Donald Trump

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  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,288
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    If we ignored Trump, globally, he'd shrivel up and die. FACT.
    Trump played CNN yesterday, in wanting to upstage pelosis's signing in he call a press briefing (in which it's usual to answer questions), the 3 main news channels CNN, MSNBC and Fox started broadcasting it, as usual MSNBC who have said they will not have Trump propaganda on, cut off as soon as trump got border guards on stage to praise him and his wall. CNN and as you'd expect Fox stayed with it. CNN expecting to ask questions were shocked when he walked out without answering questions. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't.
    It's good ratings, innit?

    There's the whole complicity in the press & Trump: he's good box office (and he knows it), and so they hide behind calling it 'reporting' when they report his delusions and lies, as if his words actually have any meaning, (other than proving he's unfit to be President). Someone like Maggie 'Duranty' Haberman is a prime example, but they are all treating it like showbusiness. I'd love Chris Morris to do a "The Day Today" take on what the US media has become under Drumpf.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    If we ignored Trump, globally, he'd shrivel up and die. FACT.
    Trump played CNN yesterday, in wanting to upstage pelosis's signing in he call a press briefing (in which it's usual to answer questions), the 3 main news channels CNN, MSNBC and Fox started broadcasting it, as usual MSNBC who have said they will not have Trump propaganda on, cut off as soon as trump got border guards on stage to praise him and his wall. CNN and as you'd expect Fox stayed with it. CNN expecting to ask questions were shocked when he walked out without answering questions. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't.
    It's good ratings, innit?

    There's the whole complicity in the press & Trump: he's good box office (and he knows it), and so they hide behind calling it 'reporting' when they report his delusions and lies, as if his words actually have any meaning, (other than proving he's unfit to be President). Someone like Maggie 'Duranty' Haberman is a prime example, but they are all treating it like showbusiness. I'd love Chris Morris to do a "The Day Today" take on what the US media has become under Drumpf.
    Not sure why you mean, 24 hour news stations have and will always report on politics, Trump just adds a whole new dimension to report on. Fox in favour (generally) MSNBC and CNN call him out. It's the US they do things differently over there. The worse thing they could possibly do is ignore him.
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,107
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    If we ignored Trump, globally, he'd shrivel up and die. FACT.
    Trump played CNN yesterday, in wanting to upstage pelosis's signing in he call a press briefing (in which it's usual to answer questions), the 3 main news channels CNN, MSNBC and Fox started broadcasting it, as usual MSNBC who have said they will not have Trump propaganda on, cut off as soon as trump got border guards on stage to praise him and his wall. CNN and as you'd expect Fox stayed with it. CNN expecting to ask questions were shocked when he walked out without answering questions. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't.
    It's good ratings, innit?

    There's the whole complicity in the press & Trump: he's good box office (and he knows it), and so they hide behind calling it 'reporting' when they report his delusions and lies, as if his words actually have any meaning, (other than proving he's unfit to be President). Someone like Maggie 'Duranty' Haberman is a prime example, but they are all treating it like showbusiness. I'd love Chris Morris to do a "The Day Today" take on what the US media has become under Drumpf.

    Are you criticising Haberman, the White House correspondent, for reporting what the President says?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/22/us/p ... years.html
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,288
    KingstonGraham wrote:
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    If we ignored Trump, globally, he'd shrivel up and die. FACT.
    Trump played CNN yesterday, in wanting to upstage pelosis's signing in he call a press briefing (in which it's usual to answer questions), the 3 main news channels CNN, MSNBC and Fox started broadcasting it, as usual MSNBC who have said they will not have Trump propaganda on, cut off as soon as trump got border guards on stage to praise him and his wall. CNN and as you'd expect Fox stayed with it. CNN expecting to ask questions were shocked when he walked out without answering questions. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't.
    It's good ratings, innit?

