The big Coronavirus thread
Comments
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Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
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Most people don't even realise, though. They'd start to understand if the the authorities were contacting them either through a compulsory app or because they'd seen them on CCTV.rick_chasey said:
The met already use face recognition in Kings Cross and are rolling it out in mobile stations across the city.nickice said:
Amazing how ready some of use are to give up our civil liberties. If they started using CCTV to identify and contact people before there were even a perceived risk, that wouldn't last. Even the South Koreans are starting to get concerned about privacy issues concerning the compulsory app they have on their phones.rick_chasey said:On what basis would the U.K. not accept it?
Most people give up that info for free, and that’s before the wide acceptance of CCTV everywhere. London is the world centre of CCTV.
The guardian and folk like me kick up a fuss but most people don’t give a sh!t.
I don’t think for a moment Brits on the whole actually care about that stuff.0 -
It’s not a flippant statement. It’s the sort of dilemma the leaders are having to rationalise and respond to objectively.rick_chasey said:
Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
Simply having a low mortality rate in the early days is meaningless if the end result is worse.0 -
This is what the epidemiology says, unfortunately. Time will tell whether it was better to hold off until treatments/vaccines available.rick_chasey said:
Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
Deaths in Germany are lower because they locked down sooner, by a couple of days... possibly... but then so did Belgium. Which is now doing worse than the UK by capita. It is almost like you can pick any narrative you want and find some evidence to support it...0 -
yep, on top of which, everyone carrying an operational mobile phone is already being tracked in real time, the carriers make this data available to government and in some cases to anyone with the money, it varies by country, but the default assumption should always be that you are traceablerick_chasey said:On what basis would the U.K. not accept it?
Most people give up that info for free, and that’s before the wide acceptance of CCTV everywhere. London is the world centre of CCTV.
it's not high accuracy one-shot, but with enough data and compute resource it's enough to track people you want to monitor/arrest/kill
widespread use of backend onboarding services extends global visibility to guest wifi, if you give a real email address/other id to register for free/guest wifi then that adds to the mix, some governments mandate providing a mobile number (so that an sms can be sent with a pin to access wifi) then they can link cellular subscriber identity to wifi usage, bluetooth adds further optionsmy bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny0 -
This is simply not the same as having a compulsory app on your phone as they do in South Korea. I think we understand that we are already tracked but to do it so openly is completely different.sungod said:
yep, on top of which, everyone carrying an operational mobile phone is already being tracked in real time, the carriers make this data available to government and in some cases to anyone with the money, it varies by country, but the default assumption should always be that you are traceablerick_chasey said:On what basis would the U.K. not accept it?
Most people give up that info for free, and that’s before the wide acceptance of CCTV everywhere. London is the world centre of CCTV.
it's not high accuracy one-shot, but with enough data and compute resource it's enough to track people you want to monitor/arrest/kill
widespread use of backend onboarding services extends global visibility to guest wifi, if you give a real email address/other id to register for free/guest wifi then that adds to the mix, some governments mandate providing a mobile number (so that an sms can be sent with a pin to access wifi) then they can link cellular subscriber identity to wifi usage, bluetooth adds further options
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I can do that for yourick_chasey said:So Germany got its first cases roughly the same time as the U.K. and yet they’ve only had 2800 deaths vs 10,000 U.K.
Who wants to defend the U.K. actions vs that?
There’s a reason it’s delivering ventilators and kit to the U.K. and not the other way around - Britain is the charity case here.
We could not possibly of known C19 was heading our way
Even we had of known of its existence how could we have learned from other countries who already had it
We have the best health service in the world
We have the best civil service in the world
We have the best Parliamentary system in the world
If we were all a bit cheerier we could defeat C19
Forecasting is pointless so maybe less people are dying and the economy doing better than if no pandemic.
