The Big 'Let's sell our cars and take buses/ebikes instead' thread (warning: probably very dull)
Comments
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A c t u a l l y, I love seeing older cars on the road. A 2CV merrily toodles passed the house each day, fantastic.
In my advanced superior opinion people should be encouraged to maintain not destroy and dispose. It's not sadly how the consumer capitalist society is geared though. It would be wangered without it.
Here we go-go-go to the temple of consumption...0 -
As opposed to some guy from another country telling me what shitty air quality I should put up with. I might well be middle class but the council tenant family who live opposite has three cars to our one. As I said really poor people don't own a car in the first place.First.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition1 -
I was responding to the comments about “poor people’ not being able to change their car. Those with a pre-2009 petrol should be able to get something very similar or better with the £2k scrappage fee.mully79 said:What were really saying is trade in your 35000 mile 2015 mercedes A class diesel for a French hatchback that's been flogged to death for 125000 miles and get no change.
That will be my pensioner parents decision when the Manchester Caz finally happens.
I thought diesels from 2015 onwards were compliant anyway?
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I didn’t see you make a point that someone with a 2009 petrol banger could upgrade to a 2010 model with public money but if you did I’m more than happy to have helped.Stevo_666 said:
Cheap because its non-compliant. Thanks to Pross for demonstrating my point for memully79 said:
That's a diesel, they're all cheap now. + Huge mileage.Pross said:
Nice Ford Fiesta 2010 petrol less than £2k, one of many on Autotrader.mully79 said:
Sounds like a good idea until you realise you can't get finance on a car older than 10 years and a 2012 VW polo is over £6k.Pross said:
Flog their old diesel, take the grant and buy a similar age petrol? That’s what I’d have done with my 10 year old non-compliant high mileage diesel worth around £1500. Pretty sure I could get a similar level of petrol car. Not many will have pre-2009 petrols and £2k would probably allow an upgrade on most that are older.Stevo_666 said:
More likely to be the case that they can't afford to upgrade, as has been pointed out several times.rjsterry said:
Seems entirely fair that it only affects the people who haven't bothered their arses to upgrade.Stevo_666 said:
Oh I dunno. Although I can understand why so many are motivated to get around such an unfair tax on the a section of the motoring public. Especially given the evidence that the claimed benefits are marginal in outer London.rick_chasey said:Stevo’s not a fan of law and order
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202308271255924?sort=relevance&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Diesel&include-delivery-option=on&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&page=1&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-to=2000&year-from=2009&fromsra
I've just sold a newer fiesta for £200 scrap as it fell to bits.
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Yeah, Adblue and the joys of oil dilution (more frequent oil changes).Pross said:
I was responding to the comments about “poor people’ not being able to change their car. Those with a pre-2009 petrol should be able to get something very similar or better with the £2k scrappage fee.mully79 said:What were really saying is trade in your 35000 mile 2015 mercedes A class diesel for a French hatchback that's been flogged to death for 125000 miles and get no change.
That will be my pensioner parents decision when the Manchester Caz finally happens.
I thought diesels from 2015 onwards were compliant anyway?0 -
2015 A class diesels (Euro 5 so non-compliant) with low mileage are currently selling for around £12k or more so might be worth selling now and getting a compliant car before the rush.0
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To be fair though you don't get that nasty whaft of deisel stench old ones give you as they pass, horrible.0
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Seriously?rjsterry said:
As opposed to some guy from another country telling me what shitty air quality I should put up with. I might well be middle class but the council tenant family who live opposite has three cars to our one. As I said really poor people don't own a car in the first place.First.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
Do they have a big TV as well?
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Sell a 2015 Euro 5 model
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202309011415017?sort=distance&advertising-location=at_cars&include-delivery-option=on&make=Mercedes-Benz&model=A Class&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-from=11000&year-from=2015&fromsra
Get a 2017 model with a few more miles
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202308291297283?sort=distance&advertising-location=at_cars&include-delivery-option=on&make=Mercedes-Benz&model=A Class&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-from=11000&price-to=13000&year-from=2015&fromsra
Or similar mileage 2015 Euro 6
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202307310250300?sort=distance&advertising-location=at_cars&include-delivery-option=on&make=Mercedes-Benz&model=A Class&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-from=11000&price-to=13000&year-from=2015&fromsra
For roughly the same price.
