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Really?rick_chasey said:Worth remembering Johnson wasn’t so much popular as Corbin was toxic.
A significant minority knew he wasn’t fit for purpose. But to deny he had popular support is an odd claim.0 -
It’s all in the numbers. Approval at election was worse than May etc etcmorstar said:
Really?rick_chasey said:Worth remembering Johnson wasn’t so much popular as Corbin was toxic.
A significant minority knew he wasn’t fit for purpose. But to deny he had popular support is an odd claim.
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https://news.sky.com/story/boris-johnsons-personal-appeal-was-less-important-in-2019-victory-than-many-thought-12598727
A couple illustrative charts there too.
One breaks down some of the demographics and which of those had high approval ratings for him.
We/I know the answer to that, obviously, but when people ask “who was surprised by his behaviour” now you have some data.
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Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
We mustn't forget leftie hypocrisybriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Depending on the outcome of certain investigations, that could be added to Starmers description. Boring and law breaking - what a combination. Just what Labour needsbriantrumpet said:
You left out "law-breaking".Pross said:
I'll take boring over lying narcissist any day.Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Keep clutching at straws. I'm not sure what hold Johnson has got on you... unlike ministers, you don't rely on him for your employment. "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
As opposed to declaring yourselves a low tax govt and whacking on the largest tax take in a generation?0
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Or how about “we’re not racist but we are designing an immigration policy which essentially imprisons asylum seekers unless they’re white ukranians when we’ll make the border police put up “ukranians welcome” flags at the border”
???
Righty hypocrisy is alive and well, Stevo.0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.0 -
The most bizarre thing is that they continue to declare themselves as a low tax Govtrick_chasey said:As opposed to declaring yourselves a low tax govt and whacking on the largest tax take in a generation?
Maybe Starmer could juice up his image by comparing Boris to a trans swimmer?0 -
It's been widely reported that the current immigration policies have led to more multi-cultural immigration than before.rick_chasey said:Or how about “we’re not racist but we are designing an immigration policy which essentially imprisons asylum seekers unless they’re white ukranians when we’ll make the border police put up “ukranians welcome” flags at the border”
???
Righty hypocrisy is alive and well, Stevo.0 -
Are you suggesting the current approach to asylum seekers is not racist? I'd like evidence for that.0
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No, I'm talking about everything other than asylum claims.rick_chasey said:Are you suggesting the current approach to asylum seekers is not racist? I'd like evidence for that.
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I fail to see why anyone would care if a party leader is boring, nobody is asking you to go out on the town with them.
The seats vs votes on the table is strange - both the SNP and the lib dems are predicted to lose votes and gain seats?0 -
So more divisive. A la Trump, Farage, Hitler.rick_chasey said:
It’s all in the numbers. Approval at election was worse than May etc etcmorstar said:
Really?rick_chasey said:Worth remembering Johnson wasn’t so much popular as Corbin was toxic.
A significant minority knew he wasn’t fit for purpose. But to deny he had popular support is an odd claim.
That is not the same as not having popular support.
I think Trump is an absolute disaster. He’s still popular.0 -
I wasn't aware that I was in government? You give me too much credit sometimes Rick. Since when were you opposed to high taxes? You should be voting Tory based on what you've just postedrick_chasey said:As opposed to declaring yourselves a low tax govt and whacking on the largest tax take in a generation?
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Maybe Starmer could really juice up his image by making Labour a low tax partysurrey_commuter said:
The most bizarre thing is that they continue to declare themselves as a low tax Govtrick_chasey said:As opposed to declaring yourselves a low tax govt and whacking on the largest tax take in a generation?
Maybe Starmer could juice up his image by comparing Boris to a trans swimmer?
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you so strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out.0 -
There's a time and a place for both. Tories are usually 180 degrees away from my own view on timing.Stevo_666 said:
I wasn't aware that I was in government? You give me too much credit sometimes Rick. Since when were you opposed to high taxes? You should be voting Tory based on what you've just postedrick_chasey said:As opposed to declaring yourselves a low tax govt and whacking on the largest tax take in a generation?
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Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Exactly. That’s my point. He’s pretty sh1te but nowhere near as sh1te as most of the chancerbriantrumpet said:skyblueamateur said:
Makes you realise how shallow the talent pool of current politicians on all sides are when Milliband looks heavyweight.ddraver said:Is there anyway we could switch to chaos with this guy?
I still don't rate him highly - he's not a natural orator (needs to read his script), and his delivery feels stilted/practised.