As you hate our country so much why don’t you fvck off back home
If the EU was any good they would have sent us all the equipment and medical staff we need months ago0 -
If we ramp up our death numbers to 2000 a day, and assume a mortality rate of 0.5% we can have 60% of the population infected within 100 days.morstar said:
It’s not a flippant statement. It’s the sort of dilemma the leaders are having to rationalise and respond to objectively.rick_chasey said:
Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
Simply having a low mortality rate in the early days is meaningless if the end result is worse.
Get herd immunity done?0 -
Your underlying assumption is that this trend can be extrapolated out for the entire lifecycle of the pandemic.rick_chasey said:So Germany got its first cases roughly the same time as the U.K. and yet they’ve only had 2800 deaths vs 10,000 U.K.
Who wants to defend the U.K. actions vs that?
There’s a reason it’s delivering ventilators and kit to the U.K. and not the other way around - Britain is the charity case here.
Do you acknowledge any possibility that may not be the case?0 -
It breaks my heart but, that's gonna work.surrey_commuter said:
I can do that for yourick_chasey said:So Germany got its first cases roughly the same time as the U.K. and yet they’ve only had 2800 deaths vs 10,000 U.K.
Who wants to defend the U.K. actions vs that?
There’s a reason it’s delivering ventilators and kit to the U.K. and not the other way around - Britain is the charity case here.
We could not possibly of known C19 was heading our way
Even we had of known of its existence how could we have learned from other countries who already had it
We have the best health service in the world
We have the best civil service in the world
We have the best Parliamentary system in the world
If we were all a bit cheerier we could defeat C19
Forecasting is pointless so maybe less people are dying and the economy doing better than if no pandemic.
As you hate our country so much why don’t you fvck off back home
If the EU was any good they would have sent us all the equipment and medical staff we need months ago
Coop's already spouting it...We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
Even epidemiologists haven't been able to explain why Germany is different yet he's using it as a model to bash the UK.morstar said:
Your underlying assumption is that this trend can be extrapolated out for the entire lifecycle of the pandemic.rick_chasey said:So Germany got its first cases roughly the same time as the U.K. and yet they’ve only had 2800 deaths vs 10,000 U.K.
Who wants to defend the U.K. actions vs that?
There’s a reason it’s delivering ventilators and kit to the U.K. and not the other way around - Britain is the charity case here.
Do you acknowledge any possibility that may not be the case?0 -
Mobile phone tracking is not accurate enough to know who came into contact with who. You would need a smartphone, with the accurate location settings switched on so high accuracy GPS and WiFi access point locations are recorded. Plenty of people still don't have smartphones. They would need to be provided and made to carry them.
This isn't an argument for or against it.0 -
In theory sure but I don’t see much evidence to support your position and in the meantime fewer Germans are dying.morstar said:
Your underlying assumption is that this trend can be extrapolated out for the entire lifecycle of the pandemic.rick_chasey said:So Germany got its first cases roughly the same time as the U.K. and yet they’ve only had 2800 deaths vs 10,000 U.K.
Who wants to defend the U.K. actions vs that?
There’s a reason it’s delivering ventilators and kit to the U.K. and not the other way around - Britain is the charity case here.
Do you acknowledge any possibility that may not be the case?0 -
You should be focusing your arguments on what treatment (specifically if they are receiving certain drugs on a compassionate basis) Germans are receiving as though they have fewer deaths, they have more people in a serious or critical condition.rick_chasey said:
In theory sure but I don’t see much evidence to support your position and in the meantime fewer Germans are dying.morstar said:
Your underlying assumption is that this trend can be extrapolated out for the entire lifecycle of the pandemic.rick_chasey said:So Germany got its first cases roughly the same time as the U.K. and yet they’ve only had 2800 deaths vs 10,000 U.K.
Who wants to defend the U.K. actions vs that?
There’s a reason it’s delivering ventilators and kit to the U.K. and not the other way around - Britain is the charity case here.
