Euro 2020/21 (more football, sorry Brian)

ddraver

Denmark gave up on scoring in normal and extra time from the moment they equalised. They barely got out of their own half from that point on and even when they did it was half-hearted and almost immediately lost possession. I cannot see how England were ever under any cosh...

The decisions may have been soft but they got them because they played in the right places. In contrast, Denmarks 'soft decisions' - the Maguire Yellow card for example, were all given in their own penalty box.

Italy are going to defend as well, probably, but also go and try and win the game and that is what is making me nervous...

First.Aspect

rick_chasey said:

And like Kane doesn’t hold the ball up, back into a player and fall down clutching his back on contact when it suits him.

Yup. He doesn't hold his face though to force the other team to kick it out or the ref to stop the game.

pinno

elbowloh said:

DeVlaeminck said:

elbowloh said:

Grealish went off because we had the lead and Southgate wanted to change to 3 at the back to close out the game.

Yes that's obvious but what it actually did is hand the momentum to Denmark - sitting on a lead for 15 minutes when you've dominated the previous 15 isn't my idea of good tactics - I'd say he got away with it rather than it worked but it's subjective.

Normally I hate when we try to close out a game, because traditionally we've been terrible at keeping possession, but last night the team did it terrifically, completely neutralised the oppo and it was almost easy in the last 15 mins

This.
I thought Grealish caused so much concern amongst the Danish defence - after all, he is the most fouled player in the tournament and for good reason.
As said previously. as soon as he came off, Denmark had more possession.
I don't think changing formation over the course of the match did England any favours although in mitigation, the job was done. Only, there were patches of play where we didn't seem to be in control. We were left with the brilliance of a lone Kyle Walker to mop up and some luck with Pickford's poor distribution and clearance.
It's amazing how at no point - especially corners and goal kicks, was the height of the Danes taken into more consideration. Most corners/goal kicks were dealt with by them and we never really bossed the midfield. It was only the forward runs and emphasis down the wings by the likes of Sterling that created opportunities.

Most of the comments are not really made within the context that Denmark were a physical force and actually, played well - they lacked the numbers in the final 3rd that could have made the difference for them.

I wonder what preparation Southgate will carry out knowing that unlike all the other games, England won't have the same possession against Italy and the midfield will be where it's won or lost and therefore a bigger midfield presence will be needed. Perhaps a start for Henderson.
Holding players in that area will be key but straying too far from the formations/players that have been accustomed to; that could be detrimental.
Kyle Walker cannot be on his own and there has to be a constant pair (trio) even, that stay back or we'll be punished - plus Pickford showed frailties that the Italians may exploit. This means fewer numbers attacking.
It's a balance and if badly judged or executed, it's game over.

Being the underdogs will I think, be in England's favour.
I think there was/is more pressure on England to get to the final than win it.

Just my rambling thoughts.

Ben6899

skyblueamateur said:

England will beat Italy as long as Grealish doesn't get on the pitch.

Lost the ball on quite a few occasions and failed to track back allowing the Danes to counter attack. Italy will punish that.

Is too much of a luxury. Foden controls the game better.

Grealish hat-trick.

loltoride

seanoconn said:

History! Well in my life time. Denmark parked the bus and were extremely difficult to break down. England did as well as any team could against that kind of defence. Thoroughly deserved victory. Sterling is the player of the tournament so far.

Totally agree will all you have said.

loltoride

joe2019 said:

rick_chasey said:

Sterling was excellent at cheating

Please let me know when he has cheated.

Ben6899

Sterling's performance last night was as good as you'll see.

Grealish' inclusion does change the shape, but he buys sooo much time and is so clever with the ball. Fantastic substitute option to change things up.

There's no harm in having great/your best players on the bench, to come on and frighten the life out of the opposition with their ability and fresh legs. Sven, Capello, McLaren didn't realise this... man, that midfield vs Germany in 2010.

loltoride

Don't be daft. Never a penalty. You're correct all strikers would go down, doesn't make it a penalty though.

It was a clear penalty you can see the contact anyway I am happy with Ref's & VAR decision.

