Cycling & weight training

briantrumpet

sungod wrote:

briantrumpet wrote:

And your point?

a point? in this plaice?

Fair point. Dash. I'll stop.

kingrollo

My experience is that weight training directly won't make you faster.

But for me the increased core, hamstring, and glute strength has meant I can be comfortable on a bike for longer - which means you can train longer.....and get faster....

Stretching is must - remember to hold the hamstring stretch for at least 30 secs ....x 3

Sleeper Service

So, yeah, anyway... weight training and cycling.

At the age of 47 I find both useful, particularly after many years of damaging myself playing rugby. Personally I'll vary what I'm doing depending on the season - when it's baltic and icy out there I'll do more weights. When it's scorchio I'll do more cycling.

I usually stick to a simple program like Wendler's 531 which focuses on big compound lifts because:

1) Spending more than an hour in the gym is boring.
2) At the beginner and intermediate stage (and beginners should look at Starting Strength or Stronglifts) you get most return from these exercises.
3) You can vary them so you do them anything from 2 to 4 times a week depending on how treacherous the weather is.

I wouldn't do squats or deadlifts before a long ride though. That would be silly.

webboo

Milemuncher1 wrote:

diy wrote:

blessings and cod pieces aside. You do need to stretch. Surely that isn't up for debate

It doesn't have to take long.

Very good point. Stretch before, and after the ride. I know a fair few noobies who neglect the post ride stretch.

I see again that you offer advice against the majority of current research in regard to what's best in training.
The idea of stretching before exercise is the best way to injure yourself.

pinno

Warm up before, stretch afterwards.

On a Turbo Trainer, 2 minutes spin at a low resistance at max. rpm for example.
Low gear high revs whilst out on your bike for the first x as a percentage of y.

x = minutes
y = ride length.

A physio friend told me 20 second holds for stretching but we're all different.

Sleeper Service

Webboo wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

diy wrote:

blessings and cod pieces aside. You do need to stretch. Surely that isn't up for debate

It doesn't have to take long.

Very good point. Stretch before, and after the ride. I know a fair few noobies who neglect the post ride stretch.

I see again that you offer advice against the majority of current research in regard to what's best in training.
The idea of stretching before exercise is the best way to injure yourself.

Static stretching maybe. Dynamic stretching is good.

briantrumpet

One does find the weirdest things on the internet...



I reckon he's trying to grow big mussels.

milemuncher1

Sleeper Service wrote:

Webboo wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

diy wrote:

blessings and cod pieces aside. You do need to stretch. Surely that isn't up for debate

It doesn't have to take long.

Very good point. Stretch before, and after the ride. I know a fair few noobies who neglect the post ride stretch.

I see again that you offer advice against the majority of current research in regard to what's best in training.
The idea of stretching before exercise is the best way to injure yourself.

Static stretching maybe. Dynamic stretching is good.

Correct.

Eebijeebi

There are those who love to cycle but don't like the physique of a 'proper' cyclist? Spaghetti arms and Popeye thighs aren't for us all. We realise that we may never reach our full cycling potential as a result - but it doesn't negate the enjoyment, not that that's really part of the argument.
From a general health and fitness point of view however, always training the same muscles in (pretty much) the same way, i.e. just riding your bike whilst ignoring all the other associated muscles can't be good for you overall, even if it is the best way to develop the muscles required for cycling. Anyone who participates in another sport or has a physical job may well agree and I suspect many cyclist related ailments/injuries may result from lack of muscle balance, especially around the legs and core, which don't necessarily manifest themselves whilst actually being perched on the bike.
Case study self - after getting back to all round weight training almost 3 years after getting back into cycling, some of that has made a difference. Core and lower back are now less 'at risk' of injury, hamstrings are more comfortable. Not saying it's made me any faster on the bike but certainly more comfortable and for longer and more comfortable in recovery and other physical activity. That is a definite improvement over 'just riding'. I accept that there will also be non-cycling muscle weight that will be detrimental to power/weight ratio as my excercises aren't 'cycling specific' only, but each to their own.

pinno

^ You don't actually expect anyone to listen to sensible stuff do you?!

Eebijeebi

Pinno wrote:

^ You don't actually expect anyone to listen to sensible stuff do you?!

No, I'm sure the self appointed masters of the sweeping statement will tear me to shreds.

pinno

Eebijeebi wrote:

Pinno wrote:

^ You don't actually expect anyone to listen to sensible stuff do you?!

No, I'm sure the self appointed masters of the sweeping statement will tear me to shreds.

I wouldn't worry, the clocks go forward soon and the protagonists of the sweeping statement will be out on their bikes/in the gym attempting to prove themselves right.

ddraver

Eebijeebi wrote:

good stuff

Yehbut.....what fish are you?

pinno

ddraver wrote:

Eebijeebi wrote:

good stuff

Yehbut.....what fish are you?

