O, Danny Boy
Comments
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rayjay wrote:Rich, You have quite a few on here that slag off some dopers yet other doped riders, they will buy their books welcome them back in to the peloton . Its bull%%%% IMO.
I'd wager at least as many more on here denounce nobody. We're reading your stuff too....a rare 100% loyal Pro Race poster. A poster boy for the community.0 -
ddraver wrote:rayjay wrote:So it's ok for others to tell their stories and make some money?
But obviously only the dopers you like.
Rubbish - no one has said that. Stop stirring.
It's ok to write a tell-all-book if you tell all. Thus far he has shown no indication of this, he's only tried to shift blame. If he wanted to help, he'd have helped already...
It's not rubbish. Look at the Millar thread. Look at the way people are happy for a team like Garmin to race.
All doped all took drugs all cheated the same.
I don't see the same hatred aimed at them.
If Di Luca said he was sorry and had the smile of a car salesman would he be welcome back as well.
Who's more honest?0 -
You do realise that Di Luca has been banned on three separate occasions, don't you?rayjay wrote:It's not rubbish. Look at the Millar thread. Look at the way people are happy for a team like Garmin to race.
All doped all took drugs all cheated the same.
I don't see the same hatred aimed at them.
If Di Luca said he was sorry and had the smile of a car salesman would he be welcome back as well.
Who's more honest?
He used to tour schools giving talks about the evils of doping.
He roped in a priest to vouch for his reformed character.
He's a different level to your average doper.Twitter: @RichN950 -
rayjay wrote:ddraver wrote:rayjay wrote:So it's ok for others to tell their stories and make some money?
But obviously only the dopers you like.
Rubbish - no one has said that. Stop stirring.
It's ok to write a tell-all-book if you tell all. Thus far he has shown no indication of this, he's only tried to shift blame. If he wanted to help, he'd have helped already...
It's not rubbish. Look at the Millar thread. Look at the way people are happy for a team like Garmin to race.
All doped all took drugs all cheated the same.
I don't see the same hatred aimed at them.
If Di Luca said he was sorry and had the smile of a car salesman would he be welcome back as well.
Who's more honest?
You are, rajay, because you honestly couldn't give a flying f*** whether anyone doped or not.
Those of us that are bothered though, we take things like repeat offences seriously. This is Danilo's third (count them, three) suspension. It's difficult for any of us to accept any contrition he might possibly come out with at face value.Warning No formatter is installed for the format0 -
I don't like Millar/many of the Garmin riders because of their doping history....rayjay wrote:Look at the Millar thread. Look at the way people are happy for a team like Garmin to race.http://www.georgesfoundation.org
http://100hillsforgeorge.blogspot.com/
http://www.12on12in12.blogspot.co.uk/0 -
No tA Doctor wrote:rayjay wrote:ddraver wrote:rayjay wrote:So it's ok for others to tell their stories and make some money?
But obviously only the dopers you like.
Rubbish - no one has said that. Stop stirring.
It's ok to write a tell-all-book if you tell all. Thus far he has shown no indication of this, he's only tried to shift blame. If he wanted to help, he'd have helped already...
It's not rubbish. Look at the Millar thread. Look at the way people are happy for a team like Garmin to race.
All doped all took drugs all cheated the same.
I don't see the same hatred aimed at them.
If Di Luca said he was sorry and had the smile of a car salesman would he be welcome back as well.
Who's more honest?
You are, rajay, because you honestly couldn't give a flying f*** whether anyone doped or not.
Those of us that are bothered though, we take things like repeat offences seriously. This is Danilo's third (count them, three) suspension. It's difficult for any of us to accept any contrition he might possibly come out with at face value.
The fact he got caught 3 times does not mean he has doped any more than some one busted once. He just was more stupid to get caught.
If you want to see him banned for life then the others should be banned as well.
It's the same offence.
Ex dopers still riding could have gained long term advantages as well, depending on what PEDs they took.
So even a ex doper now riding clean could have benefited from cheating.
I am being honest with my opinion. I don't care if they dope. Why should I.
All I see is a lot of riders cheating and some back racing and some never riding again for the same offence.
