Cycling and Class

Rockbuddy

henry_ho_yin wrote:

you don't need to ride a £500+ bike or spend a lot of money on it to classific cycling as your hobby. as long as you enjoy cycling and go cycling offen then that will count as a hobby even though you are just riding a second-hand halfords bike.

Ok, is your bike 2nd hand then??? 'Cos new the Specialized Rock hopper Pro Disc is about £1000 isn't it!?!

soy_sauce

Rockbuddy wrote:

henry_ho_yin wrote:

you don't need to ride a £500+ bike or spend a lot of money on it to classific cycling as your hobby. as long as you enjoy cycling and go cycling offen then that will count as a hobby even though you are just riding a second-hand halfords bike.

Ok, is your bike 2nd hand then??? 'Cos new the Specialized Rock hopper Pro Disc is about £1000 isn't it!?!

my bike wasn't second-hand but if its not because of the C2C scheme then i would prop spend the £100 down at the local halfords so i can commute to work and spend a weekend away cycling in the countryside.

always_tyred

Blimey people are serious. I didn't say you NEEDED a nice bike to enjoy it, but really, truly, honestly, seriously, gears and brakes that work and a frame weighing less than a landrover does facilitate a positive cycling experience, even on a tow path.

Shopping at Lidl, or otherwise, is about common sense, not class. Do I (a) buy those nice Balsen biscuits at Sainsbury's for £1.50, with English writing on the box, or (b) buy them for 75p am Lidl, mit Deutsch? Tricky.

Alternatively, if I want Mini-bites or yoghurt covered strawbs, there's only one place for it and I don't care how damn expensive they are.

il_principe

Rich158 wrote:

Just because you're fully lycrad up on a £3k plus Italian carbon masterpiece doesn't mean you get any more enjoyment out of the sport, in fact I suspect many people take the sport far too seriously and would benefit from taking time to smell the roses rather than worrying about whether a new wheelset would add .5mph to their average speed.

It's an unfortunate fact that the more afluent among us fall into the trap of trying to buy succes rather than using more traditional methods of going faster like training harder :shock:

Dammit, this is exactly where I've been going wrong!

I take your point though. However my £3k plus Italian carbon masterpiece most definitely adds to my enjoyment. Tackling 75+ miles on a £100 Halfords special might make for good training, but I'm not sure it'd be much fun! :shock:

Equally I’m aware that a £500 Ribble would do the job. Ultimately it’s about buying the kit that fits with the seriousness with which you take the hobby/sport and the time/money you commit to it. I choose to spend money on cycling, others spend it on cars, holidays, or in some cases, cigarettes! A 20 a day habit adds up to around £1600 a year. You could buy a damn nice bike for that.

I do get a lot of much pleasure from pootling round London on my SS though.

Rich158

jashburnham wrote:

Rich158 wrote:

Just because you're fully lycrad up on a £3k plus Italian carbon masterpiece doesn't mean you get any more enjoyment out of the sport, in fact I suspect many people take the sport far too seriously and would benefit from taking time to smell the roses rather than worrying about whether a new wheelset would add .5mph to their average speed.

It's an unfortunate fact that the more afluent among us fall into the trap of trying to buy succes rather than using more traditional methods of going faster like training harder :shock:

Dammit, this is exactly where I've been going wrong!

I take your point though. However my £3k plus Italian carbon masterpiece most definitely adds to my enjoyment. Tackling 75+ miles on a £100 Halfords special might make for good training, but I'm not sure it'd be much fun! :shock:

Equally I’m aware that a £500 Ribble would do the job. Ultimately it’s about buying the kit that fits with the seriousness with which you take the hobby/sport and the time/money you commit to it. I choose to spend money on cycling, others spend it on cars, holidays, or in some cases, cigarettes! A 20 a day habit adds up to around £1600 a year. You could buy a damn nice bike for that.

I do get a lot of much pleasure from pootling round London on my SS though.

+1 to that. I'm speaking as someone who has about £10k's worth of bikes sitting in the shed :shock:

However I do sometimes feel that the people you see pootling about on cheap bikes get just as much fun out of cycling as I do, it's all about what you expect to get out of it.

