Velo South 2018

Bottom briquettes

mrfpb wrote:

Imposter wrote:

Hope everyone survived the 'great storm of 2018'..?? Worse than 1987 apparently..

I "foolishly" cycled to work this morning in the freezing 10° cold. Got wet.
I'll have similar temps going home this evening but no rain.

The rest of the week will be colder; 2° some mornings.

I have to admit I would not have cycled in if it had been very windy as well as cold and wet..
I'd have ridden a sportive today if it been looki g forward to go it for months. I only sign up for one a year, so it have been gutted if it was cancelled.

I would have ridden it, if I was legally responsible for circa 15000 riders, maybe not.

gavinbay

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Beautiful autumnal afternoon in the Midlands... 8)

https://www.strava.com/activities/1860755805

That's positively soft !!

This is what some mates did racing this morning along with pics as well.

https://www.strava.com/activities/1860344164

ugo.santalucia

GavinBay wrote:

That's positively soft !!

This is what some mates did racing this morning along with pics as well.

https://www.strava.com/activities/1860344164

Where is the thumb up button when you need it?

ugo.santalucia

Bottom briquettes wrote:

if I was legally responsible for circa 15000 riders, maybe not.

But are they really? We always assume all responsibilities are with the organiser, but this is not my understanding. There are umpteen disclaimers you agree to when you sign up and as long as they have done their risk assessment and made changes if required for H&S in view of wet and windy conditions, then the ultimate responsibility is with the rider...

kingrollo

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Bottom briquettes wrote:

if I was legally responsible for circa 15000 riders, maybe not.

But are they really? We always assume all responsibilities are with the organiser, but this is not my understanding. There are umpteen disclaimers you agree to when you sign up and as long as they have done their risk assessment and made changes if required for H&S in view of wet and windy conditions, then the ultimate responsibility is with the rider...

Rubbish.
you can not bypass negilence by putting a section in the T & C s . if there were a serious injury claim
The issue would be were csm reckless to run a cycling event with 15,000 participants with a weather warning for strong winds and heavy rain.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Lovely sunny ride to Butser Hill this afternoon, not as gusty as Friday, but a bit cooler... So glad I was wearing wintery kit including overshoes.

Was so tempted to head to South Harting to do the cat4s, even though I'm still not over lurgy #2, but I finally left home at 1600ish and it was approaching 1730 as I climbed Hoggs Lodge Lane... I was supposed to be back for dinner by 1900ish. Maybe later this week...

green_mark

ugo.santalucia wrote:

GavinBay wrote:

So for these Alpine events they do have procedures in place, but do not cancel pre the event.

... or in other words they are not chancers and know what they are doing? :roll:

I think the Etape organisers learnt their lesson the hard way in the year 2000 edition, when about 700 riders were assisted for cold/hypothermia.

ugo.santalucia

kingrollo wrote:

Rubbish

No need to rubbish users, keep it clean.

Yes, negligence is mentioned several times in the Velo South T&C... however, this is from the organisers' handbook for Audax events, which specifically mentions amber and red warnings as being beyond "contingency plans". I don't think the law applies differently and not all Audax events are 20 riders, LEL is well over a thousand. Yellow warning means: be aware... just that

However, regardless of your contingency plans, there will be occasions when the conditions dictate that it
simply is not possibly to hold your event safely (e.g. Met Office Amber or Red weather warnings) either for
the riders, yourself or your helpers.

slowbike

audax is quite different to a sportive - and that's different to a closed road sportive with 15000 riders set off in quite a tight time pattern....

but yet again, you're holding it up to your pinnacle of excellence ...

ugo.santalucia

Slowbike wrote:

but yet again, you're holding it up to your pinnacle of excellence ...

Don't get your point, don't see why my comment deserves a sarcastic answer. If you want to put a lid on the thread and call it a day, then fine, but otherwise there is really no need for this constant "ad personam" comments

slowbike

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

but yet again, you're holding it up to your pinnacle of excellence ...

Don't get your point, don't see why my comment deserves a sarcastic answer. If you want to put a lid on the thread and call it a day, then fine, but otherwise there is really no need for this constant "ad personam" comments

It wasn't sarcastic - you're comparing the health & safety requirements for a supported mass participation event to a significantly smaller self supported event. In terms of organizational responsibility, the two types of event are worlds apart.

kingrollo

ugo.santalucia wrote:

kingrollo wrote:

Rubbish

No need to rubbish users, keep it clean.

Yes, negligence is mentioned several times in the Velo South T&C... however, this is from the organisers' handbook for Audax events, which specifically mentions amber and red warnings as being beyond "contingency plans". I don't think the law applies differently and not all Audax events are 20 riders, LEL is well over a thousand. Yellow warning means: be aware... just that

However, regardless of your contingency plans, there will be occasions when the conditions dictate that it
simply is not possibly to hold your event safely (e.g. Met Office Amber or Red weather warnings) either for
the riders, yourself or your helpers.