Do you acknowledge any possibility that may not be the case?0 -
Nice paraphrasing. But elements of your summary are correct even if you are trying to lump me in the kill em off quickly and be done with it mentality.Jeremy.89 said:
If we ramp up our death numbers to 2000 a day, and assume a mortality rate of 0.5% we can have 60% of the population infected within 100 days.morstar said:
It’s not a flippant statement. It’s the sort of dilemma the leaders are having to rationalise and respond to objectively.rick_chasey said:
Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
Simply having a low mortality rate in the early days is meaningless if the end result is worse.
Get herd immunity done?
As stated yesterday, herd immunity is the only end game here. Ignoring a vaccine, the mortality rate will be dictated by demographics, health care provision and isolation.
Our leaders are carefully balancing conflicting requirements.
The vanity of a short term lower mortality rate will not be the measure of the ultimate success or failure of different approaches.
If a vaccine takes 18months from start of pandemic and all countries where health capacity wasn’t exceeded have experienced largely the same mortality rate by the end of those 18 months, getting through it quicker will be a success.
If the vaccine only takes 6 months, the delay tactics will 100% be proven correct.
Either is a massive gamble. Like I say consistently, I don’t envy the decision makers and am not judging them with a certainty we are not entitled to or a hindsight they didn’t have.
They will be measured in the fullness of time as mistakes will have been made. If they were made based on reasonable assumptions and informed advice, who am I to judge?
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At present it is. You would expect this to some extent given their real life experience of SARS and avian flu etc. And in the case of Singapore particularly, it is geographically way smaller and with a pretty strict control over the population.rick_chasey said:
But their death and infection rate is significantly lower than the U.K.Stevo_666 said:
They did lock down sooner, did more testing and engaged in track and trace, as you recommended. But it's not containing the problem.rick_chasey said:
Yes duh how does that contrast with what I’ve been saying?Stevo_666 said:
I've already pointed out upthread that test and track no longer seems to be containing the problem in countries like Singapore and they are having to bring in additional restrictions. Here's another link on the issue in Singapore:rick_chasey said:
Have offered plenty of suggestions, you just need to pay more attention.john80 said:
Heavy on the criticism bit light on the solution. Once you accept there is not a silver bullet you might gain some perspective.rick_chasey said:
So what is the good news in the U.K. peaking mucher higher than the Italy?Stevo_666 said:
+1.First.Aspect said:
Scotland's is half that of England. They squeezed the Murrayfield match in while they could. Same policies, much lower population density.rick_chasey said:If you compare Ireland to England, England has a 2.5x higher death rate per capita right now.
I guess that’s the difference between cancelling st Patrick’s day and letting Cheltenham happen.
I've been watching your posts on here for a couple of weeks Rick and they are unbalanced. Everything is bad. The UK is terrible. We should have done more. Of everything.
I think you need to step away from the news somehow.
I've said the same thing and to be fair its not just Rick. It wasn't that long back that somebody commented on how certain people must be googling 'negative UK ÇOVID news' or similar every morning before posting.
I'd love to see some of this lot running the show instead of the government.
I mean, f@ck me, thousands more are dying than in other comparable nations and it’s all “you’re a doomonger”.
Strap on a pair and smell the sh!t.
Lockdown sooner so you can get on top of testing, then you test and track.
That then allows for more specific measures that don’t involve such a gigantic lockdown for so long.
https://cnet.com/news/singapore-had-the-coronavirus-under-control-now-its-locking-down-the-country/
Pretty straightforward. Duh indeed.
By miles.
Or is this another right wingers being relaxed by people who aren’t them dying thing?
As I said above, we need to see how this pans out over time as until there is a vaccine, it does look like all that countries can do is slow and manage the spread.
However, my point above was that what you are recommending does not work on its own, even for countries that are seen to be dealing with it well."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Rick, what should be done? The floor is yours.
Please include details on cause and effect, rather than just a list of things that some other countries have done, some of which are currently doing "better" and ignoring others which aren't.
I've been listening to Chris Smith again this morning, and even he is talking now about the as yet unmeasured mortality that is a consequence of lock down.
