Who on BR has bought a 'cheap' Chinese carbon frame?

daniel_b

Percy Vera wrote:

I forgot to say, I bought my faulty frame from Carbonzone on eBay - he was great up until I contacted him about the fault. So if you still are going to buy a frame I would avoid Carbonzone, and take a punt with another.

Sorry to hear that PV, I had a similar experience with my carbon wheels, all very professional and helpful until I started wanting to discuss what to do with my imperfect wheels, very politely may I add, just about what my options were and how we could sort it between us.

I was then told that as I had unpacked the wheels, that I had accepted them, and if I returned them they would charge me 17% as a restocking fee on top of the cost of me posting them back of course, which would have set me back somewhere in the region of £100.

It is a shame, as they were, up until that point uber helpful, it's a pity they cannot carry the customer service on a bit further - although I appreciate they are a fair way away, but still, they are a business and have a reputation.

I guess you could say that we are probably in the 1% or 2% of people who get imperfect goods from them, and it's a risk you take when you order.

It's certainly put me off the idea of ordering a frame I must be honest.

What have you done with your bottle cage holes - were all 4 faulty........?

Dan

ademort

guinea wrote:

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=90693&start=15

The pictures of the chinarello on page two is enough to ensure I'll never buy one.

Have another look at this link. It,s suddenly taken a whole new turn.Somebody put some more pictures, allegedly from the bike with broken forks and newspaper sticking out of the fork crown featured on page 2. Unfortunately the bike on page 7 has different wheels and the frame is also different as i have pointed out.Of course there has to be an explaination, and who better to give that explaination than Starnut,One of Americas bikeshop owners who admits that this is a different bike than the one He posted on page 2 but that the failiure mode is the same in both frames as well as the pics that get sent out to dealers.My guess is that American dealers are suffering as a result of all the people who are buying frames direct from China and not going through the LBS as we used to. As a result of that every time a breakage occurs they plan on showing that breakage to as many people as possible.
If you are going to try and scare us by posting these pictures then at least post pictures of the same bike and dont insult our intelligence by posting pictures of two different bikes and claim they are the same is all i can say.
Ademort

rolf_f

ademort wrote:

If you are going to try and scare us by posting these pictures then at least post pictures of the same bike and dont insult our intelligence by posting pictures of two different bikes and claim they are the same is all i can say.
Ademort

So the situation isn't as bad as we thought it was because now there are two broken frames rather than just the one?

And, to be fair, you are insulting our intelligence just a little bit by claiming you won't pretend your bike is a Pinarello

derbygrimpeur

Went out on my club's chaingang last night and one of the lads was riding a new Cervelo which he'd got on a warranty claim because his last frame cracked at the bottom bracket. Ok, he got a replacement on warranty, but any frame can break. Surely the argument that anti-chinese-frame posters should be using is one related to warranty. But even then, it's up to the purchaser to decide whether they accept the risk of having no warranty.

So in short, if you don't like the chinese frames, fine. But don't bother posting here that they're made of paper etc. It's pointless.

ademort

derbygrimpeur wrote:

Went out on my club's chaingang last night and one of the lads was riding a new Cervelo which he'd got on a warranty claim because his last frame cracked at the bottom bracket. Ok, he got a replacement on warranty, but any frame can break. Surely the argument that anti-chinese-frame posters should be using is one related to warranty. But even then, it's up to the purchaser to decide whether they accept the risk of having no warranty.

So in short, if you don't like the chinese frames, fine. But don't bother posting here that they're made of paper etc. It's pointless.

+1
ademort

Percy Vera

mroli wrote:

and your problem was faulty bottle cage inserts... Did you get it sorted? How? and are you riding the bike?

I glued them with epoxy resin, unfortunately that didn't work. I'm still riding it (but not much due to an injury) with the bottle swinging about, I'll probably just end up using a couple of cable ties.

Daniel B wrote:

What have you done with your bottle cage holes - were all 4 faulty........?
Dan

Only 2 were faulty, the ones on the down tube.

As I said before at £300 it was worth a punt. The frame seems Ok, so if you're lucky and get one that isn't faulty it would be a good buy.

JustinLeeAtkinson

Hmmm

Happy with my chinese carbon. no decals, just black carbon. Much better ride than my 6 year old aluminium Dawes. Nuff said.

