Full susp for £1k - £1.5k

danlightbulb

Hi all.

Been a while since I was here. Back in 2012 i got myself a Rockrider 8.1 hardtail that ive been riding ever since. Had a couple years away from regular riding and now looking to get back involved. Rode Cannock last week and alot of it is pretty badly rutted now, and wasnt comfortable on the hardtail.

So Im looking for a full suspension bike suitable for trails like Cannock, Llandegla, Hopton. All are a mix of climbs, singletrack, with the technical sections thrown in around the route - you all know the score.

Id like to spend between £1k and £1.5k although lower end is better for financial reasons but could go higher end if its worth doing so for a step up in spec.

Are there some go to bikes at this price range that you can point me to?

Thanks.

JGTR

Jamis Dakar from Evans, better reviews than the Bossnut

mark_fogel

Saw this the other day, these tend to get fairly good reviews.

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/vitu ... prod146547

British Cycling gets you 10% off too so you can spend the change on a dropper.

Calibre Bossnut, Boardman FS are good to options too. Pauls cycles usually sell last years models for a good price. Apart from that, look for 2nd hand however leave some money in your budget for a good overall service to ensure everything is running smoothly. You can usually get 1-2 year old bike for 1/3 of the price which will leave a bit of cash in your pocket.

danlightbulb

JGTR wrote:

Jamis Dakar from Evans, better reviews than the Bossnut

This looks ideal although (typically) my local shops dont have stock. Im between sizes so really need to try out medium and large.

The Vitus Escarpe looks good but if i can get single ring on the Jamis Im swaying towards that.

Just had a look at new bossnut evo online and that looks pretty good too. Will go have a look at it i think.

JGTR

danlightbulb wrote:

JGTR wrote:

Jamis Dakar from Evans, better reviews than the Bossnut

This looks ideal although (typically) my local shops dont have stock. Im between sizes so really need to try out medium and large.

The Vitus Escarpe looks good but if i can get single ring on the Jamis Im swaying towards that.

Just had a look at new bossnut evo online and that looks pretty good too. Will go have a look at it i think.

Evans can order it in

tallpaul_s

This: http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/vitus-escarpe-vr-suspension-bike-slx-1x11-2018/rp-prod159743 with the British cycling discount makes it £1355 (if you have to buy BC membership).

You will not find a better value FS bike out there, the offer ends in a week so be quick.

Dropper, revelations, deluxe rear shock, SLX, decent finishing kit, all for £1350.

Unlike the Jamis, it's got decent maxxis tyres, 27mm internal rims, basically there's nothing that's been comprimised in the spec. You even get a full 800mm bar on the L and XL sizes.

I've had mine less than a week, it's a brilliant bike even for £300 more than the price it's currently at.

danlightbulb

It does look good ill admit. But i can get the Bossnut on cyclescheme saving another couple hundred on its price so around £750 all in which is half the price of the Escarpe. Hard to turn that away I think.

Bossnut Evo still has 1x11 and 130mm air susp.

danlightbulb

Would i have any issues with 1x11 up hills? im not as fit as i used to be (which wasnt very fit to start with).

jamski

danlightbulb wrote:

Would i have any issues with 1x11 up hills? im not as fit as i used to be (which wasnt very fit to start with).

You’ll be fine. That bike it the best value full suss I’ve seen, like, ever! Well, in the four years or so I’ve been back into biking.

Do it!

jamski

And to clarify you’ll be fine. It has a 46t cog at the rear and a 32t chainring so it’s a nice easy climbing gear.

jamski

The more I read the spec the better it gets. Great tyres, nukeproof finishing kit, metric shock. It’s a very well put together package. I just spent £1k more on a Bird, which although has slightly better forks, shock and arguably brakes, it’s not £1000 better.

I don’t regret for one second my choice, but I would have been very tempted with this had it been this price.

danlightbulb

thanks. gonna go for that one i reckon, subject to fit tomorrow when i visit shop. do full suss bikes tend to need a slightly larger size? Im 5'11 but longer legs short body.

Also, what dropper post would you recommend?

jamski

danlightbulb wrote:

thanks. gonna go for that one i reckon, subject to fit tomorrow when i visit shop. do full suss bikes tend to need a slightly larger size? Im 5'11 but longer legs short body.

Also, what dropper post would you recommend?

I’m the same height as you and normally go for a 18”/medium, but you do need to try them. It’s all dependant of the geometry, no need to go bigger for full suss.

As for dropper, I don’t think you get an option do you? It’s just whatever comes with the size you choose.

It’s great you can try one, where abouts is the shop?

danlightbulb

jamski wrote:

danlightbulb wrote:

thanks. gonna go for that one i reckon, subject to fit tomorrow when i visit shop. do full suss bikes tend to need a slightly larger size? Im 5'11 but longer legs short body.

