The official TrainerRoad thread

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  • daveyok
    daveyok Posts: 69
    Day off tomorrow! Looking forward to starting week 2 of the plan on Boxing Day.

    Merry Christmas
  • kleinstroker
    kleinstroker Posts: 2,133
    dw300 wrote:
    If you haven't failed a test and are adding lots of Watts to your FTP, then re-test, otherwise your FTP isn't set right. The first time you blow up and fail to complete an FTP test (at a pace that would see you improve it by just a couple of percent or <10W) then you'll know it's set right.

    Cool! That means my complete failure at last weeks 8 minute test is now a success. Definitely went out too hard but surprised at the fail never the less
  • springtide9
    springtide9 Posts: 1,731
    Not sure if people remember the tests with the Satori I did to recalibrate it to the PT figures, but got an email from TR today....

    Sorry this took so long. I've added these new formulas. Look for
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 1
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 2
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 3
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 4
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 5
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 6
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 7
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 8
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 9
    Tacx Satori (powertap) 10

    As I have swapped out the Satori for a RnR these have little value to me anymore, so have shared the email...
    Simon
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    Many thanks for that..
    I am going to use the new formula to see if the workouts have a different feel to them. ie harder

    edit:

    just used it for 30 minutes or so. and need to retest and reset current ftp.
    I recommend any satori user should use this version.
  • daveyok
    daveyok Posts: 69
    Just done Ericcson. I could have done with some advanced visual warnings and I didn't seem to get the beeps every time . Still, the hour went past very quickly.

    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/136815

    If it's heavy rain tomorrow, I think I'll crack on with Monitor. Quite keen to get out on the road as I've discovered my Garmin does vertical ascent and balance(?).
  • richa
    richa Posts: 1,632
    Got a Kurt Kinetic RnR for Christmas and am a little unsure how to set up to get consistent results (previously used a Tacx Flow).

    It doesn't seem to have a quick release for the brake unit - So to get the wheel/bike on/off the KK you have to undo the handle. How do you ensure a consistent tightness the next time?

    Thanks.
    Rich
  • dashik
    dashik Posts: 156
    Well I've been using trainer road for a few weeks along with just interval training before that.

    I went out Christmas Eve and again today for the first time in a while due to icy/bad weather.

    Now I've certainly not used it long enough yet to get an improvement but I can say that I was pleasantly surprised at my time over my usual Glenrothes Circuit and that I'm definitely not any worse than I was so if nothing else at this point the Turbo is helping maintain my fitness and that alone makes TR and the Turbo worth the time/effort/money :D
    http://www.endomondo.com/workouts/tNSG6qnWmYk
    http://app.strava.com/athletes/1014761
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    The result of the updated Satori PT power curve
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/137452
    Now it is telling the truth!
    Again thnks to Springtide9 for going to all the trouble of getting this curve onto TR.
  • wardieboy
    wardieboy Posts: 230
    RichA wrote:
    Got a Kurt Kinetic RnR for Christmas and am a little unsure how to set up to get consistent results (previously used a Tacx Flow).

    It doesn't seem to have a quick release for the brake unit - So to get the wheel/bike on/off the KK you have to undo the handle. How do you ensure a consistent tightness the next time?

    Thanks.

    I've got a dedicated bike on mine, but if I do need to take it off for whatever reason I try to tighten the brake down gradually until it completely stops slipping when jerking the wheel back and forth.

    I suppose you could tighten until the wheel is barely touching the brake and then count a number of complete turns and use that as your benchmark.

    Failing that you could partially deflate the rear each time you want to mount the bike and leave the brake set at a fixed position.

    Anyone have any other ideas?
  • twotyred
    twotyred Posts: 822
    If the R&R is anything like my Road Machine don't obsess about it. I bring the roller up to touch the tyre then give the knob another couple of turns. Doing this the speed to power meter correlation remains consistent
  • Ketocyclist
    Ketocyclist Posts: 1
    Hi,

    Does anyone know how much the Elite super Crono Power Fluid Wireless Trainer (number 158 on the TrainerRoad list) is off with VirtualPower against RealPower ? I emailed with Nate and Reid but they don't know the offset for this Elite. The Kurt Kinetic trainer was off by 30 watts or so.

