tube strike and numpy cyclists

Harry B

Porgy wrote:

Harry B wrote:

Porgy wrote:

Harry B wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

FFS Crow open your eyes and see the real world.

Sorry, rant over :oops:

I think it's you in a fantasy world trying to deny that some workers have retained the power to stand up to their bosses.

I don;t like Bob Crow - but so far - he's always won his battles.

So you've mentioned not wanting to be selfish but are quite happy for the city and all those who work in it to be held to ransome because you want a guranteed job and a pay rise when almost evryone else it taking a pay cut or losing thier jobs?

Shouldn't you be sitting on a pucket line with your pals?

Oh as for your point about the engineers I know several who work on the underground and they seem to be doing very very well and a lot better than most

stupid stock phrases straight out of the Daily Mail - sorry - I'm not continuing with this. YOu sound irrational

Harry B wrote:

Shouldn't you be sitting on a pucket line with your pals?

you're being extremely ignorant to make a point. I am not front line staff, and am not in the front line union, and they are not my pals.

I don;t have to be pals with them to support their cause.

End of argument.

How did the Anarchists Book Sale go?

Porgy

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

always_tyred

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

I think some comments are quite considered. Would you like to address mine?

il_principe

simon_ramsey wrote:

Perhaps if the government hadn't sp**nked so much money up the wall bailing out the private sector when PFI turned to a pile of sh*te then there would be money for safety improvements and a reasonable - i.e 1-2% settlement for the RMT.

Similar story with the 10bn shortfall with the NHS ?? Managed to find 10 x that to bail out the banks

Sadly our economy is rather more reliant on the financial sector than anything else. Doesn't give the RMT the right to demand more money though, everyone is suffering the effects of recession. I might even consider becoming a tube driver, pay looks damn good from where I'm sitting, and let's face it, it can't be that taxing a job can it?

Headhuunter

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

il_principe

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?
>

Oh come on. No one's being "rabid." Surely you can understand why people have little sympathy?

Harry B

Headhuunter wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

+1 but he still came out with some complete crap. That's the first time I've got truly annoyed but what I've seen posted on this site :?

Headhuunter

jashburnham wrote:

simon_ramsey wrote:

Perhaps if the government hadn't sp**nked so much money up the wall bailing out the private sector when PFI turned to a pile of sh*te then there would be money for safety improvements and a reasonable - i.e 1-2% settlement for the RMT.

Similar story with the 10bn shortfall with the NHS ?? Managed to find 10 x that to bail out the banks

Sadly our economy is rather more reliant on the financial sector than anything else. Doesn't give the RMT the right to demand more money though, everyone is suffering the effects of recession. I might even consider becoming a tube driver, pay looks damn good from where I'm sitting, and let's face it, it can't be that taxing a job can it?

PFI is exactly the problem. Blair and Nu Lab set up the ridiculous PFI scheme to run things which promptly fell on its face after providing fantastic pay and conditions for Tube workers, managers etc etc, many of who seem to have quickly run off with the proceeds. Now the government is left with a barrel of debt from the collapsed PFI and ridulous pay and terms for workers, which it is now trying to re neg back to public sector levels. It's Blair and Nu Lab who have got us into this mess.

artaxerxes

If the tube workers wanted to make a point, couldn't they have carried on working and simply turned off all the ticket machines and opened the ticket barriers?

This does require them to work though...

Porgy

Headhuunter wrote:

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

i can look forward to being strung up tonight eh?

Good that things have come down to this


<looks forward to fascist state>

Headhuunter

Porgy wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

i can look forward to being strung up tonight eh?

Good that things have come down to this


<looks forward to fascist state>

Hmmmm You accused me of being Daily Mail and sensationalist, pot, kettle, black? Anyone?

Porgy

anyway you win - i'm considering quitting this site.

Harry B

So Porgy what exactly are your politics? Your blog would tend to imply that they're not exactly mainstream and fairly similar to Mr Crow?

Oh and how did the anachists book fair go, did you buy much?

il_principe

No one hates you Porgy, we're just understandably narked with the selfish strikers.

Headhuunter

Porgy wrote:

Harry B wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

+1 but he still came out with some complete crap. That's the first time I've got truly annoyed but what I've seen posted on this site :?

as opposed to all the crap everyone else was citing.

fark it noone wants to be hated.

So i've renounced it all - just went out and bought the Daily Mail, and kicked a striker in the balls. Can I be like you now? A retarded right wing nut? Please?


anyway you win - i'm quitting this site.

