And the hits just keep on coming! 3 more riders positive
Comments
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disgruntledgoat wrote:It's the sheer length of it that makes the challenge though Pokerface, the last pure sprinter i can think of winning it was Cipo in 2002 (I think Friere is more than just a pure sprinter as 3 Worlds will testify). It normally comes down to a sprint from a small group, which does favour a certain type of rider, i'll grant you.
I just looked at the list of winners - and you are correct. Even the "sprinters" who have won it weren't pure sprinters. Like Valverde coming 2nd to Boonen in 2002 for instance. That couldn't have been a big bunch sprint!0 -
LIke you say it suits a certain type of rider, who has a good kick at the ned of a long race. Riders like Valverde and Bettini aren't sprinters, they are riders who have an excellent sprint finish, so good in fact that they could compete in bunch sprints.
I'd say 8 years between "pure" sprinters worlds is pretty good0 -
Look at the list of the winners. Tell me how many in the last ten years or so you would consider to be in your top five favourite riders.
I clearly mentioned above that this year may be different but I still hold by the fact it doesn't mean the massive amount that some people seem to hold it by.Contador is the Greatest0 -
There isn't an objective measure of how much a race "means", you know. I, by and large, prefer one day races because they promote risk taking and attacking riding.
And why would you limit it to the last ten years? Of people who have won the worlds in even the last 20 years I would list Lemond, Bugno, Bettini, Boonen, Museeuw, Friere, Cipo and Olano as worthy winners of any race!
The podiums are stuffed full of class too! Cunego, Valverde... The 1 2 3 in 1995 of Olano, Indurain and Pantani is one of the best races i've ever seen."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
frenchfighter wrote:
I clearly mentioned above that this year may be different but I still hold by the fact it doesn't mean the massive amount that some people seem to hold it by.
I think most cycling fans would rank it alongside the biggest single day classics in importance.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
Favourites, not worthy. 99% of winners of any bike race are worthy.Contador is the Greatest0
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iainf72 wrote:frenchfighter wrote:
I clearly mentioned above that this year may be different but I still hold by the fact it doesn't mean the massive amount that some people seem to hold it by.
I think most cycling fans would rank it alongside the biggest single day classics in importance.
Do you base your opinions on those of others? I don't as should be quite clear.
In my opinion a win in Flanders, LBL, Roubaix or MSR is much, much better.Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Favourites, not worthy. 99% of winners of any bike race are worthy.
So if my favourite riders haven't won it, and my favourite riders don't measure up as greats in your estimation, the race isn't as good as a different race... How does that work? It has nothing to do with whether my favourite rider is capable of winning it!
What if, for example, my favourite rider is a British Cat 2... Does that make the Tour of Flanders less good than the Bashall Eaves CDNW RR?"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
frenchfighter wrote:iainf72 wrote:frenchfighter wrote:
I clearly mentioned above that this year may be different but I still hold by the fact it doesn't mean the massive amount that some people seem to hold it by.
I think most cycling fans would rank it alongside the biggest single day classics in importance.
Do you base your opinions on those of others? I don't as should be quite clear.
In my opinion a win in Flanders, LBL, Roubaix or MSR is much, much better.
You also described your opinion as fact."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
frenchfighter wrote:iainf72 wrote:frenchfighter wrote:
I clearly mentioned above that this year may be different but I still hold by the fact it doesn't mean the massive amount that some people seem to hold it by.
I think most cycling fans would rank it alongside the biggest single day classics in importance.
Do you base your opinions on those of others? I don't as should be quite clear.
In my opinion a win in Flanders, LBL, Roubaix or MSR is much, much better.
What's clear is that you are completely incapable of considering other people's opinions, and anyone who offers an opinion different to yours is dismissed out of hand.
Why do I get the feeling your opinion would change if Contador won the worlds in the next couple of years?0 -
Lets take this from another angle.
Does a flat 1 day race on smooth roads in September whose riders haven't races much in close proximity to the event rank as highly as a 1 day hilly race or a flat one on bad road surfaces in Spring whose riders have likely riden many races within a fortnight window either side?Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Look at the list of the winners. Tell me how many in the last ten years or so you would consider to be in your top five favourite riders.
