BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴

kingstongraham

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

Reporting last month was that the UK rejected a mutual short term exemption from visa requirements for singers.

surrey_commuter

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

TheBigBean

My suspicion was that the EU's offer included more than just travelling musicians.

TheBigBean

ddraver said:

I've skimmed the posts, so...

I'm not angry at you Bean.

Season passes are always discounted for locals, even Verbier was 600 CHF for the year (year!) if you had a local work permit and bought it in early December. It's a stunning bargain frankly.

I had an au pair as a nipper. Lovely French girl who looked after me and sis-raver during the week and (I now realise) then went out in Plymuff and banged off duty marines on the weekend. She taught me to say censored ...

That's how I thought season passes worked. Then if you offer to sell x thousand lift tickets, they are happy to comp you a few. Or at least, that's how it used to work in Canada.

ddraver

Possibly so, I wasnt in that game...

They rarely seemed to advertise it, you had to know what to go in and answer and what form to have. But obviously, everybody who had access made sure they knew...

rick_chasey

https://coconuts.co/hongkong/food-drink/hk-mcdonalds-warns-breakfast-hash-browns-in-short-supply-due-to-us-shipping-delays/

Does anyone have a view on what is going on with shipping? Not Brexit, I mean, generally.

Seems to be a mess all over the place.

pinkbikini

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

morstar

rick_chasey said:

https://coconuts.co/hongkong/food-drink/hk-mcdonalds-warns-breakfast-hash-browns-in-short-supply-due-to-us-shipping-delays/

Does anyone have a view on what is going on with shipping? Not Brexit, I mean, generally.

Seems to be a mess all over the place.

There is a container shortage and CNY drives a massive peak in trade in January.
We are at the peak period when the system was already stressed.

surrey_commuter

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

pinkbikini

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

ballysmate

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

pinkbikini

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

ballysmate

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

surrey_commuter

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

They did not just casually decide not to go they made a pact

A pact will carry more weight weight with the boss if he needs you in Atlanta for a week.

pinkbikini

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

We really didn’t do it to ‘show them’ - it was more to feel comfortable with our own principles. It’s really not strange, unless you find the concept of personal principles strange.

Not saying it’s right or wrong - just a belief system!

Never said it’s just one country either, just don’t see why you needed to know.

pinkbikini

surrey_commuter said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

They did not just casually decide not to go they made a pact

A pact will carry more weight weight with the boss if he needs you in Atlanta for a week.

So getting back to the original point, how is JFK these days compared to Heathrow?

ballysmate

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

We really didn’t do it to ‘show them’ - it was more to feel comfortable with our own principles. It’s really not strange, unless you find the concept of personal principles strange.

Not saying it’s right or wrong - just a belief system!

Never said it’s just one country either, just don’t see why you needed to know.

I didn't 'need to know' anything. You posted that you had made a pact not to go to the US of A. I just asked if you had any other countries you had decided not to visit.
I thought it quite a straight forward question to be honest.

TheBigBean

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

We really didn’t do it to ‘show them’ - it was more to feel comfortable with our own principles. It’s really not strange, unless you find the concept of personal principles strange.

Not saying it’s right or wrong - just a belief system!

Never said it’s just one country either, just don’t see why you needed to know.

I didn't 'need to know' anything. You posted that you had made a pact not to go to the US of A. I just asked if you had any other countries you had decided not to visit.
I thought it quite a straight forward question to be honest.

I think everyone is free to invoke whatever principles they like. I do think there is a good argument that voting with your feet carries more weight against democracies, so I suppose not wanting to go to the US fits well with that. Most people have the opposite view though which is that nasty dictators shouldn't be supported, so those countries shouldn't be visited.

john80

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

They did not just casually decide not to go they made a pact

A pact will carry more weight weight with the boss if he needs you in Atlanta for a week.

So getting back to the original point, how is JFK these days compared to Heathrow?

If it is anything like Miami there will be a guy that looks Mexican checking your passport whilst giving out vibes that he is just itching to reject some people that day.

In fairness when he asked me what was in my bag and I gave him an incredibly detailed account he was wanting to kill me when I got onto the colour of my t-shirts and how they made me feel.

pinkbikini

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

ballysmate said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

pinkbikini said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

Today's talk is about the visa impact restrictions on touring performers. That seems the sort of thing where some sort of mutual agreement could have been fairly easily reached. I'm not sure if it is due to the same rules but my sister has decided to give up on her aim for a career in opera and retrain due to some form of visa issue due to Brexit making it virtually impossible for smaller opera companies to hire UK singers (plus Covid helping to finish off a lot of the smaller companies where she would have been auditioning back last autumn).

I am sure I read somewhere that there was a deal to be done but like Erasmus the UK was not interested

I was always struck by the list of exemptions that people wanted, students, doctors, nurses, builders, social care, chefs, seasonal workers and of course au pairs to name a few so maybe Boris decided it was a thin end of the wedge and to stay pure.

In fairness if you place such a high value on ending FoM and pay such a heavy price to achieve it then it would be borderline madness to then undermine it with a long series of exemptions

I honestly don’t think Spaffer places a high value on anything - he’s just a reed in the wind.

