BREXIT - Is This Really Still Rumbling On? 😴

tailwindhome

TailWindHome wrote:

From the 9th September to 14th October the UK parliament will be unable to hold the UK government to account on preparations to leave the EU without a withdrawal agreement

For anyone in the 'EU caves at the last minute' camp, the last minute would seem to be the EU summit 17th October.

These dates are the maximum that parliament could be prorogued due to the Grieve Amendment to the NI Executive Formations Act

9th Sept

(1)The Secretary of State must, on or before 4 September 2019, publish a report explaining what progress has been made towards the formation of an Executive in Northern Ireland (unless an Executive has already been formed).
(2)The Secretary of State must make arrangements for—
(a)a copy of each report published under subsection (1) to be laid before each House of Parliament by the end of the day on which it is published,
(b)a motion in neutral terms, to the effect that the House of Commons has considered the report, to be moved in the House of Commons by a Minister of the Crown, and
(c)a motion for the House of Lords to take note of the report to be tabled in the House of Lords and moved by a Minister of the Crown.
(3)The motions required under subsections (2)(b) and (c) must be moved in the relevant House by a Minister of the Crown within the period of five calendar days beginning with the end of the day on which the report is laid before Parliament.

14th Oct

(5)The Secretary of State shall make a further report under subsection (1) on or before 9 October 2019 and at least every fourteen calendar days thereafter until either an Executive is formed or until 18 December 2019, whichever is the sooner.

Jez mon

Doesn't the whole JAM thing really depend on personal view. I mean, someone sending their kids to private school may be running up to their overdraft each month, and feel they are just about getting by.

Brexit will benefit those who have capital and can invest it in the right things. The vast majority don't have that.

TheBigBean

I'm still intrigued whether all the outraged MPs were planning on cancelling the conference recess, because no one has mentioned that so far.

kingstongraham

TheBigBean wrote:

I'm still intrigued whether all the outraged MPs were planning on cancelling the conference recess, because no one has mentioned that so far.

I've definitely heard that being discussed in the past couple of weeks

TheBigBean

kingstongraham

Leave voters would blame Corbyn more than May or Johnson? Amazing. Shows the power of tribalism.

hopkinb

Jez mon wrote:

Doesn't the whole JAM thing really depend on personal view. I mean, someone sending their kids to private school may be running up to their overdraft each month, and feel they are just about getting by.

Brexit will benefit those who have capital and can invest it in the right things. The vast majority don't have that.

There was the observation following the vote that Brexit voters were either very rich, or stupid. I believe the easy way for people to find out which category they fell into is to check their bank balance. What benefits the owners of capital very rarely, if ever, benefits the peon masses.

TheBigBean

KingstonGraham wrote:

Leave voters would blame Corbyn more than May or Johnson? Amazing. Shows the power of tribalism.

I found it interesting that remain voters would blame the MPs who didn't vote for May's deal because they wanted a harder Brexit (10s of MPs). Why not blame the ones that didn't vote for it, because they wanted a softer Brexit (100s of MPs).

Separately, it appears the vote on the summer recess was won 223 to 25, so a lot of abstentions. Still, there are 25 MPs who can be outraged, and take the moral high ground.

shirley_basso

hopkinb wrote:

Jez mon wrote:

Doesn't the whole JAM thing really depend on personal view. I mean, someone sending their kids to private school may be running up to their overdraft each month, and feel they are just about getting by.

Brexit will benefit those who have capital and can invest it in the right things. The vast majority don't have that.

There was the observation following the vote that Brexit voters were either very rich, or stupid. I believe the easy way for people to find out which category they fell into is to check their bank balance. What benefits the owners of capital very rarely, if ever, benefits the peon masses.

What's the rich/stupid cut off balance? Asking for a friend.

haydenm

A leaver I know has a salary 5 times higher than the regional average and doesn't think of himself as wealthy. He is otherwise quite sharp. He did just say he was surprised that Boris had taken 'quite an extreme option' to suspend parliament. Not sure where he fits into that scale...

hopkinb

Shirley Basso wrote:

hopkinb wrote:

Jez mon wrote:

Doesn't the whole JAM thing really depend on personal view. I mean, someone sending their kids to private school may be running up to their overdraft each month, and feel they are just about getting by.

Brexit will benefit those who have capital and can invest it in the right things. The vast majority don't have that.

There was the observation following the vote that Brexit voters were either very rich, or stupid. I believe the easy way for people to find out which category they fell into is to check their bank balance. What benefits the owners of capital very rarely, if ever, benefits the peon masses.

What's the rich/stupid cut off balance? Asking for a friend.

It wasn't my personal observation. Only your friend can work out where he/she sits on the spectrum.

hopkinb

HaydenM wrote:

A leaver I know has a salary 5 times higher than the regional average and doesn't think of himself as wealthy. He is otherwise quite sharp. He did just say he was surprised that Boris had taken 'quite an extreme option' to suspend parliament. Not sure where he fits into that scale...

Up where you are, that probably means he brings in a cool £20k per annum.

haydenm

hopkinb wrote:

HaydenM wrote:

A leaver I know has a salary 5 times higher than the regional average and doesn't think of himself as wealthy. He is otherwise quite sharp. He did just say he was surprised that Boris had taken 'quite an extreme option' to suspend parliament. Not sure where he fits into that scale...