Perhaps he needs to be initiated. Is he aware of the fish list?

milemuncher1

Eebijeebi wrote:

There are those who love to cycle but don't like the physique of a 'proper' cyclist? Spaghetti arms and Popeye thighs aren't for us all. We realise that we may never reach our full cycling potential as a result - but it doesn't negate the enjoyment, not that that's really part of the argument.
From a general health and fitness point of view however, always training the same muscles in (pretty much) the same way, i.e. just riding your bike whilst ignoring all the other associated muscles can't be good for you overall, even if it is the best way to develop the muscles required for cycling. Anyone who participates in another sport or has a physical job may well agree and I suspect many cyclist related ailments/injuries may result from lack of muscle balance, especially around the legs and core, which don't necessarily manifest themselves whilst actually being perched on the bike.
Case study self - after getting back to all round weight training almost 3 years after getting back into cycling, some of that has made a difference. Core and lower back are now less 'at risk' of injury, hamstrings are more comfortable. Not saying it's made me any faster on the bike but certainly more comfortable and for longer and more comfortable in recovery and other physical activity. That is a definite improvement over 'just riding'. I accept that there will also be non-cycling muscle weight that will be detrimental to power/weight ratio as my excercises aren't 'cycling specific' only, but each to their own.

I made the mistake of training in such a way as to end up with a 'cyclist shape' last year. Someone described me as "A.I.D.S.y" I decided that probably wasn't actually a good thing. So I changed the balance of riding - gym stuff, and now I'm less 'AIDSy'.

Tom Dean

Nice. Now you can feel superior to people who kick your arse in bike races!

pinno

***THREAD CROSSOVER ALERT*** ***THREAD CROSSOVER ALERT***

iI'm not posting this twice.

viewtopic.php?f=40020&t=13061324&e=1&view=unread#p19829432

milemuncher1

Tom Dean wrote:

Nice. Now you can feel superior to people who kick your ars* in bike races!

Fortunately, that is a joy I will never have to experience. Racing isn't for me.

imposter2.0

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Tom Dean wrote:

Nice. Now you can feel superior to people who kick your ars* in bike races!

Fortunately, that is a joy I will never have to experience. Racing isn't for me.

Don't knock it 'til you've tried it...?

homers_double

I've tried enduro MTB racing and took it for what it was. We were never going to win but being in the mix of it all was good and does make you push harder.

diy

An interesting read on the subject of weight loss and performance.
http://www.usacycling.org/how-important ... entage.htm

pinno

diy wrote:

An interesting read on the subject of weight loss and performance.
http://www.usacycling.org/how-important ... entage.htm

The author emphasises the danger of being dehydrated as a sign of weight loss but he doesn't actually say that loosing weight is detrimental to performance. He balances the weight loss with lean muscle gain, CV fitness, body fat index and nutrition but he is more or less saying don't be underweight.

AndyEd

Reminder that caps lock is banned on the forums. We don't permit shouting at other members.

Thigh_burn

At the risk of reigniting the off-topic cr@p up-thread, I just wanted to revisit this topic.

I'm a few months in now and personally find the combination of weight training/conditioning and cycling has done wonders for me. Again to reiterate what I said in my original post, I'm not looking to become the world's best or slimmest cyclist. I fully get that for people utterly dedicated to cycling, focusing heavily on weights isn't ideal and the more time on the bike, the better.

But in terms of all round health and well-being, it's done me the world of good. I can't put numbers on it, but I have lost a lot of fat over the past few months, got better body definition (although still leaves a lot to be desired) and feel generally very good. That's it for now.

Rb5_turbo

Hi I road raced for years and still ride a fair bit but for fitness. When racing I was 6 foot (still am actually) and 12 stone so slim so I decided I wanted wider shoulders than my waist.

1 year later I do all the body weight exercises (13 stone now) and I have a 32 inch waist!

The key really is if you want to compete at road racing heavy lifting will hurt your cycling as muscle weighs more than fat etc but if you want to be fit with some muscle shape then I believe you can train hard in the gym and still be able to get around on a bike at a fair lick.

I trained the Arnold way, classic chest/shoulders etc and built up to heavy sets e.g. now on the bench I do after warm up:

Flat bench - 70kg - 3 * 8 reps, Decline bench- 65kg - 3 * 8, Incline Flys - 17.5kg 3 * 10, Incline Dumb Bell - 25kg 3 * 8, dropset to failure 25kg each arm on seated chest dropping 5kg each side no rest and then finisher - press-ups 2 sets to failure with 60 sec rest

I do Shoulders, arms, back etc on different days with 100 ish miles a week on the bike.

The great news downhill I am a lot faster!!