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BREXIT 2020 - Bye Bye Brussels. It's Been a Blast.🇬🇧

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  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 12,639
    rjsterry said:

    ddraver said:

    For Post I think you're right. I think that is a teething problem as it were.

    The thing you're mostly talking about there is transit though and while it's well established, it's an administrative and logistical pain in the censored tho, and again doesn't really apply to groupage loads.

    Groupage, and rules of origin - it is almost as if we did not know what we were doing. Or our glorious leader just wanted to declare success, but not appreciating that the end of this project was not Dec 31st.
    You read that thread, yes? It was just an ideological push for whatever minimal FTA would allow them to claim freedom from EU law and to hell with the consequences. Not so much f*** business as who gives a f*** about business.
    I used to wonder whether they did not care about business or did not understand it until I realised they are the same thing.

    In the article they mention pretending to be a madman which nobody has credited with being Yanis’s strategy and how ell it worked for him
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 12,639
    edited 23 January

    Even if The Telegraph can't bring itself to cover it, CNN is:

    https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/23/business/brexit-business-intl-gbr/index.html


    Thanks for that, always good to read the foreign perspective, in this example it is illuminating how they portray the politicians

    When asked for comment on the immediate consequences of the trade barriers implemented as a result of the deal, a UK government spokesperson told CNN Business:
    "From the outset we were clear that we would be leaving the customs union and single market which meant that there would be new processes after the end of the Transition Period. These were widely communicated through our public information campaign."
  • briantrumpetbriantrumpet Posts: 5,975

    Even if The Telegraph can't bring itself to cover it, CNN is:

    https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/23/business/brexit-business-intl-gbr/index.html


    Thanks for that, always good to read the foreign perspective, in this example it is illuminating how they portray the politicians

    When asked for comment on the immediate consequences of the trade barriers implemented as a result of the deal, a UK government spokesperson told CNN Business:
    "From the outset we were clear that we would be leaving the customs union and single market which meant that there would be new processes after the end of the Transition Period. These were widely communicated through our public information campaign."

    In other words: "We don't give a f*ck now."
  • darkhairedlorddarkhairedlord Posts: 6,451
    morstar said:

    I’m waiting for sturmey archers 13 speed hub gear to be announced. That’ll be a Brexit bonus.

    Don't, the little chain will break and you won't be able to unscrew it. You'll need to pull it out to middle speed and put a bent nail through the link to keep it in gear.
  • briantrumpetbriantrumpet Posts: 5,975

    morstar said:

    I’m waiting for sturmey archers 13 speed hub gear to be announced. That’ll be a Brexit bonus.

    Don't, the little chain will break and you won't be able to unscrew it. You'll need to pull it out to middle speed and put a bent nail through the link to keep it in gear.

    That's not a bad description of how Brexit is panning out.
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 52,612 Lives Here
    edited 24 January
    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/23/brexit-hit-firms-advised-government-officials-set-up-shop-in-eu

    Don’t think this is what you had in mind, John

    Remarkable:
    Andrew Moss, who runs Horizon Retail Marketing Solutions, based in Ely, Cambridgeshire, which sells packaging and point-of-sale marketing displays in the UK and to EU customers, is registering a European company Horizon Europe in the Netherlands in the next few weeks, on the advice of a senior government adviser.
    This will mean laying off a small number of staff here and taking on people in the Netherlands.
  • https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/23/brexit-hit-firms-advised-government-officials-set-up-shop-in-eu

    Don’t think this is what you had in mind, John

    Remarkable:

    Andrew Moss, who runs Horizon Retail Marketing Solutions, based in Ely, Cambridgeshire, which sells packaging and point-of-sale marketing displays in the UK and to EU customers, is registering a European company Horizon Europe in the Netherlands in the next few weeks, on the advice of a senior government adviser.
    This will mean laying off a small number of staff here and taking on people in the Netherlands.
    This will happen more and more but tbf the reverse will and is happening as well, and EU firms will setup small operations in the UK.

    It does all seem very unnecessary but that's where we're at.
  • john80john80 Posts: 1,851
    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 12,639
    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
  • morstarmorstar Posts: 3,880

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/23/brexit-hit-firms-advised-government-officials-set-up-shop-in-eu

    Don’t think this is what you had in mind, John

    Remarkable:

    Andrew Moss, who runs Horizon Retail Marketing Solutions, based in Ely, Cambridgeshire, which sells packaging and point-of-sale marketing displays in the UK and to EU customers, is registering a European company Horizon Europe in the Netherlands in the next few weeks, on the advice of a senior government adviser.
    This will mean laying off a small number of staff here and taking on people in the Netherlands.
    This will happen more and more but tbf the reverse will and is happening as well, and EU firms will setup small operations in the UK.

    It does all seem very unnecessary but that's where we're at.
    Yes, this, it is a two way street. British business I was working for was bought by an Eu business in 2017 for this very reason.