I’m actually surprised how little difference there is between the prices to be honest.0 -
I mean what would I know? I just live here.First.Aspect said:
Seriously?rjsterry said:
As opposed to some guy from another country telling me what shitty air quality I should put up with. I might well be middle class but the council tenant family who live opposite has three cars to our one. As I said really poor people don't own a car in the first place.First.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
Do they have a big TV as well?1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I assume the pro vandalism contributors think it's fine for people to slash the tyres of wankpanzers because they disagree with them being on the streets.0
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They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next. "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Much easier not to introduce this cluster**** of a system in the first place then none of this public funding would be needed.Pross said:
I didn’t see you make a point that someone with a 2009 petrol banger could upgrade to a 2010 model with public money but if you did I’m more than happy to have helped.Stevo_666 said:
Cheap because its non-compliant. Thanks to Pross for demonstrating my point for memully79 said:
That's a diesel, they're all cheap now. + Huge mileage.Pross said:
Nice Ford Fiesta 2010 petrol less than £2k, one of many on Autotrader.mully79 said:
Sounds like a good idea until you realise you can't get finance on a car older than 10 years and a 2012 VW polo is over £6k.Pross said:
Flog their old diesel, take the grant and buy a similar age petrol? That’s what I’d have done with my 10 year old non-compliant high mileage diesel worth around £1500. Pretty sure I could get a similar level of petrol car. Not many will have pre-2009 petrols and £2k would probably allow an upgrade on most that are older.Stevo_666 said:
More likely to be the case that they can't afford to upgrade, as has been pointed out several times.rjsterry said:
Seems entirely fair that it only affects the people who haven't bothered their arses to upgrade.Stevo_666 said:
Oh I dunno. Although I can understand why so many are motivated to get around such an unfair tax on the a section of the motoring public. Especially given the evidence that the claimed benefits are marginal in outer London.rick_chasey said:Stevo’s not a fan of law and order
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202308271255924?sort=relevance&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Diesel&include-delivery-option=on&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&page=1&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-to=2000&year-from=2009&fromsra
I've just sold a newer fiesta for £200 scrap as it fell to bits.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Maybe you should lobby the Tory Government to get rid of the legislation that made it necessary then?Stevo_666 said:
Much easier not to introduce this cluster**** of a system in the first place then none of this public funding would be needed.Pross said:
I didn’t see you make a point that someone with a 2009 petrol banger could upgrade to a 2010 model with public money but if you did I’m more than happy to have helped.Stevo_666 said:
Cheap because its non-compliant. Thanks to Pross for demonstrating my point for memully79 said:
That's a diesel, they're all cheap now. + Huge mileage.Pross said:
Nice Ford Fiesta 2010 petrol less than £2k, one of many on Autotrader.mully79 said:
Sounds like a good idea until you realise you can't get finance on a car older than 10 years and a 2012 VW polo is over £6k.Pross said:
Flog their old diesel, take the grant and buy a similar age petrol? That’s what I’d have done with my 10 year old non-compliant high mileage diesel worth around £1500. Pretty sure I could get a similar level of petrol car. Not many will have pre-2009 petrols and £2k would probably allow an upgrade on most that are older.Stevo_666 said:
More likely to be the case that they can't afford to upgrade, as has been pointed out several times.rjsterry said:
Seems entirely fair that it only affects the people who haven't bothered their arses to upgrade.Stevo_666 said:
Oh I dunno. Although I can understand why so many are motivated to get around such an unfair tax on the a section of the motoring public. Especially given the evidence that the claimed benefits are marginal in outer London.rick_chasey said:Stevo’s not a fan of law and order
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202308271255924?sort=relevance&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Diesel&include-delivery-option=on&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&page=1&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-to=2000&year-from=2009&fromsra
I've just sold a newer fiesta for £200 scrap as it fell to bits.0 -
Came in from the m3 today, warning about the ulez on that way in too, with opportunity to come off to avoid it. Sorry to report.0
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You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Since a straw poll on here indicated that it affected zero people, I'd say you have a point.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
Mountain range out of a molehill for political point scoring. #wasteoftimeThe above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Gosh you are right, even though this new tax not based on public health and will affect everyone eventually.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
I'm in good health, so I'm not entitled to comment on the NHS. Nor do I have children, so education is off the table. My office building isn't made of RAAC so I can't comment on that.
