriously, how badly do people normally have their shifters set up? I've dropped my chain 3 times in the last ... well as far back as I can remember, and that was due to a new chain ring with a slightly different offset. I can see that it's very nice if you've go the cash, but on a budget, there's just no point.

<awaits accusations of Ludditism (?)>

fossyant

I'm seriously thinking about it or EPS. I may have a PI settlement soon, and depending upon what I get I may think about it.

Italian frame must be EPS though.

Only thing that would bother me now would be DA Di2 as the new groupset will be out next year, and it's going to be more compatible with Ultegra.

EPS is too new to know how good it is ? I've never heard anything bad about Di2.

bompington

It would be quite cool to go from my down-tube friction shifters directly to electronic - I'll wait until the week the Lidl version comes out in the special offers though.

fossyant

I haven't even gone STI - both my road bikes have Ultegra and DA groupsets and still have downtube shifters - you know what, they work too.

Still considering the electric-ery stuff though.

meanredspider

Veronese68 wrote:

If there is so little movement required to shift have either of you accidentally shifted when braking?

Nope - in fact, it's taken a little bit of practice to downshift the cassette side whilst braking hard (I go through a very narrow gap in the fence at the bottom of a 30mph+ slope - I love leaving the braking until the last second with the discs) in long-fingered gloves. Easy in mitts though. You aren't using the brake lever itself but a lever just behind it (which also might contribute to my relearning need)

TheStone

You can get upgrade kits. DA-1600EUR or Ultegra-1000EUR.
http://www.bike-components.de/products/ ... -Kit-.html
http://www.bike-components.de/products/ ... 2012-.html

I could probably sell the bits replaced for £180, so looking at £1150 or £650 upgrade.

DonDaddyD

It's not about the fact that they work, it's how they work.

suzyb

Are there any pre-built bikes that come with electronic shifting yet. Or is it still just an upgrade option.

Once again I'm thinking of a new bike, you know so it can sit in my room gathering dust cause I can't motivate myself to go out

fossyant

suzyb wrote:

Are there any pre-built bikes that come with electronic shifting yet. Or is it still just an upgrade option.

Once again I'm thinking of a new bike, you know so it can sit in my room gathering dust cause I can't motivate myself to go out

Loads, Cube, Canyon, Pinarello etc. etc.

meanredspider

fossyant wrote:

I'm seriously thinking about it or EPS. I may have a PI settlement soon, and depending upon what I get I may think about it.

Italian frame must be EPS though.

Only thing that would bother me now would be DA Di2 as the new groupset will be out next year, and it's going to be more compatible with Ultegra.

EPS is too new to know how good it is ? I've never heard anything bad about Di2.

I've heard that EPS uses something much closer to conventional lever throws. I think that might seem more natural to start with but perhaps unnecessarily slow when you are used to it

fossyant

With EPS, it's less of a throw, but they have built in a more mechanical click so you know you've changed, and if held down it will shift the over the whole cassette. But a few presses of a button is hardly hard work.

CiB

Veronese68 wrote:

One question though. If there is so little movement required to shift have either of you accidentally shifted when braking?

No. No movement doesn't equal no pressure. It does require more than a fleeting touch to change, quite a bit more tbh, but when that threshold is reached the change happens, smoothly, quickly, correctly. Every time.

rjsterry wrote:

My 15 year old Shimano RSX shifters manage "first time, every time" and cope with even my cack-handed mis-timed changing. Seriously, how badly do people normally have their shifters set up?

So did my Ultegra, usually. And sometimes I miss, my fingers slip off the lever, or I push a bit too far and the indexing goes half onto the next cog up but doesn't quite make it, or I just misjudge the effort despite doing a million gear changes on it and it doesn't drop in. And indexed gears do go out of tune. They'll be brilliant for a while then gradually lose that edge.

No-one's claiming that life's incomplete without i2, but it is a big step up from cables.

meanredspider

fossyant wrote:

With EPS, it's less of a throw, but they have built in a more mechanical click so you know you've changed, and if held down it will shift the over the whole cassette. But a few presses of a button is hardly hard work.

Ah - ok. I know I've changed because my legs are going at a different speed

Yup - the button pressing isn't a big deal - want to change 3 cogs just do 3 quick presses. There's very little I'd change about it TBH. Some aftermarket bling covers to the mechs might please some - they are a bit grey and utilitarian

FoldingJoe

Yep, I think I might pull the trigger on the Ultimate AL with Di2 before the end of the year, or as soon as I get a divorce, whichever happens first!!

fossyant

Sprint buttons for Strava sections, or the bar top buttons for the climbs.

rjsterry

CiB wrote:

Veronese68 wrote:

One question though. If there is so little movement required to shift have either of you accidentally shifted when braking?

No. No movement doesn't equal no pressure. It does require more than a fleeting touch to change, quite a bit more tbh, but when that threshold is reached the change happens, smoothly, quickly, correctly. Every time.

rjsterry wrote:

My 15 year old Shimano RSX shifters manage "first time, every time" and cope with even my cack-handed mis-timed changing. Seriously, how badly do people normally have their shifters set up?

So did my Ultegra, usually. And sometimes I miss, my fingers slip off the lever, or I push a bit too far and the indexing goes half onto the next cog up but doesn't quite make it, or I just misjudge the effort despite doing a million gear changes on it and it doesn't drop in. And indexed gears do go out of tune. They'll be brilliant for a while then gradually lose that edge.

No-one's claiming that life's incomplete without i2, but it is a big step up from cables.

Sure it's an improvement, but enough of an improvement to justify the cost of another bike. €1600 to cover up for my sloppy shifting technique just puts it so far down the list as to be of no further concern.

BTW, what's the battery life like on them and what happens when it does go flat? If you are retro fitting, is damage to the wiring a significant concern? I ask as my computer died as a result of the cables being worn away.