BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴
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The health ministers of Germany, France, Netherlands and Italy were forced to write to Ursula to apologise for trying to go it alone with vaccine procurement. I think that counts as pressure.elbowloh said:
No. I even said it in my post, they didn't deliver what the intended/promised.Stevo_666 said:
Do you think it's conjecture that the EU vaccine rollout didn't work out as intended?elbowloh said:
Because the rest was conjectureStevo_666 said:
Why? Because you didn't want to hear the rest?elbowloh said:
You could have just stopped there.ballysmate said:elbowloh said:The vaccine procurement plan was not mandatory, they agreed to sign up. It's just been very badly delivered or not delivered I should say
No not mandatory. But were countries not pressurised into throwing their lot in with the EU.
The EC said joint procurement would simplify negotiation processes and give the EU the “merit of speed and efficiency” compared to running 27 individual procurements. 🙄.
The EU saw it as a way to show everyone the benefit of acting as one in its march to its wet dream of a superstate.
Not worked out as intended.
The conjecture started with implying countries were pressured into joining. It's more likely they a) believed that combined purchasing power would be better or b) they were offered quid pro quos rather than pressure, but who knows, it's all conjecture. Bottom line is, the procurement programme was a failure, no one has denied that.0 -
After they had signed up?ballysmate said:
The health ministers of Germany, France, Netherlands and Italy were forced to write to Ursula to apologise for trying to go it alone with vaccine procurement. I think that counts as pressure.elbowloh said:
No. I even said it in my post, they didn't deliver what the intended/promised.Stevo_666 said:
Do you think it's conjecture that the EU vaccine rollout didn't work out as intended?elbowloh said:
Because the rest was conjectureStevo_666 said:
Why? Because you didn't want to hear the rest?elbowloh said:
You could have just stopped there.ballysmate said:elbowloh said:The vaccine procurement plan was not mandatory, they agreed to sign up. It's just been very badly delivered or not delivered I should say
No not mandatory. But were countries not pressurised into throwing their lot in with the EU.
The EC said joint procurement would simplify negotiation processes and give the EU the “merit of speed and efficiency” compared to running 27 individual procurements. 🙄.
The EU saw it as a way to show everyone the benefit of acting as one in its march to its wet dream of a superstate.
Not worked out as intended.
The conjecture started with implying countries were pressured into joining. It's more likely they a) believed that combined purchasing power would be better or b) they were offered quid pro quos rather than pressure, but who knows, it's all conjecture. Bottom line is, the procurement programme was a failure, no one has denied that.0 -
As it becomes increasingly obvious that people’s problem is with the EU rather than our membership of it I wonder if the solution is another change of name for this thread or a new EU thread0
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surrey_commuter said:
As it becomes increasingly obvious that people’s problem is with the EU rather than our membership of it I wonder if the solution is another change of name for this thread or a new EU thread
EU whingeing thread?1 -
I don’t think they refer to it as whingeing.briantrumpet said:surrey_commuter said:As it becomes increasingly obvious that people’s problem is with the EU rather than our membership of it I wonder if the solution is another change of name for this thread or a new EU thread
EU whingeing thread?
There is a very subjective set of rules defining criticism and whingeing.0 -
I would start it myself but am not sure if whingeing should be whinging?briantrumpet said:surrey_commuter said:As it becomes increasingly obvious that people’s problem is with the EU rather than our membership of it I wonder if the solution is another change of name for this thread or a new EU thread
EU whingeing thread?0 -
I see the golden egg of Brexit that was reducing corporation tax and attracting investment has been scrambled.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
We're getting free ports!ddraver said:He was really quiet about all the benefits in general eh?
He mentioned it a whole...never
Things we could have had in the EU and we had as recently as 2012, when were still in the EU (according to the beeb).
How can you not be excited by that?0 -
Tbh I can't find the link to give an exact timeframe but If it was before they had signed up, that would be surely indicate they were bullied into it.elbowloh said:
After they had signed up?ballysmate said:
The health ministers of Germany, France, Netherlands and Italy were forced to write to Ursula to apologise for trying to go it alone with vaccine procurement. I think that counts as pressure.elbowloh said:
No. I even said it in my post, they didn't deliver what the intended/promised.Stevo_666 said:
Do you think it's conjecture that the EU vaccine rollout didn't work out as intended?elbowloh said:
Because the rest was conjectureStevo_666 said:
Why? Because you didn't want to hear the rest?elbowloh said:
You could have just stopped there.ballysmate said:elbowloh said:The vaccine procurement plan was not mandatory, they agreed to sign up. It's just been very badly delivered or not delivered I should say
No not mandatory. But were countries not pressurised into throwing their lot in with the EU.
The EC said joint procurement would simplify negotiation processes and give the EU the “merit of speed and efficiency” compared to running 27 individual procurements. 🙄.
The EU saw it as a way to show everyone the benefit of acting as one in its march to its wet dream of a superstate.
Not worked out as intended.
The conjecture started with implying countries were pressured into joining. It's more likely they a) believed that combined purchasing power would be better or b) they were offered quid pro quos rather than pressure, but who knows, it's all conjecture. Bottom line is, the procurement programme was a failure, no one has denied that.