I rarely use the trains, so that's not up for discussion.
I'm British, so I have no right to comment on the Trump or Putin threads.
Shall I go on?
What an utterly childish attitude.
And yes, telling poor people to just get a new car, and alleging that people in council houses have lots of money because they have nicer cars than you shows a whole new level of social ignorance. Well done.
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Easy one that - blaming the poor for their problems and lacking sympathy for them (according to the centre leftie Bible of right wing stereotypes).rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
If there is a Tory mayor elected next year she has it in her manifesto will scrap the expansion. Probably the most effective route.Pross said:
Maybe you should lobby the Tory Government to get rid of the legislation that made it necessary then?Stevo_666 said:
Much easier not to introduce this cluster**** of a system in the first place then none of this public funding would be needed.Pross said:
I didn’t see you make a point that someone with a 2009 petrol banger could upgrade to a 2010 model with public money but if you did I’m more than happy to have helped.Stevo_666 said:
Cheap because its non-compliant. Thanks to Pross for demonstrating my point for memully79 said:
That's a diesel, they're all cheap now. + Huge mileage.Pross said:
Nice Ford Fiesta 2010 petrol less than £2k, one of many on Autotrader.mully79 said:
Sounds like a good idea until you realise you can't get finance on a car older than 10 years and a 2012 VW polo is over £6k.Pross said:
Flog their old diesel, take the grant and buy a similar age petrol? That’s what I’d have done with my 10 year old non-compliant high mileage diesel worth around £1500. Pretty sure I could get a similar level of petrol car. Not many will have pre-2009 petrols and £2k would probably allow an upgrade on most that are older.Stevo_666 said:
More likely to be the case that they can't afford to upgrade, as has been pointed out several times.rjsterry said:
Seems entirely fair that it only affects the people who haven't bothered their arses to upgrade.Stevo_666 said:
Oh I dunno. Although I can understand why so many are motivated to get around such an unfair tax on the a section of the motoring public. Especially given the evidence that the claimed benefits are marginal in outer London.rick_chasey said:Stevo’s not a fan of law and order
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202308271255924?sort=relevance&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Diesel&include-delivery-option=on&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&page=1&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-to=2000&year-from=2009&fromsra
I've just sold a newer fiesta for £200 scrap as it fell to bits."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Well said.First.Aspect said:
Gosh you are right, even though this new tax not based on public health and will affect everyone eventually.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
I'm in good health, so I'm not entitled to comment on the NHS. Nor do I have children, so education is off the table. My office building isn't made of RAAC so I can't comment on that.
I rarely use the trains, so that's not up for discussion.
I'm British, so I have no right to comment on the Trump or Putin threads.
Shall I go on?
What an utterly childish attitude.
And yes, telling poor people to just get a new car, and alleging that people in council houses have lots of money because they have nicer cars than you shows a whole new level of social ignorance. Well done."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Went into Bromely via the A21 last night, the warning sign for the LEZ had a space below it where a 4 letter acronym had been removed - I can't guess what that waskingstongraham said:Came in from the m3 today, warning about the ulez on that way in too, with opportunity to come off to avoid it. Sorry to report.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
See FA's post above - good response to your point.pblakeney said:
Since a straw poll on here indicated that it affected zero people, I'd say you have a point.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
Mountain range out of a molehill for political point scoring. #wasteoftime"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Projecting a lot onto what I've written and just flat out inventing things now. The ULEZ is going to be a universal tax on everyone is it?First.Aspect said:
Gosh you are right, even though this new tax not based on public health and will affect everyone eventually.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
I'm in good health, so I'm not entitled to comment on the NHS. Nor do I have children, so education is off the table. My office building isn't made of RAAC so I can't comment on that.
I rarely use the trains, so that's not up for discussion.
I'm British, so I have no right to comment on the Trump or Putin threads.
Shall I go on?
What an utterly childish attitude.
