The Big 'Let's sell our cars and take buses/ebikes instead' thread (warning: probably very dull)
Comments
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why aren't hybrids talked about more?0
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Won't sales of them be banned in 7 years?surrey_commuter said:why aren't hybrids talked about more?
Edit: they get an extra 5 years, so 12 years in total.0 -
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc..."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
It’s because carrying a heavy load of gear/people kills the battery range so they look bad.Pross said:Trying to find a decent size 'normal' estate car in electric form is a challenge. I can't work out if this is because it is difficult to make them for some reason or just because the manufacturers have decided that SUVs are what sells and therefore are only making SUVs twhich becomes self-perpetuating.
Just drop 50k on a hybrid petrol Passat estate with less range and lower fuel economy than the original 2 litre diesel.0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
Thanks, though from the energy-efficiency POV it's still nuts to justify the cost of the battery by sticking it in an expensive (and heavy) car.0 -
Per the article, the main reason for the high cost of these cars is the battery.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
Thanks, though from the energy-efficiency POV it's still nuts to justify the cost of the battery by sticking it in an expensive (and heavy) car."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Per the article, the main reason for the high cost of these cars is the battery.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
Thanks, though from the energy-efficiency POV it's still nuts to justify the cost of the battery by sticking it in an expensive (and heavy) car.
Indeed, but that's letting economics trump energy efficiency, which is the point I'm trying to make.0 -
It's been explained on this thread. It's to cover the situation where you need to buy a christmas tree and toilet paper at the same time.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.0 -
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.0 -
TheBigBean said:
It's been explained on this thread. It's to cover the situation where you need to buy a christmas tree and toilet paper at the same time.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
My bad.
That reminds me... must remember to buy some toilet paper, though nine rolls should see me through to July.0 -
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?0 -
What they need is someone to take over from Colin Chapman.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Per the article, the main reason for the high cost of these cars is the battery.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
Thanks, though from the energy-efficiency POV it's still nuts to justify the cost of the battery by sticking it in an expensive (and heavy) car.
Indeed, but that's letting economics trump energy efficiency, which is the point I'm trying to make.
And add in reliability. 😉The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
I think that's where you're barking up the wrong tree. It's a pile of bigger and smaller things... public transport, better cycling infra, less use of cars private cars, people making work/life choices that reduce travel needs, people's expectations about ease of travel shifting it being less easy, etc. And within those and other areas there will be a million small changes which will have to add up to a big shift. There's no magic wand.0 -
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rick_chasey said:
I mean, isn't that basically what I've been arguing?
Not the way I've been reading your posts, but I can't speak for anyone else's comprehension skills.0 -
Bit of everything. There's no silver bullet.rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
The 2030 deadline for personal vehicles needs looking at though. "The market" is not sentient and there will be unnecessary hardship if the UK just trundles head long into a transport crisis. Either the deadline needs to go back or more proactive policies to facilitate electrification need to be put in place.
Unfortunately we have a zombie government so it will be at least 2025-2026 before any adults sit down and assess the scale of the problem. A mad panic with 4 years to go, or a last minute deadline extension, are far from ideal outcomes.
And you'll note that there's no comment in that about trains. That's because it doesn't seem to be on the agenda.
The active travel budget as a percentage of total transport budget will stay down at less than the percentage of active journeys as well, I'd have thought. Because people don't like cyclists.0 -
I've heard it described as "and and and"briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
I think that's where you're barking up the wrong tree. It's a pile of bigger and smaller things... public transport, better cycling infra, less use of cars private cars, people making work/life choices that reduce travel needs, people's expectations about ease of travel shifting it being less easy, etc. And within those and other areas there will be a million small changes which will have to add up to a big shift. There's no magic wand.0 -
“Move away from car oriented transport system” seems to be what you’re describing.briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:I mean, isn't that basically what I've been arguing?
Not the way I've been reading your posts, but I can't speak for anyone else's comprehension skills.0 -
The level of denial that us all continuing to run on fossil fuels will not have any negative impacts on *us* is really quite something.First.Aspect said:
Bit of everything. There's no silver bullet.rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
The 2030 deadline for personal vehicles needs looking at though. "The market" is not sentient and there will be unnecessary hardship if the UK just trundles head long into a transport crisis. Either the deadline needs to go back or more proactive policies to facilitate electrification need to be put in place.