Ben6899

kingstongraham

For the penalty, he got kicked once and barged into once in the penalty box. Can't see how VAR could overturn it.

First.Aspect

loltoride said:

Don't be daft. Never a penalty. You're correct all strikers would go down, doesn't make it a penalty though.

It was a clear penalty you can see the contact anyway I am happy with Ref's & VAR decision.


In today's game it was a penalty. Should it be? Different question. But the assessment was 1. Was the striker or the defender in control of the ball? 2. If the striker, did the defender impede the striker?

This doesn't require him to trip him up by making contact, providing that the defender impedes the striker illegally. It can still be a foul if the striker has to fall over to avoid being hurt or tripped. Assessed that way, there were two Danish defenders who committed a foul, potentially. Neither was going to get the ball. One was stepping into the space the striker was running in to, which is obstruction. The other was trying to run him out of play, which is obstruction. I guess only Sterling knows how much he over egged it.

I don't genuinely think that this should be a foul, don't get me wrong. But, a majority, but by no means all, refs would give it.

skyblueamateur

'It can still be a foul if the striker has to fall over to avoid being hurt or tripped.'

I'll hold my hands up and admit that I wasn't aware of this. If that is the case then that is mental. If that penalty was given against England you'd all be rightly p1ssed off about it.

Glad to watch the Championship if that's deemed a foul. I'll always see it as a dive.

skyblueamateur

Ben6899 said:

Sterling's performance last night was as good as you'll see.

Grealish' inclusion does change the shape, but he buys sooo much time and is so clever with the ball. Fantastic substitute option to change things up.

There's no harm in having great/your best players on the bench, to come on and frighten the life out of the opposition with their ability and fresh legs. Sven, Capello, McLaren didn't realise this... man, that midfield vs Germany in 2010.

How many times did Grealish give the ball away yesterday and allow the Danes to counter? Do that against Italy and we'll punished.

Bring him on if a goal down and chasing the game but otherwise I'd take Foden ahead of him everytime. A much classier and clever player.

First.Aspect

skyblueamateur said:

'It can still be a foul if the striker has to fall over to avoid being hurt or tripped.'

I'll hold my hands up and admit that I wasn't aware of this. If that is the case then that is mental. If that penalty was given against England you'd all be rightly p1ssed off about it.

Glad to watch the Championship if that's deemed a foul. I'll always see it as a dive.

Hasn't this always been the case? An extreme example would be someone jumping out of the way of a "Robbo" shin-breaker (in fairness he got worse in his mid-30s). Those are given as fouls quite often.

skyblueamateur

First.Aspect said:

skyblueamateur said:

'It can still be a foul if the striker has to fall over to avoid being hurt or tripped.'

I'll hold my hands up and admit that I wasn't aware of this. If that is the case then that is mental. If that penalty was given against England you'd all be rightly p1ssed off about it.

Glad to watch the Championship if that's deemed a foul. I'll always see it as a dive.

Hasn't this always been the case? An extreme example would be someone jumping out of the way of a "Robbo" shin-breaker (in fairness he got worse in his mid-30s). Those are given as fouls quite often.

Dodging out of the way of a two-footer and what happened last night is quite a difference

skyblueamateur

We'll have to agree to disagree but the fact that all of the ex pro's didn't think it was a penalty is pretty telling for me.

First.Aspect

skyblueamateur said:

First.Aspect said:

skyblueamateur said:

'It can still be a foul if the striker has to fall over to avoid being hurt or tripped.'

I'll hold my hands up and admit that I wasn't aware of this. If that is the case then that is mental. If that penalty was given against England you'd all be rightly p1ssed off about it.

Glad to watch the Championship if that's deemed a foul. I'll always see it as a dive.

Hasn't this always been the case? An extreme example would be someone jumping out of the way of a "Robbo" shin-breaker (in fairness he got worse in his mid-30s). Those are given as fouls quite often.

Dodging out of the way of a two-footer and what happened last night is quite a difference

Well, yes, but tell UEFA that.

Ben6899

It was a penalty.

seanoconn

Ben6899 said:

It was a penalty.

