Will you have the Covid-19 vaccine?
Comments
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Possibly a touch unfair to under 30s, you could argue that the majority of under 30s have had an over the top view of personal covid risk throughout. The only reason U30s are being offered a different jab is because their risk of dying of covid is so tiny, which is the exact same reason why you might be content only having one jab at that age.First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
I'll take whichever jab I'm given but I'd prefer to have a different one if I'm offered before October when I'm 30.0 -
I think it will hinder confidence in vaccines.Pross said:I guess with it being a not for profit vaccine there would be no major issue if they eventually discontinue it with all the others coming on stream. I can't decide whether stopping it would help or hinder confidence in the vaccines generally - would it help show that they are taking even very low risks seriously or be seen as a sign that you can't trust the testing process?
The major problem is that because of price and ease of administering it was being relied upon as the global workhorse, it is now in danger of being seen as a 2nd rate vaccine for the poor which will not help take up.
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.0 -
Interesting point. Probably already mentioned but the contraceptive pill has something like a 1 in 2000 risk of blood clots compared to the ~1 in 250,000 from the AZ vaccinesurrey_commuter said:
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.0 -
Or they work in care or the NHS or other key worker rolessurrey_commuter said:
I think it will hinder confidence in vaccines.Pross said:I guess with it being a not for profit vaccine there would be no major issue if they eventually discontinue it with all the others coming on stream. I can't decide whether stopping it would help or hinder confidence in the vaccines generally - would it help show that they are taking even very low risks seriously or be seen as a sign that you can't trust the testing process?
The major problem is that because of price and ease of administering it was being relied upon as the global workhorse, it is now in danger of being seen as a 2nd rate vaccine for the poor which will not help take up.
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.0 -
I wonder if attitudes in the States will be different to the media portrayal across Europe. Anyone who has seen American TV will know how it's plagued with ads from private drugs companies where they have to list the potential side effects in the voiceover. In a culture where they're so used to hearing this pill or that pill could potentially make you grow a tail or poop yourself to death, whether a minute risk from a COVID vaccine will seem like nothing to them.0
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Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
The two I know one has mild exercise induced asthma and one is a student psychiatric nurse.surrey_commuter said:
I think it will hinder confidence in vaccines.Pross said:I guess with it being a not for profit vaccine there would be no major issue if they eventually discontinue it with all the others coming on stream. I can't decide whether stopping it would help or hinder confidence in the vaccines generally - would it help show that they are taking even very low risks seriously or be seen as a sign that you can't trust the testing process?
The major problem is that because of price and ease of administering it was being relied upon as the global workhorse, it is now in danger of being seen as a 2nd rate vaccine for the poor which will not help take up.
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
No, it isn't. This was clear from the trial data.DeVlaeminck said:
Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.0 -
strangely I do not know anybody who got called up early for asthmaDeVlaeminck said:
The two I know one has mild exercise induced asthma and one is a student psychiatric nurse.surrey_commuter said:
I think it will hinder confidence in vaccines.Pross said:I guess with it being a not for profit vaccine there would be no major issue if they eventually discontinue it with all the others coming on stream. I can't decide whether stopping it would help or hinder confidence in the vaccines generally - would it help show that they are taking even very low risks seriously or be seen as a sign that you can't trust the testing process?
The major problem is that because of price and ease of administering it was being relied upon as the global workhorse, it is now in danger of being seen as a 2nd rate vaccine for the poor which will not help take up.
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.0 -
First.Aspect said:
No, it isn't. This was clear from the trial data.DeVlaeminck said:
Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.
No what isn't ? Just so I know what the claim is exactly have you got a published source you can point us to.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
Yes but it's my daughter so I know it's true - at least she was called up and the only thing she can think of is that she has an inhaler.surrey_commuter said:
strangely I do not know anybody who got called up early for asthmaDeVlaeminck said:
The two I know one has mild exercise induced asthma and one is a student psychiatric nurse.surrey_commuter said:
I think it will hinder confidence in vaccines.Pross said:I guess with it being a not for profit vaccine there would be no major issue if they eventually discontinue it with all the others coming on stream. I can't decide whether stopping it would help or hinder confidence in the vaccines generally - would it help show that they are taking even very low risks seriously or be seen as a sign that you can't trust the testing process?
The major problem is that because of price and ease of administering it was being relied upon as the global workhorse, it is now in danger of being seen as a 2nd rate vaccine for the poor which will not help take up.
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
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A colleague's latest theory is that there's a news blackout on how manky the side effects are from AZ.
