NY Times - Cyclists are said to back claims Armstrong doped

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  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,653
    cajun_cyclist wrote:
    Currently at the news agent, hopefully the net article has as much as the magazine.

    http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/150 ... lance.html

    ooops, one of the comments...

    Which ONE of the comments were you REFERRING to? ;-)

    Was interesting to see how much cash he could be making out of the commercial arm of Livestrong, shame the article author didn't mention that....
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  • cajun_cyclist
    cajun_cyclist Posts: 493
    Was interesting to see how much cash he could be making out of the commercial arm of Livestrong, shame the article author didn't mention that....

    But a Reader does in the comments:
    Fast Company has taken on an interesting journalistic investigation, however they have missed an opportunity to completely understand the motivation of Armstrong and Livestrong.com. If you had looked closely at the SEC documentation for the Demand Media IPO (S1) you would find some interesting data points.

    Simply put, Livestrong.org is the charitable organization, while Livestrong.com is a for profit venture. When Livestrong.com was sold to Demand Media, Armstrong was given warrants that allow him to buy 1,062,500 shares at $6/share after the Demand Media IPO. These warrants were issued in exchange for Armstrong providing “certain services and endorsement rights”. Demand Media is expected to go out at $12/share meaning Armstrong is expected to pull in over $6.3 MM in profit from endorsing the Livestrong name. This provides high credence to the argument that Armstrong’s comeback to the sport and specifically the 28 jersey incident were simply motivated by Armstrong’s obligation to promote Livestrong in exchange for his warrants.

    There is certainly nothing illegal about what Armstrong is doing but it does put in to question his altruistic motivations. His awareness effort for Livestrong clearly provides him a paycheck. Most importantly, you will not find any other high profile leaders at high profile charities participating in such nefarious activities.
    Bill Hughes11/13/2010 03:47 PM


    I will have to mill over this article over the next few days. I guess this is a business magazine though I'm not positive about that. Lance loses his halo a bit with this.
  • sherer
    sherer Posts: 2,460
    The article may clai that no other owner of a charity does this but how many did they investigate ? Not saying the staement isn't true but it does seem a bit sweeping
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,653
    @cajun - yes that's what I was referring to. If the commenter is correct then the article can only be read as a PR gloss job. Making several million dollars out of your charity work is a fairly relevant detail to omit, whether it be deliberately or through lack of research.
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  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 14,653
    sherer wrote:
    The article may clai that no other owner of a charity does this but how many did they investigate ? Not saying the staement isn't true but it does seem a bit sweeping

    That's not part of the article, it's a comment on it. I can't comment on whether it's true or not that other charity leaders haven't cashed in like that, but it's certainly the sort of thing that could get a charity a very bad rep if it were common knowledge.
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  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Another big article is going to appear in Sports Illustrated in the US in the next couple of weeks. Probably to coincide with the TdU.

    From what I've read, there will be some new stuff, but who knows if it'll be interesting.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • cajun_cyclist
    cajun_cyclist Posts: 493
    Iain72: thanks for the update.

    A big article in SI? Huh?? SI has had some good investigative journalism in the past, maybe they'll look at the financial angles of the charities. SI has tended to partner with CNN I believe, CNN/SI.

    As an example of SI journalism, I know they could not find anything directly on Usain Bolt but they were able to find some things on other Jamaican tracksters like getting substances in the mail. So if they send out investigators, maybe, just maybe they can find something. I don't see "kid gloves" treatment here.
  • Steve2020
    Steve2020 Posts: 133
    There is a big long article about him in the new Procycling which has just arrived. Nothing new in it (his hissy fit about this forum gets another mention) but it does say "a source close to the investigation assured us that two of Armstrong's most emblematic former team-mates had told...everything about their time under the Armstrong and Bruyneel regime"

    Presumably Hamilton is the other one.
  • Rodrego Hernandez
    Rodrego Hernandez Posts: 1,436
    Steve2020 wrote:
    There is a big long article about him in the new Procycling which has just arrived. Nothing new in it (his hissy fit about this forum gets another mention) but it does say "a source close to the investigation assured us that two of Armstrong's most emblematic former team-mates had told...everything about their time under the Armstrong and Bruyneel regime"

    Presumably Hamilton is the other one.

