Pub Talk. Britain's greatest male road cyclist?

tailwindhome

Wiggins, Cavendish, Millar or Simpson?

Le Commentateur

Not many Monday night boozers here.

RichN95.

TailWindHome wrote:

Wiggins, Cavendish, Miller or Simpson?

Froome

(Or it will be. At the moment it's Cavendish)

phreak

I would have Froome above Miller and Simpson. Probably Cavendish 1st, then Wiggins, Froome, Simpson, Miller.

welshmessenger

I think longevity and consistency trump the "first Brit" exploits of Simpson et al. Got to be Cav.

gsk82

I'd say froome has achieved more than wiggins on the road although, wiggins was obviously the trailblazer.

FJS

Cavendish is one of the very best road sprinters ever. Worldwide.

Wiggins' achievements on the road were ground-breaking for Britain, but not quite that worldwide.

Therefore, right now, I'd say Cavendish

Froome has the potential to trump Wiggins and Cavendish, but not yet

chrisaonabike

FJS wrote:

Cavendish is one of the very best road sprinters ever. Worldwide.

I don't get the whole sprint thing at all. I'm pretty new to all this, but it just seems to me that sprinters sit behind their team mates for the whole race and then pop out in the last few hundred meters. Sure, there's split second tactics to get right, and they have to be able to push enormously hard on the pedals for a few seconds, but they're rubbish at everything else (I know, a bit of a generalisation, but ykwim).

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all. On the track, sure, but not on the road.

I watched a lot of the Tour this year - loved all the long stages, especially the mountains. But the sprints were a bit of a yawn for me.

Anonymous

gsk82 wrote:

I'd say froome has achieved more than wiggins on the road although, wiggins was obviously the trailblazer.

Chris Froome Palmares

Stage races
Tour de France (2013)
Critérium du Dauphiné (2013)
Tour de Romandie (2013)
Critérium International (2013)
Tour of Oman (2013)

Bradley Wiggins
Tour de France (2012)
Critérium du Dauphiné (2011, 2012)
Paris–Nice (2012)
Tour de Romandie (2012)
One-day races and Classics
National Time Trial Championships (2009, 2010)
National Road Race Championships (2011)

Between these two but depends how you define it. I'd say Wiggins but will quicky be over taken by Froome

No_Ta_Doctor

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

FJS wrote:

Cavendish is one of the very best road sprinters ever. Worldwide.

I don't get the whole sprint thing at all. I'm pretty new to all this, but it just seems to me that sprinters sit behind their team mates for the whole race and then pop out in the last few hundred meters. Sure, there's split second tactics to get right, and they have to be able to push enormously hard on the pedals for a few seconds, but they're rubbish at everything else (I know, a bit of a generalisation, but ykwim).

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all. On the track, sure, but not on the road.

I watched a lot of the Tour this year - loved all the long stages, especially the mountains. But the sprints were a bit of a yawn for me.

Iain? Is that you?

RichN95.

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all.

They win lots of races. More than any other riders. That's the point of them.

chrisaonabike

No tA Doctor wrote:

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

FJS wrote:

Cavendish is one of the very best road sprinters ever. Worldwide.

I don't get the whole sprint thing at all. I'm pretty new to all this, but it just seems to me that sprinters sit behind their team mates for the whole race and then pop out in the last few hundred meters. Sure, there's split second tactics to get right, and they have to be able to push enormously hard on the pedals for a few seconds, but they're rubbish at everything else (I know, a bit of a generalisation, but ykwim).

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all. On the track, sure, but not on the road.

I watched a lot of the Tour this year - loved all the long stages, especially the mountains. But the sprints were a bit of a yawn for me.

Iain? Is that you?

Who's Iain? No, just me. Probably a very naïve view that may change over time, but there it is.

Daz555

Cav - Britain's greatest road cyclist.
Hoy - Britain's greatest track cyclist.

Wiggins - Britain's greatest cyclist.

chrisaonabike

RichN95 wrote:

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all.

They win lots of races. More than any other riders. That's the point of them.

Yes, but what's the point of riding a very long way out of the wind, just for a few seconds at the end? Might just as well not bother with the preceding ten billion miles, you can guarantee they'll do nothing interesting in the meantime.

Other than a bunny hop over a mini roundabout, admittedly. God, that was exciting. It sure got the commentators fawning over Cav's mastery of the bike. FFS, even I can do that.

No_Ta_Doctor

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all.

They win lots of races. More than any other riders. That's the point of them.

Yes, but what's the point of riding a very long way out of the wind, just for a few seconds at the end? Might just as well not bother with the preceding ten billion miles, you can guarantee they'll do nothing interesting in the meantime.

Other than a bunny hop over a mini roundabout, admittedly. God, that was exciting. It sure got the commentators fawning over Cav's mastery of the bike. FFS, even I can do that.

Right, to take this seriously...

Firstly, any sprint stage has to be controlled to be a sprint stage. There is always a breakaway to reel in. This brings up team tactics - who does the work to fetch it back? who has the legs to lead out their sprinter at the end?

Secondly, though the sprint is over in seconds, the last 10km is usually quite interesting in seeing how the teams jockey for position. No-one wants to use too much energy, but no-one wants to be caught behind and have to make up ground quickly.

Thirdly, there's a huge difference between being able to sprint flat out after 20km and 200km.

Fourthly, though the leg sapping first 150km of a "sprint stage" may be fairly boring, the sight of the full peloton steaming toward the sprint at top speed, and the sprinters bursting out from the front, is absolutely awesome.