However, is anyone aware of any chinese cyclocross frames for sale??

P_Tucker

Nickwill wrote:

Then why do you pretend it's a Pinarello? Surely the only reason to put Pinarello stickers on is for other people to think you are riding the genuine article. I have no problem with people buying cheap frames but why do you need to pretend it's something it's not? You know it isn't so why do you need to infringe someone else's legitimate copyright.

I can't speak for ademort, but personally:

1. Pinarellos look awesome IMHO. However, I wouldn't pay £3.5k for one just as I wouldn't pay £200 for a pair of jeans - having done a quick cost-benefit analysis, I conclude that the benefits of owning the "real thing" simply don't justify the costs. If your analysis differs - you know what - that's okay.

2. It looks great at the cafe. I'm shit at cycling, looking good is all I've got. But CHRIST I look awesome.

3. The holier-than-thou comments amuse me no end. "But its not REAL". FFS. Its a bike made in a Chinese factory; if you think its better to send it to Italy, have an Italian bloke sand down the fork and fit the headset so that the "Made in Italy" sticker is legal, then send to the distributor, then to your local shop - all of which costs you £3k - then good for you. Personally I'm happy for it to arrive at my front door 6 weeks later directly from the factory for 10% of the price. And whilst my Chinarello might not have the weapons grade carbon fibre or the asymetric chainstays, or indeed a warranty - none of those will affect my enjoyment of it one jot.

4. The smug satisfaction of laughing at fat dentists riding a real Pinarello about half as fast as I ride my Chinarello is priceless. Even better if I manage to inform them how much mine cost before this happens.

BeaconJon

Well it's taken me a week of lunchtimes to read (with interest) this thread.

I'm looking for a winter build project to give me a slightly less "racey" ride for the Alps next year. I'm currently riding a Spesh E5 Aero-tech in aluminium. While I utterly love it's stiff responsive frame it does tend to beat my back up a little above 40 miles with the geometry.

I'm thinking that the FM028 might fit the bill. Any thoughts chaps?

Ps, me and the Mrs rode up L'alpe D'huez this year on race day, to be honest there was pretty much every type and price of bike you could imagine, even a guy on a Chopper!! Nobody gave a stuff what you were riding, just being there was all people wanted.

rob\'s_lexx

P_Tucker wrote:

Nickwill wrote:

Then why do you pretend it's a Pinarello? Surely the only reason to put Pinarello stickers on is for other people to think you are riding the genuine article. I have no problem with people buying cheap frames but why do you need to pretend it's something it's not? You know it isn't so why do you need to infringe someone else's legitimate copyright.

I can't speak for ademort, but personally:

1. Pinarellos look awesome IMHO. However, I wouldn't pay £3.5k for one just as I wouldn't pay £200 for a pair of jeans - having done a quick cost-benefit analysis, I conclude that the benefits of owning the "real thing" simply don't justify the costs. If your analysis differs - you know what - that's okay.

2. It looks great at the cafe. I'm shoot at cycling, looking good is all I've got. But CHRIST I look awesome.

3. The holier-than-thou comments amuse me no end. "But its not REAL". FFS. Its a bike made in a Chinese factory; if you think its better to send it to Italy, have an Italian bloke sand down the fork and fit the headset so that the "Made in Italy" sticker is legal, then send to the distributor, then to your local shop - all of which costs you £3k - then good for you. Personally I'm happy for it to arrive at my front door 6 weeks later directly from the factory for 10% of the price. And whilst my Chinarello might not have the weapons grade carbon fibre or the asymetric chainstays, or indeed a warranty - none of those will affect my enjoyment of it one jot.

4. The smug satisfaction of laughing at fat dentists riding a real Pinarello about half as fast as I ride my Chinarello is priceless. Even better if I manage to inform them how much mine cost before this happens.

bike looks stunning!!

what frame type is it (model number for example) and what supplier did u use if you don't mind my asking

Evil Laugh

I don't get the "Pissing off dentists" angle. Why would a dentist be pissed off that you've got a fake dogma? Why would he care what you paid for it even?

Btw your argument falls away at point one anyway. Dogmas look shite. IMHO.

Eyon

Just placed my order for a FM015-ISP from Hongfu! Should be a month or so away, cant wait!