If someone got seriously injured and they chose to appoint solicitor to fight there claim - CSM would get no protection in the courts from there terms and conditions.

In a sense its not really the legals - it would be if CSM choose to run and event with a severe weather warning in place would they be able to defend that in court ?

Don't tell me Ive stumbled on a subject where "Mr Know it all - cycled it all Ugo" isn't the absolute authority. ?

You need to get yourself to a knockin shop for a bit of relief pal....

kingrollo

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

but yet again, you're holding it up to your pinnacle of excellence ...

Don't get your point, don't see why my comment deserves a sarcastic answer. If you want to put a lid on the thread and call it a day, then fine, but otherwise there is really no need for this constant "ad personam" comments

You could opt out of a thread on an event you never had any intention riding. (or the forum) and do us all a favour...

ugo.santalucia

kingrollo wrote:

If someone got seriously injured and they chose to appoint solicitor to fight there claim - CSM would get no protection in the courts from there terms and conditions.

In a sense its not really the legals - it would be if CSM choose to run and event with a severe weather warning in place would they be able to defend that in court ?

Don't tell me Ive stumbled on a subject where "Mr Know it all - cycled it all Ugo" isn't the absolute authority. ?

You need to get yourself to a knockin shop for a bit of relief pal....

First part of your reply informative,

second part usual offload of unnecessary language. Since you can't keep it clean and moderators no longer care about mutual respect, I say you win and much to your relief, I'll take my coat. No hard feelings

slowbike

kingrollo wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

kingrollo wrote:

Rubbish

Yes, negligence is mentioned several times in the Velo South T&C... however, this is from the organisers' handbook for Audax events, which specifically mentions amber and red warnings as being beyond "contingency plans". I don't think the law applies differently and not all Audax events are 20 riders, LEL is well over a thousand. Yellow warning means: be aware... just that

However, regardless of your contingency plans, there will be occasions when the conditions dictate that it
simply is not possibly to hold your event safely (e.g. Met Office Amber or Red weather warnings) either for
the riders, yourself or your helpers.

If someone got seriously injured and they chose to appoint solicitor to fight there claim - CSM would get no protection in the courts from there terms and conditions.

In a sense its not really the legals - it would be if CSM choose to run and event with a severe weather warning in place would they be able to defend that in court ?

There's also the compassionate reason for canning it - that VS used on their website - given the forecast at the time (thursday night) there was a good chance of it being foul (it was - although not as bad as forecast at the time) and therefore a good chance that they'd have to can it (due to the weather warnings) and ultimately it would be unrideable for many intended participants - and even if it wasnt quite unrideable, it would've been far from pleasant.
They could've held out until Saturday afternoon to call it - but as many of the 15k participants were coming some distance, staying locally and racking up costs - they called it early, to give those participants time to change their plans and potentially save time, effort & money.

Having driven around the area over the weekend - through the heavy rain - I'm glad VS did can it - I think they made the right call - there was standing water & debris all over the more heavily used roads (that I was driving) so the lanes would've been worse. Waking up on Sunday morning - it was cold and wet - that would've resulted in more casualties than usual requiring medical attention due to cold. The standing water & debris would've meant more punctures than on average - and probably more accidents due to the hidden potholes. With a mass start of 15k riders in less than 2 hours - even at a slower speed, there would've been accidents due to lack of space given the conditions.
Whilst I'm sure riders could've done the 100 in the conditions or even worse - it wouldn't have been enjoyable and would've damaged the brand name with calls of "Why didn't they cancel if they knew it was going to be so bad" - because, it's not a mandatory ride - it's a ride for pleasure.

Bottom briquettes

I couldn’t ride the Velo South on Sunday, due to the cancellation, so I did this instead, yesterday.

https://www.relive.cc/view/1863151404

The weather was really nice too.

thegreatdivide

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Rewind 10 years to 2008... ALL sportives but one were run by local clubs for the benefit of cyclists, with no profits associated other than some money for charity. The Dragon Ride was already a "Granfondo" run for money by Mr Lunardi.

The Etape Caledonia started in 2007.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Covered part of this route again yesterday between Rake and South Harting (https://www.strava.com/activities/1873113641), discovered a fairy visit just after climbing West Marden's "wall" (which perhaps was a slow f-visit as I topped up that tyre before going up "Turkey Island") on my newish pair of Rubino Pro G+. The X-Files music started playing, thinking it was sabotage from the SVS group, but it turned out to be a nasty arrow-head shaped bit of flint!

