Big fat winter power training thread
Comments
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Using the Kurt Kinetic Power Curve (set up as described) and algorithm
FTP: 332w
Weight: 75.5kg (damn swiss trip!)
W/Kg: 4.4"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
Just done the test.
Computing results...
Stand by...0 -
Standby...0
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Seperating them out into those with weights, and those without
JibberJim
Nov -- 295watts -- 75kg -- 3.9 w/kg
Bhima
Oct -- 278watts -- 58kg -- 4.8 w/kg
Alex_Simmons/RST --- Sep -- 280watts -- 78kg -- 3.6 w/kg
Oct -- 280watts -- 78kg -- 3.6 w/kg
Nov -- 300watts -- 78kg -- 3.8 w/kg
Phil S
Oct -- 305watts -- 71kg -- 4.3 w/kg
Disgruntledgoat
Nov -- 332watts -- 76kg -- 4.4 w/kg
NapD -
Sept 220 watts -- 96kg -- 2.3 w/kg
Nov---277watts--89kg--3.1 w/kg
58585 - Sept 4.1-Oct 3.6
hopper1 - Nov 3.0
Pokerface - Nov 3.1
Jeff Jones - Sept 4.65-Oct 4.6-Nov N/A0 -
*noob alert*
Got a turbo trainer that shows power output, and it gives average over the duration of session. So is it just a matter of climbing on and going as hard as i can for an hour and seeing what the average is at the end?
10 min warmup beforehand, or straight into it? :S0 -
Rokkala wrote:*noob alert*
Got a turbo trainer that shows power output, and it gives average over the duration of session. So is it just a matter of climbing on and going as hard as i can for an hour and seeing what the average is at the end?
10 min warmup beforehand, or straight into it? :S
Which trainer? If its an Elite Crono like I have then it is over by around 10% I reckon and the resistance changes significantly over the first 20 mins or so as it warms up..More problems but still living....0 -
It's a Tacx cycleforce basic0
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Pretty much but be aware that reported power outputs from turbos can be fairly inaccurate (unless you are lucky enough to have a Cycleops Powerbeam or similar expensive bit of kit).Rokkala wrote:Got a turbo trainer that shows power output, and it gives average over the duration of session. So is it just a matter of climbing on and going as hard as i can for an hour and seeing what the average is at the end?
Yes, warmup first before starting the session then note your average power output excluding the warmup.Rokkala wrote:10 min warmup beforehand, or straight into it? :S0 -
http://alex-cycle.blogspot.com/2008/05/ ... -sins.htmlRokkala wrote:So is it just a matter of climbing on and going as hard as i can for an hour and seeing what the average is at the end?
10 min warmup beforehand, or straight into it? :S0 -
~69kg and ~320W in Sept/Oct but I suspect the formatting is going to get horrible if we add all this data for the next few months
W/kg is a pretty good metric and as the OP said, there are no prizes, just keep it consistent.Jeff Jones
Product manager, Sports0 -
Cheers to those who provided info!
I take it when you say some of the turbos power readings can be inaccurate, you mean they tend to exaggerate the actual power?
This should be fun anyway, 1hour hard as i can on turbo, which is indoors, and i have no fan. Not going to be pretty
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Jeff Jones wrote:~69kg and ~320W in Sept/Oct but I suspect the formatting is going to get horrible if we add all this data for the next few months
Should probably just show the latest, the previous ones will be there in the other posts.
I'm not sure I'll actually improve much through the winter anyway, finding the commute depresses fitness, and I just don't have the time or inclination to train at the minute.Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/0 -
Rokkala wrote:Cheers to those who provided info!
I take it when you say some of the turbos power readings can be inaccurate, you mean they tend to exaggerate the actual power?
This should be fun anyway, 1hour hard as i can on turbo, which is indoors, and i have no fan. Not going to be pretty
Full blast for an hour indoors without any fan sounds like a recipe for deep unpleasantness and you'll not achieve anything remotely like the effort you'd achieve if you were cooled :shock:
You might be better spending the hour nipping down to Argos or similar fan vending establishment for the biggest mutha they sell, and get two of them 0 -
rdt wrote:Full blast for an hour indoors without any fan sounds like a recipe for deep unpleasantness and you'll not achieve anything remotely like the effort you'd achieve if you were cooled :shock:
You might be better spending the hour nipping down to Argos or similar fan vending establishment for the biggest mutha they sell, and get two of them
Think thats probably a very good idea! Have a friend who works for Argos anyway, discount time! 0 -
No, they can be inaccurate either way and often not consistent either (lack precision). They can vary from session to session, also the power readings can drift as the unit heatsup/cools down. Some are better than others.Rokkala wrote:I take it when you say some of the turbos power readings can be inaccurate, you mean they tend to exaggerate the actual power?
While wheel speed/cadence can be used a a power proxy on a trainer (if you can minimise the variations for your trainer) then the next challenge is that the relationship of speed/cadence to power can be pretty brutal.
e.g. a 1 rpm increase in cadence may tip the power well over what you are capable of sustaining. It all depends on the power-speed relationship of your trainer. Not such a big deal for general aerobic rides but when you are doing intervals, it can "make or break" you.0 -
Finally psyched myself up enough to do the hour on the turbo. Tried getting a big fan at weekend, but it seems lot of places don't stock them come winter :[
Anyways: 11st7=73.03kg by my calculations, and the average i got for the hour was 312watts. So 4.27w/kg for me 0 -
Been ill the last two weeks and starting to feel a little better so today I did a scheduled threshold workout. Used the Carmichael Climbing DVD. I decided to set my FTP a little lower to compensate, at 265 watts (dotted yellow line).