Sewinman

The trouble with lidl is that you can't get wild alaskan smoked salmon, and i don't touch that farmed muck. You can also get whole saucisson in Waitrose, rather than sliced.

There was a ranking of a basket of goods in a recent newspaper and Lidl etc were pricier than Sainsburys.

always_tyred

Sewinman wrote:

The trouble with lidl is that you can't get wild alaskan smoked salmon, and i don't touch that farmed muck. You can also get whole saucisson in Waitrose, rather than sliced.

There was a ranking of a basket of goods in a recent newspaper and Lidl etc were pricier than Sainsburys.

Hence, don't buy everything at either Lidl or Sainsburys.

I have a colour palette used for farmed Salmon somewhere - they aren't all lurid - sure I can't change your mind?

gtvlusso

It comes down to "what you want".

Ultimately - if you like cycling, youwill spend more on a bike. My wife has a saying - buy what you want, don't settle for second best as you won't get as much usage, therefore value, out of it. Hence my desperation for a Bianchi Pista - I know it is not the best value for money, but I want one and ultimately will use it more because it is what I wanted!

I think we are heading off track slightly and onto bike snobbery - which I have no issues with. I see a snob as someone who is passionate nd knowledgeable about what they are a snob about......Arrogance, is a different thing altogether, but is sometimes seen as snobbery!

As for class....As an engineer, I know nothing......I just ride a bike! And enjoy it.

However, I see the same issues around my favourite sports of rowing a rugby - seen as public school, wealthy sports! Completely untrue when you actually get involved in the sport. people only see the media pomp of Eton, The Oxbridge boat race and therefore believe it is for the elite! My last crew had the cross section of a plasterer, factory worker, lawyer, engineer, doctor, retail worker and a vet........

Are people viewing class as Viner ownership, versus Halfords Carrera ownership?!?!

I am secondary modern educated....it shows! But hey!! Thats not what its about!

Sewinman

Always Tyred wrote:

Sewinman wrote:

The trouble with lidl is that you can't get wild alaskan smoked salmon, and i don't touch that farmed muck. You can also get whole saucisson in Waitrose, rather than sliced.

There was a ranking of a basket of goods in a recent newspaper and Lidl etc were pricier than Sainsburys.

Hence, don't buy everything at either Lidl or Sainsburys.

I have a colour palette used for farmed Salmon somewhere - they aren't all lurid - sure I can't change your mind?

I can't be arsed to go to two places though!

Well the organic salmon are not fed carotene to dye the flesh but they still swim around in their own crap all day and have caused the virual extinction of sea trout and wild salmon in the west of Scotland.

How off-topic!?

RedAende

I would say that cycling +20 yrs ago was definitely a working class sport, but nowadays ... "the new golf" ?

always_tyred

Sewinman wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

Sewinman wrote:

The trouble with lidl is that you can't get wild alaskan smoked salmon, and i don't touch that farmed muck. You can also get whole saucisson in Waitrose, rather than sliced.

There was a ranking of a basket of goods in a recent newspaper and Lidl etc were pricier than Sainsburys.

Hence, don't buy everything at either Lidl or Sainsburys.

I have a colour palette used for farmed Salmon somewhere - they aren't all lurid - sure I can't change your mind?

I can't be arsed to go to two places though!

Neither can I. With the exception of mini-bites from M&S. You will note the sweet-toothed thread throughout.

Gazzaputt

Defo the new 'golf'.

So many corporates trying to get into the Etape as a 'challange'.

DonDaddyD

Always Tyred wrote:

Sewinman wrote:

The trouble with lidl is that you can't get wild alaskan smoked salmon, and i don't touch that farmed muck. You can also get whole saucisson in Waitrose, rather than sliced.

There was a ranking of a basket of goods in a recent newspaper and Lidl etc were pricier than Sainsburys.

Hence, don't buy everything at either Lidl or Sainsburys.

I have a colour palette used for farmed Salmon somewhere - they aren't all lurid - sure I can't change your mind?

You guys eat salmon. Sheeet it was only the other day I found out that raw tuna was red :shock:

That's another thing as well, yet another argument with my girlfriend. She likes her food, warmed on the frying pan but still able to crawl off the plate.

