Pure Climbers

disgruntledgoat

I dunno... Some stunning accellerations on here, first in his amateur days and the Giro in 2001 too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwh2zM0jrN8&feature=PlayList&p=800D8550FCADF1D4&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=31

frenchfighter

mididoctors

Charly Mottet

frenchfighter

Not familiar with Mottet so will ahve to look him up.

Just saw this about him though:

Mottet: one clean cyclist

In 1989 Voet joined the RMO team. A year later the French rider Charly Mottet, who twice finished fourth in the Tour de France, joined the team.

The arrival of Charly Mottet helped to clean up the team. He was the team leader, he had more influence than anyone on the way his teammates thought and he never wanted to know about drugs. When he arrived at RMO, we knew hardly anything about him. We knew he had the ability to win the Tour de France, but we didn't know what means we had to put at his disposal to help him get there. It was only as the races went by and we ate with him and spent time with him that we worked out what kind of a fellow we were dealing with. This was one clean cyclist. An iron supplement or an injection of an anti-oxidant (Iposotal) and that was as far as he went.

You could honestly say that Mottet was a victim of drug-taking right through his career - of other riders' drug-taking. If he had used some stuff to help him recover, perhaps only now and then, the list of races which he won - already a long one - would have been considerably longer. Who knows if he might not have won the Tour? As it was, he was a rider who was said to fall apart in the final week.

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/osm/stor ... 10,00.html

iainf72

To me, Mottet was always a CLM guy rather than climber.

Classy classy bike rider though. Is he still involved in the Dauphine now ASO own it?

disquieting_museeuws

I would agree Mottet was more an all-rounder who excelled at everything really. I remember him once getting off on a mountain pass in the TDF & cutting the corner on a little path - strange the things that stay in the memory.

---

Beat Breu was another climbing character / nutcase who also did cyclo-cross and was a 'Stayer' on the track.

Winning at Alpe D'Huez (note untaped bar tops to save weight):



http://www.dewielersite.net

frenchfighter

I understand that when you started you admired Pantani. Do you sit and chat with his director, Martinelli, sometimes?

Yes, he’s told me some stories. You can spend hours talking about Pantani. He was a great champion. Martino was always on his back. I still remember the way he would drop the entire peloton. The other day I was watching a video that compared his climb of the Peyresourde to mine, in the Tour. I liked it a lot.

Pantani was out of this world. He attacked from way, way out. He was incredible. But what attracted my attention even more was that he climbed mountains gripping the handlebars from below. After watching that video, I tried to do the same thing and I couldn’t. I ended up with terrible leg pain. I still wonder how he was able to do that.

Marco was the only one who truly unnerved Armstrong because he couldn’t be controlled...

Doesn’t surprise me. He was the best climber and he could put you in a tight spot any time. His level allowed him to disarm an entire team.

-Contador

I would love to see that video he is talking about.

frenchfighter

First posted by Le Commentateur, it is an amazing video of Pantani.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-J2bIsPDH8

ms_tree

Stupendo
One of the current mags has an article with Bert where he says that he has tried to ride like Pantani with hands on the drops and he can't as it hurts.

Monty Dog

Ms Tree wrote:

Stupendo
One of the current mags has an article with Bert where he says that he has tried to ride like Pantani with hands on the drops and he can't as it hurts.

Pantani had his frames built with a longer headtube to raise the bars - it is by far the most 'powerful' climbing position but needs really strong core muscles or it hurts like hell

dave_1

mididoctors wrote:

Charly Mottet

heartening to think Lucho era climbers could have handled Contador's attacks on Alpe D'huez yesterday!

paulcuthbert

Monty Dog wrote:

Ms Tree wrote:

Stupendo
One of the current mags has an article with Bert where he says that he has tried to ride like Pantani with hands on the drops and he can't as it hurts.

Pantani had his frames built with a longer headtube to raise the bars - it is by far the most 'powerful' climbing position but needs really strong core muscles or it hurts like hell

I climb like that sometimes. The only place it hurts is in the back of your neck

knedlicky

frenchfighter wrote:

Gilberto Simoni
I would be keen to hear any good quotes on Simoni if anyone has some?

Basso in 2006, of Simoni, "What he says goes in my left ear and comes out my right one".

Simoni in 2010, of Basso, "He preaches water while he drinks wine".

Kléber

iainf72 wrote:

To me, Mottet was always a CLM guy rather than climber.

Classy classy bike rider though. Is he still involved in the Dauphine now ASO own it?

Mottet was an all rounder, capable of winning flat races and mountain stages alike. No chance on the cobbles but everything else seemed possible.

He got the heave-ho from ASO, who have now put Bernard Thevenet in place for the Dauphine race.

frenchfighter

knedlicky wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Gilberto Simoni
I would be keen to hear any good quotes on Simoni if anyone has some?

Basso in 2006, of Simoni, "What he says goes in my left ear and comes out my right one".

Simoni in 2010, of Basso, "He preaches water while he drinks wine".

Haha, nice.

knedlicky

sampras38 wrote:

disquieting_museeuws wrote:

Van Impe is right about Virenque IMO, he was never a natural climber.

He was never a natural anything...;-)
I very rarely post anything about doping on here because it's really not necessary, and has been done to death anyway, but in Virqenque's case I will. It annoys me that the french constantly badger LA, yet for some reason they put this guy on a pedastal, when he was one of the heaviest users in the Festina team.
King of the Mountains...? My butt.

Kléber wrote:

sampras38 wrote:

in Virqenque's case I will. It annoys me that the french constantly badger LA, yet for some reason they put this guy on a pedastal, when he was one of the heaviest users in the Festina team.

