Quinn Simmons benched for tweet

rick_chasey

So neo-pro Quinn Simmons of Trek has been benched for a tweet that was decided was inappropriate by trek.

I get the feeling people in the states are a bit amped up over this election. Anyway.

Here's the exchange in question



https://cyclingtips.com/2020/10/american-neo-pro-quinn-simmons-benched-by-team-over-racially-charged-tweet/

rick_chasey

(I wrote tinned earlier - he's not been)

salsiccia1

I'm hoping he's getting a hard time for using the black hand emoji, and not for his political views. As odious as Trump is to me it's a bit much to cancel someone because they support him and have different views to many.

twotoebenny

From what I've read it's mainly the use of the emoji that has caused the friction... it's a weird phenomenon social media where people are happy to blurt out any old censored without thinking...

bobmcstuff

salsiccia1 said:

I'm hoping he's getting a hard time for using the black hand emoji, and not for his political views. As odious as Trump is to me it's a bit much to cancel someone because they support him and have different views to many.

You have to assume so, don't you, otherwise it's a bit harsh

Matti66

Will there be witch hunt now to ‘cancel’ him out . Kheme rouge style. Probably .

joe_totale-2

In the end of the day Quinn Simmons represents two corporations in Trek and Segafredo who want to sell bikes and coffee. His tweet is going to put potential customers off hence the actions of his team.
Trek have already courted controversy by continuing to sell bikes to the US Police.

Personally I feel that Trek Segafredo have taken the right course of action, they certainly appear more proactive than Sky/Ineos were with Moscon.

shockedsoshocked

There's been other posts on various social media platforms such as Instagram apparently. Sort of watched it real time on twitter and lots of people were getting stuck in including some high profile accounts like Phil Gaimon and Peter Flax.

Matti66

joe_totale-2 said:

In the end of the day Quinn Simmons represents two corporations in Trek and Segafredo who want to sell bikes and coffee. His tweet is going to put potential customers off hence the actions of his team.
Trek have already courted controversy by continuing to sell bikes to the US Police.

Personally I feel that Trek Segafredo have taken the right course of action, they certainly appear more proactive than Sky/Ineos were with Moscon.

Re the Moscon thing. You probably have a better recall of this than me, but I thought he was sanctioned for a few weeks an attended a course of some sort. Tbh the matter is closed .

RichN95.

salsiccia1 said:

I'm hoping he's getting a hard time for using the black hand emoji, and not for his political views. As odious as Trump is to me it's a bit much to cancel someone because they support him and have different views to many.

What is the significance of the black hand emoji?

Not knowing any significance to it, I thought it a bit unseemly seeing a load of middle age journalists pilling onto a 19 year old. At that age your political views are almost entirely inherited.

dish_dash

RichN95. said:

salsiccia1 said:

I'm hoping he's getting a hard time for using the black hand emoji, and not for his political views. As odious as Trump is to me it's a bit much to cancel someone because they support him and have different views to many.

What is the significance of the black hand emoji?

Not knowing any significance to it, I thought it a bit unseemly seeing a load of middle age journalists pilling onto a 19 year old. At that age your political views are almost entirely inherited.

The internet equivalent of black face apparently.

50x11

Not sure I agree with benching him for supporting Trump, but it also seems the emoji is the issue. Suppose it's a white person using the black hand, but not sure if there is more context to it.

Trek seem to have reacted quickly to an emoji, but don't mind constant videos of their bikes being used to beat black protesters up. Suppose it comes down to money.

joe_totale-2

RichN95. said:

salsiccia1 said:

I'm hoping he's getting a hard time for using the black hand emoji, and not for his political views. As odious as Trump is to me it's a bit much to cancel someone because they support him and have different views to many.

What is the significance of the black hand emoji?

Not knowing any significance to it, I thought it a bit unseemly seeing a load of middle age journalists pilling onto a 19 year old. At that age your political views are almost entirely inherited.

To me it looks like virtual blackface and it appears to be intentional.

However, you're right and that this is probably the actions of a 19 year old who may be still quite naive.

Matti66 said:

Re the Moscon thing. You probably have a better recall of this than me, but I thought he was sanctioned for a few weeks an attended a course of some sort. Tbh the matter is closed .

