Warning to all Canyon full suss owners

Northwind

evo3ben wrote:

I beg to differ on that im affraid. I bit of paint fade maybe but nothing like this lol Plenty of bike have cables rubbing on the frame constantly where the rear suspension is moving up and down and these definitely do not eat throught the frame.

Come on feller, there's a difference between "rubbing on the frame" and pressing hard against it. it's like the difference between leaning on a file and just wiping it over the workpiece with no weight on.

blablablacksheep

i trying to see what the main issue is here apart from that they seem to have mounted the cable too near the frame without protection.

either way its a simple fix just patch it.

Every bike i know has cable rub and every time the fix is a simple cabel protector/sticker.

i suggest more pictures of what each person has other wise it comes across as if you found a major flaw with the bike which from the posts it clearly isnt that major tbh

evo3ben

Ok, i will use my bike for example being as i have had it for over 2 yrs and not a single bit of cable rub protection on it! Yes its an Orange Five, the bike that people love to hate lol.

The cable routing on the Five runs down the top of the down tube and uder the rear shock. Then they go into the rear swing arm via two little holes. Now, anyone that has build one of these from the frame up will know how hard it is to feed the cable through these holes while the rubber protection grommit is in place. So i took my rubber grommets out and put the cable through without them. With teh swing arm going up and down constantly there is minimal if any ware and thats after 2 years!

Edited to add that the cable has worn if anything.

Northwind

Obviously not comparable though. Now if you'd pulled it tight over a part so that every move of the suspension was fretting it, like they have, you'd be seeing some damage.

Anonymous

Northwind wrote:

Obviously not comparable though. Now if you'd pulled it tight over a part so that every move of the suspension was fretting it, like they have, you'd be seeing some damage.

Don't be silly, Orange 5s are magic.

Johnny Napalm

Don't be silly, Orange 5s are magic.

I knew you wouldn't be able to resist!

evo3ben

as much as that though in 100 miles? na, not buying it. Cover the frame in chopper tape and finish a job of protecting the rest of the frame that canyon should have done from factory :roll:

evo3ben

yeehaamcgee wrote:

Northwind wrote:

Obviously not comparable though. Now if you'd pulled it tight over a part so that every move of the suspension was fretting it, like they have, you'd be seeing some damage.

Don't be silly, Orange 5s are magic.

Im not gonna bite lol

Northwind

evo3ben wrote:

as much as that though in 100 miles? na, not buying it.

So what do you think caused it then?

Like I say, imagine using a file on a bit of metal, if you just wipe it over the top it barely marks it, if you apply pressure it cuts. It's not exactly the same, but it's the same effect you're seeing here.

evo3ben

That i couldnt honestly say to be honest. But, its a rubber/plastic cable outer, not a file. The rubber/plastic should ware before that damage is caused to the frame.

Im no expert in frame engineering, anodizing or painting but impo, that damage is not acceptable for that amount of use its had with out the use of tape or pads.

ajplummer

i have the Nerve Am 7. cable runs over the bottom bracket also, minor rubbing also has started. mine has started to cut into the frame but not too badly yet. But if i hadn't seen this thread and didn't check then i wouldn't like to see it in 6months.

Anonymous

evo3ben wrote:

Im no expert in frame engineering[/quote[
Nevaaar! :shock:

that damage is not acceptable for that amount of use its had with out the use of tape or pads.

Well, sherlock, that's kind of the whole point.

Growmac

I'm confused. What kind of tape do you / could you use that is harder and more wear resistant that aluminium??

I have the same bike, and the cable is routed over the top of the BB, but there is no apparent wear of the anodising. Anyway, isn't anodising pretty soft? I would expect the metal underneath to be more durable than a brake cable..

Northwind

Growmac wrote:

I'm confused. What kind of tape do you / could you use that is harder and more wear resistant that aluminium??

3M helicopter tape/equivalent resists cable wear far better than aluminium does. Same way as the cables can wear into metal.

Brood

Growmac wrote:

I'm confused. What kind of tape do you / could you use that is harder and more wear resistant that aluminium??

I have the same bike, and the cable is routed over the top of the BB, but there is no apparent wear of the anodising. Anyway, isn't anodising pretty soft? I would expect the metal underneath to be more durable than a brake cable..

http://www.biketart.com/products/biketape

AMcK

Quick update from me, albeit not much so far.

Canyon asked for some further info on mine - perhaps my mail wasn't as comprehensive as Stubs - but they appeared keen/concerned to understand whether the problem had affected others.

Worked out how to post a pic - so here's a comparison to Stubs, you be the judge whether it's all a storm in a teacup. Just over 10mm long, 3mm wide and 1mm or so deep.



Also checked my computer (which I reset on getting the bike) as my first post was a bit of a guess - closer to 200 miles riding all told.