Chip \'oyler

rob\'s_lexx wrote:

P_Tucker wrote:

Nickwill wrote:

Then why do you pretend it's a Pinarello? Surely the only reason to put Pinarello stickers on is for other people to think you are riding the genuine article. I have no problem with people buying cheap frames but why do you need to pretend it's something it's not? You know it isn't so why do you need to infringe someone else's legitimate copyright.

I can't speak for ademort, but personally:

1. Pinarellos look awesome IMHO. However, I wouldn't pay £3.5k for one just as I wouldn't pay £200 for a pair of jeans - having done a quick cost-benefit analysis, I conclude that the benefits of owning the "real thing" simply don't justify the costs. If your analysis differs - you know what - that's okay.

2. It looks great at the cafe. I'm shoot at cycling, looking good is all I've got. But CHRIST I look awesome.

3. The holier-than-thou comments amuse me no end. "But its not REAL". FFS. Its a bike made in a Chinese factory; if you think its better to send it to Italy, have an Italian bloke sand down the fork and fit the headset so that the "Made in Italy" sticker is legal, then send to the distributor, then to your local shop - all of which costs you £3k - then good for you. Personally I'm happy for it to arrive at my front door 6 weeks later directly from the factory for 10% of the price. And whilst my Chinarello might not have the weapons grade carbon fibre or the asymetric chainstays, or indeed a warranty - none of those will affect my enjoyment of it one jot.

4. The smug satisfaction of laughing at fat dentists riding a real Pinarello about half as fast as I ride my Chinarello is priceless. Even better if I manage to inform them how much mine cost before this happens.

bike looks stunning!!

what frame type is it (model number for example) and what supplier did u use if you don't mind my asking

How can you look good on anything fake? It's the cycling equivalent of wearing chav knock off Burberry

guinea

Evil Laugh wrote:

I don't get the "Pissing off dentists" angle. Why would a dentist be pissed off that you've got a fake dogma? Why would he care what you paid for it even?

It's the standard reply from people who have crap jobs and want to take the high ground against slower cyclists with better gear.

Me? I'd rather earn £150k and take 2 minutes more when climbing l'Alpe d'Huez on my summer holidays rather than work in Burger King and buy a Chinarello with a credit card.

The irony of people slagging off dentists when at the same time buying fake gear to emulate them.

The world laughs at you.

Back to the bikes. From all the objective evidence I've seen I'd be happy with one of the tried and tested no-brand frames from the established factoies taht supply the UK. No way would I try a fake look a likey frame made in a random factory that's never gone through proper testing.

P_Tucker

guinea wrote:

Evil Laugh wrote:

I don't get the "Pissing off dentists" angle. Why would a dentist be pissed off that you've got a fake dogma? Why would he care what you paid for it even?

It's the standard reply from people who have crap jobs and want to take the high ground against slower cyclists with better gear.

Me? I'd rather earn £150k and take 2 minutes more when climbing l'Alpe d'Huez on my summer holidays rather than work in Burger King and buy a Chinarello with a credit card.

The irony of people slagging off dentists when at the same time buying fake gear to emulate them.

The world laughs at you.

Back to the bikes. From all the objective evidence I've seen I'd be happy with one of the tried and tested no-brand frames from the established factoies taht supply the UK. No way would I try a fake look a likey frame made in a random factory that's never gone through proper testing.

Why do you assume that people who buy Chinarellos can't afford Pinarellos? My Chinarello order totalled 5 frames - for an accountant, a solicitor, a civil engineer, some kind of IT contractor and a guy who owns his own printing firm. We've all just done enough cycling and owned enough bikes to know that the differences aren't worth £3k.

guinea

P_Tucker wrote:

Why do you assume that people who buy Chinarellos can't afford Pinarellos? My Chinarello order totalled 5 frames - for an accountant, a solicitor, a civil engineer, some kind of IT contractor and a guy who owns his own printing firm. We've all just done enough cycling and owned enough bikes to know that the differences aren't worth £3k.

There are plenty of non-fake bikes that offer the same level of performace for the same money.

However, you chose the one that attempts to look more expensive than it really is so that you can mock medical professionals on the internet.

Are you for real?

carl_p

This thread gets more hilarious by the day.