    As a net importer of goods people who want a piece of the UK pie may be inclined to invest here. However, it does make being an exporter harder and less accessible to small businesses.
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 52,612 Lives Here
    I thought you were all about making sure more business was being done in the U.K., John?

    Why the about-face?
  • john80john80 Posts: 1,851

    I thought you were all about making sure more business was being done in the U.K., John?

    Why the about-face?

    As a net importer what is occurring will result in more business in the UK. I know this does not fit your narrative. You are still reeling from not being able to feel the tight embrace of your favourite lycra. I get it you are hurt and confused but it will pass.
  • briantrumpetbriantrumpet Posts: 5,975
    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.


    So your answer to placating an aggrieved electorate is to make it harder for successful UK businesses to ply their trade, and say "We are where we are". Yes, we are where we are because of Brexit.
  • john80john80 Posts: 1,851

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 14,154
    john80 said:

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
    "Stupid British."
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 13,810
    I was confident all problems would be the remainers' fault.
  • morstarmorstar Posts: 3,880
    john80 said:

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
    Not really, only a small minority of the electorate had the eu as a significant issue until recent years. The tories have infought over it for decades but that wasn't reflected in the electorate until around 2010 when they were back in power.
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 52,612 Lives Here
    john80 said:

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
    It’s the EU’s fault, is the tl;dr
  • briantrumpetbriantrumpet Posts: 5,975

    john80 said:

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
    It’s the EU’s fault, is the tl;dr

    According to the Express and Mail, the current problems are France's fault. (Though according to The Telegraph there aren't any problems at all.)
  • pangolinpangolin Posts: 3,121
    How is it karma for business to be worse off (on both sides)?

    Businesses were not "ignoring the electorate" john.
    Genesis Croix de Fer
    Cube Attain
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 12,639
    john80 said:

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
    No, the 2nd last sentence about karma
  • briantrumpetbriantrumpet Posts: 5,975
    Haha, The Telegraph must have had an edict not to mention Brexit at all. The only bit in today's Sunday Telegraph is a bit by Hannam arguing that the EU is a state, but he still doesn't mention the B word. Meanwhile they have space for a piece that says the Biden is "woke, big-spending, and more left-wing than you ever imagined". They just have to keep fighting those phantoms.
  • ballysmateballysmate Posts: 14,769
    john80 said:

    john80 said:

    Post brexit if you don't have any presence in the market in which you sell them good luck to you. This is on both sides of the channel and was obvious to everyone that had a brain in 2016 as to get things the electorate wanted such as the end of freedom of movement we were erecting borders and therefore barriers to trade. Consider it karma to those that ignored the concerns of an electorate for decades without caring where it would lead. We are were we are and it was an inevitable journey in large part due to the EU institutions.

    Can you elaborate on your penultimate sentence as it makes no sense the way it is written
    The UK electorate has consistently had issues with freedom of movement and the general direction of the EU for decades. The EU ignored these views and the UK government could not get anything meaningful agreed. Hence they have lost a net contributor and reduced their access to an important market. #winning or maybe be that should be #facepalm. If you asked Europeans if they are happy with the current position and if they could have done anything differently I would hazard a guess that those currently losing out would have something to say.
    I don't know about decades but certainly since Lisbon.
    They weren't alone though. The only country who got to vote on it was Ireland and they had to vote again because they produced the wrong result.
    Lisbon's precursor was the European constitution treaty 2005 which the French and Dutch people rejected.
    Lessons were learned. Sarkozy was elected President of the French Republic in May 2007. Amongst his pledges was a re-negotiation and ratification of a mini-treaty without a referendum. Eventually, the new version of the text, the Lisbon Treaty, was voted by the Parliament. Don't ask the question if you think you won't like the answer.

    Strangely the Libdems were the party that wanted a referendum on Lisbon.

    Funny old world.
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 12,639
    After all this time it still bemuses me that they don’t appreciate that an a advantage of EU membership was that sneering French officials had to treat Brits the same as their own citizens.
  • JezyboyJezyboy Posts: 435

    Haha, The Telegraph must have had an edict not to mention Brexit at all. The only bit in today's Sunday Telegraph is a bit by Hannam arguing that the EU is a state, but he still doesn't mention the B word. Meanwhile they have space for a piece that says the Biden is "woke, big-spending, and more left-wing than you ever imagined". They just have to keep fighting those phantoms.

    I feel the last point says more about someone's imagination than Biden.
  • david37david37 Posts: 971
    edited 24 January
    lots of first world problems being whined about here
    I suppose democracy is something you would like to suspend when it suits.
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 13,810

    Haha. The Telegraph really knows what to include... much more important than Brexit...

    I can't read the article, but is it proposing naming roads after war heroes to prove something about how they aren't virtue signallers?
  • surrey_commutersurrey_commuter Posts: 12,639
    david37 said:

    lots of first world problems being whined about here
    I suppose democracy is something you would like to suspend when it suits.

    You should look up what that saying means and then look up Ghana.

    Or take my word for it that it means the very opposite of what you think
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