Things you have recently learnt

rjsterry

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

orraloon

Bank branches and cash? That'll be another Thick Lizzy pitch to re-emulate the wonderful 1970s style Brexshit Britain.

I went into a local Coop branch on Saturday, got my bits, went to check out to be told cash only, machine not working.... Cash! How quaint. Actually did have some residual notes in wallet after flogging some stuff via Gumtree pre-move months ago.

lesfirth

pangolin said:

pinno said:

Solution: don't have banking apps or any financial apps on your phone.

Yeah just pop into your local branch

I am an old git but I manage very well without any apps or a local branch. I just hope my laptop has adequate protection.

pangolin

lesfirth said:

pangolin said:

pinno said:

Solution: don't have banking apps or any financial apps on your phone.

Yeah just pop into your local branch

I am an old git but I manage very well without any apps or a local branch. I just hope my laptop has adequate protection.

Laptops can be stolen, although less likely than your mobile.
Anything requiring 2FA still needs your mobile, so that remains the weak link.
You're more likely to be victim of some phishing or fake payment scam than actual physical theft of property though.

pangolin

rjsterry said:

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

Anything is doable if you have the money!

JimD666

rjsterry said:

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

Biometrics is great as a UserID, it's ruddy awful as a security device.

TheBigBean

lesfirth said:

pangolin said:

pinno said:

Solution: don't have banking apps or any financial apps on your phone.

Yeah just pop into your local branch

I am an old git but I manage very well without any apps or a local branch. I just hope my laptop has adequate protection.

It used to be the case that only Windows Pro had the option to turn on Bitlocker and encrypt the whole drive. Without that it was trivial to get data from a stolen laptop. Android phones have been encrypted by default for a while.

pinno

pangolin said:

pinno said:

Solution: don't have banking apps or any financial apps on your phone.

Yeah just pop into your local branch

Funny.

Laptop/PC - which can have anti-virus installed and VPN switched on.
Need to pay? Card - you know, those plastic things with 'chip n pin. You can request a limit on the contactless payment - imagine that? Just point the plastic thing with the fancy silver coloured maze at a machine and voila! (my limit is £30). You can always use them in the cash machine and withdraw real money. You can use them at the café - no joke. You can purchase train tickets and even... beer! You can purchase stuff up to £300 (depending on the bank). They're quite handy you know.
There are other types pf plastic card like Credit cards (which insure purchases and transactions).
Some banks allow you to call them if you are really stuck and they can make a payment on your behalf.

For other stuff there's BACS and online facilities like Apple pay and PayPal. You can even use a cheque book. A what?! (In French it's called 'Le cheque book').

Why are we suddenly reliant on our mobile phones? Why have faceache* and your whole life including, email login and financial transaction software on it so that if it gets into the wrong hands, you're potentially fcuked?
If you loose your plastic thingy, you can call your bank and cancel it. If you loose your phone, you could be spending a lot of time informing the various agencies/links/banks/friends/contacts that you could be compromised - if you have all this personal stuff on it.

*Someone locally had it on faceache that he was going on holiday - to Australia. He got royally burgled.

Pross

What’s the difference between paying contactless with your bank card and doing it with your phone?

pblakeney

pinno said:

...You can purchase stuff up to £300 (depending on the bank). They're quite handy you know.
...

Considerably more than £300. As posted above, I have bought my last 3 cars using my debit card. I tried using my cash back credit card but the dealers wouldn't play ball.

rick_chasey

Ease of access vs security. Will never not be a trade off

surrey_commuter

Pross said:

What’s the difference between paying contactless with your bank card and doing it with your phone?

By using a phone you get to faff around and irritate the bloke behind you.

The benefit of using a phone is that you spare yourself the aggravation lugging a credit card around with you.

I admire how much people embrace risk that they have their travel card, money and means of calling for help all on one battery driven losable device.

Pross

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

What’s the difference between paying contactless with your bank card and doing it with your phone?

By using a phone you get to faff around and irritate the bloke behind you.

The benefit of using a phone is that you spare yourself the aggravation lugging a credit card around with you.

I admire how much people embrace risk that they have their travel card, money and means of calling for help all on one battery driven losable device.