Unfortunately we have a zombie government so it will be at least 2025-2026 before any adults sit down and assess the scale of the problem. A mad panic with 4 years to go, or a last minute deadline extension, are far from ideal outcomes.
And you'll note that there's no comment in that about trains. That's because it doesn't seem to be on the agenda.
The active travel budget as a percentage of total transport budget will stay down at less than the percentage of active journeys as well, I'd have thought. Because people don't like cyclists.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition1 -
I tend to think that if you genuinely want change, you need to make it as easy for people to swallow as possible. You aren't going to do that by telling people they can't afford a car any more but it's for the greater good. Policy needs to be smarter than that - why the heck do you think the green party are such a waste of a vote?rjsterry said:
The level of denial that us all continuing to run on fossil fuels will not have any negative impacts on *us* is really quite something.First.Aspect said:
Bit of everything. There's no silver bullet.rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
The 2030 deadline for personal vehicles needs looking at though. "The market" is not sentient and there will be unnecessary hardship if the UK just trundles head long into a transport crisis. Either the deadline needs to go back or more proactive policies to facilitate electrification need to be put in place.
Unfortunately we have a zombie government so it will be at least 2025-2026 before any adults sit down and assess the scale of the problem. A mad panic with 4 years to go, or a last minute deadline extension, are far from ideal outcomes.
And you'll note that there's no comment in that about trains. That's because it doesn't seem to be on the agenda.
The active travel budget as a percentage of total transport budget will stay down at less than the percentage of active journeys as well, I'd have thought. Because people don't like cyclists.1 -
rick_chasey said:
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
One partial solution could be to impose strict energy use limits on vehicles. If they can make a 5 seater that averages, for example, 60mpg why do we allow private cars which average 40mpg - or whatever the equivalent is for electric vehicles. Of course this is only a partial solution but partial is better than none.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]1 -
DeVlaeminck said:rick_chasey said:
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
One partial solution could be to impose strict energy use limits on vehicles. If they can make a 5 seater that averages, for example, 60mpg why do we allow private cars which average 40mpg - or whatever the equivalent is for electric vehicles. Of course this is only a partial solution but partial is better than none.
You then end up in BMW i8 territory.
Theoretical mpg = 134.5. Real life mpg = 50.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
If we had lots of time, then sure. But we don't. I wonder if that village that went up in smoke last summer feel 'inconvenienced'. If everyone puts off change because it's not convenient, eventually much more change will be forced on them.First.Aspect said:
I tend to think that if you genuinely want change, you need to make it as easy for people to swallow as possible. You aren't going to do that by telling people they can't afford a car any more but it's for the greater good. Policy needs to be smarter than that - why the heck do you think the green party are such a waste of a vote?rjsterry said:
The level of denial that us all continuing to run on fossil fuels will not have any negative impacts on *us* is really quite something.First.Aspect said:
Bit of everything. There's no silver bullet.rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
The 2030 deadline for personal vehicles needs looking at though. "The market" is not sentient and there will be unnecessary hardship if the UK just trundles head long into a transport crisis. Either the deadline needs to go back or more proactive policies to facilitate electrification need to be put in place.
Unfortunately we have a zombie government so it will be at least 2025-2026 before any adults sit down and assess the scale of the problem. A mad panic with 4 years to go, or a last minute deadline extension, are far from ideal outcomes.
And you'll note that there's no comment in that about trains. That's because it doesn't seem to be on the agenda.
The active travel budget as a percentage of total transport budget will stay down at less than the percentage of active journeys as well, I'd have thought. Because people don't like cyclists.
If only there was some recent example of ignoring a problem rather than confronting it. Maybe in eastern Europe.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
We can't ignore it, but it's better to work with human nature than against it.rjsterry said:
If we had lots of time, then sure. But we don't. I wonder if that village that went up in smoke last summer feel 'inconvenienced'. If everyone puts off change because it's not convenient, eventually much more change will be forced on them.First.Aspect said:
I tend to think that if you genuinely want change, you need to make it as easy for people to swallow as possible. You aren't going to do that by telling people they can't afford a car any more but it's for the greater good. Policy needs to be smarter than that - why the heck do you think the green party are such a waste of a vote?rjsterry said:
The level of denial that us all continuing to run on fossil fuels will not have any negative impacts on *us* is really quite something.First.Aspect said:
Bit of everything. There's no silver bullet.rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
The 2030 deadline for personal vehicles needs looking at though. "The market" is not sentient and there will be unnecessary hardship if the UK just trundles head long into a transport crisis. Either the deadline needs to go back or more proactive policies to facilitate electrification need to be put in place.
