The big Coronavirus thread
Comments
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Quite a reason for getting the vaccine.rick_chasey said:
Getting chickenpox as an adult is quite serious.pblakeney said:So in summary, getting chickenpox as a child boosts your immune system against shingles as an adult. But you can't get shingles as an adult until you've had chickenpox.
Surely best not to get chickenpox. Confused? You will be after this...
Get the vaccine and avoid the hassle. Don't get the vaccine and gamble between minor and major consequences.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
So it's for adults who have had chickenpox as a child?TheBigBean said:kingstongraham said:
Are they different when it's the same virus? Shingles is just chickenpox that's been chilling in your body for a few years isn't it?TheBigBean said:
Better to just have both a shingles vaccine and a chickenpox one so no one needs to suffer.rjsterry said:
Putting it another way, kids don't get vaccinated so you don't need to either. All fine until you've got blisters on the inside of your eyelids and at risk of permanent eye damage.TheBigBean said:The last bit is what I was referencing. Kids not being vaccinated is considered better for society as it supposedly helps prevent shingles in adults.
How does the shingles vaccine work?
The vaccine recommended for most people is a live vaccine called Zostavax. It contains a weakened chickenpox virus (varicella-zoster virus). It's similar , but not identical, to the chickenpox vaccine.
People with a weakened immune system cannot have live vaccines. They will be offered a non-live vaccine called Shingrix. It activates the immune system but also contains an ingredient called an adjuvant, which helps to boost the response to the vaccine.
Very occasionally, people develop chickenpox following shingles vaccination (fewer than 1 in 10,000 individuals). Talk to a GP if this happens to you.0 -
If you have the vaccine, you have a reduced chance of getting shingles, so presumably you can also have the shingles vaccine. I don't understand how you get shingles if you haven't had chickenpox due to the vaccine. Perhaps it is the case that you still have had chickenpox (so the virus lives in your body), but the vaccine meant you didn't have any symptoms.kingstongraham said:
So it's for adults who have had chickenpox as a child?TheBigBean said:kingstongraham said:
Are they different when it's the same virus? Shingles is just chickenpox that's been chilling in your body for a few years isn't it?TheBigBean said:
Better to just have both a shingles vaccine and a chickenpox one so no one needs to suffer.rjsterry said:
Putting it another way, kids don't get vaccinated so you don't need to either. All fine until you've got blisters on the inside of your eyelids and at risk of permanent eye damage.TheBigBean said:The last bit is what I was referencing. Kids not being vaccinated is considered better for society as it supposedly helps prevent shingles in adults.
How does the shingles vaccine work?
The vaccine recommended for most people is a live vaccine called Zostavax. It contains a weakened chickenpox virus (varicella-zoster virus). It's similar , but not identical, to the chickenpox vaccine.
People with a weakened immune system cannot have live vaccines. They will be offered a non-live vaccine called Shingrix. It activates the immune system but also contains an ingredient called an adjuvant, which helps to boost the response to the vaccine.
Very occasionally, people develop chickenpox following shingles vaccination (fewer than 1 in 10,000 individuals). Talk to a GP if this happens to you.
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox. Likewise, vaccinating kids for covid for little benefit for themselves because six million adults don't want to be vaccinated also seems a bit ropey. I have more sympathy when it comes to sacrificing the kids for the benefit of vaccinated adults as there is some benefit to the kids if their parents continue to live.0 -
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To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
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Apparently not as it would be covered by parents not taking time off work to look after sick children.rick_chasey said:It's also a cost thing, which is always the case for the NHS.
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Does that save the NHS money?TheBigBean said:
Apparently not as it would be covered by parents not taking time off work to look after sick children.rick_chasey said:It's also a cost thing, which is always the case for the NHS.
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Those kids won't then benefit when they get older?TheBigBean said:
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox.
Seems a short sighted view.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
Well, it means that they have fewer staff sick days, so yes.rick_chasey said:
Does that save the NHS money?TheBigBean said:
Apparently not as it would be covered by parents not taking time off work to look after sick children.rick_chasey said:It's also a cost thing, which is always the case for the NHS.
