Donald Trump

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  • elbowloh
    elbowloh Posts: 7,078
    kingstongraham said:

    Pross said:

    swjohnsey said:

    The election turns on Nevada. Trump still still stands a slim chance of pulling it off as many of the uncounted votes are from rural counties and likely to go Republican. If Biden wins Nevada the election is in the bag as he will have the requisite 270 electoral votes.

    When you look at a map of the counties of the U.S. you see a sea of red (Republican) and a few blue (Democrat) dots. The blue dots are cities. Blacks and Hispanics who make up about 1/3rd of the population are drawn to cities. Blacks vote Democrat over 90%, Hispanics probably 80%. In the 2016 election, Clinton won the popular vote and 487 counties. Trump won 2,626 counties.

    It looks like the senate will remain in Republican control. Republicans picked up strength in the house. As was demonstrated by the Democrats with the Trump administration, not much can happen without the cooperation of the other party. The president has very limited powers. He can't spend a dime that has not been appropriated by congress. Congress can't appropriate any money without the consent of the senate.

    So being President is basically pointless unless you have the Senate and Congress? That would explain why Trump doesn't seem overly bothered by the prospect of losing.
    Senate and presidency is most vital to what Trump/McConnell were doing. The judges are proposed by the president and approved by the senate into lifetime appointments - the house isn't involved. If you mould the judiciary to your view of how laws should be interpreted, then you mould the country for years to come. This is why McConnell did not allow a senate vote on so many judicial vacancies when Obama was in power - he saved them up.

    That said, Trump couldn't get his act together to pass anything much except for tax cuts, even when he did have house and senate for two years.
    [engage sarcasm mode] He did appropriate defense funds to build miles and miles of the border wall with Mexico.
    Felt F1 2014
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  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    elbowloh said:

    kingstongraham said:

    Pross said:

    swjohnsey said:

    The election turns on Nevada. Trump still still stands a slim chance of pulling it off as many of the uncounted votes are from rural counties and likely to go Republican. If Biden wins Nevada the election is in the bag as he will have the requisite 270 electoral votes.

    When you look at a map of the counties of the U.S. you see a sea of red (Republican) and a few blue (Democrat) dots. The blue dots are cities. Blacks and Hispanics who make up about 1/3rd of the population are drawn to cities. Blacks vote Democrat over 90%, Hispanics probably 80%. In the 2016 election, Clinton won the popular vote and 487 counties. Trump won 2,626 counties.

    It looks like the senate will remain in Republican control. Republicans picked up strength in the house. As was demonstrated by the Democrats with the Trump administration, not much can happen without the cooperation of the other party. The president has very limited powers. He can't spend a dime that has not been appropriated by congress. Congress can't appropriate any money without the consent of the senate.

    So being President is basically pointless unless you have the Senate and Congress? That would explain why Trump doesn't seem overly bothered by the prospect of losing.
    Senate and presidency is most vital to what Trump/McConnell were doing. The judges are proposed by the president and approved by the senate into lifetime appointments - the house isn't involved. If you mould the judiciary to your view of how laws should be interpreted, then you mould the country for years to come. This is why McConnell did not allow a senate vote on so many judicial vacancies when Obama was in power - he saved them up.

    That said, Trump couldn't get his act together to pass anything much except for tax cuts, even when he did have house and senate for two years.
    [engage sarcasm mode] He did appropriate defense funds to build repairmiles and miles of the existing border wall with Mexico.
    That's better....

    Are these defense funds for the same "defense" that employs the people who's absentee votes he is currently trying to prevent from being counted?

  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?
    left the forum March 2023
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,328
    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?

    If that is to be the only choices then without doubt it would be option B.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • Dorset_Boy
    Dorset_Boy Posts: 7,560
    First A - do you think Trump has destabilised the situation between North & South Korea, or had the reverse effect?
    I'd also say that he's had less impact on the stability of the world than any POTUS in the last 30 years. Most of his predecessors have gone to war or cocked up foreign policy completely, that has then led to conflict and instability.
    His environmental views however...
  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195
    Probably the latter. He has said as much on record.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,152
    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?