    Thanks,

    Rob
  • richa
    richa Posts: 1,632
    twotyred wrote:
    If the R&R is anything like my Road Machine don't obsess about it. I bring the roller up to touch the tyre then give the knob another couple of turns. Doing this the speed to power meter correlation remains consistent
    Thanks.

    I was thinking that rolling resistance would effect it, but maybe all the resistance is internal and therefore as long as it is tight enough not to slip, additional resistance from extra tightening is minimal?
    Rich
  • daveyok
    daveyok Posts: 69
    Can't believe I'm actually looking forward to a 90 minute session on the Turbo tomorrow.
  • ianeire
    ianeire Posts: 14
    Question, used TR for the first time the other day and as I didn't know my FTP I used the recommended 200w on the 20 min test. I was unsure where to go after this so I continued on matching the power profile on the workout pretty easily, eventually ramping up to 240w-ish avg for the last 10 min, which felt like a proper workout. TR calculated a FTP of 211w, which judging by how easy that was to maintain, is too low. It also calculated a LTHR about 12-15bpm off what I hit in both v02 test and the Joe friel protocol test.

    I assume I shouldn't have bothered with the power profile on the 20min test and just should have tried holding whatever specific power I felt I could have for the duration? I think I`ll try the 8min test tomorrow.
  • daveyok
    daveyok Posts: 69
    ianeire wrote:
    Question, used TR for the first time the other day and as I didn't know my FTP I used the recommended 200w on the 20 min test. I was unsure where to go after this so I continued on matching the power profile on the workout pretty easily, eventually ramping up to 240w-ish avg for the last 10 min, which felt like a proper workout. TR calculated a FTP of 211w, which judging by how easy that was to maintain, is too low. It also calculated a LTHR about 12-15bpm off what I hit in both v02 test and the Joe friel protocol test.

    I assume I shouldn't have bothered with the power profile on the 20min test and just should have tried holding whatever specific power I felt I could have for the duration? I think I`ll try the 8min test tomorrow.

    On the very first test you should maintain the highest power you can over the interval. The profile would only have been right if your FTP was 200. Now you have a rough idea what you might be able to hold, you could always manually raise your FTP before the test.
  • ChrisSA
    ChrisSA Posts: 455
    Did the Hunted yesterday. The 20 minute climb in the middle was 1W higher than the 20minute section from my initial 60min FTP test. This would appear to promise some improvement...
    My Blog!
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  • stueys
    stueys Posts: 1,332
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/140336

    I've been pushing a bit since Boxing Day so took a nice, easy recovery ride today on the turbo. During the first hour i can see that (a) my heart rate seems to stay closely aligned to power output, is this a good indicator of a good level of aerobic base fitness? (b) my power zones indicate that the majority pf my time was tempo, heart rate indicates zone 2 for majority of the time, does this mean its time for a retest or just that heart rate isnt a great indicator of effort?

    Thanks for any advice. Ignore the odd peaks after the first hour, I was simulating hill climbs by playing with satori resistance and then just dropping into top.
  • Caller
    Caller Posts: 124
    Out of interest, do I really NEED a turbo specific tyre or will I be ok just using the Conti 4 Season that's on the bike at the moment?

    Does the turbo really wear tyres out that quickly?
  • mike101
    mike101 Posts: 42
    I wouldn't bother with a Turbo specific tyre. I just use old road tyres on a cheap wheel. If you plan to use the tyre again outside after a while on the turbo though, be careful - can get a bit slippy!

    I don't use TR but keep an eye on the thread as I'm considering it. One thing that strikes me as a bit strange though is that the TSS and IF numbers look much larger than mine do for equivalent rides logged on Training Peaks. Has anyone else noticed this?
  • Simmotino
    Simmotino Posts: 295
    Well my first 6 weeks of Trainer Road have come to a close.

    I wasn't a lard ar$e to start with, but was carrying a little extra timber than I would have liked on my 15st (5'10") frame. Having just finished the Intermediate Base Plan I, I've lost 9.5lbs and just under 2% of body fat meaning, in my book at least, Trainer Road works!

    Re-testing tomorrow before I start the Base II plan, so will be interesting to see how much increase there is on my FTP. I'm guessing there will be quite a climb as I started from a position of little time on the bike, so the legs were out of condition.

    It's not going to win me any medals, but I certainly feel a lot better than I have done for a while, and am totally hooked on TR! :mrgreen:
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    mike101 wrote:
    I wouldn't bother with a Turbo specific tyre. I just use old road tyres on a cheap wheel. If you plan to use the tyre again outside after a while on the turbo though, be careful - can get a bit slippy!