Fact. I watched the penalty being taken with my own eyes.

womack

kingstongraham said:

elbowloh said:

Watching highlights on the beeb. Two things to note

1) they're using ITV's commentary. They normally have their own commentators.

2) Lineker, Shearer and Jenas are all wearing the same trainers.

Is watching three ex players chatting really as interesting as actual football? Maybe they feel they need to get their money's worth.

You've obviously never watched the team I support 😟

DeVlaeminck

So Italy - how does /should Southgate set up for that one?

Hard one to call. I'd suggest the Italians move the ball too well for us to want to press high and expose McGuire and Stones to too much grass. At the same time Italy will probably want to draw us out and be aware of the pace of Saka and Sterling (or a few others) on the break - so 2 teams neither of whom want to come out and a very cagey affair?

That said we have seen both sides start very aggressively in a few matches.

elbowloh

kingstongraham said:

elbowloh said:

Watching highlights on the beeb. Two things to note

1) they're using ITV's commentary. They normally have their own commentators.

2) Lineker, Shearer and Jenas are all wearing the same trainers.

Just watched this on the iPlayer. It was Jermaine Jenas and Guy Mowbray. He just has the same pompous tones for an England game as Sam Matterface on ITV.

What I noticed was the kickoff was at 2 minutes into the programme, and the final whistle was at 18 minutes in. So that's 16 minutes out of a 32 minute programme.

Is watching three ex players chatting really as interesting as actual football? Maybe they feel they need to get their money's worth.

Not on the one I watched, it had Lee Dixon. I remembered some of the lines they used during the live game.

tailwindhome

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

kingstongraham

elbowloh said:

kingstongraham said:

elbowloh said:

Watching highlights on the beeb. Two things to note

1) they're using ITV's commentary. They normally have their own commentators.

2) Lineker, Shearer and Jenas are all wearing the same trainers.

Just watched this on the iPlayer. It was Jermaine Jenas and Guy Mowbray. He just has the same pompous tones for an England game as Sam Matterface on ITV.

What I noticed was the kickoff was at 2 minutes into the programme, and the final whistle was at 18 minutes in. So that's 16 minutes out of a 32 minute programme.

Is watching three ex players chatting really as interesting as actual football? Maybe they feel they need to get their money's worth.

Not on the one I watched, it had Lee Dixon. I remembered some of the lines they used during the live game.

That's a real shame for you.

kingstongraham

tailwindhome said:

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

It's too early to say.

womack

tailwindhome said:

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

Yes, have been watching the covid death league table for a few months now. Italy were a long way behind UK a couple of months back but have been gaining rapidly, now within 5-600 deaths.

Russia recently though have thrashed us both!

pblakeney

kingstongraham said:

tailwindhome said:

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

It's too early to say.

Now it's done get over it and be positive.
Or, is that get it and be positive. 😉

focuszing723

womack said:

tailwindhome said:

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

Yes, have been watching the covid death league table for a few months now. Italy were a long way behind UK a couple of months back but have been gaining rapidly, now within 5-600 deaths.

Russia recently though have thrashed us both!

I kept mentioning about the crowd numbers but nobody would listen.

seanoconn

focuszing723 said:

womack said:

tailwindhome said:

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

Yes, have been watching the covid death league table for a few months now. Italy were a long way behind UK a couple of months back but have been gaining rapidly, now within 5-600 deaths.

Russia recently though have thrashed us both!

I kept mentioning about the crowd numbers but nobody would listen.

Now you tell us 🤦

briantrumpet

focuszing723 said:

womack said:

tailwindhome said:

Nice that the two European countries with the most disastrous pandemic response made the final.

Yes, have been watching the covid death league table for a few months now. Italy were a long way behind UK a couple of months back but have been gaining rapidly, now within 5-600 deaths.

Russia recently though have thrashed us both!

I kept mentioning about the crowd numbers but nobody would listen.

Meanwhile it looks as if they will ban spectators at the Olympics...

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jul/08/tokyo-to-be-put-under-state-of-emergency-for-duration-of-2020-olympic-games