It's not just the racist incident with Moscon but his general poor behaviour towards other riders in the peloton:

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/debusschere-on-moscons-disqualification-its-a-series-of-incidents-and-its-always-the-same-guy/

Lanterne_Rogue

I didn't go chasing up the references because I couldn't face it, frankly, but there was some suggestion that he was doubling down on it once he was called out. From a reputational point of view I can't believe that teams don't have a general social media policy of "if you get into a bit of a spat, contact the PR guys to work out the best way to extricate yourself, or at least emerge as the winner, rather than going rogue and digging yourself deeper"

ddraver

I didn't follow it closely - life's too short - but it does seem to be the black hand that was the problematic microagression/Gave the left all the excuse it needed. Given our whiteo-centric devices, he would have had to select that colour and I can't see why a white dude would have chosen a black hand to respond to a white journalist. On the other hand (arf), It's not something I've ever thought about before when using emojis 😮😝🤤😱🍆

Chloe Dygert has a similar twitter feed in terms of likes and retweets but had not yet been in trouble. Perhaps it's harder to cancel someone in a hospital bed with half a leg hanging off tho...

WvA don't think Greta Thunberg is all that either, but I suspect the Dutch won't give a sh...

m.r.m.

Or have the brains to understand that if social media doesn't directly earn you money, use it exceedingly judiciously and sparingly.

gregster04

He made a mistake, pretty easy for a 19 year old on social media. I have sympathy for that.

His team have reacted, which they’re entitled to do as they pay his wages and want to sell more of their products. I can also sympathise with that.

If you can’t see why people from minority groups have a problem with Trump then you just don’t want to see it.

I expect he’ll be back racing for Trek-Segafredo next season and we won’t seem him much on social media. He’s a very talented guy so I hope we do.

blazing_saddles

I may be older, but I don't get it.
In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

Folks are automatically assuming he must be racially motivated to have done so, but how does this relate to José Been, who is white?
Is it because of his right wing political stance?

Not sure why JB thought it would be a good idea to wade into the US political debate either. Sport's commentators tend to keep any views they have to themselves as personal views can sometimes land them in hit water too.

DeVlaeminck

I don't get why a white person can't use a black emoji either or vice versa however we are where we are and if that is considered a racial slur of some sort I can see why he needs to be suspended for it if he did it knowingly with that intention.

bobmcstuff

blazing_saddles said:

I may be older, but I don't get it.
In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

Folks are automatically assuming he must be racially motivated to have done so, but how does this relate to José Been, who is white?
Is it because of his right wing political stance?

Not sure why JB thought it would be a good idea to wade into the US political debate either. Sport's commentators tend to keep any views they have to themselves as personal views can sometimes land them in hit water too.

Do you think it was actually random though? The default colour is Simpsons-esque yellow.

His follow up suggests it possibly wasn't.

RichN95.

bobmcstuff said:

Do you think it was actually random though? The default colour is Simpsons-esque yellow.

His follow up suggests it possibly wasn't.

But here's a thing. I am part of a Whatsapp group where people use the thumbs up or down emoji to denote availability. Everyone uses the yellow ones apart from two. One uses the brown one (he's not white) and another uses the white one. Now what are we to make of that. Is he going out of his way to use it to signal white pride. Or is he just using it because he's not yellow. (I don't really know the guy)

above_the_cows

I think there's maybe some previous... https://twitter.com/alexkellum/status/1311429701362016257?s=20

focuszing723

He's an idiot, he shouldn't get political and concentrate on his riding. No doubt now somebody will take exception to something hypocritical he does and he'll be made very much aware of it.

bobmcstuff

above_the_cows said:

I think there's maybe some previous... https://twitter.com/alexkellum/status/1311429701362016257?s=20

What he said to Williams is referenced in the CyclingTips article - again not that inflammatory in isolation, but I guess part of a pattern, and sending unprovoked messages to a black rider to tell them they're rubbish after they gave an interview about their struggles with selection is probably not very sensible. Especially at the time it happened. Just keep it to yourself...

salsiccia1

blazing_saddles said:

In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

But we don't live in a non-racist society. And a white guy who openly supports a white-supremacist, has flirted with right-wing views previously and wants to make a point to a journalist (who was possibly unwise to comment as she did) using a black emoji is guaranteed to inflame things. Simmons might not be racist but that deliberate choice doesn't reflect well when things are so febrile.

blazing_saddles

bobmcstuff said:

blazing_saddles said:

I may be older, but I don't get it.
In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

Folks are automatically assuming he must be racially motivated to have done so, but how does this relate to José Been, who is white?
Is it because of his right wing political stance?

Not sure why JB thought it would be a good idea to wade into the US political debate either. Sport's commentators tend to keep any views they have to themselves as personal views can sometimes land them in hit water too.

