Laws of race physics....

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Comments

  • kieranb
    kieranb Posts: 1,674
    this diving inside the corner happens quite a bit at Crystal Palace as well, seems to be the only way some people can make up ground, only a few riders doing it but usually some at every race.
  • Down the Road
    Down the Road Posts: 949
    The next question is why does the crash happen in the sprint for 30th place.

    Why are these guys sprinting in the first place?
    Racing is life - everything else is just waiting
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Down the Road wrote:
    The next question is why does the crash happen in the sprint for 30th place.

    Why are these guys sprinting in the first place?

    I assume it's because they want to get involved in a sprint for the sake of getting involved in a sprint...
  • Down the Road
    Down the Road Posts: 949
    Yes but WHY?????

    You sprint for the win. not to finish in the bunch

    Rule 70 applies

    http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/
    Racing is life - everything else is just waiting
  • Matt the Tester
    Matt the Tester Posts: 1,261
    Down the Road wrote:
    Yes but WHY?????

    You sprint for the win. not to finish in the bunch

    Rule 70 applies

    http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/
    what NapD said, and it's good practise i believe?? if you sprint everytime on the final lap to the finish and somehow you find yourself at the front...? well you see what im getting at here.
    Coveryourcar.co.uk RT Tester
    north west of england.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Down the Road wrote:
    Yes but WHY?????

    You sprint for the win. not to finish in the bunch

    Rule 70 applies

    http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/

    I assume it's because people pay 70 quid membership, 15 quid race entry fee, thousands on kit to live out their fantasy of sprinting for a finish. So they bloody well will do!
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,667
    Down the Road wrote:
    Yes but WHY?????

    You sprint for the win. not to finish in the bunch

    Rule 70 applies

    http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/

    I assume it's because people pay 70 quid membership, 15 quid race entry fee, thousands on kit to live out their fantasy of sprinting for a finish. So they bloody well will do!
  • freehub
    freehub Posts: 4,257
    inseine wrote:
    Mr Testers posts often seem a little agressive and, dare I say it, trollish, but wanting safer racing is a good thing.
    It does anoy me when people dive for a gap in a corner only to drift back straight afterwards. I always try to leave a bit of space even if I've got the inside line. Seen too many accidents. It would also be nice if people just had a bit of spacial awareness especially for riders behind them. Non of this do this as a career but I've seen careers nearly ended in a bike race.

    Nothing wrong with wanting safer racing, but it needs to be put across differently, less trollish and aggressive.

    One thing I hate is when you're in a race and all you hear from some riders is swearing, do this, do that FOR F**K SAKE.
  • Chip \'oyler
    Chip \'oyler Posts: 2,323
    freehub wrote:
    Chip \'oyler wrote:
    freehub wrote:
    Down the Road wrote:
    To not pick fits this week I am just referring to "The Rules"

    http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/

    For this argument

    Rules 5, 67 and 70 apply

    Who wrote that silly list?

    Silly? That is THE list and should be adhered to at ALL times.

    I'm hoping I'm failing to spot a joke and that you're actually joking.

    I sincerely hope you don't go out for a ride without checking the list first. :roll:
    Expertly coached by http://www.vitessecyclecoaching.co.uk/

    http://vineristi.wordpress.com - the blog for Viner owners and lovers!
  • mattshrops
    mattshrops Posts: 1,134
    Chip \'oyler wrote:
    freehub wrote:
    Chip \'oyler wrote:
    freehub wrote:
    Down the Road wrote:
    To not pick fits this week I am just referring to "The Rules"

    http://www.velominati.com/blog/the-rules/

    For this argument

    Rules 5, 67 and 70 apply

    Who wrote that silly list?

    Silly? That is THE list and should be adhered to at ALL times.

    I'm hoping I'm failing to spot a joke and that you're actually joking.

    I sincerely hope you don't go out for a ride without checking the list first. :roll:



    there must be rules or society will implode :wink:

    t
    Death or Glory- Just another Story
  • skinarelli
    skinarelli Posts: 64
    The thing I find annoying is that bloke who sits in between 10th and 20th place on the road the entire race shouting "up, up!" everytime someone attacks and expects the riders in front to speed up and tow him back to the breakaways. He then berates the fellers in front if they don't react and attempt to close the gap quick enough for his liking. Grrrrr!!!


    :evil:
    Bald is Beautiful
  • Chip \'oyler
    Chip \'oyler Posts: 2,323
    Skinarelli wrote:
    The thing I find annoying is that bloke who sits in between 10th and 20th place on the road the entire race shouting "up, up!" everytime someone attacks and expects the riders in front to speed up and tow him back to the breakaways. He then berates the fellers in front if they don't react and attempt to close the gap quick enough for his liking. Grrrrr!!!


    :evil:

    He must be a big bloke if he can take up 9 places :shock:
    Expertly coached by http://www.vitessecyclecoaching.co.uk/

    http://vineristi.wordpress.com - the blog for Viner owners and lovers!
  • P_Tucker
    P_Tucker Posts: 1,878
    Skinarelli wrote:
    The thing I find annoying is that bloke who sits in between 10th and 20th place on the road the entire race shouting "up, up!" everytime someone attacks and expects the riders in front to speed up and tow him back to the breakaways. He then berates the fellers in front if they don't react and attempt to close the gap quick enough for his liking. Grrrrr!!!


