The big LIGHTS thread 2011-2014

KokaKona

-Archie- wrote:

bamba wrote:

Regarding 18650 batteries, far better to find your self an old laptop battery an get some good cells, imo far better than any second rate stuff from the far east, and often for free.

Thats' true, but measurement of cells' "state of health" requires some additional equipment, while most users have just ordinary charger and perhaps DMM...

I use all the slightly unscientific ways mentioned of trying to guess the health of my harvested cells, but I was wondering what equipment you'd recommend Archie to do the job properly? Is it expensive, because if so I guess it goes against the grain of getting the cells for free in the first place? I wondered for example whether there was some cheap PC software/hardware which could charge-discharge and record data...

diy

-Archie- wrote:

diy wrote:

But if all the cells have come out of the same laptop pack and hold the same voltage, there really isn't much point in doing anything more to determine the capacity.

Capacity and voltage are totally different things: there's no way to determine capacity by checking voltage only...

I think you already know, that I know that

However, it is fairly easy to work out rough capacity given a known current requirements and starting and ending voltage.

See: http://lygte-info.dk/info/BatteryCharge ... %20UK.html

-Archie-

diy wrote:

I think you already know, that I know that

I was pretty sure, but your last statement sounded like if you're suggesting to determine capacity based just on voltage, sorry. :oops:

-Archie-

KokaKona wrote:

I use all the slightly unscientific ways mentioned of trying to guess the health of my harvested cells, but I was wondering what equipment you'd recommend Archie to do the job properly? Is it expensive, because if so I guess it goes against the grain of getting the cells for free in the first place? I wondered for example whether there was some cheap PC software/hardware which could charge-discharge and record data...

Well, sometimes it's wise to invest initially, to save later.

The cell's state is determined by such major parameters as capacity, internal resistance, and self-discharge rate. Most important is, obviously, first one. It's very convenient to measure it by using processor-based universal charger, widely available as "hobby charger": I personally use Turnigy AccuCell 6. It is equipped with RS232-TTL data port (serial output), providing connection to PC via appropriate adapter: typically to USB. I've connected Bluetooth transmitter to it, so it transfers measurement data wirelessly. To collect & analyze the data, I use freeware LogView software, powerful and highly configurable, exporting results to the Excel spreadsheet and pictures with charge/discharge curves. It requires also separate power supply (charger itself capable to provide 6A current, but for playing with 18650, less expensive 2A supply is enough), adapter(s) for battery connection, and optionally thermal sensor.



Please note that sometimes such chargers are not calibrated properly at the factory, so it's worth checking/adjusting by external voltage reference.



For resistance measurement, I use Sinometer SM8124 impedance meter, but it requires a bit of modding. Device itself is very good, with proper four-wire Kelvin scheme, but is supplied with ordinary DMM-style test leads where cables are internally shorted together, spoiling whole purpose of using it. You'll have to buy correct Kelvin probes, or make ones yourself. I prefer the latter method, and used spring-loaded gold micro test pins and holders to make them.



As for self-discharge, I use Victor 86B meter with optical RS232 interface and USB receiver: supplied "DMM Data Processor" software collects the data, and is also capable of exporting directly into Excel spreadsheet.



On the photo below, you can see one of my self-made high capacity 12-cell 6P2S battery assembled with 18650 cells extracted from discarded notebook batteries and matched by parameters, using mentioned apparatus.




This particular set of equipment, of course, is just my personal setup: you can choose any other pieces more appropriate for your requirements. For beginning, hobby charger alone is probably sufficient. Good luck!

KokaKona

-Archie- wrote:

KokaKona wrote:

I use all the slightly unscientific ways mentioned of trying to guess the health of my harvested cells, but I was wondering what equipment you'd recommend Archie to do the job properly? Is it expensive, because if so I guess it goes against the grain of getting the cells for free in the first place? I wondered for example whether there was some cheap PC software/hardware which could charge-discharge and record data...