If it was afterwards, that would be even worse. It would mean that they had realised the EU was going to fail in its aim and the health ministers had tried to take steps to protect the lives of their citizens. In this case, the facade of unity was deemed more important than obtaining vaccine and saving lives.
If we are to believe that no pressure was brought to bear, we must assume that 27 EU governments looked at the EU's plan, bearing in mind the EU had missed its PPE delivery, and decided it looked a winner and bovinely signed up. Not a good look either.0 -
surrey_commuter said:
I would start it myself but am not sure if whingeing should be whinging?briantrumpet said:surrey_commuter said:As it becomes increasingly obvious that people’s problem is with the EU rather than our membership of it I wonder if the solution is another change of name for this thread or a new EU thread
EU whingeing thread?
Take your pick - I always use 'whingeing' as it's less likely to be mispronounced as 'winging' (cf 'swinging' and 'swingeing'), but either is acceptable.0 -
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bompington said:
I know quite a few singeing teachers too.0 -
It's being reported that the Loyalist Community Council, a grouping representing the various Loyalist paramilitary groups including the UDA and UVF have written to the PM informing him that they have withdrawn their support for the Good Friday Agreement.
So that's going well.
“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
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Inevitable u-turn in 3...2...1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
...Something about the vaccine...0
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Really is a worrying time. Nobody wants to return to the those days again.tailwindhome said:It's being reported that the Loyalist Community Council, a grouping representing the various Loyalist paramilitary groups including the UDA and UVF have written to the PM informing him that they have withdrawn their support for the Good Friday Agreement.
So that's going well.0 -
Whilst it would have been better if the border was on the island of Ireland from the UK's perspective I do wonder when the EU will start to realise that the Good Friday Agreement was in fact a truce rather than an end to hostilities. You only have to kill a few customs officers before those civil servants start to operate in their own self interests.0
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Yes, they should never have insisted on the UK leaving the EU and the single market.john80 said:Whilst it would have been better if the border was on the island of Ireland from the UK's perspective I do wonder when the EU will start to realise that the Good Friday Agreement was in fact a truce rather than an end to hostilities. You only have to kill a few customs officers before those civil servants start to operate in their own self interests.
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1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Whilst we should never give in to violence it could be argued that the Unionist bomb chuckers have belatedly realised they have been fvcked over.
They should be told to stop whinging and make the best of it0 -
This, I must admit i find the position bizarre.surrey_commuter said:Whilst we should never give in to violence it could be argued that the Unionist bomb chuckers have belatedly realised they have been fvcked over.
They should be told to stop whinging and make the best of it
It's just wanton pent up rage but they are lashing out at innocent victims. The UK public voted to leave and then voted for a government to deliver a version of Brexit that would inevitably lead here. Who are they lashing out and threatening? Civil servants and no doubt Republicans. Also known as not responsible for this mess.
Mind you, loyalist terrorists attacking UK government targets would blow the irony meter.0 -
One assumes the other side laughs themselves to bed every nightmorstar said:
This, I must admit i find the position bizarre.surrey_commuter said:Whilst we should never give in to violence it could be argued that the Unionist bomb chuckers have belatedly realised they have been fvcked over.
They should be told to stop whinging and make the best of it
It's just wanton pent up rage but they are lashing out at innocent victims. The UK public voted to leave and then voted for a government to deliver a version of Brexit that would inevitably lead here. Who are they lashing out and threatening? Civil servants and no doubt Republicans. Also known as not responsible for this mess.
Mind you, loyalist terrorists attacking UK government targets would blow the irony meter.0 -
Weren't the Unionists pro-brexit?0
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I know an NI catholic who was at Oxford with JRM and Hannan and he said they never gave a monkey’s about the Union, he offered his own support to weaken the UK.
I just googled to see what timeframe this was and was intrigued to see that Hannan’s father is mentioned as an Ulster catholic. I wonder what the crossover is between Catholicism and ERG membership.0 -
their sole objective was getting their hands on johnson's bribe, they're notoriously corrupt and also rather stupidelbowloh said:Weren't the Unionists pro-brexit?
once he had what he wanted, johnson betrayed them, he thrives on the gullible
my bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny0 -
https://www.agendani.com/northern-ireland-votes-remain/
I don't know the demographics of NI well enough to comment with conviction but, despite the clear remain vote in NI the colours on the map suggest there may be a clear split in the vote. Wonder what the common factors may have been?0 -
They also wanted, and obviously thought they'd get, a hardening of the border on Ireland. Although obvious to everyone else, they re still shocked that Johnson abandoned them as soon as he didn't need them anymore (you'd have thought the divorces, the varying amounts of children and attempt to force someone into an abortion would have been a red flag for a deeply 'christian' party but...nope).sungod said:
their sole objective was getting their hands on johnson's bribe, they're notoriously corrupt and also rather stupidelbowloh said:Weren't the Unionists pro-brexit?
once he had what he wanted, johnson betrayed them, he thrives on the gullible
In terms of wish list vs final result, it's debatable if the DUP or Joe Swinson had a bigger disasterWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0