Every under 50 that he knows who has had it has been laid up in bed for at least a day.
Anecdotally, all the more mature people I know who have been jabbed have been pretty much fine.0 -
I am under 50 and I was not laid up in bed, though I did feel a bit meh for a couple of days. It has been reported how the younger you are the more likely you are to experience side effects. I don't think there's a big conspiracy around it. So tell your colleague to take off their tinfoil hat.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-563753070 -
Yeah, me neither. Felt a bit under the weather in the afternoon (a bit cold / shivery) and my arm was saw, but that's it. The wife didn't even have those issues.nibnob21 said:I am under 50 and I was not laid up in bed, though I did feel a bit meh for a couple of days. It has been reported how the younger you are the more likely you are to experience side effects. I don't think there's a big conspiracy around it. So tell your colleague to take off their tinfoil hat.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-563753070 -
Sorry was not questioning you as there seems to be all sorts of confusion over Covid and asthma. I have (mild) asthma and you tend to know the other asthmaticsDeVlaeminck said:
Yes but it's my daughter so I know it's true - at least she was called up and the only thing she can think of is that she has an inhaler.surrey_commuter said:
strangely I do not know anybody who got called up early for asthmaDeVlaeminck said:
The two I know one has mild exercise induced asthma and one is a student psychiatric nurse.surrey_commuter said:
I think it will hinder confidence in vaccines.Pross said:I guess with it being a not for profit vaccine there would be no major issue if they eventually discontinue it with all the others coming on stream. I can't decide whether stopping it would help or hinder confidence in the vaccines generally - would it help show that they are taking even very low risks seriously or be seen as a sign that you can't trust the testing process?
The major problem is that because of price and ease of administering it was being relied upon as the global workhorse, it is now in danger of being seen as a 2nd rate vaccine for the poor which will not help take up.
One thing that intrigues me is these young women who have had the jab already must have underlying conditions.0 -
I think it would be beneficial if the Govt published a risk as compared to other drugs or vaccines that we don't think twice about taking/having. Comparing a vaccine to taking a flight or driving doesn't seem a very effective way.
If people realised that the risks of having a blood clot out of taking ibuprofene are probably higher, then maybe they would have something to relate to. Worst case scenario they would stop taking ibuprofene for every minuscule ache, which would probably be a good outcome anyway...left the forum March 20230 -
im struggling with the its my right not to have it arguments that are accompanied with complaints that a vaccine passport would discriminate against them.
self self self. more important than everyone else together0 -
hahahah yes. where theres blame there's a claimnibnob21 said:I wonder if attitudes in the States will be different to the media portrayal across Europe. Anyone who has seen American TV will know how it's plagued with ads from private drugs companies where they have to list the potential side effects in the voiceover. In a culture where they're so used to hearing this pill or that pill could potentially make you grow a tail or poop yourself to death, whether a minute risk from a COVID vaccine will seem like nothing to them.
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All Pfizered up no killer vaccine for me just the tracking device0
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I'm not sure if there's any process to it or if it's just luck of the draw as a friend of mine who is the same age had his today in the other local centre and got AZ.joe2019 said:Pross said:All Pfizered up no killer vaccine for me just the tracking device
Interesting that you got PZ, my wife will be pleased to hear that.0 -
I've just worked 36 hours in the last 3 days, so I've not had time for a fully referenced review article. Within reason listening to an interview with the prof at Oxford who developed it is good enough for me without reviewing the raw data. During the trial, detected blood clots of any type were recorded, and these were at a lower level than would be expected in the population as a whole and a lower level than the placebo group.DeVlaeminck said:First.Aspect said:
No, it isn't. This was clear from the trial data.DeVlaeminck said:
Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.
No what isn't ? Just so I know what the claim is exactly have you got a published source you can point us to.0 -
You see my point though - if the percentage you gave is true of all Covid cases not just a smaller sub set then there have been huge numbers of blood clots - the same same goes for DVTs and strokes as the professor gave percentages per case for them too. I mean maybe there have been millions of DVTs and blood clots caused by Covid in the UK - maybe strokes have increased by a factor of 3 - I'm just surprised if that's the case.
The other point is not all blood clots are equal. If you look at the number of blood clots that it is claimed followed a vaccine - then the number of them that died - well if the death rate for Covid infection clots was the same we'd have had more deaths from Covid blood clots than have actually died of Covid in total.