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Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
If you aren't already doing this, you should be socially distancing from everyone.imposter2.0 said:
Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
😂TheBigBean said:
If you have the vaccine, you have a reduced chance of getting shingles, so presumably you can also have the shingles vaccine. I don't understand how you get shingles if you haven't had chickenpox due to the vaccine. Perhaps it is the case that you still have had chickenpox (so the virus lives in your body), but the vaccine meant you didn't have any symptoms.kingstongraham said:
So it's for adults who have had chickenpox as a child?TheBigBean said:kingstongraham said:
Are they different when it's the same virus? Shingles is just chickenpox that's been chilling in your body for a few years isn't it?TheBigBean said:
Better to just have both a shingles vaccine and a chickenpox one so no one needs to suffer.rjsterry said:
Putting it another way, kids don't get vaccinated so you don't need to either. All fine until you've got blisters on the inside of your eyelids and at risk of permanent eye damage.TheBigBean said:The last bit is what I was referencing. Kids not being vaccinated is considered better for society as it supposedly helps prevent shingles in adults.
How does the shingles vaccine work?
The vaccine recommended for most people is a live vaccine called Zostavax. It contains a weakened chickenpox virus (varicella-zoster virus). It's similar , but not identical, to the chickenpox vaccine.
People with a weakened immune system cannot have live vaccines. They will be offered a non-live vaccine called Shingrix. It activates the immune system but also contains an ingredient called an adjuvant, which helps to boost the response to the vaccine.
Very occasionally, people develop chickenpox following shingles vaccination (fewer than 1 in 10,000 individuals). Talk to a GP if this happens to you.
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox. Likewise, vaccinating kids for covid for little benefit for themselves because six million adults don't want to be vaccinated also seems a bit ropey. I have more sympathy when it comes to sacrificing the kids for the benefit of vaccinated adults as there is some benefit to the kids if their parents continue to live.
Good to know they get something out of it.
More seriously, it will interesting to see to what degree protection from serious illness wanes. There is a lot of chat about Israel, but if the solution is annual boosters (like seemingly most animal jabs) then that sounds manageable.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
What is the benefit of a having chickenpox over the vaccine?pblakeney said:
Those kids won't then benefit when they get older?TheBigBean said:
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox.
Seems a short sighted view.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Good question.rjsterry said:
What is the benefit of a having chickenpox over the vaccine?pblakeney said:
Those kids won't then benefit when they get older?TheBigBean said:
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox.
Seems a short sighted view.
Ask the anti-vaxxers.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
I think this is the episode where calculations are explained.pangolin said:
Would it be liquid? What would it look like?orraloon said:I keep remembering the episode of More or Less: Behind the Stats which estimated the total physical volume of the C-virus in the world. 175ml is the number I recall. One helluva glass of wine that.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p096v4k20 -
I posted the NHS reasons upthread.rjsterry said:
What is the benefit of a having chickenpox over the vaccine?pblakeney said:
Those kids won't then benefit when they get older?TheBigBean said:
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox.
Seems a short sighted view.0 -
You mean like, posting on the internet, instead of talking face to face..?kingstongraham said:
If you aren't already doing this, you should be socially distancing from everyone.imposter2.0 said:
Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
If you strangely choose one exclusively, then yes.imposter2.0 said:
You mean like, posting on the internet, instead of talking face to face..?kingstongraham said:
If you aren't already doing this, you should be socially distancing from everyone.imposter2.0 said:
Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
I meant in terms of specific risk to the child.rick_chasey said:
I posted the NHS reasons upthread.rjsterry said:
What is the benefit of a having chickenpox over the vaccine?pblakeney said:
Those kids won't then benefit when they get older?TheBigBean said:
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox.
Seems a short sighted view.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
TheBigBean said:
I expanded on this in subsequent posts. Ultimately both are tiny and I was more interested in what parents were planning to do rather than the incessant Cake Stop point scoring.rjsterry said:
'Benefits insufficiently greater than risks' is definitely not the same as 'risks greater than benefits'. They also stated that they didn't consider the wider implications of reduced infections in that cohort and the wider population. I would suggest these are quite big things to leave out.TheBigBean said:https://www.gov.uk/government/news/jcvi-issues-updated-advice-on-covid-19-vaccination-of-children-aged-12-to-15
Although it states here that the benefits are insufficiently greater than the risks. So slightly different to my original statement. Although it affects boys more, so it may be that for boys the risks are greater than the benefits.