I clearly mentioned above that this year may be different but I still hold by the fact it doesn't mean the massive amount that some people seem to hold it by.
I'll bite - Freire and Boonen are in my top 5. If it was top 10, Bettini would be in there too. Most of the current crop of GT riders don't make it to my top 5'This week I 'ave been mostly been climbing like Basso - Shirley Basso.'0 -
afx237vi wrote:What's clear is that you are completely incapable of considering other people's opinions, and anyone who offers an opinion different to yours is dismissed out of hand.
Why do I get the feeling your opinion would change if Contador won the worlds in the next couple of years?
What you need to understand is that in most threads I make a comment then 95% of members hold a contrary opinion and try and attack mine then I proceed to defend it. I will not apologise for holding opinions different to the majority.
Did I not clearly say that I consider this year to be different because of the parcours and that it could be so next year? Also, I wouldn't expect you to try and goad me with Contador - this should be the reserve of the members I hold in contempt.
In any case, I guess there are a fair few members who actually enjoy disagreeing with me, and some have even said as much. If everyone held the same opinion, do you think this forum would be more interesting?Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Lets take this from another angle.
Does a flat 1 day race on smooth roads in September whose riders haven't races much in close proximity to the event rank as highly as a 1 day hilly race or a flat one on bad road surfaces in Spring whose riders have likely riden many races within a fortnight window either side?
Where do you get this idea that the worlds is ridden on a flat circuit every year? Look at the Salzburg circuit from a couple of years ago, Stuttgart wasn't flat, Hamilton certainly wasn't flat and even Varese had a decent hillock in if I recall correctly. If it is as flat as you say, why does Cipo only have one win in it? 220km over any terrain is no joke and the kind of medium length hills they put in will put top riders in difficulty when ridden over 10 times, covering attack etc. The 1995 race had about 2000 metres of ascent.
Even on the falt circuits... Why should the worlds cater for a GT rider every year? There's loads of races/stages that do that."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Lets take this from another angle.
Does a flat 1 day race on smooth roads in September whose riders haven't races much in close proximity to the event rank as highly as a 1 day hilly race or a flat one on bad road surfaces in Spring whose riders have likely riden many races within a fortnight window either side?
Er... yes? What does the amount of racing either side have to do with anything? A load of riders have just come off the Vuelta, so what?
Any race over 250 km is a worthy race to put on anyone's palmares. The fact that it's done for your country, and on a different route each year just adds a little bit more.0 -
frenchfighter wrote:afx237vi wrote:What's clear is that you are completely incapable of considering other people's opinions, and anyone who offers an opinion different to yours is dismissed out of hand.
Why do I get the feeling your opinion would change if Contador won the worlds in the next couple of years?
What you need to understand is that in most threads I make a comment then 95% of members hold a contrary opinion and try and attack mine then I proceed to defend it. I will not apologise for holding opinions different to the majority.
Did I not clearly say that I consider this year to be different because of the parcours and that it could be so next year? Also, I wouldn't expect you to try and goad me with Contador - this should be the reserve of the members I hold in contempt.
In any case, I guess there are a fair few members who actually enjoy disagreeing with me, and some have even said as much. If everyone held the same opinion, do you think this forum would be more interesting?
Look, you're entitled to your opinion, but so is everyone else. Sometimes the way you phrase things does seem to be deliberately provocative.
You shouldn't "hold people in contempt" just because they write something you don't agree with. It's only a cycling forum. It's not really that important in the grand scheme of things.0 -
afx237vi wrote:Er... yes? What does the amount of racing either side have to do with anything? A load of riders have just come off the Vuelta, so what?Blazing Saddles wrote:It is such an unimportant event, that half the Vuelta field ride two of three weeks, just in preparation.Rather, it makes the Vuelta winner look like a someone chasing the season's scraps.
What other races have their been between the Vuelta and the Worlds?Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:afx237vi wrote:What's clear is that you are completely incapable of considering other people's opinions, and anyone who offers an opinion different to yours is dismissed out of hand.
Why do I get the feeling your opinion would change if Contador won the worlds in the next couple of years?
What you need to understand is that in most threads I make a comment then 95% of members hold a contrary opinion and try and attack mine then I proceed to defend it. I will not apologise for holding opinions different to the majority.