Feel a bit sorry for you now. Must admit this is the most heated debate I have seen on this forum! Don't quit, this time next month it'll all be back to which £1000 bike should I buy on C2W? Or is it going to be sunny for my weekend ride?

Harry B

Headhuunter wrote:

Porgy wrote:

Harry B wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

+1 but he still came out with some complete crap. That's the first time I've got truly annoyed but what I've seen posted on this site :?

as opposed to all the crap everyone else was citing.

fark it noone wants to be hated.

So i've renounced it all - just went out and bought the Daily Mail, and kicked a striker in the balls. Can I be like you now? A retarded right wing nut? Please?


anyway you win - i'm quitting this site.

Feel a bit sorry for you now. Must admit this is the most heated debate I have seen on this forum! Don't quit, this time next month it'll all be back to which £1000 bike should I buy on C2W? Or is it going to be sunny for my weekend ride?

Presumably having hopes of bringing down society as we know it (i.e. capitalism) is not quite akin to talking about £1000 bikes. Perhaps everyone should have the same bike?

Headhuunter

Harry B wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Porgy wrote:

Harry B wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I've just remembered why I don;t argue on the internet. It envcourages all the rabid nutters to come and play.

Let's go back to laughing at the numpty cyclists eh?









<shakes head sadly and mutters "we're all doomed">

Brave man though for facing the avalanche of disapproval. If I worked for the Tube, I would probably hide from the baying crowds today....

+1 but he still came out with some complete crap. That's the first time I've got truly annoyed but what I've seen posted on this site :?

as opposed to all the crap everyone else was citing.

fark it noone wants to be hated.

So i've renounced it all - just went out and bought the Daily Mail, and kicked a striker in the balls. Can I be like you now? A retarded right wing nut? Please?


anyway you win - i'm quitting this site.

Feel a bit sorry for you now. Must admit this is the most heated debate I have seen on this forum! Don't quit, this time next month it'll all be back to which £1000 bike should I buy on C2W? Or is it going to be sunny for my weekend ride?

Presumably having hopes of bringing down society as we know it (i.e. capitalism) is not quite akin to talking about £1000 bikes. Perhaps everyone should have the same bike?

All Bikes were created equal but some are more equal than others....

il_principe

Harry B wrote:

Presumably having hopes of bringing down society as we know it (i.e. capitalism) is not quite akin to talking about £1000 bikes. Perhaps everyone should have the same bike?

[/quote]

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

Porgy

Your responses have been unexpected.

I never expected such vitriol. I found it genuinely upsetting, and its reminded me why I don't (usually) post controversial views on bulleitin boards.

There is no way I can argue against all of you, and no way I'm going to try.


now go ahead and take the piss for three pages. I won;t be in to see though

simon_ramsey

£1000 road bikes - now that would be a Velib scheme

il_principe

Porgy wrote:

Your responses have been unexpected.

I never expected such vitriol.

Seriously? People are pissed off! If you're a twitter user try searching for #RMT. I've not spoken to anyone today that has had sympathy at all.

Harry B

Porgy wrote:

Your responses have been unexpected.

I never expected such vitriol.

Really :shock: Blimey :shock: :shock: Half the city walked to work this morning and will spend hours trying to get home cos a few overpaid tube drivers want even more and you're shocked that people are upset about it :roll:

cjw

Porgy wrote:

Your responses have been unexpected.

Really, maybe that explains a lot.

You want guaranteed jobs and an above inflation pay rise at a time when millions are loosing their jobs (eg Cheltenham and Glocester announced yesterday). When this is not given you bring London to a standstil (my son has to go to UCL hospital for cancer checkups and has not been able to today due to the disruption), and seem surprised by the reaction :shock:

londonbairn

Politics aside, it shows how reliant London is on the tube infrastructure...

simon_ramsey

Maybe a few people will realise after today that it needn't be and that there are better ways to get to work

Perhaps we should all encourage a numpty to give it another go tomorrow

Porgy

cjw wrote:

Porgy wrote:

Your responses have been unexpected.

Really, maybe that explains a lot.

You want guaranteed jobs and an above inflation pay rise at a time when millions are loosing their jobs (eg Cheltenham and Glocester announced yesterday). When this is not given you bring London to a standstil (my son has to go to UCL hospital for cancer checkups and has not been able to today due to the disruption), and seem surprised by the reaction :shock:

God knows why I came back - but can I say this clearly

I DIDN;T START THE STRIKE AND I'M NOT ON STRIKE, I WAS MERELY COMMENTING ON THE STRIKE.

