Improving pedal stroke
Comments
-
OT But I am trying to buy a stages 6800 ultegra power meter, can't get one in this country. I can get any other power meter but not stages, is it the price or because Sky use them, everyone wants one?0
-
birel101 wrote:OT But I am trying to buy a stages 6800 ultegra power meter, can't get one in this country. I can get any other power meter but not stages, is it the price or because Sky use them, everyone wants one?
Merlin have them in stock"You really think you can burn off sugar with exercise?" downhill paul0 -
Not in the size I need.0
-
birel101 wrote:Not in the size I need.
Might be worth setting up the 'email when in stock' facility.
I only waited 3 or 4 days after I set that up.
Maybe I was just lucky!"You really think you can burn off sugar with exercise?" downhill paul0 -
I did, I woke up Wednesday morning with a email and went online a hour later and they were sold out again lol. I think that was with Evans though. Are you glad you went with stages?0
-
birel101 wrote:I did, I woke up Wednesday morning with a email and went online a hour later and they were sold out again lol. I think that was with Evans though. Are you glad you went with stages?
Yeah! When I was looking around I came to the conclusion that every power meter is compromised in some way or another. Stages does the job, weighs next to nothing and was easy to install. The Ultegra one that I bought had the old software installed which was a pain as you need an iphone to update it. Once I had borrowed one it only took about 5 minutes to update though."You really think you can burn off sugar with exercise?" downhill paul0 -
Cool, thanks.0
-
Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:
There's no "even now" about it. I have always maintained that riding a bike is necessary to improve how we ride a bike.bahzob wrote:Even Alex now seems to think you can get better by riding a bike
Please stop claiming or inferring things I didn't say or have never said. It's kinda tiresome.
What's kinda tiresome is your prickliness coupled with a quickness to criticise others while being remarkably shy about expressing any views of your own that can be put up to challenge.
I on the contrary have been quite willing to make my opinion clear. I'll do so again for your benefit
- Pedalling is a skill, no different from any other. Like any other skill it can be performed at various levels of aptitude. These levels are determined by a mixture of heredity and learning. Cyclists wishing to be the best they can be can benefit by including focused effort while training in an attempt to accelerate this learning. There is no downside to doing this, pedalling drills can easily be incorporated into existing workouts within a training plan
Everything I have said is consistent with this view.
Getting similar from you has been like getting blood from a stone. When I try to help you with your understanding you get all upset. I expect this sort of attitude from some of those here but expect better from you.
To the best of my recollection this thread is the first time you have actually said anything specific. Even now your position seems unclear compared to the views of some of your supporters and in contradiction to those you have expressed in the past.
You say, "Asking someone to state their opinion wrt the broad issue of pedalling is just silly. But if you must - OK, here's my opinion: Pedalling is good, get a good bike fit, choose an appropriate gear for the riding you are doing and don't overcomplicate it, the more you ride and the fitter you become as a result the better you'll get, and racing does wonders for one's pedalling."
Slightly amended later by:
"Of course pedalling improves the more your ride and race and get fitter. I've never said otherwise."
"My programs have "pedalling drills" (not that I call them that) where it makes sense. But I don't sit people on a Wattbike (or similar) and tell them to change the shape of their peanut chart."
These views still seem a little unclear but don't, in practice, seem to be so far away from my opinion.
You seem to accept that the way you pedal a bike makes a difference
You seem to accept that pedalling can better
You even give your clients pedalling drills (but can't bring yourself to call them that for some strange reason).
The only places we seem to differ are in the details.
- You seem to think the improvement takes place in some inherent way that trends towards constant improvement/eventual perfection and there is little need to focus on this (though you do sometimes). OK I'll admit that saying you think it will happen as if by magic is a little harsh but don't think its that unfair.
- I on the other hand think, like any other skill, you can pick up bad habits and will not improve without some specific focus and reference to an better practice (specifically how pros ride and/or using a Wattbike).
Below I list my first suggestions to the OP on this thread, before the trolls kicked in. I stand by all these and suspect from your views that you may even agree with some of them.