Well, sometimes it's wise to invest initially, to save later.
...
This particular set of equipment, of course, is just my personal setup: you can choose any other pieces more appropriate for your requirements. For beginning, hobby charger alone is probably sufficient. Good luck!

Comprehensive response, thanks Archie! :shock: I'm wondering about that hobby charger now...

Ouija

Some interesting battery packs just popped up on ebay.

Black Yellow
Gold Yellow
Turquoise Yellow

Makes you wonder if you can take the 18650's out and replace them and then stuff them back in the aluminium container or if the batteries are just normal shrink wrapped affairs stuffed in an aluminium can?

Also... 6 cell pack for only £14.

JamesB

Do look interesting and if I was in market for better battery pack would pursue; but to add to my previous praise of SingFire SF-90 (chinese) I continue to be impressed by it. http://dx.com/p/singfire-sf-90-cree-xm- ... 650-172351 but in blue---no idea if lumens quoted is correct !

Used in earnest on road last weekend and 2.5 hours on HIGH no sign light dimming and fabulous beam, OK for 30 mph down narrow country lane. Very impressed with it as a road light (beam may be too focussed for MTB) @ £22 or less can`t go wrong

Only criticism was screw mount thread poor so ended up with self tap screw and araldite...

diy

Also available from a uk(ish) seller for a couple of quid more.
http://www.7dayshop.com/7dayshop-super- ... head-light

JamesB

---and probably a lot quicker than seven weeks delivery too

BUT having got 2 SF 90 I am happy with them

-Archie-

Ouija wrote:

Some interesting battery packs just popped up on ebay.

Interesting, yes. BTW, the same battery is included in UltraFire dual-XML lights on DealExtreme:
http://dx.com/p/ultrafire-d-50-2-x-cree ... 650-203434
(also available in blue and gold color)

Also... 6 cell pack for only £14.

It is four-cell pack. And without knowing actual capacity, I'd refrain from judging about good price...

While we are on topic, short note about five-XML light from DX I've mentioned previously:
http://dx.com/p/5-x-cree-xm-l-t6-3000lm ... 650-192065

It arrived past week, but I haven't enough time to deal with it yet, nor to write review. In short, it is essentially junk engineering-wise, and I won't recommend buying it unless you're ready to do heavy job replacing core parts with self-made ones. To be continued...

Ouija

-Archie- wrote:

Ouija wrote:

Also... 6 cell pack for only £14.

It is four-cell pack. And without knowing actual capacity, I'd refrain from judging about good price...

Funny. Seemed oversized to me (compared to the connector). My four cell chinese packs are 66mm high and 37mm wide compared to this batteries 66x50mm. Wonder if it could be four 26650's?

-Archie-

Ouija wrote:

Wonder if it could be four 26650's?

Exactly.

-Archie-

Sheppy wrote:

Let me know how it is, I too am getting withdrawal symptoms...

Briefly, it's junk. Please excuse me, but currently I have no time to make proper review here. :oops: As for now, you can at least browse the pics from my article on domestic forum:
http://forum.biketime.ee/viewtopic.php?f=2&p=128010
Most of images are self-explanatory, I believe.

Just for fun, I've tried Google Translate on that page: the output is quite funny, but general sense of phrases is preserved relatively good, so you may want to try...

Cheers,

Twelly

Sorry to interrupt but I have a question.

I followed SS advice on this thread and bought 2 torches, 2 mounts, charger, adapter + batteries.

Firstly, the torches are epic. I recommend them to anyone. I do regular night rides with a group of lads and they have all spent £150+ on MTB lights and my <£50 set from DX blows them all away in terms of light and battery life.

But... the mounts are crap. three rides and they have eaten themselves so that they no longer grip the torch.

I am about to visit B and Q to buy some copper pipe guides and a pack of M5 bolts to fashion an engineering solution but before I do - anyone recommend a decent handlebar mount?

diy

The copper pipe clips do work, but the 22mm ones are not good for oversized bars (or you have to mount near the grips), you need 30mm clips for that.

Most people canabalise another clamp and use pipe clips.