I'm so poor I can't even afford a Chinarello. One of these will have to do for now...

http://www.funny-games.biz/pictures/1610-fake-bike.html

P_Tucker

guinea wrote:

P_Tucker wrote:

Why do you assume that people who buy Chinarellos can't afford Pinarellos? My Chinarello order totalled 5 frames - for an accountant, a solicitor, a civil engineer, some kind of IT contractor and a guy who owns his own printing firm. We've all just done enough cycling and owned enough bikes to know that the differences aren't worth £3k.

There are plenty of non-fake bikes that offer the same level of performace for the same money.

However, you chose the one that attempts to look more expensive than it really is so that you can mock medical professionals on the internet.

Are you for real?

There are plenty of bikes that offer materially the same performance for more money. In fact all of them.

If you read my earlier posts, you'll note that my primary reason for purchasing a Chinarello is that it looks awesome (IMHO) at the cafe. A £360 Ribble special would not (again IMHO). Mocking dentist sportifs is merely an added bonus.

ademort

P_Tucker wrote:

guinea wrote:

Evil Laugh wrote:

I don't get the "Pissing off dentists" angle. Why would a dentist be pissed off that you've got a fake dogma? Why would he care what you paid for it even?

It's the standard reply from people who have crap jobs and want to take the high ground against slower cyclists with better gear.

Me? I'd rather earn £150k and take 2 minutes more when climbing l'Alpe d'Huez on my summer holidays rather than work in Burger King and buy a Chinarello with a credit card.

The irony of people slagging off dentists when at the same time buying fake gear to emulate them.

The world laughs at you.

Back to the bikes. From all the objective evidence I've seen I'd be happy with one of the tried and tested no-brand frames from the established factoies taht supply the UK. No way would I try a fake look a likey frame made in a random factory that's never gone through proper testing.

Why do you assume that people who buy Chinarellos can't afford Pinarellos? My Chinarello order totalled 5 frames - for an accountant, a solicitor, a civil engineer, some kind of IT contractor and a guy who owns his own printing firm. We've all just done enough cycling and owned enough bikes to know that the differences aren't worth £3k.

I have also no problem in paying for a Real Pinarello, but just feel that for the price it,s not worth it. I,ve got the money but find it ludicrous to spend so much on a frame and fork.A chinarello does the job for me at a fraction of the cost.
Ademort

rolf_f

guinea wrote:

However, you chose the one that attempts to look more expensive than it really is so that you can mock medical professionals on the internet.

No, I think (though it is getting pretty confusing) that they buy fake Pinarellos to give people the impression that they have been ripped off by paying 3k for a frame they could have got on the internet for £300.

Either that or they like pretending they are richer than they are.........

P_Tucker

Indeed. If I could get a Chaptop for £75 that worked as well as my Sony Vaio, I would. If I could get a Chercedes S-Class that worked as well as a real one for £5k, I would.

Christ, the PANTS I'm wearing right now are from a box of 32 pairs of CK 365s I got for about £90 from - you guessed it - China. I've been wearing them for months now (to be clear, I change them daily and wash) and not ONCE has my c0ck fallen out during an important meeting or whilst being introduced to the Queen.

dodgy

GoingCarbon

When I started this topic seems I was far too nieve as I'd hoped it would be about the frame. Seems it's degenerated in to an excuse to slag each other. My bike rides help me relax, seems some posters need to ride more and read/write less.

If someone wants to buy their frame from China and have it painted it to float their boat isn't that their choice?

Should they try to sell it on and pass it off as the real thing that's another matter. Then hopefully we'll get the chance to expose them and get them kicked off BR.

As for who can afford what, what business is that of others? I can afford and have bought a Cervelo (mind you it was in the sale) but I have also bought a Chinese FM028 and 2 Boardman.

Similarly I can afford and have bought a Lexus. Could also have bought a Audi but instead but a Skoda (Audi/Skoda both owned by VAG). My point is some people are conspicuous consumers, some make in formed decisions, some do both and some just want to throw stones.

Evil Laugh

I wonder how many of the chinarello owners were out looting jd sports, laughing at all the other mugs who actually paid for their trainers. It's so funny. How many I wonder declared their goods to customs and paid the vat this country needs to rebuild it's economy crippled by people's greed.