There is no right answer and the degree to which each country's answer is wrong is un-knowable at the moment, even by you.
Wisdom starts with "I do not know", so how about some of that?0 -
As mentioned before, numbers of deaths is a trailing indicator, as time from infection to reporting of death is 4-5 weeks. It will give some idea of the effectiveness of measures, but will also be influenced by the number of distinct outbreaks, which won't necessarily be the same for each country. Germany have been very fortunate to keep the number of deaths relatively low, but that may only be partly due to when they brought in lockdown measures. They may also have just got lucky with fewer separate outbreaks.First.Aspect said:
This is what the epidemiology says, unfortunately. Time will tell whether it was better to hold off until treatments/vaccines available.rick_chasey said:
Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
Deaths in Germany are lower because they locked down sooner, by a couple of days... possibly... but then so did Belgium. Which is now doing worse than the UK by capita. It is almost like you can pick any narrative you want and find some evidence to support it...1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
I outline it a page or two back.First.Aspect said:Rick, what should be done? The floor is yours.
Please include details on cause and effect, rather than just a list of things that some other countries have done, some of which are currently doing "better" and ignoring others which aren't.
I've been listening to Chris Smith again this morning, and even he is talking now about the as yet unmeasured mortality that is a consequence of lock down.
There is no right answer and the degree to which each country's answer is wrong is un-knowable at the moment, even by you.
Wisdom starts with "I do not know", so how about some of that?
I know that the UK is on track to be one of the worst in Europe. That is factual.0 -
Based on extrapolation of incomplete data and an unknown pandemic lifecycle.rick_chasey said:
I outline it a page or two back.First.Aspect said:Rick, what should be done? The floor is yours.
Please include details on cause and effect, rather than just a list of things that some other countries have done, some of which are currently doing "better" and ignoring others which aren't.
I've been listening to Chris Smith again this morning, and even he is talking now about the as yet unmeasured mortality that is a consequence of lock down.
There is no right answer and the degree to which each country's answer is wrong is un-knowable at the moment, even by you.
Wisdom starts with "I do not know", so how about some of that?
I know that the UK is on track to be one of the worst in Europe. That is factual.0 -
You really didn't. You just said do what Germany has done.rick_chasey said:
I outline it a page or two back.First.Aspect said:Rick, what should be done? The floor is yours.
Please include details on cause and effect, rather than just a list of things that some other countries have done, some of which are currently doing "better" and ignoring others which aren't.
I've been listening to Chris Smith again this morning, and even he is talking now about the as yet unmeasured mortality that is a consequence of lock down.
There is no right answer and the degree to which each country's answer is wrong is un-knowable at the moment, even by you.
Wisdom starts with "I do not know", so how about some of that?
You may not like the reasoning, but Morstar's post at 10.48 is completely consistent with the current science. It is unpalatable, but right now, people are in poor mental health, financially poorer and regular healthcare is in hold. All of these things are associated with increased mortality. Already, the calculus is being made.
Who would you, Rick Chasey, chose to die? The chap with early stage prostate cancer that won't get diagnosed for another couple of months, or my mum with a history of pneumonia?1 -
rick_chasey said:
Have offered plenty of suggestions, you just need to pay more attention.john80 said:
Heavy on the criticism bit light on the solution. Once you accept there is not a silver bullet you might gain some perspective.rick_chasey said:
So what is the good news in the U.K. peaking mucher higher than the Italy?Stevo_666 said:
+1.First.Aspect said:
Scotland's is half that of England. They squeezed the Murrayfield match in while they could. Same policies, much lower population density.rick_chasey said:If you compare Ireland to England, England has a 2.5x higher death rate per capita right now.
I guess that’s the difference between cancelling st Patrick’s day and letting Cheltenham happen.
I've been watching your posts on here for a couple of weeks Rick and they are unbalanced. Everything is bad. The UK is terrible. We should have done more. Of everything.
I think you need to step away from the news somehow.
