Today's discussion about the news
Comments
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I'm not tolerating anti semitism at all I'm saying the police officer is in an impossible situation. Personally I'd say get the riot vans out and protect the individual but that police officer is unlikely to have the authority to do that.
So what's he actually done - told the truth. He said being "openly Jewish" in that situation is antagonising the crowd - it's the truth - don't be afraid to say it.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
The impossible situation being there are a load of racists who are triggered by the presence of a Jew. To be clear.
Im pretty sure we have laws about that sort of behaviour.
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Yes great. So blame the police chiefs, the mayor, the govt or whoever makes policy . That copper is just telling the truth.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
I thought there were Jewish groups that attended the marches and everything was peaceful.
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They were probably told to keep their distance. 😉
This story strikes me as storm in a teacup where the policeman couldn't win.
The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
In other news, it seems the US is looking at sanctions on an IDF battalion. Sounds like a small step in the direction.
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The truth that he could not uphold the law. Pathetic.
Apologist nonsense.
It is very hard to sympathise with people protesting about what is essentially apartheid who are triggered simply by the presence of different race.
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Part of policing is to try to diffuse situations and prevent potential flashpoints. It was done badly in this instance but is absolutely the right thing to do. Calling out anyone who thinks preventing trouble is better than arresting trouble makers as being apologists for anti-semetism / racist behaviour is a bit dickish to be honest.
Had they gone the other way and the police had ended up with someone getting beaten up or the protest turning into a riot there would have been uproar too and I suspect you would be leading it as you just seem to have an issue with the police.
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No, there may have been some racists amongst the marchers, as BB says the marches have largely been peaceful with many Jewish people taking part.
I still question why the leader of the CAA was there if it wasn't because of the march. Looks suspiciously like they wanted a response and they got one.
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Unless I’ve missed it, nobody* seems to mention the pro-palestinian protesters in all of this, apart from the underlying assumption expressed that they are a ‘lawless mob’.
*media
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Are they the Jewish anti Zionist groups?
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They’re behaving in a way the police think they merely by being Jewish, a bystander may trigger them.
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hmm, just saw a clip of the encounter on the news
strikingly different to the way it's been reported on the website
looked like the guy was out to cause trouble and had gone together with others to record it on video
he was insisting on his 'right' to cross the road through the marchers, hard to see that as anything but a deliberate attempt to provoke a reaction, no doubt there'd be jostling/collision, which could be then presented as assault
imo based on the clip broadcast, the "openly jewish" comment from the officer is understandable in context (though still unwise), as part of the explanation why he didn't want the apparent troublemaker to disrupt the people marching
my bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny0 -
eh?
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Honestly, the whole discourse of people in the west who are getting involved appalling.
It’s just a vehicle for anti semites and islamophobes to run riot. Whole thing is pathetic and its barely anything to do with them.
The political nadir are local councils spending time money and effort to have positions on the conflict. How about you stick to your fucking remit and sort the bins out, idiots.
It’s so pathetic. The other day I saw an extremely camp, presumably gay guy handing out leaflets holding a Palestine flag. Does he know what happens to gays in Palestine?
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Not necessarily. For example,
It shouldn't need to be said, but someone being Jewish doesn't mean they can't see oppression in the occupied territories.
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I wonder what the police response would have been when Orange marches were allowed through Catholic areas in Belfast (I always thought that was nuts to start with), and then someone 'obviously Catholic' insisted on crossing through the march. Which party would the police seek to restrain?
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At least they were arguing about their own land. Not some faraway place that is nothing to do with them
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For what it is worth, I find your hot take on this subject incredibly tedious.
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Feel free to explain why we should lose our heads over this conflict and not the many others that are just as bad around the world.
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Hang on, but you want us to get cross about Sudan, don't you?
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I mean, if you want to get cross about ongoing “genocides” and war crimes, it seems reasonable to me to get cross about the most murderous one, no?
It’s almost like the outrage and the protests aren’t really about the tragedy.
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But, FWIW, the practicalities of a police response to a potentially dangerous situation aren't in any way different: in the heat of the moment, do you deal with a small handful who can be (relatively) easily dealt with, even if they have a right to be there, or do you take on the mass? It's sometimes more practical and fruitful to approach people and say something along the lines of "I know you're within your rights and not causing trouble, but in order to avoid a potentially tricky situation, please could I ask you to find another route this time?"
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Do we need a list of RC-approved atrocities to get cross and to be allowed to protest about?
I suspect none/few of us on BR like or approve of the way that conflicts and political differences are being manipulated to set fellow citizens on each other, but you seem to be conflating a lot of your dislike of this phenomenon and projecting it onto this singular policing event, for which they've admitted the language was wholly inappropriate.
I think the rest of us are (mostly) saying that, excepting the choice of words, the action taken (particularly if @sungod's account bears some resemblance to actual events) was probably the most practical one.
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I am utterly convinced that the protesting and outrage about Israel Gaza is not really about concern for the victims as if that was the case, their attention would be shared across all the awful conflicts.
Therefore I see the interest largely as a racist. Hence Jews having to go out and say “we don’t support the invasion even though we’re Jewish” because they know they are getting racist grief.
The police response further shows what it is really about.
I am fed up with everyone pretending this is ok. The police are complicit in this, hence the response.
If it wasn’t involving a state that was fundamentally Jewish, it would garner the same attention as the other conflicts.
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I still think that that's quite a stretch, to take a admitted poor choice of words on the part of a policeman trying to diffuse a tricky situation to "the police in general are complicit in racism" on the Palestine/Israel question. I'm not sure who's pretending this whole situation is OK. Both Hamas and Netanyahu have played their part in the division, amplified by other malign actors, for sure, for nefarious ends.
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Many people aren't aware of every foreign conflict currently underway, it doesn't make them racist to think that this very asymmetrical conflict is a bad thing.
The police response seems badly worded but in essence the correct response, ie don't let someone potentially cause a situation to be massively inflamed to make a point.
Sounds like the guy was doing the equivalent of me throwing fake punches in front of my brothers face as a kid to wind him up while maintaining what I considered to be the moral high ground.
Fwiw, I ended up trying to cross one of the protests a few weeks ago and was directed around it by the police and wasnt allowed to walk past the gate of the isreali consulate either, if that is the level of disruption I have accept then so be it.
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