    Depends. If he loses Arizona, Nevada, Georgia and Pennsylvania, it's over and he won't get the support to carry on. If he somehow wins Arizona and Nevada, I think he'll keep up the fight to try and take back Pennsylvania.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,312
    kingstongraham said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?

    Depends. If he loses Arizona, Nevada, Georgia and Pennsylvania, it's over and he won't get the support to carry on. If he somehow wins Arizona and Nevada, I think he'll keep up the fight to try and take back Pennsylvania.
    He has lost Arizona, no doubt about it... I don't see why he should lose PA, seeing he has a sizeable lead with 91% of the votes in.
    left the forum March 2023
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,152
    ugo.santalucia said:

    kingstongraham said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?

    Depends. If he loses Arizona, Nevada, Georgia and Pennsylvania, it's over and he won't get the support to carry on. If he somehow wins Arizona and Nevada, I think he'll keep up the fight to try and take back Pennsylvania.
    He has lost Arizona, no doubt about it... I don't see why he should lose PA, seeing he has a sizeable lead with 91% of the votes in.
    The votes still to count in Pennsylvania come from really, really Democrat areas, and are postal votes which skew even more Democrat. The last batch to be declared were 92% Biden. Biden is quite likely to win there.

    Arizona could slightly possibly still go Trump for the same reason in reverse, but much less likely.
  • Ben6899
    Ben6899 Posts: 9,686
    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?


    B. Iranian Embassy style.
    Ben

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  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    Dorset_Boy said:

    First A - do you think Trump has destabilised the situation between North & South Korea, or had the reverse effect?
    I'd also say that he's had less impact on the stability of the world than any POTUS in the last 30 years. Most of his predecessors have gone to war or cocked up foreign policy completely, that has then led to conflict and instability.
    His environmental views however...

    I did say do everything in his power... This is a luck/good judgement thing. He has had nothing globally to react to, really. No foreign invasions to try to wade in on. No huge terrorism attacks - nust little ones in places like Europe that no one cares about.

    His Russian fratternizing is probably empowering that regime for some time to come. Time will tell how his actions in the middle east will pan out. He hasnt exactly damped down tensions with Palestine, or done much for relations with Iran. And I would argue he has legitimized the N Korean regime. Not sure how that has played in the south.
  • darkhairedlord
    darkhairedlord Posts: 7,180
    kingstongraham said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    kingstongraham said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?

    Depends. If he loses Arizona, Nevada, Georgia and Pennsylvania, it's over and he won't get the support to carry on. If he somehow wins Arizona and Nevada, I think he'll keep up the fight to try and take back Pennsylvania.
    He has lost Arizona, no doubt about it... I don't see why he should lose PA, seeing he has a sizeable lead with 91% of the votes in.
    The votes still to count in Pennsylvania come from really, really Democrat areas, and are postal votes which skew even more Democrat. The last batch to be declared were 92% Biden. Biden is quite likely to win there.

    Arizona could slightly possibly still go Trump for the same reason in reverse, but much less likely.
    And just wind up trump, the number of votes still to be counted in PA also goes up as another truck full arrives.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Dorset_Boy said:

    First A - do you think Trump has destabilised the situation between North & South Korea, or had the reverse effect?
    I'd also say that he's had less impact on the stability of the world than any POTUS in the last 30 years. Most of his predecessors have gone to war or cocked up foreign policy completely, that has then led to conflict and instability.
    His environmental views however...

    He’s mainly destabilised his own country.

    The withdrawal from Syria was disgraceful.

    He let Russia off the hook for meddling in the US election

    He has withdrawn troops from Germany and has likely fatally wounded nato as a serious force.

    He gave credibility to Kim who is a murderous despot.

    His trade wars have materially hurt global trade and has been a drag on global growth.

    So yes he didn’t play world police but his FP record is hardly glowing
    _
  • capt_slog
    capt_slog Posts: 3,974
    Ben6899 said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?