Lets see the same penalty for everyone or just make PED's legal.0 -
rayjay wrote:No tA Doctor wrote:rayjay wrote:ddraver wrote:rayjay wrote:So it's ok for others to tell their stories and make some money?
But obviously only the dopers you like.
Rubbish - no one has said that. Stop stirring.
It's ok to write a tell-all-book if you tell all. Thus far he has shown no indication of this, he's only tried to shift blame. If he wanted to help, he'd have helped already...
It's not rubbish. Look at the Millar thread. Look at the way people are happy for a team like Garmin to race.
All doped all took drugs all cheated the same.
I don't see the same hatred aimed at them.
If Di Luca said he was sorry and had the smile of a car salesman would he be welcome back as well.
Who's more honest?
You are, rajay, because you honestly couldn't give a flying f*** whether anyone doped or not.
Those of us that are bothered though, we take things like repeat offences seriously. This is Danilo's third (count them, three) suspension. It's difficult for any of us to accept any contrition he might possibly come out with at face value.
The fact he got caught 3 times does not mean he has doped any more than some one busted once. He just was more stupid to get caught.
If you want to see him banned for life then the others should be banned as well.
It's the same offence.
Ex dopers still riding could have gained long term advantages as well, depending on what PEDs they took.
So even a ex doper now riding clean could have benefited from cheating.
I am being honest with my opinion. I don't care if they dope. Why should I.
All I see is a lot of riders cheating and some back racing and some never riding again for the same offence.
Lets see the same penalty for everyone or just make PED's legal.
It's not the frequency or quantity of doping which is the issue - it the number of wasted second chances.
Most posters on here would tear Millar limb from limb if it was ever revealed that he had doped since his comeback.“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
ddraver wrote:Just to be clear, you are suggesting that there is no difference between what Millard has been convicted of (note, convicted of) and what Di Luca has been convicted of?
I think I have been perfect in my clarity. They both cheated . They both got caught.
If they should get another chance is not up to me to decide.
What they do with that chance is again not for me to decide.
If Millar had not been caught would he would have kept doping until he did get caught or retired.
How many riders are still doping and have not been caught or may never get caught.
What about all those riders who have beat Di Luca in races and have doped and got away with it.
Obviously Di Luca did not behave or react like Millar did. I understand why you feel Millar is better that DI Luca.
The same offence should have the same penalty. It's inconsistent IMO.0 -
Riders who have been caught doping have been given inconsistent bans.
Vino comes back and wins a gold. You don't know how long he has been doping and getting away with it
Garmin boys get an out of season ban. You don't know how long they had been doping and getting away with it.
Some known doped riders have kept the victory's others have had them taken away.
Di Luca is banned for life and I think there are riders who have been equally guilty and have defeated him in races and still riding.
Lets have the same penalty for everyone. if you are going to ban one for life then you have to ban them all IMO0 -
Again - this really can't be any more clear IMO...
Millar - caught once - banned for 2 years
DiLuca - caught once - banned for two years
- Caught again - banned for 2 years again
- Caught yet again - banned for life (lets be honest another 2 year ban was effectively a ban for life anyway...)
Do you see now?
Do you think someone stealing a few penny sweets from a shop and someone stealing 1000 pounds should be given the same sentence too? They re both guilty of the same crime - Stealing.We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
ddraver wrote:Again - this really can't be any more clear IMO...
Millar - caught once - banned for 2 years
DiLuca - caught once - banned for two years
- Caught again - banned for 2 years again
- Caught yet again - banned for life (lets be honest another 2 year ban was effectively a ban for life anyway...)
I'll think you'll find that most courts regardless of what they are judging view repeat offending more seriously
It's how laws and justice operate. Any other approach would be ludicrous
To paraphrase the opening lines from Porridge:
"Danilo DiLuca, you are an habitual doper, who accepts detection as an occupational hazard, and presumably accepts suspension in the same casual manner. We therefore feel constrained to commit you to the maximum term allowed for these offences"0 -
And once again,,, a rider caught once may have been doping as long or longer than a rider caught more than once.
They both could be habitual dopers.
They are both guilty of the same offence.0 -
rayjay wrote:And once again,,, a rider caught once may have been doping as long or longer than a rider caught more than once.
They both could be habitual dopers.
They are both guilty of the same offence.
We cant punish people for what they may have been doing, only for what they've been caught doing.
