Drugs in other sports and the media.

rick_chasey

TwoToeBenny wrote:

The worlds gone mad with all this stuff... absolute bonkers.

You think so?

Is it not just a question of letting people chose their own identity and being polite enough to use their preferred pro-noun?

I mean, MPs manage to abide by the weird rules of “the honorable member of...” or “the honourable....” and all that jazz in parliament and they’re f@cking idiots.

flite

I neither said nor inferred that Caster is transgender. I do not have medical training but I have read and tried to understand as much as I can. I have great sympathy for the situation Caster was put in though no fault of her own, but my remarks were not about her.
I do realise there is a difference between transgender, inter-sex, naturally high testosterone levels, insensitivity to testosterone etc. And that testosterone levels are a just convenient measure, not the ultimate arbiter. Its a sliding scale, you can't put people in a box marked male or one marked female. So it we want to enable as many people as possible to compete in sport, how do we try to make it as fair and equal as we would want? I don't have an answer.
The point I was trying to make is that in the effort to be inclusive, it is important not to discriminate against those with naturally low testosterone levels, which includes most people who would class themselves as women.

Vino'sGhost

i think choosing your own gender is frankly on its own ridiculous and offensive and the sort of microminority agenda bollocks that spoils the world.

liberal hand wringing gone one step too far. No doubt some people will feel they should be offended by that view or be offended on behalf of someone else.

No_Ta_Doctor

Vino'sGhost wrote:

i think choosing your own gender is frankly on its own ridiculous and offensive and the sort of microminority agenda **** that spoils the world.

liberal hand wringing gone one step too far. No doubt some people will feel they should be offended by that view or be offended on behalf of someone else.

To be fair, that's exactly the sort of position I would have expected you to hold.

I'm sure that the murder rates of transgender women have factored into your thinking.

tailwindhome

RichN95 wrote:

TimothyW wrote:

Anyhow, if you're going to have female categorisation in sports then the line does have to be drawn somewhere, this undeniably seems a bit unfair on Caster Semenya though - I suppose opening these new restrictions up to the more traditional power events on the field and the sprints might open a rather bigger can of worms than they want to.

Maybe it's time to (officially at least) stop classifying them as men and women's events and have them as Open and (Gender) Restricted. It would also allow women to compete against men if they so wish.

Doesn't change the problem though? You'd still need a clear definition of gender.

iainf72

TimothyW wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

I certainly don't know of any instances where former men are competing against women.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/04/11/spor ... index.html

Joe Rogan talked about this a bit - Happened in MMA too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZgtMK0UxlY

It's a good discussion - Probably some stuff that would offend some.

Vino'sGhost

No tA Doctor wrote:

Vino'sGhost wrote:

i think choosing your own gender is frankly on its own ridiculous and offensive and the sort of microminority agenda **** that spoils the world.

liberal hand wringing gone one step too far. No doubt some people will feel they should be offended by that view or be offended on behalf of someone else.

To be fair, that's exactly the sort of position I would have expected you to hold.

I'm sure that the murder rates of transgender women have factored into your thinking.

Not at all why should i?

RichN95.

TailWindHome wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

TimothyW wrote:

Anyhow, if you're going to have female categorisation in sports then the line does have to be drawn somewhere, this undeniably seems a bit unfair on Caster Semenya though - I suppose opening these new restrictions up to the more traditional power events on the field and the sprints might open a rather bigger can of worms than they want to.

Maybe it's time to (officially at least) stop classifying them as men and women's events and have them as Open and (Gender) Restricted. It would also allow women to compete against men if they so wish.

Doesn't change the problem though? You'd still need a clear definition of gender.

That’s why I said there should be a ‘gender restricted’ category (for want of a better phrase). It applies limits without officially stating what a woman is. Similarly it doesn’t bar any woman from competing with men.

k1875

Blood doping at Lokomotiv Moscow c2006:

http://www.open-goal.co.uk/siferrymeetsgarryoconnor/

Around 34mins in. Some of you may need a translator.

dish_dash

Folks, on Caster Semenya, it is worth noting that she is intersex (i.e. was born with sex characteristics which are not typical of male/female) not transgender (i.e. born one gender but identify with another). It's an important distinction.

Vino'sGhost

dish_dash wrote:

Folks, on Caster Semenya, it is worth noting that she is intersex (i.e. was born with sex characteristics which are not typical of male/female) not transgender (i.e. born one gender but identify with another). It's an important distinction.

They should make her run on her own then round the track and give her medals.

I see the south africans have been calling on the spirit of past days and likening it to apartheid. Perhaps theyll give a few IAAF officials necklaces of tyres filled with burning petrol to encourage the right way of thinking.

rick_chasey

What on earth is wrong with you?

Vino'sGhost

Rick Chasey wrote:

What on earth is wrong with you?

Its a comment on the way things are done in South Africa

Vino'sGhost

here you go https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necklacing

rick_chasey

I know what it is.

Did you not get enough love as a teenager?

blazing_saddles

Vino'sGhost wrote:

dish_dash wrote:

Folks, on Caster Semenya, it is worth noting that she is intersex (i.e. was born with sex characteristics which are not typical of male/female) not transgender (i.e. born one gender but identify with another). It's an important distinction.

They should make her run on her own then round the track and give her medals.

She's already running around the track on her own and they are giving her medals.

