Froome on Wiggins and more

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  • Macaloon
    Macaloon Posts: 5,545
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    ^ can you provide an English translation for that question, Ambassador Maca?

    Is Wiggins riding the Tour?
    ...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    Macaloon wrote:
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    ^ can you provide an English translation for that question, Ambassador Maca?

    Is Wiggins riding the Tour?


    In my non-expert view, it's about as likely as me winning in Trieste today.

    I don't think he's ever stood a chance, tbh. Brailsford's language has constantly changed when talking about BW and the Tour squad. First it was 'we'll base it in form'; then when Wiggins showed great form, it was 'oh we'll have to see how he recovers from California'. Now it's 'cohesive unit' talk.

    I think what happened was Wiggins showing in California took them all by surprise, and now Brailsford has to find a way out of not picking him.

    Just my view, obvs.

    Brailsford should just show some cojones, and say now he's not making the Tour squad, rather than this long drawn-out charade.
  • Richmond Racer
    Richmond Racer Posts: 8,561
    OTOH could this be a cunning plan on Brailsford's part, to ensure Fenton is hit with questions other than doping ones during Jul?

    Hmmm....clever, very clever...
  • Macaloon
    Macaloon Posts: 5,545
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    OTOH could this be a cunning plan on Brailsford's part, to ensure Fenton is hit with questions other than doping ones during Jul?

    Hmmm....clever, very clever...

    Nailed the Giro.
    ...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    Wiggo to Suisse, Froome to Dauphine. Still no riding together.
  • Daz555
    Daz555 Posts: 3,976
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Brailsford should just show some cojones, and say now he's not making the Tour squad, rather than this long drawn-out charade.
    From what I've read this is how Sir Dave operates - maintains tension in the team to motivate riders.
    You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
    If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
    If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.
  • ContrelaMontre
    ContrelaMontre Posts: 3,027
    Turfle wrote:
    Wiggo to Suisse, Froome to Dauphine. Still no riding together.

    So if Wiggo wins TdS what does that do to his Tour chances?
    Rule No.10 // It never gets easier, you just go faster
  • Lanterne_Rogue
    Lanterne_Rogue Posts: 4,332
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Brailsford should just show some cojones, and say now he's not making the Tour squad, rather than this long drawn-out charade.

    Being cynical, Brailsford's job isn't to win bike races. It's to get Sky's name all over the column inches. Winning races is obviously one (and the major) way of doing that, but prolonging the gossip over who will make the Tour squad is another tactic. If that's the game he's playing, then the potential for things to blow up massively makes it a brave game to play...
    Twitter: @canocola @thedreadships
  • mooro
    mooro Posts: 483
    Do they really hate each other that much? Seems daft that they don't do the dauphine together...

    Maybe brad will have a pop at the vuelta if he doesn't ride the tour. Pity if he is on top form mind, I reckon with his and brailsfords history he will be on the tour team.
  • mattyarse
    mattyarse Posts: 65
    Mooro wrote:
    Do they really hate each other that much? Seems daft that they don't do the dauphine together...

    Maybe brad will have a pop at the vuelta if he doesn't ride the tour. Pity if he is on top form mind, I reckon with his and brailsfords history he will be on the tour team.

    But if you think about Kimmage (where it didn't work) and Walsh being 'embedded' within Sky Brailsford was adamant that he wanted Walsh around the team long before the Tour so that the team were relaxed and used to having him around.

    It is surely counter intuitive to suggest that he is going to keep Froome and Wiggins apart right through the preparation to the most important race of Sky's season (especially after Froome's revelations / viewpoint / bomb drop depending on your viewpoint) and then just throw him in the mix at the 11th hour with a cheery slap on the back and a 'go get 'em Brad' whilst Froome and Porte scowl at him?
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,462
    Mooro wrote:
    Do they really hate each other that much? Seems daft that they don't do the dauphine together...

    Maybe they see a chance to win both races?
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    Wiggins should certainly be competitive in it. Couple of tricky hill finishes, 25k TT, and two relatively easy MTF including Verbier.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,253
    Pross wrote:
    Mooro wrote:
    Do they really hate each other that much? Seems daft that they don't do the dauphine together...

    Maybe they see a chance to win both races?
    It looks like they are trying to give both a good go this year (maybe because they're not exactly raking in the WT points so far this season). I expect Kennaugh to do the Tour and will be amazed if Pate does.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • Elfed
    Elfed Posts: 459
    Turfle wrote:
    Wiggins should certainly be competitive in it. Couple of tricky hill finishes, 25k TT, and two relatively easy MTF including Verbier.