    There's the whole complicity in the press & Trump: he's good box office (and he knows it), and so they hide behind calling it 'reporting' when they report his delusions and lies, as if his words actually have any meaning, (other than proving he's unfit to be President). Someone like Maggie 'Duranty' Haberman is a prime example, but they are all treating it like showbusiness. I'd love Chris Morris to do a "The Day Today" take on what the US media has become under Drumpf.

    Are you criticising Haberman, the White House correspondent, for reporting what the President says?

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/22/us/p ... years.html
    At the risk of seeing stuff that isn't there... https://medium.com/@JamesFourM/maggie-d ... c8e85c5e88
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,288
    bianchimoon wrote:
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    If we ignored Trump, globally, he'd shrivel up and die. FACT.
    Trump played CNN yesterday, in wanting to upstage pelosis's signing in he call a press briefing (in which it's usual to answer questions), the 3 main news channels CNN, MSNBC and Fox started broadcasting it, as usual MSNBC who have said they will not have Trump propaganda on, cut off as soon as trump got border guards on stage to praise him and his wall. CNN and as you'd expect Fox stayed with it. CNN expecting to ask questions were shocked when he walked out without answering questions. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't.
    It's good ratings, innit?

    There's the whole complicity in the press & Trump: he's good box office (and he knows it), and so they hide behind calling it 'reporting' when they report his delusions and lies, as if his words actually have any meaning, (other than proving he's unfit to be President). Someone like Maggie 'Duranty' Haberman is a prime example, but they are all treating it like showbusiness. I'd love Chris Morris to do a "The Day Today" take on what the US media has become under Drumpf.
    Not sure why you mean, 24 hour news stations have and will always report on politics, Trump just adds a whole new dimension to report on. Fox in favour (generally) MSNBC and CNN call him out. It's the US they do things differently over there. The worse thing they could possibly do is ignore him.
    They could refuse to go to the White House 'press briefings' (aka Sarah HS spouting lies or Trump spewing propaganda); they could refuse to report "Trump claims that" when they know they are provable lies, and so on, but that wouldn't fill the airtime. All news organisations want conflict and controversy, not just to fill the airtime, but to get the ratings. It's all showbiz, and in providing that never-ending entertainment, they (and the viewers who keep watching and reading) are complicit in the debasement of democracy.

    I agree, they can't win. It's like terrorism: you can't not report an atrocity, but by reporting and using it for horror-entertainment for the public, they are complicit in the terrorism.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    If we ignored Trump, globally, he'd shrivel up and die. FACT.
    Trump played CNN yesterday, in wanting to upstage pelosis's signing in he call a press briefing (in which it's usual to answer questions), the 3 main news channels CNN, MSNBC and Fox started broadcasting it, as usual MSNBC who have said they will not have Trump propaganda on, cut off as soon as trump got border guards on stage to praise him and his wall. CNN and as you'd expect Fox stayed with it. CNN expecting to ask questions were shocked when he walked out without answering questions. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't.
    It's good ratings, innit?

    There's the whole complicity in the press & Trump: he's good box office (and he knows it), and so they hide behind calling it 'reporting' when they report his delusions and lies, as if his words actually have any meaning, (other than proving he's unfit to be President). Someone like Maggie 'Duranty' Haberman is a prime example, but they are all treating it like showbusiness. I'd love Chris Morris to do a "The Day Today" take on what the US media has become under Drumpf.
    Not sure why you mean, 24 hour news stations have and will always report on politics, Trump just adds a whole new dimension to report on. Fox in favour (generally) MSNBC and CNN call him out. It's the US they do things differently over there. The worse thing they could possibly do is ignore him.
    They could refuse to go to the White House 'press briefings' (aka Sarah HS spouting lies or Trump spewing propaganda); they could refuse to report "Trump claims that" when they know they are provable lies, and so on, but that wouldn't fill the airtime. All news organisations want conflict and controversy, not just to fill the airtime, but to get the ratings. It's all showbiz, and in providing that never-ending entertainment, they (and the viewers who keep watching and reading) are complicit in the debasement of democracy.