    I don't use TR but keep an eye on the thread as I'm considering it. One thing that strikes me as a bit strange though is that the TSS and IF numbers look much larger than mine do for equivalent rides logged on Training Peaks. Has anyone else noticed this?

    Do you mean the TSS and IF values given to the individual rides in the TrainerRoad catalogue? or
    the results of the rides by individual people being higher then expected?
    if latter, then probably their virtual power curve for their trainer not too exact or they have underestimated their ftp.
    I am using the new Powertap version for the Satori and all I say it has gotten harder.
  • daveyok
    daveyok Posts: 69
    Caller wrote:
    Out of interest, do I really NEED a turbo specific tyre or will I be ok just using the Conti 4 Season that's on the bike at the moment?

    Does the turbo really wear tyres out that quickly?

    I think it depends on the trainer. I use an Elite Fluid and one of my old tyres last ages on it. I've heard other people say their trainer shreds the tyre after a few uses.
  • manxshred
    manxshred Posts: 295
    I tried Perkins tonight with the front wheel raised for some hill training. It was quite a bit different than being flat. I stopped after 1.5 hours as I was done. Raising the front wheel definitely makes a difference.
  • Simmotino
    Simmotino Posts: 295
    New FTP test this morning having finished the Base I.

    6 weeks ago, having not been on the bike for a while, my 20 Minute Test was my first ride on Trainer Road and my first (in anger) on a turbo. I went out too quickly, paid the price, and ended up with a 264 FTP rating (which I then scaled back to 260).

    Tested this morning having followed the Base I with a couple of extra rides dropped in toward the end, and the 20 Minute Test this time was a little better paced (still struggled to nail it completely) at a much higher output resulting in an FTP of 324! :shock:. This coupled with the wight loss means I'm now at 3.5W/Kg too.

    I would have loved to jump for joy to celebrate the improvement, but it was more collapse in a heap and try desperately to avoid throwing up in my mouth!

    I'm not sure if I'll scale the FTP back a little to account for the exaggerated last 90 seconds, but I'm delighted by the improvement.

    Something tells me the next 6 weeks will hurt a little more than the last though...
  • Garryboy
    Garryboy Posts: 344
    Simmotino wrote:
    New FTP test this morning having finished the Base I.

    6 weeks ago, having not been on the bike for a while, my 20 Minute Test was my first ride on Trainer Road and my first (in anger) on a turbo. I went out too quickly, paid the price, and ended up with a 264 FTP rating (which I then scaled back to 260).

    Tested this morning having followed the Base I with a couple of extra rides dropped in toward the end, and the 20 Minute Test this time was a little better paced (still struggled to nail it completely) at a much higher output resulting in an FTP of 324! :shock:. This coupled with the wight loss means I'm now at 3.5W/Kg too.

    I would have loved to jump for joy to celebrate the improvement, but it was more collapse in a heap and try desperately to avoid throwing up in my mouth!

    I'm not sure if I'll scale the FTP back a little to account for the exaggerated last 90 seconds, but I'm delighted by the improvement.

    Something tells me the next 6 weeks will hurt a little more than the last though...

    Well done!

    Ive been a bit of a slacker over last week or so + have been spending time getting used to my new cycleops alu rollers, which has been 'interesting' back on the wagon from Wednesday!
  • Roubaixsl3
    Roubaixsl3 Posts: 48
    JGSI wrote:
    mike101 wrote:
    I wouldn't bother with a Turbo specific tyre. I just use old road tyres on a cheap wheel. If you plan to use the tyre again outside after a while on the turbo though, be careful - can get a bit slippy!

    I don't use TR but keep an eye on the thread as I'm considering it. One thing that strikes me as a bit strange though is that the TSS and IF numbers look much larger than mine do for equivalent rides logged on Training Peaks. Has anyone else noticed this?

    Do you mean the TSS and IF values given to the individual rides in the TrainerRoad catalogue? or
    the results of the rides by individual people being higher then expected?
    if latter, then probably their virtual power curve for their trainer not too exact or they have underestimated their ftp.
    I am using the new Powertap version for the Satori and all I say it has gotten harder.