    B. Iranian Embassy style.
    I'd buy a ticket to see that.


    The older I get, the better I was.

  • swjohnsey
    swjohnsey Posts: 263
    First.Aspect said:

    swjohnsey said:

    Pross said:

    swjohnsey said:

    The election turns on Nevada. Trump still still stands a slim chance of pulling it off as many of the uncounted votes are from rural counties and likely to go Republican. If Biden wins Nevada the election is in the bag as he will have the requisite 270 electoral votes.

    When you look at a map of the counties of the U.S. you see a sea of red (Republican) and a few blue (Democrat) dots. The blue dots are cities. Blacks and Hispanics who make up about 1/3rd of the population are drawn to cities. Blacks vote Democrat over 90%, Hispanics probably 80%. In the 2016 election, Clinton won the popular vote and 487 counties. Trump won 2,626 counties.

    It looks like the senate will remain in Republican control. Republicans picked up strength in the house. As was demonstrated by the Democrats with the Trump administration, not much can happen without the cooperation of the other party. The president has very limited powers. He can't spend a dime that has not been appropriated by congress. Congress can't appropriate any money without the consent of the senate.

    So being President is basically pointless unless you have the Senate and Congress? That would explain why Trump doesn't seem overly bothered by the prospect of losing.
    Being president is cool. You get to live in a big house for free, private security, they play music when you enter the room. The president is the chief executive officer, he executes policies established by the legislature. I wonder what would happen if the senate just refused to confirm any of Biden's appointments should he be elected?
    I think the point is that he won't be doing his best to destroy the global environment or destabilise every part of the world he's actually heard of. Your supreme court tends not to matter outside of the US, although I do feel bad for you.

    Btw although democratic representation by square mile (or by county) is an interesting concept, you do understand that more people live in cities than don't right?
    Yep, you understand that the states elect the president and not the people, right?
  • mrb123
    mrb123 Posts: 4,815
    I keep seeing stories such as "60,000 votes left to count in Georgia".

    If they haven't counted them, how do they know???
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,328
    Biden only needs 17 now to win.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • swjohnsey
    swjohnsey Posts: 263
    mrb123 said:

    I keep seeing stories such as "60,000 votes left to count in Georgia".

    If they haven't counted them, how do they know???

    If someone is ahead by 60,001 votes and there are 60,000 votes to count.
  • pangolin
    pangolin Posts: 6,648
    swjohnsey said:

    mrb123 said:

    I keep seeing stories such as "60,000 votes left to count in Georgia".

    If they haven't counted them, how do they know???

    If someone is ahead by 60,001 votes and there are 60,000 votes to count.
    Eh?
    - Genesis Croix de Fer
    - Dolan Tuono
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,436
    mrb123 said:

    I keep seeing stories such as "60,000 votes left to count in Georgia".

    If they haven't counted them, how do they know???

    In think 'left to count' means open, verify and process through the counting machines.

    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    swjohnsey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    swjohnsey said:

    Pross said:

    swjohnsey said:

    The election turns on Nevada. Trump still still stands a slim chance of pulling it off as many of the uncounted votes are from rural counties and likely to go Republican. If Biden wins Nevada the election is in the bag as he will have the requisite 270 electoral votes.

    When you look at a map of the counties of the U.S. you see a sea of red (Republican) and a few blue (Democrat) dots. The blue dots are cities. Blacks and Hispanics who make up about 1/3rd of the population are drawn to cities. Blacks vote Democrat over 90%, Hispanics probably 80%. In the 2016 election, Clinton won the popular vote and 487 counties. Trump won 2,626 counties.

    It looks like the senate will remain in Republican control. Republicans picked up strength in the house. As was demonstrated by the Democrats with the Trump administration, not much can happen without the cooperation of the other party. The president has very limited powers. He can't spend a dime that has not been appropriated by congress. Congress can't appropriate any money without the consent of the senate.