I've said the same thing and to be fair its not just Rick. It wasn't that long back that somebody commented on how certain people must be googling 'negative UK ÇOVID news' or similar every morning before posting.
I'd love to see some of this lot running the show instead of the government.
I mean, f@ck me, thousands more are dying than in other comparable nations and it’s all “you’re a doomonger”.
Strap on a pair and smell the sh!t.
Lockdown sooner so you can get on top of testing, then you test and track.
That then allows for more specific measures that don’t involve such a gigantic lockdown for so long.0 -
That works for the couple of month timescales we've seen so far. Not for the timescales involved to get a viable vaccine distributed.rick_chasey said:rick_chasey said:
Have offered plenty of suggestions, you just need to pay more attention.john80 said:
Heavy on the criticism bit light on the solution. Once you accept there is not a silver bullet you might gain some perspective.rick_chasey said:
So what is the good news in the U.K. peaking mucher higher than the Italy?Stevo_666 said:
+1.First.Aspect said:
Scotland's is half that of England. They squeezed the Murrayfield match in while they could. Same policies, much lower population density.rick_chasey said:If you compare Ireland to England, England has a 2.5x higher death rate per capita right now.
I guess that’s the difference between cancelling st Patrick’s day and letting Cheltenham happen.
I've been watching your posts on here for a couple of weeks Rick and they are unbalanced. Everything is bad. The UK is terrible. We should have done more. Of everything.
I think you need to step away from the news somehow.
I've said the same thing and to be fair its not just Rick. It wasn't that long back that somebody commented on how certain people must be googling 'negative UK ÇOVID news' or similar every morning before posting.
I'd love to see some of this lot running the show instead of the government.
I mean, f@ck me, thousands more are dying than in other comparable nations and it’s all “you’re a doomonger”.
Strap on a pair and smell the sh!t.
Lockdown sooner so you can get on top of testing, then you test and track.
That then allows for more specific measures that don’t involve such a gigantic lockdown for so long.- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
Triage morality issues are a red herring for how to tackle pandemics. There are clear guidelines on this and they don’t vary much from nation to nation.First.Aspect said:
You really didn't. You just said do what Germany has done.rick_chasey said:
I outline it a page or two back.First.Aspect said:Rick, what should be done? The floor is yours.
Please include details on cause and effect, rather than just a list of things that some other countries have done, some of which are currently doing "better" and ignoring others which aren't.
I've been listening to Chris Smith again this morning, and even he is talking now about the as yet unmeasured mortality that is a consequence of lock down.
There is no right answer and the degree to which each country's answer is wrong is un-knowable at the moment, even by you.
Wisdom starts with "I do not know", so how about some of that?
You may not like the reasoning, but Morstar's post at 10.48 is completely consistent with the current science. It is unpalatable, but right now, people are in poor mental health, financially poorer and regular healthcare is in hold. All of these things are associated with increased mortality. Already, the calculus is being made.
Who would you, Rick Chasey, chose to die? The chap with early stage prostate cancer that won't get diagnosed for another couple of months, or my mum with a history of pneumonia?
Need I remind you fewer deaths more often than not means an improved recovery.0 -
Based on your calculations Saturday 18th JulyJeremy.89 said:
If we ramp up our death numbers to 2000 a day, and assume a mortality rate of 0.5% we can have 60% of the population infected within 100 days.morstar said:
It’s not a flippant statement. It’s the sort of dilemma the leaders are having to rationalise and respond to objectively.rick_chasey said:
Amazingmorstar said:
It’s a marathon, not a sprint. If those deaths come eventually anyway...rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
Simply having a low mortality rate in the early days is meaningless if the end result is worse.
Get herd immunity done?
Additionally as more people gain immunity more social interaction is needed to maintain the R0.