    I think it also starts with a prologue.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,695
    RichN95 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Mooro wrote:
    Do they really hate each other that much? Seems daft that they don't do the dauphine together...

    Maybe they see a chance to win both races?
    It looks like they are trying to give both a good go this year (maybe because they're not exactly raking in the WT points so far this season). I expect Kennaugh to do the Tour and will be amazed if Pate does.

    That, plus I refer the court to the Chris Hoy v Jason Kenny Olympic Sprint/Keiren choice in 2012 - which worked exceptionally well for Brailsford
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    Elfed wrote:
    Turfle wrote:
    Wiggins should certainly be competitive in it. Couple of tricky hill finishes, 25k TT, and two relatively easy MTF including Verbier.

    I think it also starts with a prologue.

    It does. It's the typical Suisse prologue, with a climb followed by a descent. They're hoping for Cancellara vs Sagan again I expect.
  • mooro
    mooro Posts: 483
    RichN95 wrote:
    Pross wrote:
    Mooro wrote:
    Do they really hate each other that much? Seems daft that they don't do the dauphine together...

    Maybe they see a chance to win both races?
    It looks like they are trying to give both a good go this year (maybe because they're not exactly raking in the WT points so far this season). I expect Kennaugh to do the Tour and will be amazed if Pate does.

    Good point, didn't think of that. Maybe team dynamics and actual outcomes are not that related and DB has confidence in his riders to just do their jobs properly.
  • ocdupalais
    ocdupalais Posts: 4,317
    My guess on the Sky Tour squad (barring some unseemliness at either Suisse or Dauphiné)...

    Froome
    Wiggins
    Porte
    Kiriyenka
    Knees
    Thomas
    Nieve
    Kennaugh
    Lopez


    If EBH rediscovers some form, then perhaps Knees/Kennaugh's slot maybe challenged? The latter may need to show some high mountain form to guarantee his spot, I'd say...

    I'm imagining a strange sketch of shuffled roles up Les Planches Des Belles Filles this year. There'll be Rogers showing Bertie the sights to make up for what he missed last time ("this is where I pulled on the front for Sky before Porte took over... Don't worry this steep bit eases shortly... Nice, innit? You alright - want a drink?")... Wiggins'll be gunning it on the middle section before handing over to Kiriyenka and then Porte... Before Froome attacks; only to remember that he's attacking himself and he's actually the protected rider... Then Cadel will shout encouragement to them from the crowd with a Miller-Lite in his hand... Only Nibali will be unconfused by the stage as he comes in just off the pace like last time...
  • mr_poll
    mr_poll Posts: 1,547
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    Macaloon wrote:
    Richmond Racer wrote:
    ^ can you provide an English translation for that question, Ambassador Maca?

    Is Wiggins riding the Tour?


    In my non-expert view, it's about as likely as me winning in Trieste today.

    I don't think he's ever stood a chance, tbh. Brailsford's language has constantly changed when talking about BW and the Tour squad. First it was 'we'll base it in form'; then when Wiggins showed great form, it was 'oh we'll have to see how he recovers from California'. Now it's 'cohesive unit' talk.

    I think what happened was Wiggins showing in California took them all by surprise, and now Brailsford has to find a way out of not picking him.

    Just my view, obvs.

    Brailsford should just show some cojones, and say now he's not making the Tour squad, rather than this long drawn-out charade.


    Not often I do but disagree with you here - Brailsford has shown before he puts the needs of the end result of the team before anything. Once he has a plan he will follow it through irrespective, the mess that was the Vuelta in 2011 showed that, the plan to get behind Brad in 2012, Froome was the horse he backed last year even when Wiggo ditched the Giro (the knee injury was "useful").

    Think they have split the team to keep everyone guessing - and to give Wiggo a shot at the TdS for his palmares before he serves Froome.

    FWIW I think the team for the TdF will be:

    Nieve
    Froome
    Porte
    Lopez
    G
    Pete K
    Knees
    Wiggo
    Kiryienka
  • ocdupalais
    ocdupalais Posts: 4,317
    His mum, maybe...
  • mr_poll
    mr_poll Posts: 1,547
    OnYourRight wrote:
    No-one sees Joe Dombrowski sneaking into the Tour team?