And the more often you get caught, the higher the punishment each time.
It's really very, very simple.Warning No formatter is installed for the format0 -
Well it's not simple is it.
We have doped riders still riding. Di Luca has been banned for life.
Some just get a off season ban.
Some never got to race again.
Some have had the victory's taken off of them.
Some even though they have admitted doping keep their victory's
Ryder had to fess up for doping, but no ban as it was a long time ago. The statute is 8 years.
How come that does not apply to Armstrong
All have been caught for the same offence.
It's bullsh%% IMO.
Its hypocritical Bulls%5t0 -
rayjay wrote:Well it's not simple is it.
We have doped riders still riding. Di Luca has been banned for life.
Some just get a off season ban.
Some never got to race again.
Some have had the victory's taken off of them.
Some even though they have admitted doping keep their victory's
Ryder had to fess up for doping, but no ban as it was a long time ago. The statute is 8 years.
How come that does not apply to Armstrong
All have been caught for the same offence.
It's bullsh%% IMO.
Its hypocritical Bulls%5t
You don't really deal in nuance, do you?
They've all been caught for the same offence in the same way that someone getting caught at 75mph on the motorway gets caught for the same offence as someone doing 120mph on the same stretch of road, or someone doing 50mph in a residential area with a speed limit of 30.Warning No formatter is installed for the format0 -
Rayjay spitting out his yellow dummy again, I see."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0
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rayjay wrote:Well it's not simple is it.
We have doped riders still riding. Di Luca has been banned for life.
You know there are rules right, and the rules dictate the punishment? For a vanilla doping test failure, you can get a 2 year back. The first time.
Do it again and you're gone forever.
It's not actually very confusing.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
Its bullshi#%
THATS MY OPINON.
Move on...if you can without the attempted smarter%e comments.0 -
Blazing Saddles wrote:Rayjay spitting out his yellow dummy again, I see.
Still not been over to the Lance is doping thread....check it out and then apologise for your massive wrong accusations.0 -
rayjay wrote:Its bullshi#%
THATS MY OPINON.
Move on...if you can without the attempted smarter%e comments.
If you think it should be a straight out life ban first time, that's fine. Express that. But don't act like there is some unfairness at work here - there isn't.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
rayjay wrote:Some just get a off season ban.
Hypothetically speaking what would your view be if Di Luca was to name names in return for a reduced sentence?“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
iainf72 wrote:rayjay wrote:Its bullshi#%
THATS MY OPINON.
Move on...if you can without the attempted smarter%e comments.
If you think it should be a straight out life ban first time, that's fine. Express that. But don't act like there is some unfairness at work here - there isn't.
rayjay has argued both for a life ban for first offences and for the legalisation of doping. I find it hard to see where he's coming from on either and hard to see past some sort of Armstrong fetish as the motivation.Warning No formatter is installed for the format0 -
rayjay wrote:Blazing Saddles wrote:Rayjay spitting out his yellow dummy again, I see.
Still not been over to the Lance is doping thread....check it out and then apologise for your massive wrong accusations.
Wellllllll, admitting to something a year after the fact, doesn't really qualify for an apology, especially since
you only did so to avoid what you really wanted to say, but couldn't.
Lets be honest here, You couldn't care less if di Luca got 2 years or 2 life time bans.
It's all hypocritical bullpoo to you, because your hero got his comeuppance.
You, failing to recognise the difference in sentencing dished out, between a user and a pusher,
is the real hypocrisy, here."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
rayjay wrote:Its bullshi#%
THATS MY OPINON.
Move on...if you can without the attempted smarter%e comments.
I appreciate that you are entitled to an opinion.
However, if you repeat it again and again, approx every 4th post, and make no attempt to engage with the broader debate about natural justice, then you are going to get smartar$e comments.
and lots of smileys0 -
iainf72 wrote:rayjay wrote:Its bullshi#%
THATS MY OPINON.
Move on...if you can without the attempted smarter%e comments.
If you think it should be a straight out life ban first time, that's fine. Express that. But don't act like there is some unfairness at work here - there isn't.
I think when a load of Garmin riders have to confess to doping and just get an off season ban while others get a 2 year ban say I say that is unfair .
IMO that's unfair
Move ON0