Also, what dropper post would you recommend?

I’m the same height as you and normally go for a 18”/medium, but you do need to try them. It’s all dependant of the geometry, no need to go bigger for full suss.

As for dropper, I don’t think you get an option do you? It’s just whatever comes with the size you choose.

It’s great you can try one, where abouts is the shop?

This bike doesn't come with dropper seat post, so will be an added extra. One local to me is in Wolverhampton.

My existing bike is a medium - I don't think im particularly flat on it but it does hurt my lower back. The seat post is near the maximum to get the leg extension I need. I saw a vid on you tube and a 6 foot guy had bought an XL. He looked a bulky type of guy whereas im skinny, but dunno, only an inch taller than me. The top tube looked quite short compared to my bike.

jamski

Looking at the sizing you’re either the 17” or 19”. At our size we’re always right between sizes which is really annoying. Couple of tests on do for sizing.

Get the saddle at the right height first. To do it quickly make sure the dropper is all the way up. Then you want your leg pretty straight, just a tiny bend in the knee when your heel is on the peddle and the peddle is at the bottom.

Then check the reach. Put your elbow on the front of the saddle and check where the tips of your fingers come along the stem. Ideally they’re in the middle of the stem. You can tweak this with changing the forward/backwards position of the saddle on the seatpost.

You might find, that on the 19” and the dropper all the way up, you can’t get the saddle low enough. Then you’ve got your sizing answer easily.

Hope that helps, have fun.

jamski

Oh I’m confused. You’re not going for the view vitus? The size tests are still valid. Go for a brand x dropper. Great value. Just check you get the right drop for how high/low you need the saddle.

danlightbulb

jamski wrote:

Oh I’m confused. You’re not going for the view vitus? The size tests are still valid. Go for a brand x dropper. Great value. Just check you get the right drop for how high/low you need the saddle.

Ah no sorry for the confusion lol. I can't turn down the Bossnut given I can get it on cyclescheme and pay like £750. I didn't really want spend near the top of my budget.

danlightbulb

No remote lockout front or rear on bossnut is that an issue?

Actually no rear lockout at all.

It felt really slack to ride compared to my current xc foccused hardtail.

I was at max seatpost too. Is this a problem? Thats without setting up sag properly.

jamski

danlightbulb wrote:

No remote lockout front or rear on bossnut is that an issue?

Actually no rear lockout at all.

It felt really slack to ride compared to my current xc foccused hardtail.

I was at max seatpost too. Is this a problem? Thats without setting up sag properly.

It's only a problem if you need it and dont have it. Personally I use it from time to time. Other say they never use it. All depends how well it pedals too. Every bike is different.

As for the seatpost, you mean it's all the way up? If so, I'd suggest going up a size. What size did you try?

danlightbulb

jamski wrote:

danlightbulb wrote:

No remote lockout front or rear on bossnut is that an issue?

Actually no rear lockout at all.

It felt really slack to ride compared to my current xc foccused hardtail.

I was at max seatpost too. Is this a problem? Thats without setting up sag properly.

It's only a problem if you need it and dont have it. Personally I use it from time to time. Other say they never use it. All depends how well it pedals too. Every bike is different.

As for the seatpost, you mean it's all the way up? If so, I'd suggest going up a size. What size did you try?

Hmm I don't know, never rode a full suss before. Dont want the suspension sucking up my pedaling on the fireroad climbs.

Yes seat post at maximum extension (it is on my medium rockrider 8.1 as well). Standover on the medium was about an inch below groin. I tried the large though, and standover was almost exactly zero (top tube touching groin).

I had a ride round the shop but couldn't really tell enough difference to choose. I do want to put a dropper post on it too.

jamski

Did you do the reach check I mentioned? That's always a good guide to size. As for the lockout, depending if you can wait, you could go for this.

http://calibrebicycles.com/bike/triple-b/

End of May apparently, £1400. Although no mention of the shock on the spec for some reason.

danlightbulb

jamski wrote:

Did you do the reach check I mentioned? That's always a good guide to size. As for the lockout, depending if you can wait, you could go for this.

http://calibrebicycles.com/bike/triple-b/

End of May apparently, £1400. Although no mention of the shock on the spec for some reason.

Ah I forgot to do that test. I'll try it on my current bike and see where i land on it.

Hmm interesting. Wonder if the £1400 price is pre-discount card discount?

Although I'm not sure I need more front travel and a slacker angle? I'm already concerned about not being able to climb as well as on my hardtail. There is a fair bit of boring climbing at Cannock.

Oh yeah I also wanted to ask how the front wheel comes off on these, does it need to be fully undone with an allen key? Ive only ever had a quick release spindle.

jamski

danlightbulb wrote:

jamski wrote:

Did you do the reach check I mentioned? That's always a good guide to size. As for the lockout, depending if you can wait, you could go for this.

http://calibrebicycles.com/bike/triple-b/

End of May apparently, £1400. Although no mention of the shock on the spec for some reason.

