Sky are dopers - Oh no they're not
Comments
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Well VO2 max appears to be the new hitting stick.0
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Ah, I see - you live in a parallel universe. That explains things.rayjay wrote:Everything you have said I could say the exact opposite and thats my reasons for suspicionCan I upgrade???0 -
Approvied drug taking would be the death of the sport.rayjay wrote:They will cheat they will dope . So lets let them and lets let them do it safely rather than end up like Rico nearly dead. As for listing all the possible effects of a drug. There can be horrid side effects from just taking asprin etc etc. If you read the possible effect of any drug and thought that could happen to you, you would not take.
All we'd end up with are "safe" dopers riding alongside the "unsafe" dopers who would take risks to gain an advantage and of course win via this advantage. The sport would be no more fair than it is now. More riders would be dead though.You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.0 -
Daz555 wrote:
Approvied drug taking would be the death of the sport.rayjay wrote:They will cheat they will dope . So lets let them and lets let them do it safely rather than end up like Rico nearly dead. As for listing all the possible effects of a drug. There can be horrid side effects from just taking asprin etc etc. If you read the possible effect of any drug and thought that could happen to you, you would not take.
All we'd end up with are "safe" dopers riding alongside the "unsafe" dopers who would take risks to gain an advantage and of course win via this advantage. The sport would be no more fair than it is now. More riders would be dead though.
WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
And you end up with teenagers doping. And then parents doping their children so they can keep up with the teenagers.
edit: as mrgoat says.0 -
RichN95 wrote:
To quote soemone who knows a little about such matters:Milton50 wrote:"Sky have never measured his V02 max"
That's an odd one considering how Kerrison and Sky in general train so scientifically to each rider's physiology.
Jonathan Vaughters
@Vaughters
@SSbike no idea. Vo2 max is concept from the 50's. We deal with lactate metabolism and ability to process o2 over long durations.
VO2 max in amongst cycling observers is still popular because LeMond had a very high one (92.5) and he tends to wave it around like a twelve inch dick (although KA Arvesen actually had a higher one)
I recently had lunch with a gold medal winning rower from London 2012. Interesting chat about various things, but the whole idea of V02 max and heart rates etc as any kind of predicator to performance was swiftly despatched. It is indeed all about the bloods. If t'internet nutters start using the lack of a V02 test results as further 'proof' of Chris Froome and Sky's dodginess, they don't understand very much about sports science these days.0 -
rayjay wrote:... Everything you have said I could say the exact opposite ...
Magnificent!
ddraver had Nimrod as a soundtrack to Rick's splendid line-in-the-sand post... all I can think of for rayjay's response is that bloke at the end of Dr Strangelove riding the A-bomb...0 -
Daz555 wrote:rayjay wrote:They will cheat they will dope . So lets let them and lets let them do it safely rather than end up like Rico nearly dead. As for listing all the possible effects of a drug. There can be horrid side effects from just taking asprin etc etc. If you read the possible effect of any drug and thought that could happen to you, you would not take.
While we're at it why not legalise all drugs?Scott Speedster S20 Roadie for Speed
Specialized Hardrock MTB for Lumps
Specialized Langster SS for Ease
Cinelli Mash Bolt Fixed for Pain
n+1 is well and truly on track
Strava http://app.strava.com/athletes/16088750 -
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.0 -
Guardian's input... http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/ju ... roome-data0
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100% what he just said.rayjay wrote:oooooohh I seemed to have touched a few nerves. Armstrong did not dupe me .I was never stupid enough to believe that you could ride like that clean. I have been over to the tour many times and have enjoyed it very much. Armstrong was the greatest rider of his era and his tour wins and all tour wins should stand IMO. Rick your replies are just another way of saying the same thing. I have heard it all before. Laughing at Americans, your sounding a bit xenophobic Rick. You can talk about wind conditions etc etc but there have been some extrodinary times in this tour, ax was very fast and that was after riding up the previous climb at a blistering speed. Everything you have said I could say the exact opposite and thats my reasons for suspicion. If you think that the times are not suspicious then I am fine with that .I dont seem to take it as personal as you do. But their are those among us who are suspicious. Again I say you will not stop riders looking for an advantage. They will cheat they will dope . So lets let them and lets let them do it safely rather than end up like Rico nearly dead. As for listing all the possible effects of a drug. There can be horrid side effects from just taking asprin etc etc. If you read the possible effect of any drug and thought that could happen to you, you would not take. I have not made a personal attack on any poster yet their seems to be a lot of anger in some of your replys. Im enoying the tour very much and when the next riders gets busted it will not upset one bit [they took it not me] as much as it seems to upset some of you. Its pro sport, its what athletes do. They always have. Im loving this tour. Peace and love and free speech to you all ..... Come on Contador.
beware the hatred that come with non compliance with the contadors dirty and froome and wiggins are without even suggestion of foul play mind set.