    What was the change in your FTP after using the Powertap version ?. I've been using the standard Satori 5 and just noticed your post so will do the next workout on the Powertap version. Did a couple of runs lately and uploaded to Strava, power figures were way below what I've been (supposedly) putting out on TR. That said presumably the Strava figures are probabyl wildly inaccurate too.
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    Roubaixsl3 wrote:
    JGSI wrote:
    mike101 wrote:
    I wouldn't bother with a Turbo specific tyre. I just use old road tyres on a cheap wheel. If you plan to use the tyre again outside after a while on the turbo though, be careful - can get a bit slippy!

    I don't use TR but keep an eye on the thread as I'm considering it. One thing that strikes me as a bit strange though is that the TSS and IF numbers look much larger than mine do for equivalent rides logged on Training Peaks. Has anyone else noticed this?

    Do you mean the TSS and IF values given to the individual rides in the TrainerRoad catalogue? or
    the results of the rides by individual people being higher then expected?
    if latter, then probably their virtual power curve for their trainer not too exact or they have underestimated their ftp.
    I am using the new Powertap version for the Satori and all I say it has gotten harder.

    What was the change in your FTP after using the Powertap version ?. I've been using the standard Satori 5 and just noticed your post so will do the next workout on the Powertap version. Did a couple of runs lately and uploaded to Strava, power figures were way below what I've been (supposedly) putting out on TR. That said presumably the Strava figures are probabyl wildly inaccurate too.

    Yes, using the Powertap version of Satori resulted in a lower but effectively truer FTP figure for me.
    I got over the disappointment quickly of not being that talented :wink:

    edit:
    http://www.trainerroad.com/cycling/rides/142123 - definition of loss of 'form' bit of a struggle at the moment.. not brill at wanting to rack things up a bit now.
  • wardieboy
    wardieboy Posts: 230
    I'm toying with the idea of buying one of the sufferfest videos to mix things up a bit. Currently I have completed Intermediate base 1 and am now working through base 2.

    I'm not a big fan of 90 minute sessions on the turbo so was thinking of swapping out those out for a sufferfest session (and get out on the road for weekend rides as and when).

    Looking at the workout detail HHNF looks the best to compliment a base plan. Would you guy's recommend or suggest one of the other vids?
  • jgsi
    jgsi Posts: 5,062
    wardieboy wrote:
    I'm toying with the idea of buying one of the sufferfest videos to mix things up a bit. Currently I have completed Intermediate base 1 and am now working through base 2.

    I'm not a big fan of 90 minute sessions on the turbo so was thinking of swapping out those out for a sufferfest session (and get out on the road for weekend rides as and when).

    Looking at the workout detail HHNF looks the best to compliment a base plan. Would you guy's recommend or suggest one of the other vids?

    err HHNF is RACE pace and nasty.. the times I have done it, it has felt harder than an actual race!
    Having said that, they is all hard!
    Downward Spiral with Trainer Road has me a shambling heap at the end... it never did when running it on its own... try A very dark place.. anyways .. is the combo deal for buying Sufferfests still on?
  • wardieboy
    wardieboy Posts: 230
    JGSI wrote:
    wardieboy wrote:
    I'm toying with the idea of buying one of the sufferfest videos to mix things up a bit. Currently I have completed Intermediate base 1 and am now working through base 2.

    I'm not a big fan of 90 minute sessions on the turbo so was thinking of swapping out those out for a sufferfest session (and get out on the road for weekend rides as and when).

    Looking at the workout detail HHNF looks the best to compliment a base plan. Would you guy's recommend or suggest one of the other vids?

    err HHNF is RACE pace and nasty.. the times I have done it, it has felt harder than an actual race!
    Having said that, they is all hard!
    Downward Spiral with Trainer Road has me a shambling heap at the end... it never did when running it on its own... try A very dark place.. anyways .. is the combo deal for buying Sufferfests still on?

    Cheers, I was drawn to HHNF for the 2 x 20 profile as it didn't look miles away from the 4 x 10 @ FTP Lamark session in base plan 2:
    Lamark

    Thanks for the tip on the combo deal, yes it is still on as a 3 Video Starter Kit - $31.99

    The Downward Spiral: Short, sharp and ultra-high-intensity intervals. 2. Angels: Long climbs with brutal attacks and 3. The Long Scream: A 30:00 time trial requiring maximum concentration. Save $4 off the regular price.

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