Mine are some old electron clamps and pipe clips.


I super glue the bolts once I have them set right or use locking nuts - you can still adjust them but the glue stops them undoing.

Twelly

I may try and salvage the lower half of the DX mount which has a mechanism similar to yours (why they couldn't put the same system on both sides I don't know!) and attach the pipe clips to the top of them.

I prefer to mount the lights near the grips to reduce shadowing so the clamp size isn't an issue.

Cheers

Neal_

-Archie- wrote:

Sheppy wrote:

Let me know how it is, I too am getting withdrawal symptoms...

Briefly, it's junk. Please excuse me, but currently I have no time to make proper review here. :oops: As for now, you can at least browse the pics from my article on domestic forum:
http://forum.biketime.ee/viewtopic.php?f=2&p=128010
Most of images are self-explanatory, I believe.

Just for fun, I've tried Google Translate on that page: the output is quite funny, but general sense of phrases is preserved relatively good, so you may want to try...

Cheers,

That's saved me making a purchase as they looked like they had potential.

The 3T6 with diffuser tape on the lens & Magicshine MJ-6036 is working great so will stick with what I've got for a while...although may get a couple of XM-L2 U2 501B torches for the lid to replace the T6's

TwellySmat wrote:

But... the mounts are crap. three rides and they have eaten themselves so that they no longer grip the torch.

I am about to visit B and Q to buy some copper pipe guides and a pack of M5 bolts to fashion an engineering solution but before I do - anyone recommend a decent handlebar mount?

http://dx.com/p/universal-bicycle-mount ... -8mm-15342

I use those ^ and they work well, you need to tighten the bolt holding the two halves together occasionally to stop the rotating too easily or just glue them together once you've got them positioned right.

KokaKona

Neal_ wrote:

TwellySmat wrote:

But... the mounts are crap. three rides and they have eaten themselves so that they no longer grip the torch.

I am about to visit B and Q to buy some copper pipe guides and a pack of M5 bolts to fashion an engineering solution but before I do - anyone recommend a decent handlebar mount?

http://dx.com/p/universal-bicycle-mount ... -8mm-15342

I use those ^ and they work well, you need to tighten the bolt holding the two halves together occasionally to stop the rotating too easily or just glue them together once you've got them positioned right.

I get on well with the velcro ones:
http://dx.com/p/universal-adjustable-bicycle-mount-for-flashlights-2cm-4cm-diameter-31871

-Archie-

Neal_ wrote:

That's saved me making a purchase as they looked like they had potential.

Glad to see that my warning was useful.

Nobby Nic

Hi, I had one of these below) on my lid and it worked really well but somehow Ive lost the lense, can new ones be bought ? or is it spare parts now ?

http://dx.com/p/new-s06b-xm-l-t6-5-mode ... 650-125113

ZeeSaffa

Hi all,

Please can I have some recommendations?
I've read through this thread and to be honest it's quite technical and my little brain is baffled

I need a torch for my helmet that can run for around 1.5 hours (I'll keep a spare battery on hand if I need more).
I'd be happy for anything around 800 > 1000 lumen for night trail riding.
I already have an 1100 lumen P7 (I made the mistake of buying a Magicshine one which although works great for my needs... I've since discovered threads like these and could've probably saved myself a fair bit of expense)

This should be ok shouldn't it?

http://www.lightmalls.com/ultrafire-c8-cree-xm-l-u3-1800-lumen-5-modes-led-flashlight-1-x-18650

Could I run that on medium output for the power & duration I need?
I'll be switching it off / on regularly - so does it keep the previous mode setting?

Is there perhaps something smaller, lighter or cheaper that is worth considering for my needs?

Any suggestions on the best budget 18650 batteries & charger please? (from what I've read the Ultrafire ones from Lightmalls are no good?)

Ideally I don't want to spend more than £30 for the torch, charger & 2 batteries.