Hopefully I provided you with at least my perspective, based on my 2 kids0 -
How many cakestop points do you win for that?kingstongraham said:
If you strangely choose one exclusively, then yes.imposter2.0 said:
You mean like, posting on the internet, instead of talking face to face..?kingstongraham said:
If you aren't already doing this, you should be socially distancing from everyone.imposter2.0 said:
Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
I don't know what you're on about, so let's say we're even.imposter2.0 said:
How many cakestop points do you win for that?kingstongraham said:
If you strangely choose one exclusively, then yes.imposter2.0 said:
You mean like, posting on the internet, instead of talking face to face..?kingstongraham said:
If you aren't already doing this, you should be socially distancing from everyone.imposter2.0 said:
Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?0 -
Gotcha. I am sympathetic to public health reasons prioritising private reasons (within reason), but then I am not a hardcore individualist except for when it comes to making money.rjsterry said:
I meant in terms of specific risk to the child.rick_chasey said:
I posted the NHS reasons upthread.rjsterry said:
What is the benefit of a having chickenpox over the vaccine?pblakeney said:
Those kids won't then benefit when they get older?TheBigBean said:
My point with all this is that making kids suffer for the benefit of adults seems a bit ropey in the case of chickenpox.
Seems a short sighted view.0 -
I had shingles in my 20's after a brief affair with a woman from Liverpool. I presume she was a carrier for it. Intially gives you tremendous back pain then the skin irritations, mine were across stomach.
At the time the doctor didn't prescribe anything just said something along the lines of keep it covered and it will go, which it did. Unfortunately it was a week before flying out to Jugoslavia for a beach holiday so ended up sunbathing with a row of plasters across my stomach.
Back to Covid, my booster was booked for this Saturday with flu jab but have had text today, flu jab only, too early for Covid booster, needs to be six months from second jab (mine was May)
They supply a link to book in when the time frame is met.
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That makes two of us then.kingstongraham said:
I don't know what you're on about, so let's say we're even.imposter2.0 said:
How many cakestop points do you win for that?kingstongraham said:
If you strangely choose one exclusively, then yes.imposter2.0 said:
You mean like, posting on the internet, instead of talking face to face..?kingstongraham said:
If you aren't already doing this, you should be socially distancing from everyone.imposter2.0 said:
Well, the guidance does suggest washing them several times a day...briantrumpet said:imposter2.0 said:
To be fair to Nick, his contention that "it’s important to keep the amount of virus in circulation under control and at as low a level as possible" shows remarkable insight and it definitely isn't something that is 'completely fkn obvious and always has been'...kingstongraham said:Forgot who you were for a bit there. For everyone else, that scientific American article is over a year old, so all the knowledge in it will be a bit out if date. I didn't read it.
Do we need to keep washing our hands till they bleed?
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If you read my post upthread with the NHS link then it wasn't her.womack said:I had shingles in my 20's after a brief affair with a woman from Liverpool. I presume she was a carrier for it....
At least not by contagion. She may well have drained your reserves dry. 😉
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Joke from way back when HMS Hermes was still operational....pblakeney said:
If you read my post upthread with the NHS link then it wasn't her.womack said:I had shingles in my 20's after a brief affair with a woman from Liverpool. I presume she was a carrier for it....
At least not by contagion. She may well have drained your reserves dry. 😉
"I've got hermes."
"Don't you mean herpes?"
"No, I'm a carrier.."1 -
imposter2.0 said:
Joke from way back when HMS Hermes was still operational....pblakeney said:
If you read my post upthread with the NHS link then it wasn't her.womack said:I had shingles in my 20's after a brief affair with a woman from Liverpool. I presume she was a carrier for it....
At least not by contagion. She may well have drained your reserves dry. 😉
"I've got hermes."
"Don't you mean herpes?"
"No, I'm a carrier.."
Still works
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The Guardian creating some Schrödinger people. One in 500 of the people living have died.One in 500 Americans have died of Covid
America has passed another grim Covid-19 milestone, as data shows that one in 500 people living in the US have died from the virus since the pandemic began.0
