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  • david37david37 Posts: 1,313
    the train has left the station :( it must be very difficult when you believe you should be winning the tour or the olympics and can see that you wont. Good luck to him I hope he finds some peace and gains some motivation.

  • gweedsgweeds Posts: 2,328
    Wow. Didn’t see that coming.

    But he’s human like all of us. I’d imagine the pressure at that level is insane.
    Napoleon, don't be jealous that I've been chatting online with babes all day. Besides, we both know that I'm training to be a cage fighter.
  • blazing_saddlesblazing_saddles Posts: 17,371
    edited 23 January
    In English:

    https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tom-dumoulin-puts-career-on-hold-and-leaves-jumbo-visma-training-camp/

    Says he made the decision yesterday but yesterday it was announced he had co-leadership at the Tour.

    Also Sporza said:

    Yesterday, 30-year-old Tom Dumoulin announced that he will support Wout van Aert in the Tour of Flanders. It comes as a big surprise that he is now taking a break from his career.

    There's something fishy about this.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 15,302
    Pretty much a passenger last year and doesn’t appear to want to be a support rider.
    Little surprise.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 26,158
    Never been a big fan of Dumoulin... something about a big guy climbing up Oropa like a steam train... it's a climb I know very well, I grew up there... it's hard, it's not one for testers and Dumoulin is ultimately a tester.

    It's a climb for climbers or for testers on juice, like Bruseghin...

    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping
  • twotoebennytwotoebenny Posts: 1,001
    yesterday he tweeted to say he was starting the season with strade bianche now hes not doing anything !?!?!
  • arnufarnuf Posts: 81


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 26,158
    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
  • neonriverneonriver Posts: 115

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
  • Lanterne_RogueLanterne_Rogue Posts: 2,733


    There's something fishy about this.

    If it's a mental health issue then it's not uncommon for everything to come to a crisis, and quite unexpectedly to pretty much everyone (including the person suffering it). Finally being committed to a schedule may have crystallised something. I speak from personal experience, sadly.

    I'm inclined to be non-suspicious unless anything else turns up.

  • sherersherer Posts: 2,446
    main thing is i hope he sorts himself out mentally. As stated it's not an easy life and they are only human after all
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 24,930



    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    Both Dumoulin and Aru have had injury problems. See also Bernal, Froome, Jakobsen, Evenepoel.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • redvisionredvision Posts: 2,701
    Surely the team would have suspended him if there was anything untoward going on, rather than just allow him to take unpaid leave?

    Who knows what his personal situation is. It could be a mental health issue, or perhaps the covid situation. There are loads of things. Whatever it is, I hope he gets the support he needs to get through his troubles.

  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 26,158
    neonriver said:

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
    Up to 2016, he was a fast time triallist, like Tony Martin... in 2017-2018 he basically was the number 1 (or 2) in Grand Tours, then in 2019 and 2020 he DNF 2 of them and finished 7th in the Tour, 8 minutes behind the winner and courtesy of being part of by far the strongest team in the race... had he been in a different team, he wouldn't have made the top 20.

    Bottom line, he goes from zero to hero and back to zero...

    AND, as I said, I never quite believed what he did up Oropa was genuine... he did beat Zakarin, Quintana, Landa, Pinot, Yates and Nibali.
    He did remind me a lot of Berzin for some reason...
  • phreakphreak Posts: 2,366

    neonriver said:

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
    Up to 2016, he was a fast time triallist, like Tony Martin... in 2017-2018 he basically was the number 1 (or 2) in Grand Tours, then in 2019 and 2020 he DNF 2 of them and finished 7th in the Tour, 8 minutes behind the winner and courtesy of being part of by far the strongest team in the race... had he been in a different team, he wouldn't have made the top 20.

    Bottom line, he goes from zero to hero and back to zero...

    AND, as I said, I never quite believed what he did up Oropa was genuine... he did beat Zakarin, Quintana, Landa, Pinot, Yates and Nibali.
    He did remind me a lot of Berzin for some reason...
    Weren't the likes of Quintana about 90 seconds slower than Pantani's famous ascent of the climb in 1999? When you think the whole climb is just 17/18 minutes that's a pretty hefty gap. When Quintana won on the climb in 2014 he was about 10 seconds slower than Moreno Argentin's time from 1993, and lets be honest, Argentin was certainly not a climber.
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 22,162
    Nah Nah, Nah Nah, Nah Nah Nana, Nah Nah Nah

    No Tom Dumolin

    Du-no-lin

    Noo Tom Dumoli-in

    (hopefully, this is just "Princess Tom" having a moment and he'll be back soon. 🤞 )
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • blazing_saddlesblazing_saddles Posts: 17,371
    edited 23 January

    Never been a big fan of Dumoulin... something about a big guy climbing up Oropa like a steam train... it's a climb I know very well, I grew up there... it's hard, it's not one for testers and Dumoulin is ultimately a tester.

    It's a climb for climbers or for testers on juice, like Bruseghin...