Yeah, it does seem odd. It’s the reason I printed off my travel docs when I went away last year and why I tend to still buy physical train tickets (or at least print something off). I don’t tend to rely on my phone to pay in case it doesn’t work for some reason but do often find it quicker to use it that getting my wallet out and selecting my card.

schlepcycling

rjsterry said:

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

If you have an iPhone there's a 'Reset Face ID' function in 'Settings -> Face ID & Passcode'

JimD666

schlepcycling said:

rjsterry said:

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

If you have an iPhone there's a 'Reset Face ID' function in 'Settings -> Face ID & Passcode'

I rather think you've missed his point. If your password is compromised, you change your password. If your biometric data is compromised? Then it's time for plastic surgery.

surrey_commuter

Pross said:

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

What’s the difference between paying contactless with your bank card and doing it with your phone?

By using a phone you get to faff around and irritate the bloke behind you.

The benefit of using a phone is that you spare yourself the aggravation lugging a credit card around with you.

I admire how much people embrace risk that they have their travel card, money and means of calling for help all on one battery driven losable device.

Yeah, it does seem odd. It’s the reason I printed off my travel docs when I went away last year and why I tend to still buy physical train tickets (or at least print something off). I don’t tend to rely on my phone to pay in case it doesn’t work for some reason but do often find it quicker to use it that getting my wallet out and selecting my card.

until I reached the gateline I had forgotten the stupidity of people using watches to pay or travel

TheBigBean

surrey_commuter said:

Pross said:

What’s the difference between paying contactless with your bank card and doing it with your phone?

By using a phone you get to faff around and irritate the bloke behind you.

The benefit of using a phone is that you spare yourself the aggravation lugging a credit card around with you.

I admire how much people embrace risk that they have their travel card, money and means of calling for help all on one battery driven losable device.

Some clever people mitigate the risk by having some emergency cash/card in their losable mobile phone case.

pinno

pblakeney said:

pinno said:

...You can purchase stuff up to £300 (depending on the bank). They're quite handy you know.
...

Considerably more than £300. As posted above, I have bought my last 3 cars using my debit card. I tried using my cash back credit card but the dealers wouldn't play ball.

I was referring to the chip and pin limit, not the long 16 digit Debit card payment option.

pblakeney

pinno said:

pblakeney said:

pinno said:

...You can purchase stuff up to £300 (depending on the bank). They're quite handy you know.
...

Considerably more than £300. As posted above, I have bought my last 3 cars using my debit card. I tried using my cash back credit card but the dealers wouldn't play ball.

I was referring to the chip and pin limit, not the long 16 digit Debit card payment option.

Same card and security though.

pinno

pblakeney said:

pinno said:

pblakeney said:

pinno said:

...You can purchase stuff up to £300 (depending on the bank). They're quite handy you know.
...

Considerably more than £300. As posted above, I have bought my last 3 cars using my debit card. I tried using my cash back credit card but the dealers wouldn't play ball.

I was referring to the chip and pin limit, not the long 16 digit Debit card payment option.

Same card and security though.

Yep.

schlepcycling

JimD666 said:

schlepcycling said:

rjsterry said:

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

If you have an iPhone there's a 'Reset Face ID' function in 'Settings -> Face ID & Passcode'

I rather think you've missed his point. If your password is compromised, you change your password. If your biometric data is compromised? Then it's time for plastic surgery.

Ah yes, apologies I should read more thoroughly before replying.

pangolin

pinno said:

pangolin said:

pinno said:

Solution: don't have banking apps or any financial apps on your phone.

Yeah just pop into your local branch

Funny.

Laptop/PC - which can have anti-virus installed and VPN switched on.
Need to pay? Card - you know, those plastic things with 'chip n pin. You can request a limit on the contactless payment - imagine that? Just point the plastic thing with the fancy silver coloured maze at a machine and voila! (my limit is £30). You can always use them in the cash machine and withdraw real money. You can use them at the café - no joke. You can purchase train tickets and even... beer! You can purchase stuff up to £300 (depending on the bank). They're quite handy you know.
There are other types pf plastic card like Credit cards (which insure purchases and transactions).
Some banks allow you to call them if you are really stuck and they can make a payment on your behalf.

For other stuff there's BACS and online facilities like Apple pay and PayPal. You can even use a cheque book. A what?! (In French it's called 'Le cheque book').