    I guess he is an unknown quantity on a 3 week GT - also despite doing a great job on the final climb of the tour of cali - Wiggins was exposed when Dombrowski and others were dropped on Mt Baldi, probably doesnt bode well for French mountains.
  • Turfle
    Turfle Posts: 3,762
    Dombrowski has only had 11 race days all year (2 in march, 8 in Cali, and about an hour of a stage in Bayern). I expect him to be at the Vuelta.

    My guess for their Tour team:
    Froome, Porte, Lopez, Nieve, Henao, Thomas, Kiryienka, Knees, Pate

    I think Kennaugh and Wiggins are competing for the Henao and Kiryienka spots.
  • gingermagician
    gingermagician Posts: 326
    Sky would be crazy omit Wiggins, given the form he's shown so far this year. When they consider their experience in 2011, surely they'll realise they need to have more than one card to play (whether that other card is a potential winner or not)?

    All it takes is one bit of bad luck during what's bound to be a pretty frenetic first week and - bang - there goes a top 5 placing. Porte has no sort of form this season (a decent showing in Oz apart) and no genuine GT track record to speak of. Add in the pressure from Sky top brass to select Wiggins given the Yorkshire grand depart and I can't see him not going.

    Plus he could do a genuinely destructive job for Froome on the early to mid slopes of the big climbs if he's properly committed to working on his behalf and can reproduce that Mount Diablo form.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,253
    Another reason for sending Wiggins to Switzerland is that it's one of the races that Sky have the TV rights to.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • Macaloon
    Macaloon Posts: 5,545
    I think it's just business. It's risky for Wiggo's legacy to disappear as a domestique if Froome transcends the sport in an epic. It's risky for Froome to have a publicity hungry Wiggins with time on his hands. I doubt Brave Dailsford will force Wiggins on a hostile Froome.

    Ambassador RR called it. Wiggins won't make the Tour team.
    ...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.
  • ocdupalais
    ocdupalais Posts: 4,317
    Mmm... Not so sure, Maca...
    RichN95 wrote:
    Another reason for sending Wiggins to Switzerland is that it's one of the races that Sky have the TV rights to.

    And another reason for sending Wiggins to the Tour is all the marketing gold Sky will get from having 2 x British Tour champs starting in Yorkshire (esp with Wiggins as an adopted Northerner), through to London... Before using it as a springboard to start their assault on cycling TV rights...

    Should Murray flop at Wimbledon and the England team flop in Brazil, expect this process to have even greater potency...
  • Macaloon
    Macaloon Posts: 5,545
    OCDuPalais wrote:
    Mmm... Not so sure, Maca...
    RichN95 wrote:
    Another reason for sending Wiggins to Switzerland is that it's one of the races that Sky have the TV rights to.

    And another reason for sending Wiggins to the Tour is all the marketing gold Sky will get from having 2 x British Tour champs starting in Yorkshire (esp with Wiggins as an adopted Northerner), through to London... Before using it as a springboard to start their assault on cycling TV rights...

    Should Murray flop at Wimbledon and the England team flop in Brazil, expect this process to have even greater potency...

    That's all true. And if the team had the final say, the risk of personal conflict would be worth it. I think Froome could cite two sacrificed GTs as sufficient dues to deserve a team of his own. I doubt the team would overrule him.

    Which would be a pity cos I hear the rouleur's Union have called a wildcat classics day for the cobbled stage.
    ...a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.
  • takethehighroad
    takethehighroad Posts: 6,821
    Everyone seems very confident Froome will start the Tour de France. I'm not so sure, think he needs to show a bit more form...
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    RichN95 wrote:
    Another reason for sending Wiggins to Switzerland is that it's one of the races that Sky have the TV rights to.

    Fu*king bastards.
    _
  • inseine
    inseine Posts: 5,788
    Turfle wrote:
    Dombrowski has only had 11 race days all year (2 in march, 8 in Cali, and about an hour of a stage in Bayern). I expect him to be at the Vuelta.

    My guess for their Tour team:
    Froome, Porte, Lopez, Nieve, Henao, Thomas, Kiryienka, Knees, Pate

    I think Kennaugh and Wiggins are competing for the Henao and Kiryienka spots.

    It does appear that the Dauphine team are the prefered riders for the TdF, with a couple of exceptions.
    I can't see what Haneo is down to ride, since he not named for Suisse or Dauphine, though the Route del Sud is a very provisional list, he's not on that either.
    http://cyclinganddesign.blogspot.fr/
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