    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    OK, so I won't lie, I do have that recent, "linked to Aderlass" story in the back of my mind but...
    Reading between the lines, "should never have left Sunweb" "another domestique" and "unpaid leave", I reckon he's had a major bust up with the team, probably over leadership issues and has told them he will never ride for Jumbo again.

    Whether there is any link to Hirschi leaving Sunweb under mysterious circumstances, I know not.

    One things for sure, we're talking about a massive ego here.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • zest28zest28 Posts: 332
    edited 23 January
    Tom is a GC rider and with Roglic in the team, he will never win a Grand Tour anymore. Probably why he calls it quits.

    Else he will just be a glorified domestique, which is also why Froome quit Ineos.
  • zest28zest28 Posts: 332
    edited 23 January

    neonriver said:

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
    Up to 2016, he was a fast time triallist, like Tony Martin... in 2017-2018 he basically was the number 1 (or 2) in Grand Tours, then in 2019 and 2020 he DNF 2 of them and finished 7th in the Tour, 8 minutes behind the winner and courtesy of being part of by far the strongest team in the race... had he been in a different team, he wouldn't have made the top 20.

    Bottom line, he goes from zero to hero and back to zero...

    AND, as I said, I never quite believed what he did up Oropa was genuine... he did beat Zakarin, Quintana, Landa, Pinot, Yates and Nibali.
    He did remind me a lot of Berzin for some reason...

    What are you smoking? Tom Dumoulin was together with Wout Van Aerts the reason why Team Ineos got destroyed in the Tour De France.

    Guys like Bernal got smoked after Van Aerts passed the ball to Tom Dumoulin to time-trail the Jumbo-Visma train up the mountains. Only guys like Pogacar and Porte were able to hang on to the Jumbo-Visma train.

    If you call Tom Dumoulin a zero, who was one of the strongest riders in the Tour De France last year, then what is everybody else then?

    Tom Dumoulin will be missed by Jumbo-Visma, he was not a zero like you claim him to be.
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 22,162
    From the Big Man himself



    Must say, that does sound a bit more hopeful that all he needs is time...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • zest28zest28 Posts: 332
    edited 23 January
    Makes sense. Alot of people take a sabbatical from work, is nothing new.

    Perhaps it wasn’t only the knee injury, but the added pressure everybody put on him after his big successes that made him perform worse in the end.

    In the end, I don’t think it will not matter much because we saw last year that Pogacar doesn’t give a damn what the Jumbo-Visma train does, he is stronger than the entire Jumbo-Visma all by himself.

    If Jumbo-Visma wants to win, Roglic needs to get on the same level as Pogacar.
  • Dorset_BoyDorset_Boy Posts: 3,848
    zest28 said:

    neonriver said:

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
    Up to 2016, he was a fast time triallist, like Tony Martin... in 2017-2018 he basically was the number 1 (or 2) in Grand Tours, then in 2019 and 2020 he DNF 2 of them and finished 7th in the Tour, 8 minutes behind the winner and courtesy of being part of by far the strongest team in the race... had he been in a different team, he wouldn't have made the top 20.

    Bottom line, he goes from zero to hero and back to zero...

    AND, as I said, I never quite believed what he did up Oropa was genuine... he did beat Zakarin, Quintana, Landa, Pinot, Yates and Nibali.
    He did remind me a lot of Berzin for some reason...

    What are you smoking? Tom Dumoulin was together with Wout Van Aerts the reason why Team Ineos got destroyed in the Tour De France.

    Guys like Bernal got smoked after Van Aerts passed the ball to Tom Dumoulin to time-trail the Jumbo-Visma train up the mountains. Only guys like Pogacar and Porte were able to hang on to the Jumbo-Visma train.

    If you call Tom Dumoulin a zero, who was one of the strongest riders in the Tour De France last year, then what is everybody else then?

    Tom Dumoulin will be missed by Jumbo-Visma, he was not a zero like you claim him to be.
    I don't recall Dumoulin managing more than about 500m on the front after WvA, before he blew himself.
    It was WvA and Sepp Kuss who dragged Roglic around France, not Tom D.
  • zest28zest28 Posts: 332
    edited 23 January

    zest28 said:

    neonriver said:

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
    Up to 2016, he was a fast time triallist, like Tony Martin... in 2017-2018 he basically was the number 1 (or 2) in Grand Tours, then in 2019 and 2020 he DNF 2 of them and finished 7th in the Tour, 8 minutes behind the winner and courtesy of being part of by far the strongest team in the race... had he been in a different team, he wouldn't have made the top 20.

    Bottom line, he goes from zero to hero and back to zero...

    AND, as I said, I never quite believed what he did up Oropa was genuine... he did beat Zakarin, Quintana, Landa, Pinot, Yates and Nibali.
    He did remind me a lot of Berzin for some reason...

    What are you smoking? Tom Dumoulin was together with Wout Van Aerts the reason why Team Ineos got destroyed in the Tour De France.

    Guys like Bernal got smoked after Van Aerts passed the ball to Tom Dumoulin to time-trail the Jumbo-Visma train up the mountains. Only guys like Pogacar and Porte were able to hang on to the Jumbo-Visma train.

    If you call Tom Dumoulin a zero, who was one of the strongest riders in the Tour De France last year, then what is everybody else then?