I like all my meat cooked until (when biting into it) its similar in texture to 12k carbon fibre. EVERYONE I know who lived around Croydon was the same, as soon as I moved to Wimbledon asked for welldonein a steak house I was nearly spat upon...

always_tyred

DonDaddyD wrote:

Always Tyred wrote:

Sewinman wrote:

The trouble with lidl is that you can't get wild alaskan smoked salmon, and i don't touch that farmed muck. You can also get whole saucisson in Waitrose, rather than sliced.

There was a ranking of a basket of goods in a recent newspaper and Lidl etc were pricier than Sainsburys.

Hence, don't buy everything at either Lidl or Sainsburys.

I have a colour palette used for farmed Salmon somewhere - they aren't all lurid - sure I can't change your mind?

You guys eat salmon. Sheeet it was only the other day I found out that raw tuna was red :shock:

That's another thing as well, yet another argument with my girlfriend. She likes her food, warmed on the frying pan but still able to crawl off the plate.

I like all my meat cooked until (when biting into it) its similar in texture to 12k carbon fibre. EVERYONE I know who lived around Croydon was the same, as soon as I moved to Wimbledon asked for welldonein a steak house I was nearly spat upon...

Fave Woody Allen quote goes something like, "My mother used to put the chicken through the deflavourizer".

Or it might be, with reference to parallel parking, "Its fine, I can get a taxi from here".

Stone Glider

What a stimulating and fast-paced thread.

My view is that if you "get it" you "get it" and your background is irrelevant. Also cycling is not a particularly expensive hobby (I tell the wife), have you seen the price of fishing poles and golf sticks? The real money kicks in when you go away on cycling holidays, training camps, etc.

The high end stuff is really about fueling the urge to improve. Despite the fact, which you intrinsically know, that there will always be better cyclists out there. However will they be having as much fun as you?

Cycling is a broad church which is unrestricted by concepts such as class. I hope :?

biondino

gtvlusso wrote:

Are people viewing class as Viner ownership, versus Halfords Carrera ownership?!?!!

Are you calling LiT posh :shock:

Rockbuddy

henry_ho_yin wrote:

Rockbuddy wrote:

henry_ho_yin wrote:

you don't need to ride a £500+ bike or spend a lot of money on it to classific cycling as your hobby. as long as you enjoy cycling and go cycling offen then that will count as a hobby even though you are just riding a second-hand halfords bike.

Ok, is your bike 2nd hand then??? 'Cos new the Specialized Rock hopper Pro Disc is about £1000 isn't it!?!

my bike wasn't second-hand but if its not because of the C2C scheme then i would prop spend the £100 down at the local halfords so i can commute to work and spend a weekend away cycling in the countryside.

So you used to have a cheap bike and that was just as enjoyable as your Rock Hopper is now??? You might be saying cycling is cycling and it's enjoyable what ever the bike, which I tend to agree with, just wondering if you have owned and used a sub £500 bike or just the £1000 Rock Hopper??? Keeps the thread alive


EDIT: Or not it would seem

soy_sauce

Rockbuddy wrote:

henry_ho_yin wrote:

Rockbuddy wrote:

henry_ho_yin wrote:

you don't need to ride a £500+ bike or spend a lot of money on it to classific cycling as your hobby. as long as you enjoy cycling and go cycling offen then that will count as a hobby even though you are just riding a second-hand halfords bike.

Ok, is your bike 2nd hand then??? 'Cos new the Specialized Rock hopper Pro Disc is about £1000 isn't it!?!

my bike wasn't second-hand but if its not because of the C2C scheme then i would prop spend the £100 down at the local halfords so i can commute to work and spend a weekend away cycling in the countryside.

So you used to have a cheap bike and that was just as enjoyable as your Rock Hopper is now??? You might be saying cycling is cycling and it's enjoyable what ever the bike, which I tend to agree with, just wondering if you have owned and used a sub £500 bike or just the £1000 Rock Hopper??? Keeps the thread alive


EDIT: Or not it would seem

that what i try to say. lol
the Rockhopper is my first ever bike and before i got it, i was using my fiancee's 9 years old apollo to commute and just general cycling about.

Rockbuddy

henry_ho_yin wrote:

that what i try to say. lol
the Rockhopper is my first ever bike and before i got it, i was using my fiancee's 9 years old apollo to commute and just general cycling about.

