Students

Sewinman

Sound like the students are doing some old school window smashing and rioting at Millbank. Very retro - good on 'em. :twisted:

_Brun_

Pint in the Morpeth or what's left of it after work to survey the wreckage?

W1

Seems like another excuse for "protesters" to act like yobs.

Don't they have essays to write or something?

Sewinman

W1 wrote:

Seems like another excuse for "protesters" to act like yobs.

Don't they have essays to write or something?

Bah, humbug. Although In my student days I would have still been in bed at this time.

DonDaddyD

Personally I think Students are the one group who actually have something to riot... protest (sorry) about.

Though ironically most of them will have passed their courses by the time the tuition fees are increased. In fact it should be people with kids about to or are planning on going to Uni in the next 1 - 5years who should be marching a sh*t storm right now.

And yes, I think the increases are unfair.

Specialized Needs

You may wish to avoid Millbank tonight.

The protesters are currently on the roof of 30 Millbank (the lower building next to the tower), and trying to break into the main tower building, having thrown fireworks in.

The collecting point for the protesters is outside the Tate. A fair bit of glass around, as well :?

The whole area is currently in lockdown.

lost_in_thought

W1 wrote:

Seems like another excuse for "protesters" to act like yobs.

Don't they have essays to write or something?

+1

W1

Specialized Needs wrote:

You may wish to avoid Millbank tonight.

The protesters are currently on the roof of 30 Millbank (the lower building next to the tower), and trying to break into the main tower building, having thrown fireworks in.

The collecting point for the protesters is outside the Tate. A fair bit of glass around, as well :?

The whole area is currently in lockdown.

And what, I wonder, do they think this will achieve? Apart from evidencing the fact that perhaps they need better educating?

Maybe I should become a student again - it would be great to have Wednesdays free for a bit of random vandalism.

This will ruin SCR tonight.

Pufftmw

I think Millbank SCR might be limited this evening!

DonDaddyD

Protesting on a large scale usually displays civil unrest. It is usually bought about by the unfair or unjust actions of a Government.

Sus Laws = Brixton Riots.

Sometimes, especially in the cases where the Government don't or simply won't listen, the protest has gotten the results necessary.

Rosa Parks, sit-ins, civil rights movement, Black Panther Party, Million Man March. Poll Tax riots, Miners Strikes.

That people are so willing to become destructive and violent makes you wonder about the failings of the Government to improve the society and public it serves.

As I said earlier, its all well and good sitting there typing away 'what have students or hopeful students got to complain about' you may have your degrees and necessary qualifications or can afford the tuition fee increases. For my 16 yr old brother, making a life for himself just got that much more harder.

_Brun_

I'm tempted to buy innertubes in bulk and get down there to make a small fortune over the next week or so.

lost_in_thought

Yeah, the Miners' strikes certainly ended well.

W1

DonDaddyD wrote:

That people are so willing to become destructive and violent makes you wonder about the failings of the Government to improve the society and public it serves.

Or more simply that some people love a good riot, and a protest provides them decent cover to do so? It's the same explanation for football hooliganism.

I don't think that paying more for a degree represents a fair justification for violence and vandalism.

I have a lot of sympathy for your bro. A chap on the BBC basically said it was unfair for university to have been so widely encouraged, and then the fees increased. It was always madness to try to get 50% of people to university - much better to encourage vocational qualifications and send those who would really benefit to university at low-ish cost. That's not possible now simply due to the numbers of people who feel they "need" a degree when in fact they would be better off without one.

lost_in_thought

W1 wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

That people are so willing to become destructive and violent makes you wonder about the failings of the Government to improve the society and public it serves.

Or more simply that some people love a good riot, and a protest provides them decent cover to do so? It's the same explanation for football hooliganism.

I don't think that paying more for a degree represents a fair justification for violence and vandalism.

I have a lot of sympathy for your bro. A chap on the BBC basically said it was unfair for university to have been so widely encouraged, and then the fees increased. It was always madness to try to get 50% of people to university - much better to encourage vocational qualifications and send those who would really benefit to university at low-ish cost. That's not possible now simply due to the numbers of people who feel they "need" a degree when in fact they would be better off without one.

Again, spot on there W1.

I don't have a degree - doesn't seem to have held me back.

Sewinman

I think its great!

SimonAH

Call me a codger, but some of the things that you can take degrees in today are bloody laughable.

.....also a lot of the anger is produced because a lot of people were intending to hide behind a cake walk degree for three years until the financial climate improved...and now it doesn't seem such a good idea suddenly....

Coach H

DonDaddyD wrote:

Sometimes, especially in the cases where the Government don't or simply won't listen, the protest has gotten the results necessary.