In other words talking about blood clots of any type is not the whole story - the vaccine is causing particularly dangerous blood clots.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
First.Aspect said:
I've just worked 36 hours in the last 3 days, so I've not had time for a fully referenced review article. Within reason listening to an interview with the prof at Oxford who developed it is good enough for me without reviewing the raw data. During the trial, detected blood clots of any type were recorded, and these were at a lower level than would be expected in the population as a whole and a lower level than the placebo group.DeVlaeminck said:First.Aspect said:
No, it isn't. This was clear from the trial data.DeVlaeminck said:
Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.
No what isn't ? Just so I know what the claim is exactly have you got a published source you can point us to.
Is the key not an incredibly rare type of clot that is so rare, you probably wouldn't expect to see it in any kind of trial.
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If you only trial your drug on 100k people then if the chance of a clot is 4 in a million your could well see none in your sample. Drug trials don't generally involve millions or people and when people are looking at the risk of drugs they tend to start at 1 in 10 rick and go down to the 1 in a thousand risks. Not 1 in 250k risk for good reason in that it is practicably negligible for most people.1
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Exactly - a lot of people are talking as if a clot is a clot and they all carry equal risk.Jezyboy said:First.Aspect said:
I've just worked 36 hours in the last 3 days, so I've not had time for a fully referenced review article. Within reason listening to an interview with the prof at Oxford who developed it is good enough for me without reviewing the raw data. During the trial, detected blood clots of any type were recorded, and these were at a lower level than would be expected in the population as a whole and a lower level than the placebo group.DeVlaeminck said:First.Aspect said:
No, it isn't. This was clear from the trial data.DeVlaeminck said:
Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.
No what isn't ? Just so I know what the claim is exactly have you got a published source you can point us to.
Is the key not an incredibly rare type of clot that is so rare, you probably wouldn't expect to see it in any kind of trial.
If we talked about fatal blood clots we'd see why the govt and scientific community aren't just dismissing it and why they've actually made changes to who gets what vaccine.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
You seem to be simultaneously explaining why you are coming down on the side of the vaccine being 'risky' whilst also admitting you don't really understand the clot statistics and asking others to find out for you.DeVlaeminck said:
Exactly - a lot of people are talking as if a clot is a clot and they all carry equal risk.Jezyboy said:First.Aspect said:
I've just worked 36 hours in the last 3 days, so I've not had time for a fully referenced review article. Within reason listening to an interview with the prof at Oxford who developed it is good enough for me without reviewing the raw data. During the trial, detected blood clots of any type were recorded, and these were at a lower level than would be expected in the population as a whole and a lower level than the placebo group.DeVlaeminck said:First.Aspect said:
No, it isn't. This was clear from the trial data.DeVlaeminck said:
Ok so this is evidence of clots the majority of which would go undetected if they weren't looked for. Be interesting to know if the AZ vaccine is causing many more clots and we are only hearing about those with serious consequences.nibnob21 said:
BBC article I read this morning said something like 7.8% of cases have shown evidence of small clots on the lungs.DeVlaeminck said:
Surely those blood clot stats can't be right - have there really been millions of blood clot cases from Covid ?First.Aspect said:
You don't have to drive anywhere. That is a choice.joe2019 said:First.Aspect said:
You are more likely to die on the road on the way there.DeVlaeminck said:I know a few u30s who have had a single AZ dose who aren't sure they are going to have the second.
About 1 in 40000 people die in rta's every year in the UK. The risk from the AZ vaccine seems to be about 1 in 1000000. Do these u30s leave the house at all?
Of course that is true, but that's a calculated risk we all take going about our daily lives on most days. The AZ vaccine is a risk people don't have to take.
The figures, however remote, are of no consolation to the 19 people in the UK alone, who have lost their lives due to this vaccine.
Another way of looking at this is that whilst 78 blood clot cases have been found, the risk of clots if you have Covid is huge - 10% or more. So how many of these have been prevented by the AZ vaccine? Many more than 78.
No what isn't ? Just so I know what the claim is exactly have you got a published source you can point us to.
Is the key not an incredibly rare type of clot that is so rare, you probably wouldn't expect to see it in any kind of trial.
If we talked about fatal blood clots we'd see why the govt and scientific community aren't just dismissing it and why they've actually made changes to who gets what vaccine.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono1 -
Errr no. I'm suggesting the risk is being misrepresented by some of you - that's a different thing to it being risky.
And I'm giving First Aspect the opportunity to clarify why he thinks he's right because whilst I disagree with him I don't approach the discussion as a battle I'm trying to win.
So back in your box til you've got something to contribute.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]1