Ok ok , I get it, just seemed ironic that someone on a grands worth of bike was stating expense isn't what it's about. Nice bike by the way

brushed

Back in the day me and all my clubmates would scrimp and scrape to buy their bikes piece by piece or get a secondhand bike.

No one ever bought a whole new bike.

The only way that would happen was if you were a pro and were given it.

By the time you had a complete matching groupset......... a new one would come out Doh!

Bassjunkieuk

Well that was fun, yet another intriguing thread DDD :-)

I can see where your coming from in your OP, but don't you think part of this is based upon your view of cycling? I imagine we're both in similar boats - we're both the same age, starting out with cycling proper after having spent our youth knocking around on various other lower end bikes (with the exception of your M2) and practically have the same bike now :-)

For us cycling is more then just a means of transport it is an enjoyable hobby that we can use both to keep fit and socialise, just look at the good days out we had on the ML and at the Freewheel, which brings me along nicely to my next point.

Lets start with the infamous Marlborough Loop ride, we had a nice cross section of riders with a good smattering of bikes, from our GIants upto JA's Pinarello with the other riders making up the bit's in between. Sure I'd love to have tackled the ride on a bit of Italian exotica but I still had great fun on my bike! Likewise on the Freewheel we had a huge selection of people from various classes on a multitude of bikes there. You could quite easily identify the serious riders, casual riders and the family day out riders. But they all appeared to be having great fun!

I've never really given any thought to what class I am, if pushed I'd say working class, but I don't see this as a restriction to what I can do. Much like one of the previous posters I used to be all hung up on the designer gear (back when I was in college) but once I started living properly and got a family to look after I realized there are more important things in life then having the latest designer clothes :-) People nowadays can me so materialistic! Now I just get what ever I feel comfortable in, even with my cycling gear it's been quite a bit brought from the cheaper end with my most extravagant single outlay probably being my Pearl Izumi cycle shorts, but I certainly think they where worth every penny :-)

I guess what I'm trying to say really is who really gives a damn what class you are, if you enjoy cycling, be it as a means to simply get to work or as a hobby then it's still one less car on the road, whether that be one less Aston Martin or one less Ford ;-)

All this comes from someone who was born and raised in Croydon, still lives in the area and likes his meat properly cooked :-) although after recently trying some what I think was medium rare steak I might be converting ;-)

Note: Sorry if none of the above makes sense, I can ramble sometimes!

DonDaddyD

Bassjunkieuk wrote:

Well that was fun, yet another intriguing thread DDD :-)

I can see where your coming from in your OP, but don't you think part of this is based upon your view of cycling? I imagine we're both in similar boats - we're both the same age, starting out with cycling proper after having spent our youth knocking around on various other lower end bikes (with the exception of your M2) and practically have the same bike now :-)

For us cycling is more then just a means of transport it is an enjoyable hobby that we can use both to keep fit and socialise, just look at the good days out we had on the ML and at the Freewheel, which brings me along nicely to my next point.

Lets start with the infamous Marlborough Loop ride, we had a nice cross section of riders with a good smattering of bikes, from our GIants upto JA's Pinarello with the other riders making up the bit's in between. Sure I'd love to have tackled the ride on a bit of Italian exotica but I still had great fun on my bike! Likewise on the Freewheel we had a huge selection of people from various classes on a multitude of bikes there. You could quite easily identify the serious riders, casual riders and the family day out riders. But they all appeared to be having great fun!

I've never really given any thought to what class I am, if pushed I'd say working class, but I don't see this as a restriction to what I can do. Much like one of the previous posters I used to be all hung up on the designer gear (back when I was in college) but once I started living properly and got a family to look after I realized there are more important things in life then having the latest designer clothes :-) People nowadays can me so materialistic! Now I just get what ever I feel comfortable in, even with my cycling gear it's been quite a bit brought from the cheaper end with my most extravagant single outlay probably being my Pearl Izumi cycle shorts, but I certainly think they where worth every penny :-)

I guess what I'm trying to say really is who really gives a damn what class you are, if you enjoy cycling, be it as a means to simply get to work or as a hobby then it's still one less car on the road, whether that be one less Aston Martin or one less Ford ;-)

All this comes from someone who was born and raised in Croydon, still lives in the area and likes his meat properly cooked :-) although after recently trying some what I think was medium rare steak I might be converting ;-)

Note: Sorry if none of the above makes sense, I can ramble sometimes!