Recognise that tape/protector would have solved the problem - like I said, Canyon are hot on it elsewhere, so I'm thinking it shouldn't be routed over the bb. Still surprised about the wear, but my first full susser/hydraulic disc brakes (after having a marin hardtail for over a decade).

So there you go.

supersonic

evo3ben

I've seen tight cables go completetly through headset cups, frames and fork crowns in a matter of DAYS on numerous bikes. All aluminium alloys used on bikes are about the same hardness. You can't say one bike has better alloys than another, and will not happen on some, it can and it does.

Tape has different durability qualities.

Growmac

Okay, the helicopter tape looks good, but they specifically say they don't recommend it for anodised frames. Which is what the Canyon is. Use it anyway?

supersonic

Use carbon patches - there is more than copter tape that can be used to solve this problem.

evo3ben

supersonic wrote:

evo3ben

I've seen tight cables go completetly through headset cups, frames and fork crowns in a matter of DAYS on numerous bikes. All aluminium alloys used on bikes are about the same hardness. You can't say one bike has better alloys than another, and will not happen on some, it can and it does.

Tape has different durability qualities.

OK, fair enough. I have not wiitnessed this in all my biking ownership (25years) nor seen it on anyone elses but you deal with these for a living so see way more than i do.

Only time will tell on these bikes, not a quickish mag test. Me personally, i will stay well clear

supersonic

It's purely cables and routing, nothing more. And it can be avoided or prevented.

Welsh_Tom

supersonic wrote:

Use carbon patches - there is more than copter tape that can be used to solve this problem.

what else? carbon patches look poo, and to cover that weld on the bb they look like the wrong shape

supersonic

Vinyl wrap, all sorts of adhesive tapes out there. I have even used sellotape! Nothing looks as bad as a bloody great divot in the frame.

If in doubt about the anodising, contact Canyon for more advice.

Horton

could be wrong but the 'copter tape & anodising issue might well be one or both of 2 things: 1) It's not a smooth finish which could affect how well it sticks to the metal; 2) Cosmetic - a glossy surfaced tape looks a bit poo on a matte ano surface - albeit a lot less poo than a

bloody great divot in the frame.

Hope you guys get your frames sorted... I've got one of their FR bikes and whilst there wasn't a sniff of tape in rub-areas, there were loads of soft rubber sleeves around the cables about an inch long in areas prone to contact with the cables. Clearly shows that they're well aware of the issues of cable rub so this might just be an oversight and as such hopefully they'll look favourably on a warranty claim.

Dick Scruttock

On my last anodized bike i used the lizard skins carbon patches as nothing else would stick to it.

Traindriverrob

Your problem is minuscule compared to mine, but it sounds like you got a similar response from Canyon as I have done, then again the response to my problem (from Germany) was the most disgusting example of aftersales care that you could possibly imagine!

Btw, looked at my frame tonight (2011 AM 6.0) and the routing is over the BB, but I have no marking. I have ordered some helicopter tape from eBay though!

Welsh_Tom

Traindriverrob wrote:

Your problem is minuscule compared to mine, but it sounds like you got a similar response from Canyon as I have done, then again the response to my problem (from Germany) was the most disgusting example of aftersales care that you could possibly imagine!

Btw, looked at my frame tonight (2011 AM 6.0) and the routing is over the BB, but I have no marking. I have ordered some helicopter tape from eBay though!

wont to tell us what it is then ??

What did they say.

lemoncurd

Put one of these on for a couple of days, just make sure that you distract your frame with a sweet or something before pulling the plaster off or there'll be tears.

Growmac

I'm only about 50 miles in, but my routing is over the top of the BB and there's no sign of any rubbing. Perhaps this is more a case of routing that is too tight than that is fundamentally incorrect?

That said, I think I'll get some tape of some sort and run it underneath, although it would be a lot more vulnerable to rock strikes that route so maybe I won't..? Will be keeping an eye on it anyway.

Fudgie

Welsh_Tom wrote:

wont to tell us what it is then ??

What did they say.

Rob's in the same position as stubs. Doesn't want to influence delicate negotiations with Canyon. Rob showed me his problem yesterday and it certainly is serious and worrying for all Canyon owners but, like stubs, Canyon's first response could in no way be considered good customer service. I'm sure he'll give us all the details when it's resolved - one way or the other.

Canyon's direct sales model is an exciting concept with a lot of benefits but it's success rests on it's after sales service. i.e. how they deal with problems. We all accept that things go wrong sometimes and that parts break. The way to deal with it is the John Lewis way - a no quibble money-back or exchange guarantee. That is why people return to them again and again and recommend them to others and their profits keep increasing. If Canyon treat their customers with contempt the word will quickly spread and they may as well forget selling in the UK.

It's their market to lose and they should be aware that a lot of people are watching the outcome of this thread very carefully. I'd hold off ordering a Canyon until we see a satisfactory outcome from the customer service point of view.