The_Boy

k1875 wrote:

Blood doping at Lokomotiv Moscow c2006:

http://www.open-goal.co.uk/siferrymeetsgarryoconnor/

Around 34mins in. Some of you may need a translator.

Was just coming to post that. I know there's the whole treating blood with UV thing that is doing the rounds in some sports circles (which would tie in with him referring to them 'cleaning' the blood), but that's an actual smoking gun right there.

And nobody batting an eyelid at it either.

No_Ta_Doctor

The_Boy wrote:

k1875 wrote:

Blood doping at Lokomotiv Moscow c2006:

http://www.open-goal.co.uk/siferrymeetsgarryoconnor/

Around 34mins in. Some of you may need a translator.

Was just coming to post that. I know there's the whole treating blood with UV thing that is doing the rounds in some sports circles (which would tie in with him referring to them 'cleaning' the blood), but that's an actual smoking gun right there.

And nobody batting an eyelid at it either.

The "put it back in before the game" bit doesn't sound like UV treatment though. He's specifically talking about being at a training camp "for four days" when the blood is removed.

The_Boy

No tA Doctor wrote:

The_Boy wrote:

k1875 wrote:

Blood doping at Lokomotiv Moscow c2006:

http://www.open-goal.co.uk/siferrymeetsgarryoconnor/

Around 34mins in. Some of you may need a translator.

Was just coming to post that. I know there's the whole treating blood with UV thing that is doing the rounds in some sports circles (which would tie in with him referring to them 'cleaning' the blood), but that's an actual smoking gun right there.

And nobody batting an eyelid at it either.

The "put it back in before the game" bit doesn't sound like UV treatment though.

It doesn't, and i thought I had said as much. Simply think it's fair to point out that a throwaway comment could mean many things. Might be a good idea to have him in front of a commons select committee to see if they can get to the bottom of it.

kingstongraham

This hasn't aged well:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-athl ... SKCN0XK0FT

shinyhelmut

KingstonGraham wrote:

This hasn't aged well:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-athl ... SKCN0XK0FT

Ah but his sample was doctored. We know that because he was warned in advance of the out of competition test and he would have just skipped it if he was "glowing"...

Clearly the testers doctored his sample because the bribe he paid them was not enough. Because that's what you would do if you're clean, bribe the testers.

https://saddiqueshaban.wordpress.com/2018/05/03/asbel-kiprop-statement-on-adrv-charges-against-him/amp/

sherer

The_Boy wrote:

k1875 wrote:

Blood doping at Lokomotiv Moscow c2006:

http://www.open-goal.co.uk/siferrymeetsgarryoconnor/

Around 34mins in. Some of you may need a translator.

Was just coming to post that. I know there's the whole treating blood with UV thing that is doing the rounds in some sports circles (which would tie in with him referring to them 'cleaning' the blood), but that's an actual smoking gun right there.

And nobody batting an eyelid at it either.

we all know there's no doping in football so im sure it's all innocent and above board

How widely has this been circulated, doubt FIFA or UEFA would have seen that clip

shirley_basso

Robinson Cano: $240m baseball star banned for 80 games for failed drugs test - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/baseball/44133177

Babahahaha

takethehighroad

Not quite along the same lines as some of the others but Richard Osman made a great joke on Fighting Talk on Saturday.

"A lot of people say they have God on their side when they win at sport. We already have anti-doping regulations, I think we should have some anti-Poping regulations"

Tashman

TakeTheHighRoad wrote:

Not quite along the same lines as some of the others but Richard Osman made a great joke on Fighting Talk on Saturday.

"A lot of people say they have God on their side when they win at sport. We already have anti-doping regulations, I think we should have some anti-Poping regulations"

Heard that too, made me actually LOL. Got some looks as I was out walking just chuckling to myself.

lostboysaint

The England cricket selectors are clearly on something and I suspect that Gareth Southgate will prove to be later this morning.

salsiccia1

Shirley Basso wrote:

Robinson Cano: $240m baseball star banned for 80 games for failed drugs test - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/baseball/44133177

Babahahaha

That's half a season. They obviously take this sort of thing seriously over there :roll:

shirley_basso

Salsiccia1 wrote:

Shirley Basso wrote:

Robinson Cano: $240m baseball star banned for 80 games for failed drugs test - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/baseball/44133177

Babahahaha

That's half a season. They obviously take this sort of thing seriously over there :roll:

Excuse made me chuckle.

dolan_driver

This is quite an interesting read! I think it's something we all suspect but amazingly this poorly kept secret is allowed to simmer away with very few journalists brave enough to tackle the subject. Hammer cycling (quite rightly as we know) but let the grand world of football off the hook.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer ... 43284.html

DD.

RichN95.

Dolan Driver wrote:

This is quite an interesting read! I think it's something we all suspect but amazingly this poorly kept secret is allowed to simmer away with very few journalists brave enough to tackle the subject. Hammer cycling (quite rightly as we know) but let the grand world of football off the hook.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer ... 43284.html

DD.

Unfortunately written by a Kimmage wannabe.

There's probably doping in football, but bring up Ronaldo and Messi is a little spurious - especially as Messi had necessary HGH when he was eleven. Recently I heard on a football podacst that the outfield player who ran the second least per game in the Champions League was Ronaldo. And the one who ran the least, by a very long way, was Messi.