Full susp for £1k - £1.5k

danlightbulb wrote:

Thanks.

Do you think 14.5kg is too heavy, for trail centre riding? Would i regret not spending more for a lower weight?

I think you can always spend more and get something better.

I also think budgets for these things can be stretched, and normally are.

I’m going to point you in the direction of that Vitus again. It’s one of the best value bikes I’ve ever seen. If you dont want to spend the £1300 on that, then buy the Calibre.

The Jamis Dakar A2 is another cheaper option.

Look at final payments for the bike 2 work. After the 12 months, to keep the bike you have to make a ‘small’ payment I believe.

You have a 46tooth cassette and 32t chainring on the Vitus. Compared to the Sram Eagle with it's 50 tooth and 34t chainring, the climbing gear is pretty much the same. I just went round Swinley on the Aeris 145 (145/150mm suspension) no problem at all. Different bikes I know, but you will be fine, and I would say the bike will last you longer.

Having said that I've just spent a lot of money on a Bird Aeris 120 (120/130) and it will do pretty much anything I want.

Perhaps, as you're not sure right now, you buy the cheapest you can (Calibre), have fun and learn on it, then in a couple of years you'll be in a position for the next step up.

140/150mm travel is the sweet spot for trail bikes IMO, and don't worry about weight - I weighed my XL escarpe (the one you're considering) and it is just over 15kg as stock with a 400g set of pedals, that's 33lbs. It climbs perfectly fine, hardly any pedal bob either. I use it to ride to work and back, 4 miles per day - mostly tarmac.

Haven't been on a proper off road ride yet, hopefully I'll get out this weekend or one evening.

I probably wouldn’t get too hung up on weight and too slack geometry with the bikes you are looking at.

I run a 2004 Kona Caldera which is quite short and steep and I also have a Bird Aeris 145 LT which is 160mm travel at both ends and is long and slack. The Aeris climbs better on a lot of stuff then the hardtail when you look at Strava times. I think this is helped by bigger wheels / better grip on bumpy climbs and having a nice stretched top tube keeps the front wheel on the ground on steep climbs. I’d say it’s probably about 5 lbs heavier than the Kona - but even on flat ish trails around Bristol I can’t get close to the Aeris times on the Kona.

If I were looking at the £1000 mark I think I’d be lookin at the Bossnut or that new Jamis potentially. I had a Boardman Pro FS before which I liked a lot - but recently had a quick go on a Boardman Team Fs and it felt very short / high at the front and quite retro.

The Bossnut is probably a good compromise position - it’s not extremely long and slack but it’s also not short and steep. The reviews back that up - and over time if you wanted to you could probably quite easily lose a bit of weight off it.

The Vitus also looks nice to be fair. Can you stretch the budget - i.e. you’ll need to check if the shop you are looking at will allow you to add cash on top of he £100 voucher?

According to this review the Boardman is actually 13kg:
https://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/cate ... -fs-50371/

"Despite a burlier build kit for 2016, the Pro FS has refused to put on weight – our size large test bike tipped the scales at around 13kg. This lack of heft also makes for a generally nimble feel and means you’ll embrace rather than endure the climbs."


One thing to keep in mind though, the FS Pro is kinda old now - been around 2 years. I had the previous model Team and it was an excellent bike and loads of fun on the trail. Lively ride and pedalled well after I replaced the basic shock. The new PRO is a much better bike however is it due to be replaced at any time now so could be discounted heavily by Halfords. Have a look on the Boardman Facebook group and ask if anyone knows when the new range is being released. You might save yourself some money.

New Boardman bikes are coming out NOW. You may have seen the weight on their website for the new range and be looking at the old bike on the Halfords website?

apreading wrote:

Dont trust any of the weights you read online. They all lie. Useful as a general guide but dont expect them to be accurate. They will also be for a certain size bike and if you buy a different size obviously the weight will be different.

Until you have ridden a full sus on proper rides, you probably wont know what you want from such a bike anyway. I think the prudent call would be to get the Bossnut, ride it for a couple of years and then ask yourself if there is anything you would want to change - if there is then you will know what you are looking for in a replacement, having invested less up front on what could become an 'interim' bike (whichever one you choose now).

I do like the Bossnut, everything about it screams "buy me" apart from the shock which does not have "pedal/climb" mode. I had a Boardman Team with the same shock and I found myself bobbing on climbs which slowed me down somewhat. I ended up upgrading the shock to resolve the issue. It was the bike on which I learnt the most and I knew exactly what I wanted from my next bike when I was done with it. Rear suspension lockout / pedal / climb mode was a deal breaker for me which was the reason I did not buy the Bossnut in the end and ended up going for a 150mm Zesty AM. Perhaps Bossnut is not affected so much by suspension bob but its something to think about... might be worth trying it out in the carpark of the shop allows this. Personally I prefer the Vitus as its only a little more £££ with the 10% British Cycling Discount and comes with a dropper out of the box and a little more modern than the Boardman.

danlightbulb wrote:

Joebristol wrote:

I probably wouldn’t get too hung up on weight and too slack geometry with the bikes you are looking at.