BUT FUCK THAT EH? THAT'S TOO MUCH LIKE FREE SPEECH.

GO ON HOUND ME SOME MORE. I MIGHT AS WELL BECOME A BANKER FOR ALL THE GOOD OF 25 YEARS IN PUBLIC SERVICE HAVE DONE ME.

THIS IS THE CLOSEST TO MOB RULE I'VE EVER SEEN (FORTUNATELY) AND SOMEHOW YOU LOT SEEM TO THINK YOU'VE WON THE ARGUMENT.

NGale

Porgy wrote:

Your responses have been unexpected.

I never expected such vitriol. I found it genuinely upsetting, and its reminded me why I don't (usually) post controversial views on bulleitin boards.

There is no way I can argue against all of you, and no way I'm going to try.


now go ahead and take the wee-wee for three pages. I won;t be in to see though

We arn't asking you to argue against us all. but at no point have you states the case for these strike. Do so, we may not agree with it, but at least we will have some understanding of why from someone who is there on the ground rather than the media fed nonsense that is out there at the moment.

We don't don't have to agree with what it being done, but we do have the right to understand why.

The one thing that really pees me off about this country is the fact that people don't talk about politics. it's the elephant in the room that no one wants to acknowledge.

When I walked out with the Prison Officers a couple years back it caused one hell of a problem between me and my ex boyfriend, when I tried to tell him why I did it he refused to listen saying that we shouldn't talk about politics or religion. That's the problem! people stick their fingers in their ears when someone gives an explanation because it might actually make them think and reassess deeply held beliefs.

I consider myself still to be a socialist (a dirty word these days), so yes I have some deeply held beliefs, but I am still willing to listen even if I don't agree.

So come on, make us think, make us reassess, you never know you might actually help someone understand.

Porgy

NGale wrote:

We arn't asking you to argue against us all. but at no point have you states the case for these strike. Do so, we may not agree with it, but at least we will have some understanding of why from someone who is there on the ground rather than the media fed nonsense that is out there at the moment.

i'm not a striker - you can read the press statements as well as i can - try the RMT site.

We don't don't have to agree with what it being done, but we do have the right to understand why.

not from me though - I'm not defending the strike on this forum - i like using this website.

The one thing that really pees me off about this country is the fact that people don't talk about politics.

do you wonder why?

My views remain unchaged in principle since i joined the Labour Party in 1983, but while they were mainstream then, have become unacceptable now.

I consider myself still to be a socialist (a dirty word these days), so yes I have some deeply held beliefs, but I am still willing to listen even if I don't agree.

So come on, make us think, make us reassess, you never know you might actually help someone understand.

not on here, mate - maybe if we met up in a bar to have a chat - but not on here.

I really, genuinely fear for the future of free speech, you know. Not just cos of this, but generally, I find myself keeping my views to myself, especially at work.

bluesacs

Well I'm going to show solidarity with the RMT and Mr Crowe and indeed Porgy, people should always try to better their conditions and unions are usually a good way of doing it. And sometimes you have to strike. There are a lot more effective unions in the world who get their members huge salaries, benefits and bonuses. So don't knock a union for asking for modest demands.

I'm reaching for my helmet now, not a silly bicycle helmet, but a proper steel one. To your positions!

alfablue

I am not sufficiently informed about the case of the Tube staff to make my own judgement about the justification of the strike, however, strikes are intended to cause disruption, the only way they may have any effect is if they do, it may help to demonstrate how the service and the workers that run it are important to us, and maybe help to re-evaluate the value that is placed upon it, and them.

Of course, people will be upset, inconvenienced, caused expense, and worse as a result of a strike, that is to be expected.

On the face of it I understand that there is a claim for an RPI + 0.5% pay settlement and a guarantee of no compulsory redundancies. Whilst this may be better than many workers may enjoy, it does not seem excessive, it is not likely to bankrupt the service. If TFL get a multi-year settlement on this basis, they will consider themselves as having done well once the economy has improved.

The right to strike is a fundamental right of employees in this country, it is a right that has been fought for and also needs defending. Without it then the rights, pay and conditions of workers will inevitably be eroded to the benefit of the employers (and the shareholders, where applicable).

Sure, we don't like strikes when they hurt us, but it is an important democratic right - if the strike is legally constituted then I feel no need to demonise those who exercise this right.