    I agree, they can't win. It's like terrorism: you can't not report an atrocity, but by reporting and using it for horror-entertainment for the public, they are complicit in the terrorism.
    I think MSNBC have refused to show chuckabee sanders press conferences and also abandoned a live Trump press briefing yesterday also banned Kellyanne Conway from Morning Joe show, got to give them credit they're trying to bring this house of cards down :)
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,288
    bianchimoon wrote:
    I think MSNBC have refused to show chuckabee sanders press conferences and also abandoned a live Trump press briefing yesterday also banned Kellyanne Conway from Morning Joe show, got to give them credit they're trying to bring this house of cards down :)
    Yes, indeed. And ironically, their ratings have gone up, and they've taken the top spot from Fox 'News' :)
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    briantrumpet wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    I think MSNBC have refused to show chuckabee sanders press conferences and also abandoned a live Trump press briefing yesterday also banned Kellyanne Conway from Morning Joe show, got to give them credit they're trying to bring this house of cards down :)
    Yes, indeed. And ironically, their ratings have gone up, and they've taken the top spot from Fox 'News' :)
    win, win :D
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,288
    Bloomin' 'eck, he's getting loopier by the day. He's just going round words he knows in random loops, hoping something comes out that sounds like he's not utterly bonkers. He is. https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1081266758072193024
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • bendertherobot
    bendertherobot Posts: 11,684
    Everything industrial, cruel, polluting, everything in Donald's world is beautiful.
    My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
    https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
    Facebook? No. Just say no.
  • briantrumpet
    briantrumpet Posts: 20,288
    bendertherobot wrote:
    Everything industrial, cruel, polluting, everything in Donald's world is beautiful.
    Don't forget steel, beautiful steel, beautiful steel walls, the beautiful steel industry. It's beautiful. Really.
    https://www.facebook.com/unanglaisendiois
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    bendertherobot wrote:
    Everything industrial, cruel, polluting, everything in Donald's world is beautiful.
    And his sons who shoot elephants for pleasure, the trump dynasty is sick to the core
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • orraloon
    orraloon Posts: 13,227
    End of (Dotard) days.
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    If Berlin can have a wall, why not Trump?

    The_story_of_Berlin_Wall%2B%252818%2529.jpg
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,462
    Robert88 wrote:
    If Berlin can have a wall, why not Trump?

    The_story_of_Berlin_Wall%2B%252818%2529.jpg

    Yep, I can see him going there and making a speech in front of hundreds of thousands of adoring supporters and the world's media, the greatest speech ever by any politician, "ich bin ein San Deigan". The crowd would erupt into cheers.
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    trump-big-brother-7.jpg?1469209355
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,930
    Indeed, he could learn a few things about wall building from us morally superior Europeans couldn't he? Electrified and built by prison labour. that's the way to do it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/r-hunga ... ?r=UK&IR=T
  • bondurant
    bondurant Posts: 858
    I would (comfortably) criticise both Trump's and Hungary's approaches.

    Are you saying that's hypocritical?
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,930
    Bondurant wrote:
    I would (comfortably) criticise both Trump's and Hungary's approaches.

    Are you saying that's hypocritical?

    Obviously if you criticise both equally vehemently, then there is no hypocrisy, but we (collectively, as Europeans) find it fashionable to sneer at Americans and for some reason, consider ourselves morally, a cut above.

    Edit:

    Morally was the wrong word. I do feel that we like to think ourselves more sophisticated though.
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Bondurant wrote:
    I would (comfortably) criticise both Trump's and Hungary's approaches.

    Are you saying that's hypocritical?

    Obviously if you criticise both equally vehemently, then there is no hypocrisy, but we (collectively, as Europeans) find it fashionable to sneer at Americans and for some reason, consider ourselves morally, a cut above.

    Edit:

    Morally was the wrong word. I do feel that we like to think ourselves more sophisticated though.
    Re: sophistication, hardly a high bar set by the current US admin is it?
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,930
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Bondurant wrote:
    I would (comfortably) criticise both Trump's and Hungary's approaches.

    Are you saying that's hypocritical?