I run a 2004 Kona Caldera which is quite short and steep and I also have a Bird Aeris 145 LT which is 160mm travel at both ends and is long and slack. The Aeris climbs better on a lot of stuff then the hardtail when you look at Strava times. I think this is helped by bigger wheels / better grip on bumpy climbs and having a nice stretched top tube keeps the front wheel on the ground on steep climbs. I’d say it’s probably about 5 lbs heavier than the Kona - but even on flat ish trails around Bristol I can’t get close to the Aeris times on the Kona.

If I were looking at the £1000 mark I think I’d be lookin at the Bossnut or that new Jamis potentially. I had a Boardman Pro FS before which I liked a lot - but recently had a quick go on a Boardman Team Fs and it felt very short / high at the front and quite retro.

The Bossnut is probably a good compromise position - it’s not extremely long and slack but it’s also not short and steep. The reviews back that up - and over time if you wanted to you could probably quite easily lose a bit of weight off it.

The Vitus also looks nice to be fair. Can you stretch the budget - i.e. you’ll need to check if the shop you are looking at will allow you to add cash on top of he £100 voucher?

Thanks.

Just a bit worried i guess going from xc oriented bike with 2.2" tyres to heavier bike with chunkier tyres, that i will struggle on it, especialy as im also giving up the granny ring for 1x11. i do sit and spin up hills usually.

Hence why the boardman seemed maybe a better choice but if its14.2kg rather than 13kg that takes away some of the benefit in my eyes, so i would want confirmation before i buy.

The vitus is clearly more of an enduro bike. its 20mm longer ETT, 0.8 degress slacker and has 150mm front travel. maybe that would be a step too far?

Just on the gearing thing, my Boardman Pro fs was he previous model that had 2x10 - when I swapped it to 1x10 with a 32t chainring and 11-42 cassette I didn’t lose that easiest hill climbing gear.

When I’ve got the Bird on 1x11 I’ve gone for a 30t chainring with a 10-42 cassette - it gives a nice easy spinning gear for the steepest stuff but enough range at the other end.

I guess my Kona already has 2.4” f / 2.25” rear tyres with Mavic d521 rims - so not the lightest wheelsets ever. It does feel more instant and responsive than the Bird in the flat / uphill, but it doesn’t result in quicker times. I also feel more tired quicker riding the Kona as it’s more physical on bumps - the Aeris means I can ride longer without getting a sore lower back for example.

apreading wrote:

Dont trust any of the weights you read online. They all lie. Useful as a general guide but dont expect them to be accurate. They will also be for a certain size bike and if you buy a different size obviously the weight will be different.

Also, weight isn't everything - it's just one factor in how a bike rides.

Case in point - I test rode, back to back, a Whyte S150 C-works and a T130 S.

The S150 is sub-30lbs, carbon wheels, 29er, and long and very slack. £5500
The T130 is 31lbs+ (and you could feel it picking it up), heavier wheels, 27.5, not as slack. Half the price at £2750.

I much preferred the heavier, steeper HA 27.5 T130 S.

66-67 degree HA and 140mm rear travel is trail bike territory, not enduro. They're quite capable of being blatted along flat, straight birdleways, as they are winching up steep technical climbs, and they'll love being thrown down fast, rocky, rooty descents as fast as you dare

I did 7 miles this evening on my 33lb heavyweight across generally flat bridleways. Was it painful? Hard? Nope! Perfectly good for this sort of riding, and when I got to a little descent with some chattery bumps it felt like it was barely stretching it's legs.

danlightbulb wrote:

Its not the flat sections im worried about its the hills, switchback climbing and steep short climbs.

Ive read a couple reviews on the escarpe (a slightly older model) and they commented on its heaviness at 14.7kg.

What would i have to spend to get the same capability at a lighter weight? And what weight is classed as lightish, with these types of trail bikes?


edit - think what im asking is can i get something with the spec of the bossnut but shave a kg or a kg and a half off it, for a few hundred more?

14kg is probably about average for the price as the frame itself is heavier. I wouldn't worry too much about the overall bike weight, research the wheels and tyres as rotating weight is where you would notice it most... I have a 14kg full susser with lightweight Mavic rims and Nobby Nic Evo tyres and it actually climbs better than my lighter 13kg hardtail which has no name rims and heavier lower spec tyres.