    Surely he's not happy with the Cycling News forum, unless he's been on this one and been criticised for giving feedback on a Trek by some idiot who rides a compact
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:

    Surely he's not happy with the Cycling News forum, unless he's been on this one and been criticised for giving feedback on a Trek by some idiot who rides a compact

    Nah, I outraged him 2 years ago with my question I posted here and it was asked. He threw a strop and it was one of my prouder moments.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • Rodrego Hernandez
    Rodrego Hernandez Posts: 1,436
    iainf72 wrote:
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:

    Surely he's not happy with the Cycling News forum, unless he's been on this one and been criticised for giving feedback on a Trek by some idiot who rides a compact

    Nah, I outraged him 2 years ago with my question I posted here and it was asked. He threw a strop and it was one of my prouder moments.

    Got a link?

    Wouldn't surprise me, he is a tool and deserves to go down for ruining our sport.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:

    Surely he's not happy with the Cycling News forum, unless he's been on this one and been criticised for giving feedback on a Trek by some idiot who rides a compact

    Nah, I outraged him 2 years ago with my question I posted here and it was asked. He threw a strop and it was one of my prouder moments.

    Got a link?

    Wouldn't surprise me, he is a tool and deserves to go down for ruining our sport.

    Yeah. Ian never mentions it....

    It's in one of the mags - was one of the reasons I joined the forum!
    _
  • dennisn
    dennisn Posts: 10,601
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:
    iainf72 wrote:
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:

    Surely he's not happy with the Cycling News forum, unless he's been on this one and been criticised for giving feedback on a Trek by some idiot who rides a compact

    Nah, I outraged him 2 years ago with my question I posted here and it was asked. He threw a strop and it was one of my prouder moments.



    ............. he is a tool and deserves to go down for ruining our sport.

    I understand what you're saying. It's too bad that this year will be the last for Pro Cycling.
    No more TDF or Giro. No more one day races. No team sponsors. All the riders have left to do is open a bike shop. It's all ruined. OUR sport has bit the dust and only waits to be swept into history and only be read about in dusty old books. I've even heard that bicycles themselves are being discontinued by most makers. Shimano, Campy, Sram - all gone by next year. Nothing left. Sad, sad, sad. What sport, if any, will you be taking up
    this coming year? I'm thinking badminton but I suppose someone will come along and ruin it too. Will there be any sports left after all this?
  • cajun_cyclist
    cajun_cyclist Posts: 493
    Dennis has a point here, would not the people who ruined the sport at the very least have been caught?? Okay, the point that someone may have abused and NOT caught is valid but still, let's see the riders that have been officially caught or sanctioned that have won the Tour since '96.

    1996 Bjarne Riis CAUGHT
    1997 Jan Ullrich CAUGHT
    1998 Marco Pantani CAUGHT
    1999-2005 Lance Armstrong
    2006 Floyd Landis CAUGHT Yellow Jersey to Oscar Perreiro
    2007 Contador CAUGHT
    2008 Carlos Sastre
    2009 Contador CAUGHT
    2010 ContadorCAUGHT

    :wink:
  • cajun_cyclist
    cajun_cyclist Posts: 493
    From New Zealand:
    Seven-time Tour de France champion Lance Armstrong has been forced to pull out of the Rotorua's Blue Lake Multisport Festival next month, due to problems with his knee.

    He will return to the United States immediately after participating in the Tour Down Under in Australia..

    http://www.rotoruadailypost.co.nz/have- ... t/3935632/
    Armstrong had planned to compete in a sprint triathlon, but in a phone interview he said the knee condition had forced him to stop his training runs. The injury has not interfered with his cycling. Armstrong still plans to compete in the Tour Down Under cycling race in Australia that begins Jan. 16.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/30/sport ... lance.html

    "Sprint Triathlon"? Not my sport, not familiar with that, means what it says I guess.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Rodrego Hernandez wrote:

    Got a link?

    Wouldn't surprise me, he is a tool and deserves to go down for ruining our sport.

    No link, but here is the comedy question..