I suspect ‘The Arts’ are just collateral damage in his eyes. They can all retrain in cyber-security like Cummings proposed (remember him?)

I’m sure there were opportunities for agreements - to be fair, I seem to remember that proposals were put forward by both sides. Unfortunately I think we have a very lazy PM, and that attitude percolates through the layers.

But there are two groups of voters he cares about. Tory MPs for whom sovereignty actually means something and makes them more important.
Secondly Tory party members whose hatred of the EU must be driven by immigration as they seem to think FoM only applies to people.

So he stood firm on ECJ, EMA etc and people coming here.

And I am serious when I say it would be madness to pay an economic price already north of £100bn and then make so many compromises on immigration that the new system leaked like a sieve.

Do you think this merry band think entry should look like it did pre Xmas or more like landing at JFK?

My wife and I made a pact not to go back to the US whilst the orange moron was incumbent. What does JFK look like these days then?

Any other countries you have blacklisted due to their leaders?

Why do you ask?

Just seems a strange thing to do. Sit down with your good lady and decide to blacklist one country out of over 200 worldwide.
I bet that showed 'em.

We really didn’t do it to ‘show them’ - it was more to feel comfortable with our own principles. It’s really not strange, unless you find the concept of personal principles strange.

Not saying it’s right or wrong - just a belief system!

Never said it’s just one country either, just don’t see why you needed to know.

I didn't 'need to know' anything. You posted that you had made a pact not to go to the US of A. I just asked if you had any other countries you had decided not to visit.
I thought it quite a straight forward question to be honest.

I think this whole conversation is a bit odd. Why are you asking? Are we not allowed to make our own decisions without running them by you first?

Yes, there are other countries we’d choose not to visit. Many of which we’d probably never go to anyway, irrespective of who is President/PM/Dictator, etc. Life is all about choices.

They have nothing to do with JFK airport though, which was the original topic.

ballysmate

Why so defensive? You are right, the conversation seems to have taken a strange twist.
As I said, I thought it quite an innocuous question.
I never said that you had to run them past me or anyone else.

Pross

Presumably the US is somewhere PB and Mrs PB would otherwise be inclined to visit whereas the likes of North Korea, Myanmar, Belarus or even Russia / China aren't likely holiday destinations?

rick_chasey

Have to say, the conclusion of the trade deal doesn't seem to have taken the heat out of relations between the UK and the EU.

It's certainly deteriorated since. This is not good for anyone apart from perhaps populists.

briantrumpet

ballysmate said:

Why so defensive? You are right, the conversation seems to have taken a strange twist.
As I said, I thought it quite an innocuous question.
I never said that you had to run them past me or anyone else.

It started with a strange twist - I'm not sure what point you were trying to make or why you wanted to know.

john80

rick_chasey said:

Have to say, the conclusion of the trade deal doesn't seem to have taken the heat out of relations between the UK and the EU.

It's certainly deteriorated since. This is not good for anyone apart from perhaps populists.

Do you think you beloved EU has been driving the animosity. Seems that way from my view of things. Given they are one half of the relationship any tips for what they could do better.

rick_chasey

john80 said:

rick_chasey said:

Have to say, the conclusion of the trade deal doesn't seem to have taken the heat out of relations between the UK and the EU.

It's certainly deteriorated since. This is not good for anyone apart from perhaps populists.

Do you think you beloved EU has been driving the animosity. Seems that way from my view of things. Given they are one half of the relationship any tips for what they could do better.

I think they are as bad as each other.

rjsterry

briantrumpet said:

ballysmate said:

Why so defensive? You are right, the conversation seems to have taken a strange twist.
As I said, I thought it quite an innocuous question.
I never said that you had to run them past me or anyone else.

It started with a strange twist - I'm not sure what point you were trying to make or why you wanted to know.

Fishing for that magical gotcha moment when PB admits that some other holiday destination he visited also has an unsavoury head of state. I guess it beats train spotting, especially in this weather.

rick_chasey

Bally's like the forum's guido fawkes.

Is there to point out hypocrisy however trivial, but makes sure he never expresses his own views as to ensure he doesn't get snared himself.

TheBigBean

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

ballysmate said:

Why so defensive? You are right, the conversation seems to have taken a strange twist.
As I said, I thought it quite an innocuous question.
I never said that you had to run them past me or anyone else.

It started with a strange twist - I'm not sure what point you were trying to make or why you wanted to know.

Fishing for that magical gotcha moment when PB admits that some other holiday destination he visited also has an unsavoury head of state. I guess it beats train spotting, especially in this weather.

I've been on the receiving end the other way around. People telling me that they couldn't go where I have on holiday for political reasons whilst being happy to holiday in more conventional places with shoddy human rights.

Stevo_666

Pross said:

Presumably the US is somewhere PB and Mrs PB would otherwise be inclined to visit whereas the likes of North Korea, Myanmar, Belarus or even Russia / China aren't likely holiday destinations?

Or maybe saying that you won't holiday in (say) Turkey because Erdoğan is an authoritarian git doesn't score quite as many right on brownie points?