The Clinic is mental but this place mocks it and at times is as daft the other way.
Good that everyone has their own opinon.
Just that most are wrong
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Why do parents dress their 6yr olds like hookers to win beauty pagents????Daz555 wrote:
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?0 -
To be pro Lance fanbois for a mo, We never really had this discussion about Lances numbers.... couldn't help myself throwing that in there.
IMO There is a sizable chunk of commentary on the certainty of froome being dirty coming as a belated sideways defense of lance rather than an attempt to expose some cheating at sky. I think It's really about self esteem of the posters involved. the selectivity of targets is absurd if you stop and muse over it for a minute or two.
I can not put any handles on the data thing. And No one at this site has demonstrated to me any real expertise on the subject.....ever.
paraphrasing vaughters, If a gun was placed against to my head and I had to choose yes or no whether sky are clean or not I would say clean....but I am going to wince real hard praying I don't hear that trigger click as I say it.
As for ricks rant...pfft yeah but what did you expect,
and as for johnny bugnos rant, he doesn't get to express an opinion in my book.... after we have all been subjected to DECADES of BS from the sport at all levels to us the consumers of their "product" and the rationale for their wage check I can categorically say with absolute conviction that I have an overpowering sense of self-entitlement to tell him to go and FHS for even daring to use the word respect or even expressing an opinion at all
like LA et al thy all need to take a big dose of STFU
who is going to get the last word in all this? because we all want to feel part of that crew. but the world (and the internet) doesn't really work like that"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:
Why do parents dress their 6yr olds like hookers to win beauty pagents????Daz555 wrote:
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?
I don't know.
If you knew that if your child showed promise at a sport they would be pumped full of drugs by some amateur team, would you encourage them in it?"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
[quote="rickyrider
Ithey don't understand very much about sports science these days.[/quote]
That's the problem Rick. everyone who has Google thinks they are an expert on power metering/haemotology/sports medicine when in fact they seem to be struggling to ride a bike imo. Those subjects I've listed take years of study to understand and you can skew the data any way if you interpret the figures wrongly.M.Rushton0 -
I just don't understand why there's so much focus on VO2Max. How can hair care products be so important to the outcome of a race?
And if it's such a big deal, why is nobody questioning Alberto's VO5, that's got to be more impressive than Vo2.Warning No formatter is installed for the format0 -
No tA Doctor wrote:I just don't understand why there's so much focus on VO2Max. How can hair care products be so important to the outcome of a race?
And if it's such a big deal, why is nobody questioning Alberto's VO5, that's got to be more impressive than Vo2.
Surely you mean Kittel's V050 -
rickyrider wrote:No tA Doctor wrote:I just don't understand why there's so much focus on VO2Max. How can hair care products be so important to the outcome of a race?
And if it's such a big deal, why is nobody questioning Alberto's VO5, that's got to be more impressive than Vo2.
Surely you mean Kittel's V05
Yep the way that hair stays up, there is definitely a banned substance in that hair gel...Scott Speedster S20 Roadie for Speed
Specialized Hardrock MTB for Lumps
Specialized Langster SS for Ease
Cinelli Mash Bolt Fixed for Pain
n+1 is well and truly on track
Strava http://app.strava.com/athletes/16088750 -
rickyrider wrote:No tA Doctor wrote:I just don't understand why there's so much focus on VO2Max. How can hair care products be so important to the outcome of a race?
And if it's such a big deal, why is nobody questioning Alberto's VO5, that's got to be more impressive than Vo2.
Surely you mean Kittel's V05
Nope
http://www.vo5haircare.com/Warning No formatter is installed for the format0 -
No tA Doctor wrote:I just don't understand why there's so much focus on VO2Max. How can hair care products be so important to the outcome of a race?