Did I not clearly say that I consider this year to be different because of the parcours and that it could be so next year? Also, I wouldn't expect you to try and goad me with Contador - this should be the reserve of the members I hold in contempt.
In any case, I guess there are a fair few members who actually enjoy disagreeing with me, and some have even said as much. If everyone held the same opinion, do you think this forum would be more interesting?
No i don't have any problem with people holding opinions I disagree with. More power to them. I do have a problem when they present them as fact and refuse to countenance the idea that any sane person could disagree with them and patronise them as a result."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
afx237vi wrote:Look, you're entitled to your opinion, but so is everyone else. Sometimes the way you phrase things does seem to be deliberately provocative.
You shouldn't "hold people in contempt" just because they write something you don't agree with. It's only a cycling forum. It's not really that important in the grand scheme of things.
Just like the Worlds?'This week I 'ave been mostly been climbing like Basso - Shirley Basso.'0 -
Madrid was "flat" but it was a cracking race.
The nice thing about the worlds is the circuit changes and it suits different riders. Sometimes it favours sprinters, sometimes it favours the hilly classics or GC men.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
afx237vi wrote:Look, you're entitled to your opinion, but so is everyone else. Sometimes the way you phrase things does seem to be deliberately provocative.
You shouldn't "hold people in contempt" just because they write something you don't agree with. It's only a cycling forum. It's not really that important in the grand scheme of things.
Someone can have a different opinion to me that is perfectly fine - I don't hold them in contempt for it at all. Those I do, I do so for other reasons, such as abuse, teasing, goading, in a deliberate manner.
My phrasing could be a little passionate but then so is that of many others?
Now, from the previous page I quote:afx237vi wrote:W.
T.
F.
Is this not 'deliberately provocative'?Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:What other races have their been between the Vuelta and the Worlds?
The Omloop van het Houtland Lichtervelde (http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/omloop-van-het-houtland-lichtervelde-1-1/results)
The Vuelta finished on Sunday, what races are between the Tour de Suisse and The Tour de France?0 -
iainf72 wrote:Madrid was "flat" but it was a cracking race.
The nice thing about the worlds is the circuit changes and it suits different riders. Sometimes it favours sprinters, sometimes it favours the hilly classics or GC men.
It's also ridden in national teams which means you see odd alliances and treachery of the highest order!0 -
andyp wrote:iainf72 wrote:Madrid was "flat" but it was a cracking race.
The nice thing about the worlds is the circuit changes and it suits different riders. Sometimes it favours sprinters, sometimes it favours the hilly classics or GC men.
It's also ridden in national teams which means you see odd alliances and treachery of the highest order!
There is a whole new level of intrigue added... Remember Tom Southam?
And the way the Italians will at least 3 years out of every 5 chase each other down, refuse to pull or somehow implode spectacularly."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
Tom Southam and Charly Wegelius did very nicely out of working for the Italians I believe.
I'm going to start a new thread on treachery.0 -
TTHR, not a hard race that one and neither did most of the World riders ride it. It doesn't compare to a Classic does it.
Who said anything about a three week race.Contador is the Greatest0 -
Merckx and De Vlaeminck rank high for treachery too... Saronni and Moser.
Incidentally, one of my favourite ever quotes from cycling comes after another heated Sarroni and Moser battle in the Worlds : "Today, I would have beaten him on a womans bike in my slippers""In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
frenchfighter wrote:Now, from the previous page I quote:afx237vi wrote:W.
T.
F.
Is this not 'deliberately provocative'?
Not in response to saying the World Championships road race isn't a big deal, no.0 -
Maybe in your opinion, not in mine,
See, it is all very subjective.Contador is the Greatest0 -
frenchfighter wrote:TTHR, not a hard race that one and neither did most of the World riders ride it. It doesn't compare to a Classic does it.
Who said anything about a three week race.
This is what I'm saying. It doesn't matter what races are around a particular race, whether it's a one day race, a week long stage race or a grand tour, what matters is the riders in that race.
All the riders are all going to be at a similar level, just like they are in the Tour, Paris Nice, Milan San Remo and Paris Roubaix, so it makes the win as special as us as fans make it.
Am I making sense?0