    :evil:

    Sounds like he's in prime position and is successfully getting others to do all the hard work for him. It's a race FFS, not some sort of hippy communist group ride.
  • ga02clr
    ga02clr Posts: 97
    :evil:[/quote]

    Sounds like he's in prime position and is successfully getting others to do all the hard work for him. It's a race FFS, not some sort of hippy communist group ride.[/quote]

    I agree entirely. Club run rules and racing rules are entirely different with this respect. Some of the things mentioned above however are more safety orientated and appropriate for both.
  • freehub
    freehub Posts: 4,257
    Maybe club run leaders should carry a set of those rules on their back and also have a whip in their possession?
  • ga02clr
    ga02clr Posts: 97
    An electric cattle prod may be even more effective.
  • zoom gordo
    zoom gordo Posts: 78
    more 'wisdom':

    http://zoom-gordo.blogspot.com/2011/03/ ... tting.html
    Gordo's World of Zoom http://zoom-gordo.blogspot.com/
    Those that can, do. Those that can't write about it.
  • ozzzyosborn206
    ozzzyosborn206 Posts: 1,340
    i don't see why people shouldn't sprint for minor places, at what stage do you think people should stop sprinting? surely the crashes get caused by people not sprinting coming into a finish when everyone else is. Yes it is up the the riders sprinting to make sure they don't smash into anyone but noone expects someone coming up to the finish to just sit up and slow down all of a sudden
  • P_Tucker
    P_Tucker Posts: 1,878
    ozzzyosborn206 wrote:
    noone expects someone coming up to the finish to just sit up and slow down all of a sudden

    Really? It happens in pretty much every race when someone goes too early and pops.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,697
    Come and ride in Holland - people are friendly here!
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ju5t1n
    ju5t1n Posts: 2,028
    zoom gordo wrote:
    more 'wisdom':

    http://zoom-gordo.blogspot.com/2011/03/ ... tting.html
    Enjoyed reading that, thanks for posting
  • paddlemyowncanoe
    paddlemyowncanoe Posts: 265
    It's nothing to do with physics at this level. Bike positioning and handling are psychological, limited by the rider's physiology. It's the limited fitness which means that Gordo's scenario is so often played out - hesitant, defensive group riding saving it for a chance to be in the lottery of that mad gallop. A crash, paradoxically, could be what many weaker riders are there for - it gives them a chance of improving their place from 23rd to 15th.

    Race experience is priceless, but on the other hand, maybe train more and in particular more specifically, then be in better shape to take part in attacks during the first hour. Perhaps we are all too focused on the points and not having fun and getting really involved.

    I wonder if sprinting for 23rd spot is encourgaed by BCF publishing positions 11 down to whatever. If they didn't there would be less pride lost.

    Meanwhile, here's a cracking example of what we're talking about:

    http://www.davehaywardphotos.com/SER...31300785_SNEyD
  • Tom Butcher
    Tom Butcher Posts: 3,830
    Certainly in a bunch finish unless you are in the points finishing position is fairly meaningless because so many people don't contest the sprint. If I thought I'd left myself no chance of a placing I'd keep pedalling so as not to get in the way but I'm not going to sprint balls out for 22nd position or something.

    Enjoying the racing by attacking is definitely the way to go - especially if you don't have skills/attitude you need to get a good position in a bunch coming into a finish.
    it's a hard life if you don't weaken.
  • P_Tucker
    P_Tucker Posts: 1,878
    Exactly - any half-decent rider won't contest the sprint the second they realise they have no chance of getting a top 5. Because WGAF who came 6th in the sprint?

    If the answer to that is "you", then you need a long hard look in the mirror. Seriously, even the best sprinters c0ck up occasionally and don't get a result - just because you've lost your position at the vital moment doesn't mean you are rubbish - it just means that you might as well sit this particular sprint out because you've already lost.
  • Down the Road
    Down the Road Posts: 949
    ozzzyosborn206 wrote:
    i don't see why people shouldn't sprint for minor places, at what stage do you think people should stop sprinting? surely the crashes get caused by people not sprinting coming into a finish when everyone else is. Yes it is up the the riders sprinting to make sure they don't smash into anyone but noone expects someone coming up to the finish to just sit up and slow down all of a sudden

    The correct head count from your spot in the bunch goes 2,4 ,6 ,8 bugger I can't WIN so why sprint?
    Racing is life - everything else is just waiting
  • mattshrops
    mattshrops Posts: 1,134
    arent there points available for top 10?
    Death or Glory- Just another Story
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,463
    Be a crap bunch finish if only those who had a genuine chance of winning sprinted!
  • amaferanga
    amaferanga Posts: 6,789
    Surely you're entirely justified in contesting the sprint if you think you're in with a chance of a placing that'll get you some points? And since usually you have no idea how good the people around you are in 3rd/4th Cat racing then it's always worth having a go even if you're a bit outside the top 10 with a few hundred metres to go.
    More problems but still living....
  • Tom BB
    Tom BB Posts: 1,001
    P_Tucker wrote:
    Exactly - any half-decent rider won't contest the sprint the second they realise they have no chance of getting a top 5. Because WGAF who came 6th in the sprint?

    If the answer to that is "you", then you need a long hard look in the mirror. Seriously, even the best sprinters c0ck up occasionally and don't get a result - just because you've lost your position at the vital moment doesn't mean you are rubbish - it just means that you might as well sit this particular sprint out because you've already lost.

    I'm sure the person who comes 6th in the sprint will be pretty chuffed-they've just scored some points!
  • ju5t1n
    ju5t1n Posts: 2,028
    mattshrops wrote:
    arent there points available for top 10?
    There are points for the top 20 in National A & B road races, and top 15 in Regional As

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