    Tom Dumoulin will be missed by Jumbo-Visma, he was not a zero like you claim him to be.
    I don't recall Dumoulin managing more than about 500m on the front after WvA, before he blew himself.
    It was WvA and Sepp Kuss who dragged Roglic around France, not Tom D.
    Check the stage where Bernal got knocked out of the TdF. First Van Aerts did a huge effort and then Van Aerts called it quits and dropped back to Bernal. And then Tom Dumoulin TT the entire Jumbo-Visma train to the top of the mountain before calling it quits.

    After that, Roglic and Pogacar went on to fight for the stage win.

    I do not recall Kuss doing much against Ineos? Only towards the end of the TdF Kuss did something, but that was totally ineffective as Roglic was unable to put time onto Pogacar.
  • roscoeroscoe Posts: 98
    zest28 said:

    zest28 said:

    neonriver said:

    arnuf said:


    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    I don't see what makes this fishy. He has quit a lot things (races, teams, seasons) the last two or three years so this decision is pretty much in line with that.
    I'm always a bit suspicious of riders going from hero to zero (or the other way round) in the space of a season... it's the same trajectory as Fabio Aru... to me there is only one plausible explanation... and involves the availability (or the lack of) a particularly effective pharmaceutical practice.

    I do appreciate having a bad season, but here is different... we are talking about the number one (or two) in GT races, being unable to even finish a Grand Tour...
    He was 7th in the tour hardly hero to zero
    Up to 2016, he was a fast time triallist, like Tony Martin... in 2017-2018 he basically was the number 1 (or 2) in Grand Tours, then in 2019 and 2020 he DNF 2 of them and finished 7th in the Tour, 8 minutes behind the winner and courtesy of being part of by far the strongest team in the race... had he been in a different team, he wouldn't have made the top 20.

    Bottom line, he goes from zero to hero and back to zero...

    AND, as I said, I never quite believed what he did up Oropa was genuine... he did beat Zakarin, Quintana, Landa, Pinot, Yates and Nibali.
    He did remind me a lot of Berzin for some reason...

    What are you smoking? Tom Dumoulin was together with Wout Van Aerts the reason why Team Ineos got destroyed in the Tour De France.

    Guys like Bernal got smoked after Van Aerts passed the ball to Tom Dumoulin to time-trail the Jumbo-Visma train up the mountains. Only guys like Pogacar and Porte were able to hang on to the Jumbo-Visma train.

    If you call Tom Dumoulin a zero, who was one of the strongest riders in the Tour De France last year, then what is everybody else then?

    Tom Dumoulin will be missed by Jumbo-Visma, he was not a zero like you claim him to be.
    I don't recall Dumoulin managing more than about 500m on the front after WvA, before he blew himself.
    It was WvA and Sepp Kuss who dragged Roglic around France, not Tom D.
    Check the stage where Bernal got knocked out of the TdF. First Van Aerts did a huge effort and then Van Aerts called it quits and dropped back to Bernal. And then Tom Dumoulin TT the entire Jumbo-Visma train to the top of the mountain before calling it quits.

    After that, Roglic and Pogacar went on to fight for the stage win.

    I do not recall Kuss doing much against Ineos? Only towards the end of the TdF Kuss did something, but that was totally ineffective as Roglic was unable to put time onto Pogacar.
    Didn’t Bernal leave the Tour because he was carrying a fairly serious injury?
  • ProssPross Posts: 27,149
    I seem to recall Bernal being "knocked out" by an ongoing back problem as soon as the racing started not by any particular team or rider. Dumoulin did next to nothing after "surrendering his own chances to support Roglic".
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 54,994 Lives Here
    Pross said:

    I seem to recall Bernal being "knocked out" by an ongoing back problem as soon as the racing started not by any particular team or rider. Dumoulin did next to nothing after "surrendering his own chances to support Roglic".

    Struggled a lot with a saddlesore
  • carbonclemcarbonclem Posts: 963
    I’m surprised more riders don’t end up packing. I can’t imagine the pressure and relentless work schedule. When you go from team lead to super dom it must be hard.
    2020 Metric Century Challenge Winner
  • andypandyp Posts: 8,509

    Never been a big fan of Dumoulin... something about a big guy climbing up Oropa like a steam train... it's a climb I know very well, I grew up there... it's hard, it's not one for testers and Dumoulin is ultimately a tester.

    It's a climb for climbers or for testers on juice, like Bruseghin...

    I think too there is something fishy and normally in cycling that means doping

    Given how consistently wrong you are in your analysis on other pro race topics, one assumes this is from the same, error-strewn place. You have absolutely zero evidence to back up any of your assertions, but throw them out there like they are known truths.

    Either back up this claims with evidence, or stay silent.
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 6,855
    Who knows what has gone on. I admit my first reaction was either stress/mental health or else a bust up with the team rather than doping but any would fit with what we know - which is not much.

    AFC Mercia women - sign for us
  • orraloonorraloon Posts: 8,286
    Moore and Chennaoui mistimed their Presenting Jumbo Visma 21 release of The Cycling Podcast then.
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