And yes, telling poor people to just get a new car, and alleging that people in council houses have lots of money because they have nicer cars than you shows a whole new level of social ignorance. Well done.
What I'm suggesting is that maybe I have a better handle than you on the demographics of the lower income areas affected by the ULEZ expansion as I live there. I also think I have a better idea of the alternative travel options for the 24% of local households who don't have a car because as someone who doesn't drive but needs to travel a lot for work, I use those alternatives myself.
You don't believe removing vehicles with higher NOx and particulates emissions will improve air quality. Beyond dismissing the information that is available on fairly narrow grounds I've not seen much of an argument on why. As the air quality in London directly affects me and my children, I'm sure you can understand why being told what I should think by someone utterly unaffected by either the charge or the air quality is a bit much.
Similarly seeing as you brought it up - I would think lecturing a resident of Mariupol about what they should be doing about the Russian invasion would be a bit presumptuous.1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
The slight flaw in your logic is that you are assuming ULEZ will make a material difference to air quality - unfortunately there is good evidence that it will make very little difference.rjsterry said:
Projecting a lot onto what I've written and inventing things that don't exist now. The ULEZ is going to be a universal tax on everyone is it?First.Aspect said:
Gosh you are right, even though this new tax not based on public health and will affect everyone eventually.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
I'm in good health, so I'm not entitled to comment on the NHS. Nor do I have children, so education is off the table. My office building isn't made of RAAC so I can't comment on that.
I rarely use the trains, so that's not up for discussion.
I'm British, so I have no right to comment on the Trump or Putin threads.
Shall I go on?
What an utterly childish attitude.
And yes, telling poor people to just get a new car, and alleging that people in council houses have lots of money because they have nicer cars than you shows a whole new level of social ignorance. Well done.
What I'm suggesting is that maybe I have a better handle than you on the demographics of the lower income areas affected by the ULEZ expansion as I live there. I also think I have a better idea of the alternative travel options for the 24% of local households who don't have a car because as someone who doesn't drive but needs to travel a lot for work, I use those alternatives myself.
You don't believe removing vehicles with higher NOx and particulates emissions will improve air quality. Beyond dismissing the information that is available on fairly narrow grounds I've not seen much of an argument on why. As the air quality in London directly affects me and my children, I'm sure you can understand why being told what I should think by someone utterly unaffected by either the charge or the air quality is a bit much.
Similarly seeing as you brought it up - I would think lecturing a resident of Mariupol about what they should be doing about the Russian invasion would be a bit presumptuous.
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/ac30c1
As I've said before, if you really want better air quality, escape to the country.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Well I'll keep this in mind for your posts in future RJS. I feel almost certain that you'll slip up and say something you know nothing about, or at the very least are unqualified to comment on in my special judgement.
1. Other cities will use ULEZ as a template. I know its a difficult concept for you to grasp, but there are actually other cities.
2. Tailpipe emissions in traffic on the busiest roads do not translate to the population level health benefits that ULEZ is purported to be addressing.
3. When governments say things that aren't true, it bothers me.0 -
RJS is talking about tax in the Conservative party thread. According to his logic, I'm the only person who should be allowed to discuss it in Cake StopFirst.Aspect said:Well I'll keep this in mind for your posts in future RJS. I feel almost certain that you'll slip up and say something you know nothing about, or at the very least are unqualified to comment on in my special judgement.
1. Other cities will use ULEZ as a template. I know its a difficult concept for you to grasp, but there are actually other cities.
2. Tailpipe emissions in traffic on the busiest roads do not translate to the population level health benefits that ULEZ is purported to be addressing.
3. When governments say things that aren't true, it bothers me. "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
The final sentences of the abstract seem to indicate they have much less confidence than you in the idea that ULEZ makes little difference.Stevo_666 said:
The slight flaw in your logic is that you are assuming ULEZ will make a material difference to air quality - unfortunately there is good evidence that it will make very little difference.rjsterry said:
Projecting a lot onto what I've written and inventing things that don't exist now. The ULEZ is going to be a universal tax on everyone is it?First.Aspect said:
Gosh you are right, even though this new tax not based on public health and will affect everyone eventually.rjsterry said:
You'll have to explain what is rightwing about what I've written.Stevo_666 said:
They say you get more right wing as you get older. It appears that rjsterry is ageing quicklyFirst.Aspect said:This has turned into the middle class censored thread.