Ah I forgot to do that test. I'll try it on my current bike and see where i land on it.

Hmm interesting. Wonder if the £1400 price is pre-discount card discount?

Although I'm not sure I need more front travel and a slacker angle? I'm already concerned about not being able to climb as well as on my hardtail. There is a fair bit of boring climbing at Cannock.

Oh yeah I also wanted to ask how the front wheel comes off on these, does it need to be fully undone with an allen key? Ive only ever had a quick release spindle.

That's discount card price I think. I wouldn't worry about climbing, they climb so well these days. You're not on an enduro rig, it's very much a trail bike. The maxles unscrew by hand unless they're the 'slealth' version, which requires an allen key. It's just that you have to take it all the way out rather than just loosen. All very easy.

danlightbulb

jamski wrote:

The maxles unscrew by hand unless they're the 'slealth' version, which requires an allen key. It's just that you have to take it all the way out rather than just loosen. All very easy.

Yeah its the stealth version. Can I fit a quick release version to it instead do you think? Otherwise have to carry the right size allen key on the trail all the time.

danlightbulb

How can I work out if the dropper post will definately fit?

The bike has a seat post length of 350mm, and the dropper post has a length of 410mm with a drop of 120mm. 120mm doesn't feel like much, is that normal?

I had to have the standard 350mm seat post at full extension.

jamski

Normal maxels will fit. As for the dropper you need to measure the new bike I guess. Drop needed depends on each bike, it’s size and your size. 125mm is perfect on my new bike, I couldn’t have any more.

You should be carrying a multi tool out with you though, for those trail side fixes.

danlightbulb

I think im gonna have to go back to the shop tomorrow and look at sizing again as i cant be sure im picking the right size.

There is only 17mm extra reach on the large and 21mm extra ETT but 50mm extra seat tube length. I dont know how to be sure what size is right.

Am i better off with a lower saddle in a taller frame or a higher saddle in a shorter frame? If I was to go large does it mean im sitting higher on the bike or more 'in' the bike? I could fit a shorter stem on the large to bring the reach back down?

The slackness of the bike compared to my current bike meant I couldnt really tell in store whether the medium was right for me.

jamski

Take a look at this for fit.

https://www.bikeradar.com/gear/article/ ... fit-29498/

As for the seatpost, if you're wanting a dropper I'd say you'd want at least 120mm out of the frame, you'd need at least that to fit the brand x. In fact, you'd need a little more, probably 130mm. So take a tape measure, get both bikes saddle height right, and have a measure and check the reach. I'd say both of those tests should tell you which fit is correct. Is there a size guide online for them, can't find one anywhere?

danlightbulb

jamski wrote:

Take a look at this for fit.

https://www.bikeradar.com/gear/article/ ... fit-29498/

As for the seatpost, if you're wanting a dropper I'd say you'd want at least 120mm out of the frame, you'd need at least that to fit the brand x. In fact, you'd need a little more, probably 130mm. So take a tape measure, get both bikes saddle height right, and have a measure and check the reach. I'd say both of those tests should tell you which fit is correct. Is there a size guide online for them, can't find one anywhere?

No size guide but the dimensions are very similar to the canyon bikes and their size guide puts me top end of medium. Think i probably need to try a few more full sussers out to get the feel of them as thats the first one ive ever sat on. Im worried about not getting enough weight over the front too, cos of its slackness. Halfords tomorrow i think.

Good point about the dropper too, its possible the large wouldnt have had enough seat post showing to fit the 125mm brand x dropper.

danlightbulb

Popped in to Halfords today and sat on a Boardman Team full suss. Size medium was right I think, that was an 18" frame. Seat post wasn't quite at maximum but only a couple cm off that.

What felt different was the bike itself. It felt more like my current bike, whereas the Bossnut felt like a chopper to ride with the front wheel seemingly way out in front. The head angle on the Boardman is 68.5 deg comapred to 66.8 on the Bossnut. The ETT on the Boardman is 610mm compared to 601mm for the Bossnut so not much in it really, extra half inch frame size and 9mm ETT.

Bossnut has a much bigger front tyre too, with its 2.3" tyre and wider rims, that must be making a difference.

jamski

Geometry is complex. If you’re looking at reach I think you need to look at seat angle too. I don’t fully understand it myself. I had a Boardman Pro FS, great bike. I wouldn’t go for the team over the Bossnut though. My new bike is a lot slacker than the boardman, you’ll get used to it.

If I were you if I’d go for the Bossnut, you just need to decide on the size. Sounds like the medium is fine, you’ll just be able to have a big dropper on there.