Do you think it was actually random though? The default colour is Simpsons-esque yellow.

His follow up suggests it possibly wasn't.

I haven't a clue as I don't general bother with twitter, so I am afraid I haven't read any follow up.

focuszing723 said:

He's an idiot, he shouldn't get political and concentrate on his riding. No doubt now somebody will take exception to something hypocritical he does and he'll be made very much aware of it.

Same thing could be said for José Been.
Her tweet was extremely political and whatever we as individuals think of Trump, extremely offensive towards 43% of their voting public.
She's not 19 years old either, a sizeable percentage of whom are bound to be idiots.

DeVlaeminck

salsiccia1 said:

blazing_saddles said:

In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

But we don't live in a non-racist society. And a white guy who openly supports a white-supremacist, has flirted with right-wing views previously and wants to make a point to a journalist (who was possibly unwise to comment as she did) using a black emoji is guaranteed to inflame things. Simmons might not be racist but that deliberate choice doesn't reflect well when things are so febrile.

When you say he openly supports a white supremacist you mean he supports the elected President of his country - sounds less dramatic.

rick_chasey

blazing_saddles said:

bobmcstuff said:

blazing_saddles said:

I may be older, but I don't get it.
In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

Folks are automatically assuming he must be racially motivated to have done so, but how does this relate to José Been, who is white?
Is it because of his right wing political stance?

Not sure why JB thought it would be a good idea to wade into the US political debate either. Sport's commentators tend to keep any views they have to themselves as personal views can sometimes land them in hit water too.

Do you think it was actually random though? The default colour is Simpsons-esque yellow.

His follow up suggests it possibly wasn't.

I haven't a clue as I don't general bother with twitter, so I am afraid I haven't read any follow up.

focuszing723 said:

He's an idiot, he shouldn't get political and concentrate on his riding. No doubt now somebody will take exception to something hypocritical he does and he'll be made very much aware of it.

Same thing could be said for José Been.
Her tweet was extremely political and whatever we as individuals think of Trump, extremely offensive towards 43% of their voting public.
She's not 19 years old either, a sizeable percentage of whom are bound to be idiots.

What's the point you're driving at here?

salsiccia1

DeVlaeminck said:

salsiccia1 said:

blazing_saddles said:

In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

But we don't live in a non-racist society. And a white guy who openly supports a white-supremacist, has flirted with right-wing views previously and wants to make a point to a journalist (who was possibly unwise to comment as she did) using a black emoji is guaranteed to inflame things. Simmons might not be racist but that deliberate choice doesn't reflect well when things are so febrile.

When you say he openly supports a white supremacist you mean he supports the elected President of his country - sounds less dramatic.

But the President of his country is a white supremacist. He's got so blatant that anyone supporting him is tacitly supporting that because they're obviously not concerned enough about it to stop supporting him.

mididoctors

At this stage you don't get a pass on being a trumpanaut ... I do not care what percentage they represent . Neutrality is actually pro one side in this and it's the wrong side ... There is no place for that now . We are a cigarettes papers width from full fascist . Get on the right side of this now . Not the forum or place for this ? Look at what these people have done to the body politic and our forum culture

DeVlaeminck

salsiccia1 said:

DeVlaeminck said:

salsiccia1 said:

blazing_saddles said:

In a truly non-racist society, surely a white guy could and would randomly use both black and white emojis, as would a black guy?
To me the idea that a white person cannot use a black symbol is at best, counter-productive.
Atm, this seems to be an insurmountable hurdle in our society.

But we don't live in a non-racist society. And a white guy who openly supports a white-supremacist, has flirted with right-wing views previously and wants to make a point to a journalist (who was possibly unwise to comment as she did) using a black emoji is guaranteed to inflame things. Simmons might not be racist but that deliberate choice doesn't reflect well when things are so febrile.

When you say he openly supports a white supremacist you mean he supports the elected President of his country - sounds less dramatic.

But the President of his country is a white supremacist. He's got so blatant that anyone supporting him is tacitly supporting that because they're obviously not concerned enough about it to stop supporting him.

Well I don't agree he's blatantly a white supremacist - that's like people who call anyone right of Tony Blair a fascist.

About 30% of Asian voters supported Trump, even 1 in 10 black voters. He may favour policies that impact less favourably on BAME people whether directly or indirectly but saying he's blatantly a white supremacist is laying it on rather thick.

I don't even like the guy or his policies but this kind of hyperbole just inflames the debate.