You'll all be saying these people should have studied harder next.
More a case of wanting people with no stake in this to keep their noses out of things that don't affect them.
I'm in good health, so I'm not entitled to comment on the NHS. Nor do I have children, so education is off the table. My office building isn't made of RAAC so I can't comment on that.
I rarely use the trains, so that's not up for discussion.
I'm British, so I have no right to comment on the Trump or Putin threads.
Shall I go on?
What an utterly childish attitude.
And yes, telling poor people to just get a new car, and alleging that people in council houses have lots of money because they have nicer cars than you shows a whole new level of social ignorance. Well done.
What I'm suggesting is that maybe I have a better handle than you on the demographics of the lower income areas affected by the ULEZ expansion as I live there. I also think I have a better idea of the alternative travel options for the 24% of local households who don't have a car because as someone who doesn't drive but needs to travel a lot for work, I use those alternatives myself.
You don't believe removing vehicles with higher NOx and particulates emissions will improve air quality. Beyond dismissing the information that is available on fairly narrow grounds I've not seen much of an argument on why. As the air quality in London directly affects me and my children, I'm sure you can understand why being told what I should think by someone utterly unaffected by either the charge or the air quality is a bit much.
Similarly seeing as you brought it up - I would think lecturing a resident of Mariupol about what they should be doing about the Russian invasion would be a bit presumptuous.
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/ac30c1
As I've said before, if you really want better air quality, escape to the country.
0 -
They've selected a candidate who is a Trump fan to run for mayor in one of the most left leaning cities in the country.Stevo_666 said:
If there is a Tory mayor elected next year she has it in her manifesto will scrap the expansion. Probably the most effective route.Pross said:
Maybe you should lobby the Tory Government to get rid of the legislation that made it necessary then?Stevo_666 said:
Much easier not to introduce this cluster**** of a system in the first place then none of this public funding would be needed.Pross said:
I didn’t see you make a point that someone with a 2009 petrol banger could upgrade to a 2010 model with public money but if you did I’m more than happy to have helped.Stevo_666 said:
Cheap because its non-compliant. Thanks to Pross for demonstrating my point for memully79 said:
That's a diesel, they're all cheap now. + Huge mileage.Pross said:
Nice Ford Fiesta 2010 petrol less than £2k, one of many on Autotrader.mully79 said:
Sounds like a good idea until you realise you can't get finance on a car older than 10 years and a 2012 VW polo is over £6k.Pross said:
Flog their old diesel, take the grant and buy a similar age petrol? That’s what I’d have done with my 10 year old non-compliant high mileage diesel worth around £1500. Pretty sure I could get a similar level of petrol car. Not many will have pre-2009 petrols and £2k would probably allow an upgrade on most that are older.Stevo_666 said:
More likely to be the case that they can't afford to upgrade, as has been pointed out several times.rjsterry said:
Seems entirely fair that it only affects the people who haven't bothered their arses to upgrade.Stevo_666 said:
Oh I dunno. Although I can understand why so many are motivated to get around such an unfair tax on the a section of the motoring public. Especially given the evidence that the claimed benefits are marginal in outer London.rick_chasey said:Stevo’s not a fan of law and order
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202308271255924?sort=relevance&advertising-location=at_cars&fuel-type=Diesel&include-delivery-option=on&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&page=1&postcode=SA1 5QF&price-to=2000&year-from=2009&fromsra
I've just sold a newer fiesta for £200 scrap as it fell to bits.
They aren't trying to win.0 -
2 is obviously nonsenseFirst.Aspect said:Well I'll keep this in mind for your posts in future RJS. I feel almost certain that you'll slip up and say something you know nothing about, or at the very least are unqualified to comment on in my special judgement.
1. Other cities will use ULEZ as a template. I know its a difficult concept for you to grasp, but there are actually other cities.
2. Tailpipe emissions in traffic on the busiest roads do not translate to the population level health benefits that ULEZ is purported to be addressing.
3. When governments say things that aren't true, it bothers me.0