PS - Iain is the forum's resident grouchy sprint hater.

gsk82

sjmclean wrote:

gsk82 wrote:

I'd say froome has achieved more than wiggins on the road although, wiggins was obviously the trailblazer.

Chris Froome Palmares

Stage races
Tour de France (2013)
Critérium du Dauphiné (2013)
Tour de Romandie (2013)
Critérium International (2013)
Tour of Oman (2013)

Bradley Wiggins
Tour de France (2012)
Critérium du Dauphiné (2011, 2012)
Paris–Nice (2012)
Tour de Romandie (2012)
One-day races and Classics
National Time Trial Championships (2009, 2010)
National Road Race Championships (2011)

Between these two but depends how you define it. I'd say Wiggins but will quicky be over taken by Froome

i'd add in wiggins' 3rd in the tdf and vuelta and froomes 2nd in both, plus froome won on ventoux. if both finished now i agree it would be tight

sbbefc

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

ChrisAOnABike wrote:

I don't see the point of specialist sprinters on the road at all.

They win lots of races. More than any other riders. That's the point of them.

Yes, but what's the point of riding a very long way out of the wind, just for a few seconds at the end? Might just as well not bother with the preceding ten billion miles, you can guarantee they'll do nothing interesting in the meantime.

Other than a bunny hop over a mini roundabout, admittedly. God, that was exciting. It sure got the commentators fawning over Cav's mastery of the bike. FFS, even I can do that.

They still have to usually catch the break and regardless of being shielded by team mates theyre still on the road for hours. First to cross the line, it doesnt matter how.

However.

For me its Wiggins, Froome, cav.

Froome will no doubt overtake wiggins though, his win on Ventoux was legendary.

alihisgreat

Daz555 wrote:

Cav - Britain's greatest road cyclist.
Hoy - Britain's greatest track cyclist.

Wiggins - Britain's greatest cyclist.

can't argue with that.

Tom Butcher

I'd say Wiggins over Cav, just. I don't count Froome as British whatever it says on his passport or racing licence but even with him in the equation I'd still go for Wiggins as things stand. The Olympic TT has to be worth adding to Wiggins' palmares above.

tailwindhome

Cavendish has won in excess of 100 professional races - 43 of those in Grand Tours
He's won the points Jersey in all 3 Grand Tours, winning 4 times in Paris.
He's won the British National Title and the Worlds.
He's won Scheldeprijs 3 times, KBK once and Milan San Remo
He's been World Champion twice on the track and Commonwealth Champion once.
And he's won 2 stage races.


I reckon he's ahead of Wiggins.

No_Ta_Doctor

TailWindHome wrote:

Cavendish has won in excess of 100 professional races - 43 of those in Grand Tours
He's won the points Jersey in all 3 Grand Tours, winning 4 times in Paris.
He's won the British National Title and the Worlds.
He's won Scheldeprijs 3 times, KBK once and Milan San Remo
He's been World Champion twice on the track and Commonwealth Champion once.
And he's won 2 stage races.


I reckon he's ahead of Wiggins.

Not arguing with your general point, but track doesn't count for this one.

yorkshireraw

TailWindHome wrote:

Cavendish has won in excess of 100 professional races - 43 of those in Grand Tours
He's won the points Jersey in all 3 Grand Tours, winning 4 times in Paris.
He's won the British National Title and the Worlds.
He's won Scheldeprijs 3 times, KBK once and Milan San Remo
He's been World Champion twice on the track and Commonwealth Champion once.
And he's won 2 stage races.


I reckon he's ahead of Wiggins.

Bang on. Every single RR Pro wants to wear Rainbow, and few get to. He's one of them. If he was Belgian he'd be the biggest sports star in the country.

dougzz

Cav by a long way. A monument, a World Champion, and a shed load of wins.

TMR

Cavendish. Stage Wins > TdF Victory IMHO.

Outsider art by Loan

Lots of people have won the tour. Far fewer have won as many stages as Cav (he's up there with Merckx and Hinault, if that says anything...).

Froome is nominally British - about as British as I am, and I've never been near the damn place. I suppose he'd take it for Africa though.

greasedscotsman

YorkshireRaw wrote:

If he was Belgian he'd be the biggest sports star in the country.

Err, no. He would be a long way behind Tom Boonen...

phreak

Not to mention behind Wiggins.

Richmond Racer

phreak wrote:

Not to mention behind Wiggins.

Droll

Rodrego Hernandez

Cav by a long way.

Robert Miller defo up there as a trail blazer and great champion in the days before english speakers were are common in europe.

Dave Millar is a cheat and doesn't count ;-)

meursault

sjmclean wrote:

gsk82 wrote:

I'd say froome has achieved more than wiggins on the road although, wiggins was obviously the trailblazer.

Chris Froome Palmares

Stage races
Tour de France (2013)
Critérium du Dauphiné (2013)
Tour de Romandie (2013)
Critérium International (2013)
Tour of Oman (2013)

Bradley Wiggins
Tour de France (2012)
Critérium du Dauphiné (2011, 2012)
Paris–Nice (2012)
Tour de Romandie (2012)
One-day races and Classics
National Time Trial Championships (2009, 2010)
National Road Race Championships (2011)

Between these two but depends how you define it. I'd say Wiggins but will quicky be over taken by Froome

You are missing a shed load of golds from the olympics. Wiggins is our best cyclist by a long way.

greasedscotsman

meursault wrote:

You are missing a shed load of golds from the olympics. Wiggins is our best cyclist by a long way.

Only one. Track wins don't count on this thread.