    Obviously if you criticise both equally vehemently, then there is no hypocrisy, but we (collectively, as Europeans) find it fashionable to sneer at Americans and for some reason, consider ourselves morally, a cut above.

    Edit:

    Morally was the wrong word. I do feel that we like to think ourselves more sophisticated though.
    Re: sophistication, hardly a high bar set by the current US admin is it?

    No, unfortunately not.
    I was thinking more of the US and Americans in general.
  • bianchimoon
    bianchimoon Posts: 3,942
    Ballysmate wrote:
    bianchimoon wrote:
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Bondurant wrote:
    I would (comfortably) criticise both Trump's and Hungary's approaches.

    Are you saying that's hypocritical?

    Obviously if you criticise both equally vehemently, then there is no hypocrisy, but we (collectively, as Europeans) find it fashionable to sneer at Americans and for some reason, consider ourselves morally, a cut above.

    Edit:

    Morally was the wrong word. I do feel that we like to think ourselves more sophisticated though.
    Re: sophistication, hardly a high bar set by the current US admin is it?

    No, unfortunately not.
    I was thinking more of the US and Americans in general.
    True, but it is a thread about trump, the world is a shit example of ‘sophistication’ which I guess is subjective.
    All lies and jest..still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest....
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Indeed, he could learn a few things about wall building from us morally superior Europeans couldn't he? Electrified and built by prison labour. that's the way to do it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/r-hunga ... ?r=UK&IR=T

    I don't recall Hungary being regarded as the leader of the Western world. When did that happen?

    BREXIT and Trump if anything are breaches in Europe's wall against a fascist revival. Hungary is a signpost on a road back to the bad old days.

    Worse for the UK is the prospect of doing deals with Trump post brexit from a position of weakness.
  • ballysmate
    ballysmate Posts: 15,930
    Robert88 wrote:
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Indeed, he could learn a few things about wall building from us morally superior Europeans couldn't he? Electrified and built by prison labour. that's the way to do it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/r-hunga ... ?r=UK&IR=T

    I don't recall Hungary being regarded as the leader of the Western world. When did that happen?

    BREXIT and Trump if anything are breaches in Europe's wall against a fascist revival. Hungary is a signpost on a road back to the bad old days.

    Worse for the UK is the prospect of doing deals with Trump post brexit from a position of weakness.

    Is there some sort of sliding scale then regarding fencing your border to stop illegal immigrants with powerful countries at one end and poorer countries at the other?
    I made no claims for Hungary at all regarding its leadership credentials.
    People are horrified that Trump wants to build a wall, hold rallies and marches in protest. There are god knows how many column inches in the papers and people even discus it on a cycle forum. Hungary is on our doorstep, so to speak, and as you mention Brexit, is a net recipient of money from the EU and therefore ultimately the UK. Our response to Hungary amounts to a collective shrug.
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Indeed, he could learn a few things about wall building from us morally superior Europeans couldn't he? Electrified and built by prison labour. that's the way to do it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/r-hunga ... ?r=UK&IR=T

    I don't recall Hungary being regarded as the leader of the Western world. When did that happen?

    BREXIT and Trump if anything are breaches in Europe's wall against a fascist revival. Hungary is a signpost on a road back to the bad old days.

    Worse for the UK is the prospect of doing deals with Trump post brexit from a position of weakness.

    Is there some sort of sliding scale then regarding fencing your border to stop illegal immigrants with powerful countries at one end and poorer countries at the other?
    I made no claims for Hungary at all regarding its leadership credentials.
    People are horrified that Trump wants to build a wall, hold rallies and marches in protest. There are god knows how many column inches in the papers and people even discus it on a cycle forum. Hungary is on our doorstep, so to speak, and as you mention Brexit, is a net recipient of money from the EU and therefore ultimately the UK. Our response to Hungary amounts to a collective shrug.