Solid post Bass as always very solid.

always_tyred

biondino wrote:

Are you calling LiT posh :shock:

This is a conclusion that it would be possible to draw.

DonDaddyD

biondino wrote:

gtvlusso wrote:

Are people viewing class as Viner ownership, versus Halfords Carrera ownership?!?!!

Are you calling LiT posh :shock:

You were the inspiration for this thread when you asked me if "To crack ones second duck" was "youth speak".

Well it was that and all the other differences involving me, my lifestyle choices and the way I speak that is often picked out by others (cyclists) whether here or in the real world, which spurred me on to make this thread.

Christophe3967

bluesacs wrote:

I don't want to be too hard and fast about this but chaps and chapesses in

lycra on racing bikes are generally middle class, very probably middle managers, if it's a bit dirty then working class made almost good

those wearing helmets, day glo stuff, face masks and with lights on during the day and cycling at a ridiculous cadence are over achieving geeks and geekesses in the city, and obviously lower middle classes perpeptualy worried about their status

those on bromptons are upper middle class, possibly higher

whilst those on a quite knackered old heavy bike with something made out of whicker on it generally own the county that you are cycling through

but if it's old and knackered but with no whicker and only a sturmey three speed then probably skilled working class, the blue overalls will confirm this

those on ridiculously small bikes cycling in the lowest gear possible are an under class member making a drugs delivery

otherwise no member of the sub proletariat will be seen dead near a bicycle other than driving over it in a stolen car

Anybody carrying ortlieb panniers are artists and therefore classless, but really probably very upper class.

I dunno though, could be wrong.

Greg T, in one of his more lucid momments, espoused a similar theory if I recall.

Dropzone-dog__

My two pence worth. It is certainly true that by splashing out a load of cash you can improve your own performance. Lighter bike, aero bars etc. Eddy Merckx turned up on a single speed butchers bike & left everybody else in the club for dust. Graham Obree built an hour record winning bike out of a washing machine & spare bits of bmx tubing.

True talent always wins at the end of the day & if people have the money to improve their own personal best then good luck to them.

As long as they enjoy what they are doing then no harm is done.
If they think they are somehow better than somebody else by riding a carbon frame/disc wheel bike then, the true talent emerges during a race.

Nothing worse for the ego than being fully kitted out & being scalped by a jeans wearing halford special rider.

Fashion is a transient thing true cyclists will always exist.

Bassjunkieuk

Dropzone-dog__ wrote:

Fashion is a transient thing true cyclists will always exist.

+1 Just look at the amount of numpties we have riding around on Charge Plugs/Spec Langsters in town who only brought a SS bike because it's "cool"

As soon as it's starts raining or they fall out of fashion they'll be relegated to the shed.........

posh_pedaller

The school I went to would suggest I'm upper class.
Everything else (the money my parents made, the way I speak, the university I'm going to) would suggest middle or upper middle class.

DDD's next thread: Cycling and Steak. Mine's a blue. (Upper class?)

DonDaddyD

posh_pedaller wrote:

The school I went to would suggest I'm upper class.
Everything else (the money my parents made, the way I speak, the university I'm going to) would suggest middle or upper middle class.

DDD's next thread: Cycling and Steak. Mine's a blue. (Upper class?)

As in discussion with a waitress at a Argentinian restaurant in Kensington, I think... The way my steak is cooked depends on the cut.

If it is a rump, and these days it rarely is, I will have it medium, a well done rump is too tough to take... lol.

If sirloin, Ribeye or anything else, then I tend to go for a medium or if it looks like their medium is my version of rare then memdium to well-done.

I don't mind a little red. But I hate sticking a fork in my food and watching blood pour out.

Stone Glider

I once offered the definition that if you had to work to support your lifestyle (hate that word), then you were working class.

Strangely the USA definition of "working class" is those who do not have regular, contracted employment.

"Call me Dave" considers himself as "middle Class", where he is clearly "ruling class". I look up to him 'cos he has innate breeding.

DDD has tapped into that very British, obsession.