Rosa Parks, sit-ins, civil rights movement, Black Panther Party, Million Man March. Poll Tax riots, Miners Strikes.

Not sure you can use the miners strikes as an example here. The only person who came out well there was Scargill and he still has the temerity to sue the NUM for not continuing to pay the morgage on his mansion!!

There are plenty of villages in Yorkshire who don't think they got the necessary result. You could find out for yourself by bringing the subject up in one of the working mens clubs........then again maybe not, don't want another riot

ketsbaia

W1 wrote:

Or more simply that some people love a good riot, and a protest provides them decent cover to do so?

Innit.

W1

ketsbaia wrote:

W1 wrote:

Or more simply that some people love a good riot, and a protest provides them decent cover to do so?

Innit.

Love it - "F**K Fees" - in my day I'm pretty sure you could get that for free an Uni.

Oddjob62

lost_in_thought wrote:

I don't have a degree - doesn't seem to have held me back.

I shouldn't have a degre... but i think they gave it to me to get rid of me

asprilla

I'm quite happy for fees to be increased, providing it's based upon how important the course is to the national economy:

Engineers - Free
Doctors - £3,000 per year
Physicist - £1,0000 er year

Media Studies - £10,000 per year
PPE - £50,000 per year

And so on....

el_presidente

Good luck to them. This country's economy as been brought close to breaking point by successive governments, about time someone stood up to the man.

pitchshifter

SimonAH wrote:

Call me a codger, but some of the things that you can take degrees in today are bloody laughable.

.....also a lot of the anger is produced because a lot of people were intending to hide behind a cake walk degree for three years until the financial climate improved...and now it doesn't seem such a good idea suddenly....

+1

Anyone gonna risk the millbank route tonight? Anyone got any alternative routes planned?

soundninjauk

Asprilla wrote:

I'm quite happy for fees to be increased, providing it's based upon how important the course is to the national economy:

Engineers - Free
Doctors - £3,000 per year
Physicist - £1,0000 er year

Media Studies - £10,000 per year
PPE - £50,000 per year

And so on....

Now now, we need all those PPE graduates to come into power and then put up the fees for everyone else coming after them.

W1

pitchshifter wrote:

SimonAH wrote:

Call me a codger, but some of the things that you can take degrees in today are bloody laughable.

.....also a lot of the anger is produced because a lot of people were intending to hide behind a cake walk degree for three years until the financial climate improved...and now it doesn't seem such a good idea suddenly....

+1

Anyone gonna risk the millbank route tonight? Anyone got any alternative routes planned?

I might head along for the craic. Otherwise south of the river and cross at Vauxhall (there aren't many pubs along there so I doubt the soap dodgers would bother going that far).

rjsterry

ketsbaia wrote:

W1 wrote:

Or more simply that some people love a good riot, and a protest provides them decent cover to do so?

Innit.

Indeed, some people on both sides by the look of that photo (and other recent protests).

Clever Pun

the roads are closed till 16.00 should be ok by 6ish

DonDaddyD

There is a difference between a protest and a riot. Should any group of people start rioting you'll know about it. I've never known a protest that hasn't been an inconvenience and that is what you are mostly complaining about, the inconvenience. It doesn't mean the students don't have a point or no right to protest.

Furthermore, I don't care about the past Government, vocational course blah blah bollocks. And LiT stand to one side you got to go to Oxford or Cambridge, dare I say you and yours could afford the increases for your kids to come. the circumstances of you not having a degree are your own, your own luck and skill will not be the same for every other person.

Quite besides which, what I care about are those who are able, intelligent enough and want a job that a degree demands but are priced out of doing so.

What is left for those people are your beloved vocational courses and a life imposed on them because the opportunity for something different was taken away.

It is once again a mechanism to impose a class divide and keep people there.

But I'm sure many will continue to advocate the fee increases, vocational courses and jobs those qualifications warrant. Those I suspect for many are OK for children as long as it isn't their kids.

greg66_tri_v2.0

Asprilla wrote:

Physicist - £1,0000 er year

Although one might hope that most physicists would know their numbers a bit better than that...

rick_chasey

Asprilla wrote:

I'm quite happy for fees to be increased, providing it's based upon how important the course is to the national economy:

Engineers - Free
Doctors - £3,000 per year
Physicist - £1,0000 er year

Media Studies - £10,000 per year
PPE - £50,000 per year

And so on....

I suggest you listen toStewart Lee's opinion. He's not far off the mark. Certainly closer than you are.

jzed

ketsbaia wrote:

W1 wrote:

Or more simply that some people love a good riot, and a protest provides them decent cover to do so?

Innit.