    I think Brexit was our collective shrug.
  • orraloon
    orraloon Posts: 13,227
    dUK has this 21 mile minimum stretch of water, doesn't need a wall / fence. Should geography be different and we remained as in pre Ice Age times land connected to the continent, then I reckon the political clamour for a fence would be just as loud round these parts.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Indeed, he could learn a few things about wall building from us morally superior Europeans couldn't he? Electrified and built by prison labour. that's the way to do it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/r-hunga ... ?r=UK&IR=T

    I don't recall Hungary being regarded as the leader of the Western world. When did that happen?

    BREXIT and Trump if anything are breaches in Europe's wall against a fascist revival. Hungary is a signpost on a road back to the bad old days.

    Worse for the UK is the prospect of doing deals with Trump post brexit from a position of weakness.

    Is there some sort of sliding scale then regarding fencing your border to stop illegal immigrants with powerful countries at one end and poorer countries at the other?
    I made no claims for Hungary at all regarding its leadership credentials.
    People are horrified that Trump wants to build a wall, hold rallies and marches in protest. There are god knows how many column inches in the papers and people even discus it on a cycle forum. Hungary is on our doorstep, so to speak, and as you mention Brexit, is a net recipient of money from the EU and therefore ultimately the UK. Our response to Hungary amounts to a collective shrug.

    Orban is a fascist racist wannabe autocrat with a particular penchant for antisemitism who makes Trump look moderate by comparison.

    He is not however, leader of the world’s most powerful nation, nor is he the topic of the thread.

    Happy?

    Your challenge is why Tory MEPs are in an alliance with his party in the European Parliament.
    _
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,513
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Robert88 wrote:
    Ballysmate wrote:
    Indeed, he could learn a few things about wall building from us morally superior Europeans couldn't he? Electrified and built by prison labour. that's the way to do it.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/r-hunga ... ?r=UK&IR=T

    I don't recall Hungary being regarded as the leader of the Western world. When did that happen?

    BREXIT and Trump if anything are breaches in Europe's wall against a fascist revival. Hungary is a signpost on a road back to the bad old days.

    Worse for the UK is the prospect of doing deals with Trump post brexit from a position of weakness.

    Is there some sort of sliding scale then regarding fencing your border to stop illegal immigrants with powerful countries at one end and poorer countries at the other?
    I made no claims for Hungary at all regarding its leadership credentials.
    People are horrified that Trump wants to build a wall, hold rallies and marches in protest. There are god knows how many column inches in the papers and people even discus it on a cycle forum. Hungary is on our doorstep, so to speak, and as you mention Brexit, is a net recipient of money from the EU and therefore ultimately the UK. Our response to Hungary amounts to a collective shrug.

    They're mostly refugees seeking asylum, not illegal immigrants, for a start. We don't need to look as far away as Hungary to find similar rhetoric to Trump. Our own Home Secretary is at it with his "crisis" of a couple of hundred people spread over a month. There's Lega Nord in Italy, AfD, FN. There's a lot of it about. Not much mention of it on a thread about Trump but they are all quite widely covered in the media.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    orraloon wrote:
    dUK has this 21 mile minimum stretch of water, doesn't need a wall / fence. Should geography be different and we remained as in pre Ice Age times land connected to the continent, then I reckon the political clamour for a fence would be just as loud round these parts.
    Northern Ireland is part of the UK and has a 310 mile border with the Republic of Ireland. That border has some 200 formally recognised border crossings and an estimated double that with the informal crossings points added to that.

    The UK government hasn't bothered looking into that matter but I understand the Republic has been carrying out a survey of the border to try and find that out.

    Of course the French government cuts Calais loose with the agreements over controlling immigration to the UK at their borders then I do wonder what the effect on our border will end up being. Truck drivers and logistics companies getting no help in keeping immigrants off their trucks then still get fines when there's little they can do. Dover might need a big fence around it instead. :wink:
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,107
    The reason the wall funding has been rejected is because:
    - the congressman representing 820 miles of the border has said it's not a good use of money and voted against it. He's a republican.
    - the senate passed a funding bill without it by 100-0 only last month.
    - 94% of border security funding for 2018 has not been spent.
    - it's a symbol of a manufactured crisis.
    - it will make Trump look bad when he eventually caves.

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