Anyone wanna see a photo of the 42" flat screen I nicked from Currys in peckham yesterday? I did laugh at the dentist heckling me as I carried it off, bet his cost him £1000 the mug. It's ok though I had a think and came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth buying one.

:roll:

rolf_f

GoingCarbon wrote:

When I started this topic seems I was far too nieve as I'd hoped it would be about the frame. Seems it's degenerated in to an excuse to slag each other. My bike rides help me relax, seems some posters need to ride more and read/write less.

You want 54 dreary pages about frame specs and import duties? Each to their own I suppose but I reckon this threads been much more fun of late.

And it sounds like one thing most of us are doing is riding our bikes a lot but taa for the concern!

Evil Laugh

I thinl we are talking about the frames. What I've gathered...


Some people like to delude themselves they're getting a brand name frame from the same production line with but with no paint on.

Some people think the frames are way better than their old alu trek and probably as good as a dogma they've never ridden.

Some, who've never ridden them, say they are a cheap pile of crap.

Some say it's ok they break because branded bikes break too.

Some people apparently threatened by lack of business are trying to convince people they'll kill you.

Some people for some reason buy them and get them painted like dogmas and then show them off claiming it pisses off dentists.

Some people reckon they're frames copying the shape of popular brands, made in factories in china using some unknown grade of carbon in factories with questionable h&s, sold without any taxes being paid or any warranty given or any money pumped back into the sport or r&d and bought by people willing to take a chance of various kinds, because they're a little cheaper than a ribble or px.

P_Tucker

Evil Laugh wrote:

I wonder how many of the chinarello owners were out looting jd sports, laughing at all the other mugs who actually paid for their trainers. It's so funny. How many I wonder declared their goods to customs and paid the vat this country needs to rebuild it's economy crippled by people's greed.

Anyone wanna see a photo of the 42" flat screen I nicked from Currys in peckham yesterday? I did laugh at the dentist heckling me as I carried it off, bet his cost him £1000 the mug. It's ok though I had a think and came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth buying one.

:roll:

the crucial difference being, of course, that my 'stealing' Pinarellos logos doesn't deny anyone else their use

Eyon

Evil Laugh wrote:

I wonder how many of the chinarello owners were out looting jd sports, laughing at all the other mugs who actually paid for their trainers. It's so funny. How many I wonder declared their goods to customs and paid the vat this country needs to rebuild it's economy crippled by people's greed.

Anyone wanna see a photo of the 42" flat screen I nicked from Currys in peckham yesterday? I did laugh at the dentist heckling me as I carried it off, bet his cost him £1000 the mug. It's ok though I had a think and came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth buying one.

:roll:

Jeez thats stooping pretty low. Just because people like to buy bikes from China, doesnt really compare them to the london thugs does it?

I mean really, its a bike, get over it. You dont like the bike? Ignore it! People having a dig isnt going to make the guy strip the paint of his chinarello and paint it in his own colours is it? If a rider is riding his bike happily then let him be, if he wants it to look like a pinarello, let him be!

Its just a few chunks of carbon and metal at the end of the day, doesnt mean that everyone needs to kiss the arses of people riding 5k bikes and think the 350 quid bike riders are scum of the earth :roll:

GoingCarbon

Evil Laugh wrote:

I thinl we are talking about the frames. What I've gathered...


Some people like to delude themselves they're getting a brand name frame from the same production line with but with no paint on.

Some people think the frames are way better than their old alu trek and probably as good as a dogma they've never ridden.

Some, who've never ridden them, say they are a cheap pile of crap.

Some say it's ok they break because branded bikes break too.

Some people apparently threatened by lack of business are trying to convince people they'll kill you.

Some people for some reason buy them and get them painted like dogmas and then show them off claiming it pisses off dentists.

Some people reckon they're frames copying the shape of popular brands, made in factories in china using some unknown grade of carbon in factories with questionable h&s, sold without any taxes being paid or any warranty given or any money pumped back into the sport or r&d and bought by people willing to take a chance of various kinds, because they're a little cheaper than a ribble or px.

As I said, in a few less words, some people make informed decisions

ademort

Take a look at these Real Pinarellos that have failed. Funnily enough they all fail at the top tube and down tube :shock:


http://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum ... 90#p786990.
Funnily enough they always seem to break at the top tube and down tube
Ademort