    PC : Why should I take the relationship with Catlin seriously, when at the time I’m writing this question you have no legal agreement in place with him? (iain Forfar, London)

    LA : There is no point in me sitting down with Procycling if these are your readers, because they don’t want to read about me and I don’t want to talk to them. These guys may as well go and read about something else. This is what is always so interesting about the blacklist – you have a lot of demands on your time. Do you want to talk to this person or that person? Is this magazine available in Europe? In the US? Do you want to sit down with them? You have all these demands, but you, can’t do all of them. .... (some shit) But you see these – and no offence to the questions, they’re great questions – but there is probably no need for me to be available. These are forum questions – watchdog groups, Michele Ferrari, Don Catlin. This is the shit that they lob in the night
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,549
    You fail to mention me softening him up for you with my question about working with Dr Michele Ferrari. :wink:

    That interview was hilarious.
  • skavanagh.bikeradar
    skavanagh.bikeradar Posts: 1,097
    While we are at it I irritated him with one about how he planned to measure success.
  • dave_1
    dave_1 Posts: 9,512
    just seen load of pics of LA at miami beach a month back. All the muscle bulk gone...either he takes the triathlon stuff serious or he is worried sick.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKBacb2V ... ata_player
  • Monty Dog
    Monty Dog Posts: 20,614
    Dave_1 wrote:
    just seen load of pics of LA at miami beach a month back. All the muscle bulk gone...either he takes the triathlon stuff serious or he is worried sick.

    Maybe Bertie sent him some of his Spanish steaks?
    Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..
  • cajun_cyclist
    cajun_cyclist Posts: 493
    Dave_1 wrote:
    just seen load of pics of LA at miami beach a month back. All the muscle bulk gone...either he takes the triathlon stuff serious or he is worried sick.

    If he pulled out of the New Zealand Triathlon, it did make me wonder, maybe he doesn't want to fuss with it. As for LA in Miami, http://www.superpages.com/bp/Miami-FL/L ... 758551.htm Attorney in Miami and on the same google result pages, a Lourdes Santiago, Business Law Office in the Livestrong.com forums showing searching "Lance Armstrong Miami" can yield all kinds of results.
  • Kléber
    Kléber Posts: 6,842
    If he's out of the NZ triathlon, can he ride the Tour Down Under?
  • finchy
    finchy Posts: 6,686
    Kléber wrote:
    If he's out of the NZ triathlon, can he ride the Tour Down Under?

    If he's got a knee condition then a triathlon would be far worse than a bike race.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    I think he can cycle, but can't run (from the law)
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • Kléber
    Kléber Posts: 6,842
    Plus I suppose an appearance fee of one million Aussie dollars eases the pain somewhat? I know I'd get out of bed for something like this.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Kléber wrote:
    Plus I suppose an appearance fee of one million Aussie dollars eases the pain somewhat? I know I'd get out of bed for something like this.

    Also, if hospitals pay you to use the name of your foundation in their research centre, the least you can do is swing by and glad hand a few folks.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • dave_1
    dave_1 Posts: 9,512
    you guys must be praying on a daily basis for Jeff'n to announce a court case. Statute of limitations is up this month on the 2004 Landis stuff is it not? So time is almost up.. And if a grand jury doesn't take a case forward then I guess we don't hear that...Jeff just goes quietly away, no loss of face???
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKBacb2V ... ata_player
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Dave_1 wrote:
    you guys must be praying on a daily basis for Jeff'n to announce a court case. Statute of limitations is up this month on the 2004 Landis stuff is it not? So time is almost up.. And if a grand jury doesn't take a case forward then I guess we don't hear that...Jeff just goes quietly away, no loss of face???

    Statute of limitations is on doping offences.

    Floyd is probably not the big part of this story - Sure, he provided some information but if anyone thinks they're building a case on what Flandis said, they're dreaming.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • sherer
    sherer Posts: 2,460
    Dave_1 wrote:
    you guys must be praying on a daily basis for Jeff'n to announce a court case. Statute of limitations is up this month on the 2004 Landis stuff is it not? So time is almost up.. And if a grand jury doesn't take a case forward then I guess we don't hear that...Jeff just goes quietly away, no loss of face???

    that's prob more like the CN forums, they are even more obsessed than over here.

    I think with no news the statute will slip as it would have to go from Grand Jury to a proper trial and be over by end of Jan or something like that so no chance of that.

    As has been stated this may not really be about LA but whether public money was used by people higher up to fund a doping programme
  • Kléber
    Kléber Posts: 6,842
    The statute of limitations is surely near-meaningless? After all Armstrong is effectively retired as a cyclist so any ban, if it were to to happen, would be near meaningless. Plus the likes of Bjarne Riis still see their names in the history books and it would be a mockery to award the Tour to those who came second given the stench associated with so many riders at the time.

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