JamesB

From road experience the Sing Fire SF 90 is all you need; about 3 hr high beam run time, c £22 , 4 x 18650 cells, helmet or bar mount; Only draw back is waiting 6 weeks for it from dx extreme

http://dx.com/p/singfire-sf-90-cree-xm- ... 650-172351

been very pleased with performance, batteries are good, quick recharge time (2-3 hr), very bright light and as above 3 hr on high and at least 5 on medium . Very focussed beam with smooth reflector but also available with textured

ZeeSaffa

Thanks James!
That's pretty much the same as the MagicShine lamp I got a couple of months back... and it cost over double

I'm keen to get a torch that doesn't require a separate battery pack though. Any suggestions on that?

diy

The C8 is good and that is one of the decent LEDs to go for, but the beam pattern will not be the best.

See the 501b, with a Orange peel reflector. Smaller lighter and the smaller head works better with the LED IMO

http://www.lightmalls.com/ultrafire-wf- ... ch-1-18650

ZeeSaffa

Thanks!
Is there a difference between that 501b you mentioned and this one?

http://www.lightmalls.com/ultrafire-501b-cree-xml-u2-1300-lumen-5-mode-led-flashlight-1-18650

Is "U2" something different / better / worse?

Ouija

ZeeSaffa wrote:

Thanks!
Is there a difference between that 501b you mentioned and this one?

http://www.lightmalls.com/ultrafire-501b-cree-xml-u2-1300-lumen-5-mode-led-flashlight-1-18650

Is "U2" something different / better / worse?

"U2" is a more efficient version of the XML-T6 (brighter, generates less heat etc)

Neal_

Ouija wrote:

ZeeSaffa wrote:

Thanks!
Is there a difference between that 501b you mentioned and this one?

http://www.lightmalls.com/ultrafire-501b-cree-xml-u2-1300-lumen-5-mode-led-flashlight-1-18650

Is "U2" something different / better / worse?

"U2" is a more efficient version of the XML-T6 (brighter, generates less heat etc)

DIY linked to a XM-L2 rather than a XM-L T6 torch http://www.lightmalls.com/ultrafire-wf- ... ch-1-18650

XM-L2 (U2) are the newest & most efficient LEDs on offer at the moment

ZeeSaffa

Thanks!

From what I've seen on this thread it seems people seem to prefer to run 2 torches (such as the WF-501B that you referred to above) on their handlebars rather than the headlight style ones like these:
http://www.lightmalls.com/light-power-bicycle-lights-headlight-with-cree-xml-t6-emitter-1200-lumen-bike-light-kit#review-form

Would you say that's an accurate statement or not?

The reason I'm asking is because I figure if I'm going to place an order from Lightmalls I might get a couple of extra torches and replace my Magicshine MJ-808E on my handlebars with them.

Basically, what I'm asking is what is better / brighter?
2 torches on the bars or a 1200 lumen headlamp style light?

Neal_

Can't really say which would be brighter as the LEDs are randomly driven at different currents regardless of what the stated specs are.

I've got a couple of 501B torches which I strap to my lid and a 3 x T6 LED bike light on the bars which gives more than enough light. I like the torches, which I got first, as you can make sure you are getting decent cells and charger but wanted a powerful light with one switch so got the 3 x T6 light but the battery it came with is utter rubbish so I eventually bought a separate 6 cell magicshine battery which lasts for ages. In my experience the batteries that come with cheap bike lights from DX or Lightmalls etc aren't worth having so you end up having to buy a proper battery which the magicshine appear to be so I don't think buying a magicshine bike light and battery is an expensive option. If your magicshine light works ok then stick with what you've got.

bartimaeus

I always use lights on both bars and lid - when you go round corners your bar lights are of little use as they aren't pointing at the exit!

I'm using the C8 XML-U3 you linked to, and I really like it as it runs about 1amp on MED so lasts 2.5-3 hours on a decent cell, and the beam seems good to me though I swapped the reflector for an OP one from an old P7 SSC I had. I run one of the 501bs on my lid as they are smaller and lighter... mine is a T6 and again runs for about 2.5-3 hrs on MED.