We could be back to a much more normal way of life sometime in June, the vulnerable and high risk still isolated but parts of the rest of society back to normal.0 -
I've been banging the drum about 'secondary' deaths for weeks now. As I've said the real impact will only be known once this year's overall death rate is compared to average and even then it might not tell the whole picture as people could die in 5 years due to being denied Chemo now. But as it won't be recorded as a Covid death it feels like they are being ignored as it is better for the numbers.rick_chasey said:Does anyone have any stats on what treatment the dead had before they died?
Ie were they given the full bells and whistles or are we in “seriously rationed triage” mode? (Or somewhere in between)
I wonder as an acquaintance who has terminal cancer I have found out is now being denied the treatment he was expecting to prolong his life by around a year; hospital now refusing to do it because of being stretched with corona.
As for the level of triage who knows and I assume it will be done on a hospital by hospital basis. All I've heard is that we are not at capacity on available ventilators but I haven't heard any medical staff saying they have to decide who to keep alive as they were in Italy so I assume that's not the case at present as medical staff aren't usually reluctant to raise concerns (as they have with PPE and testing).0 -
FWIW FT reporting Germany has materially more hospital beds than most other nations and that may well be a big factor.0
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Test and track is a pipe dream. Tell you what, lets all take 10 seconds to see how that's worked in Singapore imagine how much better it would work in a country with 5 x the area and 12 x the population.rick_chasey said:rick_chasey said:
Have offered plenty of suggestions, you just need to pay more attention.john80 said:
Heavy on the criticism bit light on the solution. Once you accept there is not a silver bullet you might gain some perspective.rick_chasey said:
So what is the good news in the U.K. peaking mucher higher than the Italy?Stevo_666 said:
+1.First.Aspect said:
Scotland's is half that of England. They squeezed the Murrayfield match in while they could. Same policies, much lower population density.rick_chasey said:If you compare Ireland to England, England has a 2.5x higher death rate per capita right now.
I guess that’s the difference between cancelling st Patrick’s day and letting Cheltenham happen.
I've been watching your posts on here for a couple of weeks Rick and they are unbalanced. Everything is bad. The UK is terrible. We should have done more. Of everything.
I think you need to step away from the news somehow.
I've said the same thing and to be fair its not just Rick. It wasn't that long back that somebody commented on how certain people must be googling 'negative UK ÇOVID news' or similar every morning before posting.
I'd love to see some of this lot running the show instead of the government.
I mean, f@ck me, thousands more are dying than in other comparable nations and it’s all “you’re a doomonger”.
Strap on a pair and smell the sh!t.
Lockdown sooner so you can get on top of testing, then you test and track.
That then allows for more specific measures that don’t involve such a gigantic lockdown for so long.
If you really think that strategy is the "answer" then you are an idiot. Sorry.0 -
Have a look at the BBC website. Because they are testing more than we are - including large numbers with only mild symptoms, their mortality rate appears to be lower.rick_chasey said:
Explain Germany’s 60-70% fewer deaths in comparison to the U.K then?nickice said:
Agreed. At some point it's going to get out of control without a full lockdown.john80 said:Singapore has over 200 new cases per day and a large number cant be tracked or traced to a source. Where you boys going with this. I would say they are rapidly getting into the same boat as everybody else.
As for absolute numbers, who knows. It's a complex area with multiple potential factors. What is your explanation?
Also we await with baited breath your next statistical comparison with a country where we come off worse on some metric or other at this point in the crisis. I'm sure there are more if you look hard enough."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Very difficult to compare between countries at this stage. All countries are different, whilst geographically countries in Europe are close together their make-up often varies tremendously. France and Germany are two of the wealthiest countries in the EU, and both are typically viewed as having excellent healthcare provision, yet at this stage they have markedly different death rates - neither country has had its healthcare systems so what’s behind the differences? Are they recording Covid outcomes the same, or are they comparing apples with oranges?
It will be many months until the true picture is clear. Factors such as age, gender and ethnicity seem at this point to be a factor in death rates, plus specifics on how the data itself is collated, but ultimately we’ll only know for sure through research of both the data and the virus itself.
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