This really isn't the case, Virenque is widely seen as a plonker in France. Everyone knows he cheated and in the end, he was exposed. Yes there are still people who venerate him but they're in the minority. Apparently to deny something extremely obvious these days is "to do a Virenque".

These days he appears on reality TV and for a while he was on the French version of Spitting Image (on every evening I believe) as a running gag. I can't find a good quality video but watch this quick click and the way the laughter erupts as soon as Virenque appears.

My impression of how Virenque is regarded nowadays in France is that for much of the general public he is still a hero, despite comedians sometimes poking fun at him or imitating him (usually his break-down denial of having doped). One comedian parodies not just Virenque but also Sarkozy, Carla Bruni, opposition politician Ségolène Royal, pin-up girl Miss France 2009 and national team football trainer Domenech, so Virenque isn’t special in that regard.

In cycling circles Virenque is received more mixed. His name and Armstrong’s are often in the same sentence and it’s suspected Virenque doped more than he admitted – it’s believed his former Festina race director Bruno Roussel (now a strong opponent of doping) could say more about Virenque if he wanted. That Virenque commentates cycle races for French radio and TV doesn’t go down well with many cyclists, now that French cycling is trying to be clean, added to which Virenque isn’t always modest in his comments.

In an interview when he retired, Virenque said “One always gets what one has deserved” and meant his doping ban and disgrace. In the same interview, he indicated that in many respects he regards his more moderate success in 2004 and 2005 as his biggest achievements, not his earlier tainted (my word) jerseys. I suppose the two statements add up to some sort of remorse - although that Virenque was working with Patrick Lefévère just then, I suppose leaves a question mark about his later jerseys too. Virenque always said he was only doing the same as everyone else, so I would never pick him out to criticise more than most of the rest.

While Virenque may not have been a pure climber, which can be seen from how he won his later polkadot jerseys (by accumulating points wherever he could or by breaking away rather than winning fierce battles on the major climbs), I think during all his career he often put on a pretty good show, suggesting to me he at least thought he was a real climber.
He did have the climber’s attacking spirit and brought some colour and entertainment to TdFs which were otherwise mostly on the predictable side, and for that I liked him.

knedlicky

Miscellaneous comments to some of the above posts …

- I don’t think a ‘proper’ climber has to ride a lot out of the saddle, I don’t remember Van Impe, Herrera or Fuente doing so, nor think of Pantani being out of the saddle except when accelerating.
- Wasn’t Ocana more an allrounder?
- Claveyrolat deserves the mention he got above, because he was one of the still clean riders when doping seemingly properly invaded the peloton in the 90s. Tragic and sad end for him.
- I don’t rate Sastre as a true climber because he not only lacks the ability to frequently accelerate but also doesn’t seem to have the ‘lightness’ of style I associate with climbers, whether Van Impe, Herrera, Virenque, Schleck or Contador.
- Irrespective of how he achieved them, Chiappucci got more climbing honours than the few mentioned here, so maybe deserves a bit more recognition.
- A couple of others names to consider … from the 70s, Battaglin and Andres Oliva, from Millar’s era, Andrew Hampsten, from 10 years ago, Piccoli.

frenchfighter

Some interesting points in your last two posts. I'll have to check some of the names you mentioned.

frenchfighter

This is my battleground. mountains hurt you. you either win or you die. either way, there’s bloodshed.

Gilberto Simoni, 2010.

frenchfighter

Pantani climbing L'Aple d'Huez in '95. In the big ring. No further comment necessary.

Homer J

not bad for a coke head

DaveyL

Yeah, not hard to climb in the big ring when your hematocrit's up in the high 50s.

Team Banana Spokesman

Ah, but he's on the 25.

inkyfingers

Team Banana Spokesman wrote:

Ah, but he's on the 25.

Lightweight

kitsunegari

frenchfighter wrote:

I agree. I couldn't care that Pantani was doped. He was still had qualities and strengths that made him a very exciting and admired rider.

I suppose in a sport where many of the top riders dope it doesn't matter. Or does it? Would Pantini have been able to climb like he did without doping? Obviously thats a different topic but I do think crediting people with such ability when it was achieved by false means is a little..odd.

frenchfighter

A really great Pantani compilation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&hl=uk&v=66iXTQio7wk

Has anyone been on a climb when he came streaking past solo?

frenchfighter

Charly Gaul
Ventoux Bedoin side: 1hr 2mins 9secs, 21.5km TT

If ever there was a Rider of the Apocalypse, it was Gaul. When we last saw him, an ambulance had just dropped him at his hotel after a time trial up the Ventoux in 1958. He had pushed himself hard, because it was a hot that day and he hated the heat. The next day of that Tour he lost twelve minutes; the day after that a few more, because it was still hot. Gaul was more than fifteen minutes behind the yellow jersey, he was done for. Then came the twenty-first stage, through the Alps. Hail, black skies, storms, the end of the world from morning to night.

Far out in front of all the other riders was Gaul. The wind flogged him, the rain lashed down on him, and he took back his fifteen minutes and won the Tour.

From Tim Krabbe's The Rider

frenchfighter

“Being a mountain specialist is very hard. not that I’d rather be anything else because I don’t think you can become… a better human being without effort. You can beat the problems of life much more easily if you’ve met hardship.

It sometimes looks as if the first rider to the top has done it fairly easily; you tend to feel more sorry for the men who’ve knocked themselves out to make the climb at all; but believe me to be quicker than the rest, and particularly than the other stars, involves a lot of pain.”

JOSÉ MANUEL FUENTE

frenchfighter

andyp

Is that last one Leonardo Sierra? There's a blast from the past.