Up where you are, that probably means he brings in a cool £20k per annum.

A very good point, luckily the house prices and living costs reflect that also

sungod

HaydenM wrote:

A leaver I know has a salary 5 times higher than the regional average and doesn't think of himself as wealthy. He is otherwise quite sharp. He did just say he was surprised that Boris had taken 'quite an extreme option' to suspend parliament. Not sure where he fits into that scale...

yeah, there're people all over the range irrespective of their vote, it's just on average leavers appear to have lower net worth

i'm sure there are reasonable people who think leave made sense for some positive reasons, maybe like the guy you refer to, but they were not the ones campaigning

the debate since way before the referendum was polarised by focus on negatives and actions against selected people/institutions - this was by both leave and remain campaigners, they are all to blame - rather than positive benefits of the options, which all honest and rational people should by definition be able agree on, after which it's a matter of which you prioritise

in a contest over lies and nonsensical claims, there was never any hope of the country being united either way

end result as expected, given the wealth distribution in the uk, negative for most people - the more wealthy will do better, the poorer will do worse - business as usual

bobmcstuff

TheBigBean wrote:

Nothing surprising there - stating the obvious surely

rjsterry

bobmcstuff wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Nothing surprising there - stating the obvious surely

Bit of a disconnect in that a significant number of the MPs who voted against May's deal very much did not want to stop Brexit.

rjsterry

Jez mon wrote:

Doesn't the whole JAM thing really depend on personal view. I mean, someone sending their kids to private school may be running up to their overdraft each month, and feel they are just about getting by.

Brexit will benefit those who have capital and can invest it in the right things. The vast majority don't have that.

I know of people with a half million quid of basement extension who consider themselves just about managing - and the mad thing is, compared to some, they aren't that well off. As Rick posted this morning it's all relative to one's peers.

shirley_basso

rjsterry wrote:

Jez mon wrote:

Doesn't the whole JAM thing really depend on personal view. I mean, someone sending their kids to private school may be running up to their overdraft each month, and feel they are just about getting by.

Brexit will benefit those who have capital and can invest it in the right things. The vast majority don't have that.

I know of people with a half million quid of basement extension who consider themselves just about managing - and the mad thing is, compared to some, they aren't that well off. As Rick posted this morning it's all relative to one's peers.

Well that's all leverage and fixed assets.

robert88

Stevo 666 wrote:

Parliament has been prorogued. Closes between 9-12 Sept and reopens 14 Oct.

Maybe Queenie is a closet Brexiteer?

She wants to take back control? Like Charles I?

tailwindhome

Ruth Davidson has quit as leader of Scottish Tories.
Citing family reasons, which may or may not be true.

kingstongraham

rjsterry wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Nothing surprising there - stating the obvious surely

Bit of a disconnect in that a significant number of the MPs who voted against May's deal very much did not want to stop Brexit.

They're further down.

robert88

TailWindHome wrote:

Ruth Davidson has quit as leader of Scottish Tories.
Citing family reasons, which may or may not be true.

Family reasons? She isn't related to Boris Johnson, is she?

rjsterry

KingstonGraham wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

TheBigBean wrote:

Nothing surprising there - stating the obvious surely

Bit of a disconnect in that a significant number of the MPs who voted against May's deal very much did not want to stop Brexit.

They're further down.

Did they not notice that the LibDems and the Nats hold less than 10% of the seats? If only they did hold such power. As pointed out ad nauseum, this is the parliament we elected. All on post-referendum manifestos.

robert88

Stevo 666 wrote:

Parliament has been prorogued. Closes between 9-12 Sept and reopens 14 Oct.

Maybe Queenie is a closet Brexiteer?

I see that newspapers in other European countries were suggesting last week that the Queen might be needed to prevent what they called a 'coup' by Boris Johnston. Well, she was and she didn't.

And Ruth Davidson wasn't going hang around for any night of the long knives, either.

Maybe Brexit is no longer the crux of the matter and was simply a vehicle for a power-grab.

coopster_the_1st

I'm very much enjoying the irony that MP's who have completely ignored the referendum result are now outraged that they are to be ignored

rick_chasey

I mean, if it was Corbyn doing it....

Not a great precedent is it?

sungod

...out of a wicked design to erect and uphold in himself an unlimited and tyrannical power to rule according to his will, and to overthrow the rights and liberties of the people, yea, to take away and make void the foundations thereof, and of all redress and remedy of misgovernment, which by the fundamental constitutions of this kingdom were reserved on the people's behalf in the right and power of frequent and successive Parliaments...

is what we charged charles the first with

seems only right that we do the same for king boris the liar

Pross

Coopster the 1st wrote:

I'm very much enjoying the irony that MP's who have completely ignored the referendum result are now outraged that they are to be ignored

They haven't ignored it, they've just been unable to agree on how best way to deliver the result given the wide ranging spectrum of what the vote covered. But we know you can't understand things beyond black and white.

kingstongraham

Coopster the 1st wrote:

I'm very much enjoying the irony that MP's who have completely ignored the referendum result are now outraged that they are to be ignored

I really don't know what Boris will do if it comes down to it and he might actually have to ram through the chaotic brexit. There's still a chance he'll bottle it, don't you think?

tailwindhome

Ignored it? They've worked on nothing else for 3 years!


David Allen Green on today's events

https://twitter.com/davidallengreen/sta ... 3068921856