    So being President is basically pointless unless you have the Senate and Congress? That would explain why Trump doesn't seem overly bothered by the prospect of losing.
    Being president is cool. You get to live in a big house for free, private security, they play music when you enter the room. The president is the chief executive officer, he executes policies established by the legislature. I wonder what would happen if the senate just refused to confirm any of Biden's appointments should he be elected?
    I think the point is that he won't be doing his best to destroy the global environment or destabilise every part of the world he's actually heard of. Your supreme court tends not to matter outside of the US, although I do feel bad for you.

    Btw although democratic representation by square mile (or by county) is an interesting concept, you do understand that more people live in cities than don't right?
    Yep, you understand that the states elect the president and not the people, right?
    Ah, this must be clever in some way.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    mrb123 said:

    I keep seeing stories such as "60,000 votes left to count in Georgia".

    If they haven't counted them, how do they know???

    Voter registration records. It is a bit more rigorous than an internet poll, you see.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,152
    Nevada moves further towards Biden. Nate Silver says it is almost callable, but won't be called by networks that have already called Arizona, because Arizona isn't quite as sure, and calling both for Biden means it would be over.... which it isn't.
  • swjohnsey
    swjohnsey Posts: 263
    First.Aspect said:

    mrb123 said:

    I keep seeing stories such as "60,000 votes left to count in Georgia".

    If they haven't counted them, how do they know???

    Voter registration records. It is a bit more rigorous than an internet poll, you see.
    Has nothing to do with voter registration records. The number of votes/voters is tallied as they present themselves or a mail-in ballot is received. In the case of an in person voter the vote is actually counted after the polls close.
  • swjohnsey
    swjohnsey Posts: 263
    First.Aspect said:

    swjohnsey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    swjohnsey said:

    Pross said:

    swjohnsey said:

    The election turns on Nevada. Trump still still stands a slim chance of pulling it off as many of the uncounted votes are from rural counties and likely to go Republican. If Biden wins Nevada the election is in the bag as he will have the requisite 270 electoral votes.

    When you look at a map of the counties of the U.S. you see a sea of red (Republican) and a few blue (Democrat) dots. The blue dots are cities. Blacks and Hispanics who make up about 1/3rd of the population are drawn to cities. Blacks vote Democrat over 90%, Hispanics probably 80%. In the 2016 election, Clinton won the popular vote and 487 counties. Trump won 2,626 counties.

    It looks like the senate will remain in Republican control. Republicans picked up strength in the house. As was demonstrated by the Democrats with the Trump administration, not much can happen without the cooperation of the other party. The president has very limited powers. He can't spend a dime that has not been appropriated by congress. Congress can't appropriate any money without the consent of the senate.

    So being President is basically pointless unless you have the Senate and Congress? That would explain why Trump doesn't seem overly bothered by the prospect of losing.
    Being president is cool. You get to live in a big house for free, private security, they play music when you enter the room. The president is the chief executive officer, he executes policies established by the legislature. I wonder what would happen if the senate just refused to confirm any of Biden's appointments should he be elected?
    I think the point is that he won't be doing his best to destroy the global environment or destabilise every part of the world he's actually heard of. Your supreme court tends not to matter outside of the US, although I do feel bad for you.

    Btw although democratic representation by square mile (or by county) is an interesting concept, you do understand that more people live in cities than don't right?
    Yep, you understand that the states elect the president and not the people, right?
    Ah, this must be clever in some way.
    Ask you mother.
  • webboo
    webboo Posts: 6,087
    blazing_saddles said:

    Got sent to me this morning.
    I am looking to seriously lower the quality of input to this thread. One voters viewpoint with suitably eloquent oration.
    (in other words, not for the easily offended)

    If the Democrats had only picked this guy to run against combover man. They would have walked it.
  • bobmcstuff
    bobmcstuff Posts: 11,435
    kingstongraham said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    kingstongraham said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    So what's the outcome then... is he going to concede grumbling about the injustice of the postal vote, or will he be forcibly removed after weeks of this nonsensical saga?