Warm up
2 x 5 mins at 50-55 rpm (1st one at about 85-90% FTP, second 100-105% FTP)
1 x 10 mins at 85 rpm, 100-105% FTP
1 x 10 mins with 1 min at 65 rpm, 1min 85 rpm, all at 100-105% FTP.
5 mins recovery between each of the blocks.
For some reason though, the DVD only does 9 minutes in the second '10' minute block!
Will do an extra minute next time...
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My effort today. I have always find indoor training hard when it comes to 2x20 but I'm getting better at it. Does this mean I'm getting fitter or just more mentally resilient?
-- Dirk Hofman Motorhomes --0 -
Heh heh, like the google tab for 'How to take a screenshot'
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:oops:-- Dirk Hofman Motorhomes --0
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Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:
While wheel speed/cadence can be used a a power proxy on a trainer (if you can minimise the variations for your trainer)
My rollers have a fixed resistance and the tyres/rollers dont heat up at all (well, i'm 99% sure they dont). I'm also pretty sure that there is no fluctuation of power requirements for a given speed over time...
The question is - if I did an FT test, using average 1 hour speed instead of power, would all of the percentages on [this page] be relevant to me?
e.g. if my 1 hour maximum steady-speed is 45 kmph (my current educated guess as i've not actually done the test yet), would this be 80% of my MAP (or MAS)? (56.25 kmph?) etc.....0 -
Bhima wrote:Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:
While wheel speed/cadence can be used a a power proxy on a trainer (if you can minimise the variations for your trainer)
My rollers have a fixed resistance and the tyres/rollers dont heat up at all (well, i'm 99% sure they dont). I'm also pretty sure that there is no fluctuation of power requirements for a given speed over time...
The question is - if I did an FT test, using average 1 hour speed instead of power, would all of the percentages on [this page] be relevant to me?
e.g. if my 1 hour maximum steady-speed is 45 kmph (my current educated guess as i've not actually done the test yet), would this be 80% of my MAP (or MAS)? (56.25 kmph?) etc.....
Tell you what - come out to Derbyshire over Christmas and you can strap my Powertap wheel on for an hour. If you have Shimano. You can do some genuine testing and I'll verify the results. You can either do a full hour or do 20 minute efforts up Long Hill.0 -
No. If it were, it would be by coincidence only.Bhima wrote:Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:
While wheel speed/cadence can be used a a power proxy on a trainer (if you can minimise the variations for your trainer)
My rollers have a fixed resistance and the tyres/rollers dont heat up at all (well, i'm 99% sure they dont). I'm also pretty sure that there is no fluctuation of power requirements for a given speed over time...
The question is - if I did an FT test, using average 1 hour speed instead of power, would all of the percentages on [this page] be relevant to me?
e.g. if my 1 hour maximum steady-speed is 45 kmph (my current educated guess as i've not actually done the test yet), would this be 80% of my MAP (or MAS)? (56.25 kmph?) etc.....0 -
Deal!Pokerface wrote:Tell you what - come out to Derbyshire over Christmas and you can strap my Powertap wheel on for an hour. If you have Shimano. You can do some genuine testing and I'll verify the results. You can either do a full hour or do 20 minute efforts up Long Hill.
Doing long hill sounds like more "fun", especially as i'm still finding pacing a full hour very difficult, but can you learn as much from 20 minute efforts compared to a full hour?0 -
December:
74 kg 338 Watts 4.5 Watts per Kilo
Sweet progression!"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
I use 2x20-min efforts as one of a multitude of "sins" when assessing my threshold power.Pokerface wrote:Bhima wrote:Can you learn as much from 20 minute efforts compared to a full hour?
Yes. If done correctly. Alex may be along shortly to explain how/why.
In fact, I believe he does 2x20 intervals to calculate his FTP.
My "sins" include a combination of assessing data from:
- regular long intervals (2x20-min)
- time trial tests
- normalised power from races of ~ 1hr duration
- Maximal Aeobic Power tests
Now 20-min max power from a well paced TT effort is a very good indicator of aerobic ability, since it is mostly an aerobic effort, however there is still a not insignificant contribution from anaerobic work capacity and it is no better or worse at predicting one's hour power than some other sins.
I find Functional Threshold Power can be anywhere from 88-96% of 20-min max power, but typically ~ 90-95%.0 -
Does anyone actually do a proper one hour test this time of year?
I'll be honest, I can't face one! I can do two hr rides at a high percentage of ftp and I can do 3x20 higher than ftp but because I spend what seems like all summer doing 25 mile tt's I cant face doing all out 1 hour efforts at the moment.0 -
JibberJim
Nov -- 295watts -- 75kg -- 3.9 w/kg
Dec -- 300watts -- 75kg -- 4.0 w/kg
Bhima
Oct -- 278watts -- 58kg -- 4.8 w/kg
Alex_Simmons/RST --- Sep -- 280watts -- 78kg -- 3.6 w/kg
Oct -- 280watts -- 78kg -- 3.6 w/kg
Nov -- 300watts -- 78kg -- 3.8 w/kg
Phil S
Oct -- 305watts -- 71kg -- 4.3 w/kg
Disgruntledgoat
Nov -- 332watts -- 76kg -- 4.4 w/kg
NapD -
Sept 220 watts -- 96kg -- 2.3 w/kg
Nov---277watts--89kg--3.1 w/kg
No real improvement, but I thought I'd update the page. Still well behind where I was.Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/0 -
Finding a road to do a full hour without stopping or encountering downhill stretches is more challenging than actually doing a full hour at FTP!0