And if it's such a big deal, why is nobody questioning Alberto's VO5, that's got to be more impressive than Vo2.
Not to mention that BMC seem to have sprayed their last Harmony at the Giro....a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
disgruntledgoat wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:
Why do parents dress their 6yr olds like hookers to win beauty pagents????Daz555 wrote:
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?
I don't know.
If you knew that if your child showed promise at a sport they would be pumped full of drugs by some amateur team, would you encourage them in it?
No I wouldn't, but you and I don't have the same perspectives as others. We know this goes on though, didn't some junior rider die in Belgium a couple of years ago? Im afraid i don't recall his name or the exact circumstances. A lot of the same possible motivating circumstances are present too.0 -
ddraver wrote:rayjay wrote:Everything you have said I could say the exact opposite
The whole tread could be summed up by this next sentence - Rick has evidence for what he says, you do not
ddraver you like to present an image of scientific maturity but your seemingly intransigent position that sky is clean is clouding your critical abilities. There was a time "scientists" claimed the world was flat and that the sailors who said otherwise were poorly educated idiots.
the truth is the whole sports been built with PED abuse in its DNA, its everywhere. Its still a magnificent spectacle.
And Contador is definitely the most exciting GT racer of several generations.
PS ROCK ON Buddy0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:
Why do parents dress their 6yr olds like hookers to win beauty pagents????Daz555 wrote:
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?
Oh for goodness sake don't be so silly, what a ridiculous false comparison. One is distasteful the other can drastically harm the physical health of your child.Correlation is not causation.0 -
Above The Cows wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:
Why do parents dress their 6yr olds like hookers to win beauty pagents????Daz555 wrote:
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?
Oh for goodness sake don't be so silly, what a ridiculous false comparison. One is distasteful the other can drastically harm the physical health of your child.
At the risk of going off on a tangent............
you should see the levels of suicide, mental health problems and substance abuse that these kids suffer as they get even a little older.0 -
the heat the heat its going to everyones heads, i off for an early lunch and an afternoon of Eurosport. Should be good.0
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Above The Cows wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:
Why do parents dress their 6yr olds like hookers to win beauty pagents????Daz555 wrote:
+1disgruntledgoat wrote:WHy would any parent support their child in junior racing if that was the outcome, also?
Oh for goodness sake don't be so silly, what a ridiculous false comparison. One is distasteful the other can drastically harm the physical health of your child.
I think dressing your child up as a tart can have some serious health and mental repurcussions on the child too!Scott Speedster S20 Roadie for Speed
Specialized Hardrock MTB for Lumps
Specialized Langster SS for Ease
Cinelli Mash Bolt Fixed for Pain
n+1 is well and truly on track
Strava http://app.strava.com/athletes/16088750 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:ddraver wrote:rayjay wrote:Everything you have said I could say the exact opposite
The whole tread could be summed up by this next sentence - Rick has evidence for what he says, you do not
ddraver you like to present an image of scientific maturity but your seemingly intransigent position that sky is clean is clouding your critical abilities. There was a time "scientists" claimed the world was flat and that the sailors who said otherwise were poorly educated idiots.
the truth is the whole sports been built with PED abuse in its DNA, its everywhere. Its still a magnificent spectacle.
And Contador is definitely the most exciting GT racer of several generations.
PS ROCK ON Buddy
Show me the evidence...Sky have today and it suggests that Froome is clean. 3 years I ve been waiting for some evidence that theyre doping. I can show you evidence that the world is round, see -
Seriously I ve been asked twice this morning to back up what I think. I really cannot understand people who think that its shutting down debate or trolling to ask for evidence! When I write reports at work I state explicitly what the observations are, what they might mean and then say what my interpretation is.
The doping fans are making wild accusations, they need to back them up
As for the fanboi nonsense, I think that's the fourth time this year i ve switched from being called a jealous Sky hater to a blind Sky Fanboi...which says it all reallyWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
Some people on this thread (im looking at both viewpoints here) need to read this book on basic scientific practise and the manipulation of data.
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There really wasn't. Unless by putting "scientists" in quotes you are alluding to the fact that such people were not scientists at all.Vino'sGhost wrote:There was a time "scientists" claimed the world was flat and that the sailors who said otherwise were poorly educated idiots.You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.0
This discussion has been closed.