    Depends. If he loses Arizona, Nevada, Georgia and Pennsylvania, it's over and he won't get the support to carry on. If he somehow wins Arizona and Nevada, I think he'll keep up the fight to try and take back Pennsylvania.
    He has lost Arizona, no doubt about it... I don't see why he should lose PA, seeing he has a sizeable lead with 91% of the votes in.
    The votes still to count in Pennsylvania come from really, really Democrat areas, and are postal votes which skew even more Democrat. The last batch to be declared were 92% Biden. Biden is quite likely to win there.

    Arizona could slightly possibly still go Trump for the same reason in reverse, but much less likely.
    Yeah PA has been looking very good for Biden since yesterday - right now it is almost a dead cert. He needs 60% of the remaining votes to come in for him and they have been running closer to 80% - it might not even end up being close in the end.

    Georgia is right down to the wire though, it's extremely close. About 60k left to count with Trump 11.4k in the lead, as with PA most outstanding votes have been very Democrat leaning. One to watch (and we are expecting a result today).

    There's no "fight to take back Pennsylvania" that makes any real sense anyway - they were previously wrangling over votes arrived after election day (but postmarked on or before) before, but the votes they're counting now still all arrived in time.

    IMV the lawsuits he's putting in now are just so he can turn around and say he's been robbed later.

    Also, the BBC coverage has been rubbish.
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,436

    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    To help Swohnsey understand, in the UK Northern England has vast swathes of blue on election maps (as you know blue is conservative) but if you give each constituency the same size the North becomes red. More labour voting constituencies but the Tory voting areas are large and mostly empty. Of course the last GE kind of messed that usual situation up a bit courtesy of Corbyn.

    I think back to claimed homeland colours on the map doesn't relate to the actual popular vote. Or at least you can't rely on it. Of course popular vote doesn't elect the president AIUI it's just the means that the electoral college uses to allocate state votes on a state wide FPTP system in each state.

    It would be very interesting if the pact to use the electoral college vote system to allocate according to the popular vote ever gains traction? Imagine if it had been in place 2016. No trump presidency. Will it ever happen though?

    Anyone see Guiliani, trump jr,a huge bruiser of a suit and a bus load of other suits march past the cameras in PA to try and stop the count? Funny!
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    swjohnsey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    swjohnsey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    swjohnsey said:

    Pross said:

    swjohnsey said:

    The election turns on Nevada. Trump still still stands a slim chance of pulling it off as many of the uncounted votes are from rural counties and likely to go Republican. If Biden wins Nevada the election is in the bag as he will have the requisite 270 electoral votes.

    When you look at a map of the counties of the U.S. you see a sea of red (Republican) and a few blue (Democrat) dots. The blue dots are cities. Blacks and Hispanics who make up about 1/3rd of the population are drawn to cities. Blacks vote Democrat over 90%, Hispanics probably 80%. In the 2016 election, Clinton won the popular vote and 487 counties. Trump won 2,626 counties.

    It looks like the senate will remain in Republican control. Republicans picked up strength in the house. As was demonstrated by the Democrats with the Trump administration, not much can happen without the cooperation of the other party. The president has very limited powers. He can't spend a dime that has not been appropriated by congress. Congress can't appropriate any money without the consent of the senate.

    So being President is basically pointless unless you have the Senate and Congress? That would explain why Trump doesn't seem overly bothered by the prospect of losing.
    Being president is cool. You get to live in a big house for free, private security, they play music when you enter the room. The president is the chief executive officer, he executes policies established by the legislature. I wonder what would happen if the senate just refused to confirm any of Biden's appointments should he be elected?
    I think the point is that he won't be doing his best to destroy the global environment or destabilise every part of the world he's actually heard of. Your supreme court tends not to matter outside of the US, although I do feel bad for you.

    Btw although democratic representation by square mile (or by county) is an interesting concept, you do understand that more people live in cities than don't right?
    Yep, you understand that the states elect the president and not the people, right?
    Ah, this must be clever in some way.
    Ask you mother.
    If you were a real person I'd be very upset.

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