Why are we suddenly reliant on our mobile phones? Why have faceache* and your whole life including, email login and financial transaction software on it so that if it gets into the wrong hands, you're potentially fcuked?
If you loose your plastic thingy, you can call your bank and cancel it. If you loose your phone, you could be spending a lot of time informing the various agencies/links/banks/friends/contacts that you could be compromised - if you have all this personal stuff on it.

*Someone locally had it on faceache that he was going on holiday - to Australia. He got royally burgled.

kingstongraham

Pross said:

What’s the difference between paying contactless with your bank card and doing it with your phone?

There's no limit when you use your phone.

rick_chasey

China now has a longer average life expectancy than America

rjsterry

The Polish word for King is Krol, which is derived from the name Carol/Charles as in Charlemagne. So King Charles is a tautonym in Polish.

PMark

JimD666 said:

schlepcycling said:

rjsterry said:

That's the joke.

My bank pushed their app quite hard and it's certainly handy when you need to sort stuff out on holiday. It uses facial recognition to set up new payees and other transfers. They obviously get to see a bit more data about your spending.

One weakness of face/fingerprint ID is that you can't reset it. The data should be stored in an encrypted form, but if that is compromised in some way, I don't know how you 'reset' your face.

If you have an iPhone there's a 'Reset Face ID' function in 'Settings -> Face ID & Passcode'

I rather think you've missed his point. If your password is compromised, you change your password. If your biometric data is compromised? Then it's time for plastic surgery.

Well a finger print is easier to fake and there were some early Android phones which could be faked with just a photo. But the latest face recognition systems on phones (iPhones especially) are a lot harder to fake, and are specifically designed so they can tell the difference between a replica/model of your face and an actual human face (e.g. the temperature differences on parts of your face).

People will always try the weakest link to get into any system and I suspect there is something very basic the women in the gym was doing wrong. Like having a very simple passcode (so you can guess it by looking at the parts of the screen that had a lot of finger marks).

There was one guy I have dealt with who had a 6 figure sum taken about of one of his bank accounts (was an investment banker). Turns out he uses the same password on every site he goes to and once the hackers got his password, were trying it on all the main websites (amazon, office.com etc), so then managed to get into his email. Going through his email, they found he used to work for a investment bank and then emailed a friend who still works at that bank to transfer a large sum of money to the hackers account. The guy got his money back in the end and I would personally be surprised if his friend still works at the bank.

pblakeney

In Apple Music Alabama 3 are listed as Country music. 🤣

briantrumpet

I didn't know until now that there was a 'Bristol bus boycott' in 1963: at the time the bus company refused to employ black or Asian bus crews.

I happened to see it in a remarkably uncritical report in the Telegraph of a stained glass window in St Mary Redcliffe that celebrated Colston being replaced with designs featuring refugees and black people, as well as Jesus.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/09/23/church-replaces-edward-colston-stained-glass-window-jesus-migrant/

briantrumpet

Reading the Wikepedia article on it, it does make you realise how far we've come since (even if there's still some way to go):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bristol_Bus_Boycott

The Bristol Evening Post and the Western Daily Press ran series on the colour bar, which was blamed by company management on the Transport and General Workers' Union (TGWU), which represented bus workers. Local union officials denied that there was any colour bar but in 1955 the Passenger Group of the TGWU had passed a resolution that "coloured" workers should not be employed as bus crews. Andrew Hake, curator of the Bristol Industrial Mission, recalled that "The TGWU in the city had said that if one black man steps on the platform as a conductor, every wheel will stop".

Some white conductresses expressed concern for their safety if they were crewed with black men. Other bus workers' concerns, apart from racism, was that a new competitive source of labour could reduce their earnings. Pay was low and workers relied on overtime to get a good wage. One shop steward said, "people were fearful of an influx of people from elsewhere (on the grounds it) would be reducing their earnings potential".

Pross

briantrumpet said:

I didn't know until now that there was a 'Bristol bus boycott' in 1963: at the time the bus company refused to employ black or Asian bus crews.

I happened to see it in a remarkably uncritical report in the Telegraph of a stained glass window in St Mary Redcliffe that celebrated Colston being replaced with designs featuring refugees and black people, as well as Jesus.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/09/23/church-replaces-edward-colston-stained-glass-window-jesus-migrant/

I think I saw an article about it on something like The One Show recently. It was the first time I’d heard about it. It might have been something like the death of the first Black bus driver they recruited but I could be mixing up a few 1960s Civil Rights stories.