Unfortunately we have a zombie government so it will be at least 2025-2026 before any adults sit down and assess the scale of the problem. A mad panic with 4 years to go, or a last minute deadline extension, are far from ideal outcomes.
And you'll note that there's no comment in that about trains. That's because it doesn't seem to be on the agenda.
The active travel budget as a percentage of total transport budget will stay down at less than the percentage of active journeys as well, I'd have thought. Because people don't like cyclists.
If only there was some recent example of ignoring a problem rather than confronting it. Maybe in eastern Europe.
I don't think phasing out ice's is bad, rather that the government is sitting on its hands regarding alternatives.
Where the hell are all the chargers for people who live in flats, oe who dont have drives amd eho currently park on the street? (For example)
This passive "if there is demand the market will provide it" approach isn't adequate. Govt should be proactive and take a "build it and they will come" approach.0 -
I see your point but if people can't afford to buy them that's a big problem.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Per the article, the main reason for the high cost of these cars is the battery.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
Thanks, though from the energy-efficiency POV it's still nuts to justify the cost of the battery by sticking it in an expensive (and heavy) car.
Indeed, but that's letting economics trump energy efficiency, which is the point I'm trying to make."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Trouble is, 2030 appears to be insufficient time to prepare for the ICE ban. They should put it back to allow for proper prep, building the charging infrastructure etc.rjsterry said:
The level of denial that us all continuing to run on fossil fuels will not have any negative impacts on *us* is really quite something.First.Aspect said:
Bit of everything. There's no silver bullet.rick_chasey said:
Right.First.Aspect said:
Its not working. The effect will be to drive costs of second hand cars.rick_chasey said:
I think the hope (and I think it is a hope) from the regulators is by forcing the issue they incentivise efforts to bring the costs down.Stevo_666 said:
Economics is a factor:briantrumpet said:rick_chasey said:
I just don't get the thing with big cars at all. And especially with EVs, it's nuts.
https://thisismoney.co.uk/money/electriccars/article-11665917/Kia-boss-Cheap-small-electric-cars-not-viable-high-battery-costs.html
If we stick to 2030 for banning ICE cars this could see a lot of people priced out of new cars. Every cloud etc...
In theory, scarcity of resources aside, they are simpler machines that ought to be easier to run.
That's why I've been banging on about non-car solutions.
There are good reasons why the regulators across the west have put in these time lines for fossil fuel cars, right?
But similarly, the battery powered car is not going to be able to replace the fossil fuel car effectively.
So what's the solution?
The 2030 deadline for personal vehicles needs looking at though. "The market" is not sentient and there will be unnecessary hardship if the UK just trundles head long into a transport crisis. Either the deadline needs to go back or more proactive policies to facilitate electrification need to be put in place.
Unfortunately we have a zombie government so it will be at least 2025-2026 before any adults sit down and assess the scale of the problem. A mad panic with 4 years to go, or a last minute deadline extension, are far from ideal outcomes.
And you'll note that there's no comment in that about trains. That's because it doesn't seem to be on the agenda.
The active travel budget as a percentage of total transport budget will stay down at less than the percentage of active journeys as well, I'd have thought. Because people don't like cyclists."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
We have on street charging just outside. It is popping up everywhere all the time.First.Aspect said:
Where the hell are all the chargers for people who live in flats, oe who dont have drives amd eho currently park on the street? (For example)0 -
Good if it is, but I bet its popping up in rich areas, amd London and the SE way, way ahead of anywhere else.TheBigBean said:
We have on street charging just outside. It is popping up everywhere all the time.First.Aspect said:
Where the hell are all the chargers for people who live in flats, oe who dont have drives amd eho currently park on the street? (For example)0 -
There are at least 2 in Sevenoaks (population 30,000). Can't see any my village though. Suspect there could be a few good fights over the ones that are available. Suspect that hanging onto a decent petrol car post 2030 could be a good strategy.TheBigBean said:
We have on street charging just outside. It is popping up everywhere all the time.First.Aspect said:
Where the hell are all the chargers for people who live in flats, oe who dont have drives amd eho currently park on the street? (For example)
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0