For me, definitely. A Keir Starmer led Labour couldn't do any more damage to the economy then this shower have done.Stevo_666 said:
Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?
I would expect a more conciliatory and pragmatic tone with the EU which would ease business fears.
I never thought I'd vote Labour again but then I never expected the Tories to become pound shop Corbyns.0 -
Stevo_666 said:
Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?
I'll vote for however is most likely to give the Tories a kicking, which is probably LDs in East Devon. If the Tories won't get rid of Johnson, then the Tories have to go.
I'd rather be voting for someone because of a broad spectrum of policies I agree with, but politics is broken with Johnson at the helm. Once he's gone, I'll look at their policies.0 -
Ditto. LD are a close second in my constituency. A shame as the MP seems like a decent chap if a little unwilling to stick his head above the parapet.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?
I'll vote for however is most likely to give the Tories a kicking, which is probably LDs in East Devon. If the Tories won't get rid of Johnson, then the Tories have to go.
I'd rather be voting for someone because of a broad spectrum of policies I agree with, but politics is broken with Johnson at the helm. Once he's gone, I'll look at their policies.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
OK, so you're going down the protest/tactical voting route currently.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?
I'll vote for however is most likely to give the Tories a kicking, which is probably LDs in East Devon. If the Tories won't get rid of Johnson, then the Tories have to go.
I'd rather be voting for someone because of a broad spectrum of policies I agree with, but politics is broken with Johnson at the helm. Once he's gone, I'll look at their policies.
Interestingly the Lib Dem candidate int the recent local elections had her main selling point as 'vote for embecause Labour haven't got a hope in hell round here'. Which is probably true, although she may have found that having purple hair probably didn't win over too many of the local population who might have been wavering."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Because purple is UKIP?
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Stevo_666 said:
OK, so you're going down the protest/tactical voting route currently.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?
I'll vote for however is most likely to give the Tories a kicking, which is probably LDs in East Devon. If the Tories won't get rid of Johnson, then the Tories have to go.
I'd rather be voting for someone because of a broad spectrum of policies I agree with, but politics is broken with Johnson at the helm. Once he's gone, I'll look at their policies.
Interestingly the Lib Dem candidate int the recent local elections had her main selling point as 'vote for embecause Labour haven't got a hope in hell round here'. Which is probably true, although she may have found that having purple hair probably didn't win over too many of the local population who might have been wavering.
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It was more streaky hippy/student style.kingstongraham said:Stevo_666 said:
OK, so you're going down the protest/tactical voting route currently.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Brian, you really need to get off the fence about BJbriantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
He may well be, but I've already explained my position upthread in the team vs manager analogy.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Not sure. This sort of thing often happens mid term though.briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
Bad news if a GE is imminent I guess...briantrumpet said:Stevo_666 said:
The fact that they need to mount a campaign to try to achieve this should tell you something...ddraver said:Credit where it's due, For Day 1 of "Operation Make Starmer Look Not Boring", PMQs was not a bad start...
A long ways to go for sure, but....
Considering how boring he is, I wonder what the Tories are doing wrong to be trailing so badly...
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html
Too early to tell, obvs.
But even so, my point still stands. I'm not going to argue that he's not boring, or has charisma. But despite that, Labour is ten % points up. Why do you think that would be?
Try 'Johnson'. That would be a start. That you recognised that Corbyn was toxic, but won't admit that Johnson is now an electoral liability is bizarre.
If you're going to stick with a rubbish analogy, it doesn't stop anyone from pointing out that the manager is a lying, lazy, unprincipled charlatan, who is merely using the team/club to further his own ends. In fact, that's what I'd expect a proper club supporter to do. I'd rather the Tories weren't being dragged down to Johnson's level... I'd have thought that would have been your focus too, since you os strongly believe in them. It wouldn't be a sign of weakness on your part to call him out. The analogy was deliberately kept simple.
So let's cut to the chase - is he bad enough for you stoop to voting Labour in the next GE?
I'll vote for however is most likely to give the Tories a kicking, which is probably LDs in East Devon. If the Tories won't get rid of Johnson, then the Tories have to go.
I'd rather be voting for someone because of a broad spectrum of policies I agree with, but politics is broken with Johnson at the helm. Once he's gone, I'll look at their policies.
Interestingly the Lib Dem candidate int the recent local elections had her main selling point as 'vote for embecause Labour haven't got a hope in hell round here'. Which is probably true, although she may have found that having purple hair probably didn't win over too many of the local population who might have been wavering."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
It appears to be the chosen colour of other fringe protest parties also...HilaryAmin said:Because purple is UKIP?
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0