Weather was almost perfect, shame it wasn't something like that last weekend.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Came across this Evans ride over very roughly same territory as Velo South this morning, taking place on March 1st 2019...

https://www.evanscycles.com/evans-cycle ... REF=416089

The route in better detail...
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mi ... 29697&z=12

The only vague bit is the loop between Nursted and Walderton, because in the Q&A it states the route follows a clockwise path. If that's the case on this loop, it will ascend the "Turkey island" cat4 and descend the B2146 cat4 hill back into South Harting.

Most of the route west of Butser Hill are lanes I regularly cover, it's not bad, but I would personally tweak it a bit...
Climb https://www.strava.com/segments/12687584 and then head west to descend Watton Lane
Follow Bigpath lane into Upham, past the Brushmakers Arms and then head north to Baybridge lane

ugo.santalucia

NitrousOxide wrote:

Came across this Evans ride over very roughly same territory as Velo South this morning, taking place on March 1st 2019...

https://www.evanscycles.com/evans-cycle ... REF=416089

The route in better detail...
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mi ... 29697&z=12

The only vague bit is the loop between Nursted and Walderton, because in the Q&A it states the route follows a clockwise path. If that's the case on this loop, it will ascend the "Turkey island" cat4 and descend the B2146 cat4 hill back into South Harting.

Most of the route west of Butser Hill are lanes I regularly cover, it's not bad, but I would personally tweak it a bit...
Climb https://www.strava.com/segments/12687584 and then head west to descend Watton Lane
Follow Bigpath lane into Upham, past the Brushmakers Arms and then head north to Baybridge lane

Sportives in rural areas on the first of March... risk of ice/cancellations and whatnot, I would avoid

dannbodge

That is pretty much perfect route for me.
Nice easy ride up to the start and back.

davep1

NitrousOxide wrote:

Came across this Evans ride over very roughly same territory as Velo South this morning, taking place on March 1st 2019...

https://www.evanscycles.com/evans-cycle ... REF=416089

The route in better detail...
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mi ... 29697&z=12

The only vague bit is the loop between Nursted and Walderton, because in the Q&A it states the route follows a clockwise path. If that's the case on this loop, it will ascend the "Turkey island" cat4 and descend the B2146 cat4 hill back into South Harting.

Most of the route west of Butser Hill are lanes I regularly cover, it's not bad, but I would personally tweak it a bit...
Climb https://www.strava.com/segments/12687584 and then head west to descend Watton Lane
Follow Bigpath lane into Upham, past the Brushmakers Arms and then head north to Baybridge lane

I happened to be out and about that way this year, and may have come across this event. I was heading the opposite way up the hill, and those coming down it were having a bit of a hairy time. Even the main road isn't very wide, and there was traffic around. Add in a few hundred cyclists coming down the hill into the village with a couple of over the shoulder junctions...

shipley

Hurrah it’s back !! Not that I’d do it as it covers my usual routes but watching the ‘resistance’ will be a giggle !!

https://www.wscountytimes.co.uk/news/ca ... -1-8815369

cruff

Shipley wrote:

Hurrah it’s back !! Not that I’d do it as it covers my usual routes but watching the ‘resistance’ will be a giggle !!

https://www.wscountytimes.co.uk/news/ca ... -1-8815369

Doubt it. The nimby vote will win out and - in the unlikely event that the council doesn't collapse in the face of protests - emboldened by the cancellation of the first one (which they will see as a victory despite the official reason being bad weather), and the event not being run this year (which will be seen as further proof that their outrage is working) - and permits the event in 2020, the local gammons will make sure its a disaster. The tide has turned completely against cyclists - I suspect that Ride London and the ToC are next on the hitlist

shipley

Cruff wrote:

Shipley wrote:

Hurrah it’s back !! Not that I’d do it as it covers my usual routes but watching the ‘resistance’ will be a giggle !!

https://www.wscountytimes.co.uk/news/ca ... -1-8815369

Doubt it. The nimby vote will win out and - in the unlikely event that the council doesn't collapse in the face of protests - emboldened by the cancellation of the first one (which they will see as a victory despite the official reason being bad weather), and the event not being run this year (which will be seen as further proof that their outrage is working) - and permits the event in 2020, the local gammons will make sure its a disaster. The tide has turned completely against cyclists - I suspect that Ride London and the ToC are next on the hitlist

I agree - but I’m looking forward to hearing the ludicrous debate. Hope it’s gets canned early rather than later as the locals have only just stopped revolting resulting in more polite driving. It was getting a bit hairy when the complaints were at their worst just before last years event was conveniently cancelled due to adverse weather.

kingrollo

Hope it goes ahead - doubt I will be riding it due to injury - and the surprise Resurrection of velo Birmingham