If you want to stop getting tired by my attempts to sort my way through your views then the solution is in your hands. Just make it clear exactly what your views are and how they differ from mine.
>>> Below first posts on this topic.
The best training device at the moment remains the Wattbike, since it gives a real time feedback on your pedal stroke in a graphic format that makes it easy to see what you are doing and correct it.
Just google "wattbike pedalling" for more info. If you contact the folks at Wattbike they should be able to advise where you can find the nearest machine.
PS One technique you should not try is pedalling with one leg. Its pretty useless and can actually make things worse as it encourages trying to "pull up" the pedal.
One good and simple training tip is just make a conscious effort to train at different cadences, e.g. do 5 minutes at low rpm, then 5 minutes at very high rpm. Or vary cadence with time, so start low cadence and ramp up towards the end of the interval.
Doing this should engage all the muscles that can help provide power and develop the timing/co-ordination to do this most efficiently. It will also falling into the rut that 90% of amateurs who just pedal at their most comfortable cadence which is usually too low, especially when the going gets tough.
PPS Another good way to develop pedalling is do turbo/roller work while watching a pro race.
Simply aim to replicate their cadence and smoothness of style, especially when doing threshold+ efforts. If you find this difficult then chances are you could improve, one reason that pros are better is because they pedal better.
Best are long climbs or TTs where you get the chance to see pros in their red zone putting out power we could only dream of but doing it apparently with little effort, which is a typical mark of someone who is skilled at something.
Last years Ventoux was good example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0ucvPW ... 7KwMETyFNx
Interesting thing in this is how Quintana's previously imperious style breaks down when he pops right at the end. (around 1hour 56mins) Good example of how pedalling badly probably means you are riding badly.
bahzob
Posts: 1804
Joined: 14 Jul 2006 13:41
Top
Re: Improving pedal stroke
Postby hazzy87 » 13 Mar 2014 10:27
Thanks for the advice bahzob. A lot more helpfull then the others.Martin S. Newbury RC0 -
bahzob wrote:Below I list my first suggestions to the OP on this thread, before the trolls kicked in.
Unfortunately, 'troll' seems to be your general term of reference for anyone who doesn't agree with you. That and 'closed-minded', obviously.
As others have said, you claiming something does not automatically make it a fact. All you have to do is provide actual evidence, other than repeatedly stating "it must be correct"....0 -
It could of course just be because he is knackered, and no pedalling style is going to make any difference to how fast he goes.bahzob wrote:Interesting thing in this is how Quintana's previously imperious style breaks down when he pops right at the end. (around 1hour 56mins) Good example of how pedalling badly probably means you are riding badly.0 -
bernithebiker wrote:When we're all done here we can move onto 'Light weight wheels - worth it or not?"
Or "What lube?"0 -
OMG Dennis, what are you doing here, got lost?
Armstrong went dataway =>0 -
Hate to drag this one kicking and screaming back to the top, but Ben Swift said this in the Telegraph today;
Above all, remember to pedal smoothly and fluidly. “Try to pedal in a circle and not just up and down. You can see in the peloton which guys have been on the track because they scrape their feet in a circular motion whereas other people hammer the pedals up and down which loses a bit of power.”0 -
That explains why every road race is won by a trackie!0
-
Unfortunately the data doesn't support this oft-held view:
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=msdT ... =html_text
MTB riders have the more circular pedal stroke for reasons of traction, track sprint and pursuit riders actually push down more because the fixed gear helps move the foot through the dead spot as the wheel turns.
Xav0 -
Here's a thought.
We have most, if not all the tools, required to test whether pedaling technique effects GE and a test protocol can be constructed with some thought.
But the problem is the human element. BenderRodrigez has pointed out concern that it may take time to learn a new technique. Until its been learned the rider cannot perform the new technique. It might take so long to learn the new technique that the riders ability may have changed.
So why not replace the rider with a machine which can be programmed to apply measured effort at different places in the pedal stroke and use the existing machines to measure the result.
Was it Giant or Cervelo who made a mechanical rider that pedals in the wind tunnel?0
